Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 432-024
Date: Wednesday, May 9, 1973 at 10:54 AM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.
Recording device: Old Executive Office Building
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/432-024

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:00] He said, because this is a matter for, you know, the court, the best thing he feels to say is that, look, we're not going to comment on stories such as this.
[0:25] The fact of the matter is the material was provided to the court in the present situation.
[0:30] He didn't question my recollection.
[0:36] No.
[0:36] No.
[0:36] Because my conversation, I remember, I told him that night, there was nothing.
[0:43] So he was in good shape.
[0:45] Yeah, he was in good shape.
[0:46] He said, look, Rodney, the point of it is, he said in the course of discussions, that's where you have a client, you know, Justice Department confidentiality of executive privilege.
[0:55] He said, hell, there are all sorts of working papers that are discussed.
[0:59] National Security Matters,
[1:00] what impact that has.
[1:02] He said, that's irrelevant.
[1:07] He said, the main fact is, he said, you have all sorts of working papers when you're dealing with, you have disagreements within the Justice Department.
[1:20] That's how they're seen.
[1:22] That's right.
[1:22] They did hear.
[1:22] So, that's out of the way.
[1:25] The other point, that's sort of a pill that you can't, is working on a memo to you in terms of
[1:29] some of the things you said this morning, everyone was very impressed by that.
[1:42] That was a good, solid, uh, uh, fable, so that, you know, in terms of your, your argument, do you want that?
[1:51] Not long.
[1:53] No, no, I would agree.
[1:54] I would agree.
[1:55] Um, then the other, the other point I was just speaking with Al, in terms of tomorrow, Al feels this, I feel this also, that
[1:59] At this point, from Al's standpoint, therefore, in the best interest of what we're doing, it's better to keep referring to him as a criminal at this point, unless you want to do otherwise.
[2:19] But the argument for referring to him as a criminal is that it doesn't get a lot of the people in Washington beginning to set him up as a target now that they've had to disinfect him.
[2:23] Right.
[2:24] Well, that as well.
[2:27] And the staff, I refer to him otherwise.
[2:32] That doesn't matter.
[2:33] That doesn't matter to the staff.
[2:35] I see.
[2:36] Yeah.
[2:36] That's fine.
[2:36] And you make your decision that you'll be part of it anyway.
[2:39] Yeah.
[2:40] Just in this period.
[2:40] Yeah.
[2:40] Where it's better out here.
[2:41] Yeah.
[2:41] I'll just say that he's taking over the duty at this time.
[2:46] And I'm cooperating.
[2:48] Good.
[2:55] Well, I'm not going to talk too much.
[3:21] I agree you should give your car reports.
[3:25] I'd say that just a portion of your, a little more than glossy white.
[3:34] Oh yeah, but just, I wouldn't, yeah.
[3:41] Now it's, and again, what you say, oh, of course, I mean, it would be the black.
[3:47] It's good.
[3:48] It doesn't, because when the people, first of all, you're going to be a standing ovation.
[4:06] What do you mean?
[4:07] Well, basically, the fact that there's much to do.
[4:14] And good men in government do that.
[4:14] And the process is important, and we should not be prejudiced.
[4:17] but saying that in a way that does not sound like you are defending.
[4:38] In short, the process of justice is important, and the work of the present presidency must continue for the well-being of the country and the world, and then the rest.
[4:42] Let's not allow this to paralyze the government
[4:49] But I think the way you put it, this will not paralyze them.
[5:14] It cannot paralyze them.
[5:15] It's probably a better word than paralyze.
[5:15] Because of the work that must be done in the interest of the American people in this world.
[5:17] The other point that does not sound offensive, but it has to be said right,
[5:21] or learning from mistakes.
[5:24] You don't want to say that in a way that the president's not going to say that.
[5:29] That's something I've done.
[5:30] It's kind of...
[5:31] I don't want to say it's the press that will think that we're all growing up.
[5:38] It's the press again.
[5:39] I'm not going to allow that content.
[5:40] They've gone too far.
[5:42] They've gone too far.
[5:43] They have a tool here.
[5:45] They have a patent.
[5:47] We're not going to show any of that.
[5:50] But on this one, they're going to look back.
[5:52] Well, they won't look back.
[6:02] You know, can they go wrong if they take the word of, you know, and against the word of a rubber horse?
[6:28] Or of a genre?
[6:28] Or of an average genre?
[6:29] They haven't done that yet.
[6:29] Public heaven.
[6:29] Public heaven.
[6:30] Public heaven, no.
[6:31] I was talking to Pat this morning, and I said, Pat, would you have any time?
[6:44] I said, no.
[6:45] He said, yeah, well, no.
[6:45] He said, yeah, we have press conference.
[6:47] Every briefing will run.
[6:47] You remember, we always check everything that John came on the, on Watergate as to what we can say about it.
[6:56] He, he, is he trying to get off the witness that he was the witness to the evacuation of that original plane?
[7:13] Uh-huh.
[7:13] Yes, sir.
[7:13] I didn't know that.
[7:13] That's one of the policies.
[7:14] Well, he didn't conduct an evacuation.
[7:15] That's one of the policies.
[7:16] Yeah, but why isn't he trying to get off of that?
[7:17] I don't, I don't know what the hell, how that helps.
[7:18] Well, he's getting off of it, like somebody said.
[7:20] he reported the government did to Bob and John.
[7:33] Bob and John, did Bob, they had that investigation.
[7:36] Well, his point was, it really wasn't, see, his point is that if there wasn't covering, Bob and John were very much involved in it.
[7:44] Therefore, his investigation was not an investigation of whatever it was.
[7:47] But I would say, for example, I don't think you're perfectly capable of saying that, you know, all that you do when you get into it.
[7:52] ... ... ... ... ... ...
[8:13] And I guess, unfortunately in that conversation,
[8:47] I don't, I don't, I don't know who's going to say that, you know, because I don't, you know, I, after all, I'm very likely to probably throw, I mean, I'm going to throw that completely at you.
[9:10] You know, you're going to try to break much out of that conversation.
[9:12] You could have it covered there if you came in.
[9:14] We were great on Cheshire, but that was it.
[9:16] Right.
[9:17] Right around the wrong.
[9:38] The president congratulated.
[9:38] I'll be there.
[9:39] I got it.
[9:39] If I did that, it's called a fashion.
[9:41] You know, I don't think he's that sure.
[10:02] I'm actually just looking at him, and I don't know if he's wrong or not.
[10:03] I'm actually just looking at him, and I don't know if he's wrong or not.
[10:05] I'm actually just looking at him, and I don't know if he's wrong or not.
[10:06] I'm actually just looking at him, and I don't know if he's wrong or not.
[10:08] You've got to think about, in other words, probably going to have a lot of discrepancies.
[10:25] You know, always be very, very sure of the discrepancies.
[10:26] If you don't ever have any other chance to go out and look, I would write.
[10:30] But, uh, but that...
[10:32] Like, for example, what he did with these two-plus yesterday.
[10:39] Uh, I think he might do it to the press.
[10:41] I think he might do it to the press.
[10:42] I mean, that is the point of the issue.
[10:44] That he can now be destroyed, right now, in the Sears office.
[10:47] and then give it to them but not let them
[11:05] uh you know if we know what their goal is going to be
[11:21] That sounds like a deemed ploy, you know, to have a safety deposit box.
[11:32] That's what he did.
[11:34] He handed it to the prosecutor, not to the court.
[11:37] And he did this one last week, not the last week.
[11:44] He said what?
[11:44] He said these are in a safe in my home.
[11:46] No, it was a safety deposit box.
[11:51] Things get taken out of the way.
[11:58] Yeah, you see, I think what he, all he could have is when he wrote the camp table, back in January, I recall a discussion of Dean putting together some material to get out, to commit the gun.
[12:17] I suppose it's a great instance.
[12:17] Yep.
[12:18] So that might be what he had.
[12:18] Well, of course, that wouldn't help it.
[12:19] Not that.
[12:19] What he wrote in the camp table, after the fact.
[12:21] Okay, that's about real.
[12:33] We've got no choice but whatever he says.
[12:42] We're fighting to the death.
[12:44] Nothing's worth anything.
[12:45] I suppose, except by what I'm sitting under 12.
[12:49] I'm sure that's true.
[13:13] You know, even though they think they're people, they question all this crap, you know, they figure what to do.
[13:15] Just send out your polls to me.
[13:16] I'm trying to figure out how many.
[13:16] I'd be cautious with
[13:19] I think you should have that pole.
[13:39] Careful with how it comes into you.
[13:41] Did Colson send it by?
[13:42] I don't know.
[13:42] Yes, he must have sent it.
[13:43] Well, that was in the study.
[13:43] Yeah, right.
[13:43] So, that's all I know.
[13:44] I haven't talked to him.
[13:44] Why don't you go to the grand jury?
[13:48] The guy's really covered himself.
[13:58] He's got an answer for everything.
[14:01] I just like those.
[14:02] All of them.
[14:05] You know, if someone gets something in motion, if you know something is in motion,
[14:34] Stay away from what you put in motion.