Nixon, Haig & Bull on Watergate and Vernon A. Walters

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I have no concern about the facts, but I want Walters particularly to reassure Colby and Schlesinger

Because I don't want them to have any idea, you see.

You see, Alan, you can't have your top people, they can read a mental column like that and read all of the most sinister implications that even are in regard to the president.

Now, if you read them all, you'll write them all.

There aren't any implications in regard to the president.

Particularly with regard to the parade line effect.

You're managing it, Mr. President.

It's very damaging to Bob, you know.

I know it is.

In fact, as Ron said, it's the basis for the fight.

It doesn't look...

They were trying to cover up the... put him on the CIA.

Well, that's his job, and I'm...

He's going to have to be very careful with that.

You know, it's kind of bizarre.

It must not feel that, by golly,

about managing to the president that Bob and John of my age did something that I wanted them to do.

Because God damn it, I didn't want them to do anything like this.

I'm not trying to blame them.

But, for example, if Walrus, Walrus has got to be sure that all these men cons, first, Dahlia Richardson will sure as hell ask for the money.

No, not necessarily.

Now, what I think that

What Walrus should do is to make up a sanitized version saying, well, all the national security stuff out here is a recollection.

God damn it.

I'll give it to Dahlia Richardson.

At a later time.

No, no, no, no.

What are you asking?

Because I don't trust Walrus with this thing.

You know?

These men are so mean to him.

So precise.

You know?

I don't mean that he gives anything to the Senate.

I mean it.

I don't want my staff.

I don't want Gulligan, I don't want Colby, and I don't want Schmutzinger to have any doubts about the president.

Goddamn it.

Oh, am I not in this goddamn thing?

That's what burns me up.

They don't get all that in their way to Jesus Christ.

Well, they could have.

I mean, the first paragraph of that bothered me, because it looked as if Bob and John were saying, well, look, the president wants you to contain this son of a bitch.

Sure, I may have wanted to contain him, as I'd heard that the CIA was involved.

That's why I had Helms later tell me they weren't involved.

But the point is, be sure to tell Walters that he must lean very, very hard with Elliot, with Colby, with Messinger, and with Peterson on my conversation with Gray.

I said, where I go, Gray, to get off this goddamn ass and take it as high as was necessary.

Now, Walters is a photographic memory, you know.

You get it?

Now, that, this night was reassuring to me.

Because I could have said, you know, I might have, you know, you know, stressed.

I might have said, oh, for Christ's sake, tell Gray to lay off.

At the top, I thought that was a pretty, that was a pretty strong statement.

Listen, very strong.

Where I said, however high it goes,

It's very strong.

It's bizarre we have done it.

I want it to be all the same.

It's just the opposite with respect to the presence.

Well, for right of the law, it's this point.

Be sure Bazaar, has Bazaar read this point or has he read that carefully?

He points this out.

This goddammit, that's what I told me.

I mean, Greg, right before, I was in this office at the time.

And he called me, and I told him, I told him, I said, take it as high as necessary.

Now that's the way I deal with it all.

And I do my best to try to get to the facts.

We don't have an answer.

I don't think Bob and John are guilty of this.

Well, I don't either.

I think what happened there is that they were trying to sort of limit the damage.

And they weren't.

So I think they probably wouldn't have done it.

Why would you think they're guilty?

The answer is, they're just a bunch of fakes.

If they're going and they don't go down, and if there's a bond that sits under the conduit there, then anything to describe this thing as wrong is a case of being a God-fearer, which is not true.

There is no such thing as a God-fearer.

And what he's concerned about is the perfect God-fearing God-fearing God-fearing God-fearing

I know, I know, but, but, uh, you know, it may not be the moment yet, but I'm going to send her money.

I'm going to send her money, not even for the fact that she's screwed up.

I'm sure.

She's a decent man now.

I wouldn't send you, Jesus Christ, the life of her son, Henry, uh,

I could have screwed him on that and been a big hero, you know.

I could have screwed the whole panadom about that damn thing of the jackass.

You know it.

Why didn't I do it?

Because I bought more of the services.

You know that.

I want you to know that.

There ain't gonna be any of that.

The bizarre is not thinking those terms.

But with regard to Walgreens, and Walgreens first, I think Walgreens should reassure COVID, should reassure substance use, or do you think they need reassurance today?

Good God, if they do, I am not going to plan, believe me, I'll withdraw it in the morning.

I don't think so.

Now Richardson is a person of another color.

How about having this fellow, Walters, without talking?

Walters is a big weapon.

Walters is very convincing.

Walters is an eternal loyalist.

He's an eternal believer in the president.

There's no better reading about him.

You don't know his story.

Let God damn it use him.

You don't agree?

I don't agree.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He was not there.

What do you mean?

Well, it's hard for anybody who's suspicious and wants to, wants to vote for the Lord.

There's no way that you can say the Lord is innocent.

There was a high level of meaning to the end that was followed by a whole reaction from the end of the story.

What'd you give him, son?

I'm sure John Irwin would never have proved me who's got that meaning.

I am sure.

He would have told me in the end.

No, he didn't.

But I'm also sure that the big hit, the big hit and the calm of that person is a great chance that this person is going to come back.

And that's, that's a large factor that's probably going to come back.

Negative?

No, it's really not that.

It's just probably more.

Because the fact of the matter is it's not the fact.

John, Bob, Jose, Bob's National Security, and so forth.

I'll bet they went on that issue.

Or they went on that issue.

But whatever.

It may be a matter of they'll never lose the case.

No.

On that kind of thing, it is a crime to do.

That's the thing I think.

I thought I got it.

And it looked bizarre for reasons that you wouldn't understand.

I trusted all the rest of them.

God damn it.

After the Dean episode, I don't trust them

right out.

That's the way it's going to be.

And the bizarre mind, he doesn't, on his best judgment, do his best, but Jesus Christ, I can't trust Garland, Bazaar, Christ, anybody.

Jesus Christ, I don't know who the hell we're talking to anymore.

But, if there's one person that is totally blameless, I don't know why he's the stupidest guy that I've ever heard of.

I heard this crazy human thing.

I thought it was true.

I actually did.

I really thought it was probably a CIA case, because I couldn't think we could have done something that stupid.

All this payoff crap.

I thought, well, they're taking care of their fees and all this.

But believe me, I knew nothing about it.

No goddamn thing.

And I was busy with other things.

But the point that I'm making is this.

I'm not going to blame other people for my bad judgment and picking them.

And I'm just wrong.

I should have, I should have.

Like I can sack more tomorrow, you know.

Because of each other and this and you know that.

That John Chiefs thing.

That's going to be one.

Well, that's what we should have been doing.

We didn't know history was playing games.

Shit, you know that.

They knew it.

And they had to find out.

I didn't bother to even bother to have the hell out of Henry.

And I know Sting was bugging him too.

And he ought to think that he was bugging Sting.

Well, how do you think we handle this?

I want Roller in particular to get to the point where the president was totally in favor of a whole-out investigation, particularly with this, with Gray.

With Gray.

And you saw something in the paper of Gray, but Gray may have done something way different than Gray, I'm sure, and he was totally...

So to keep the investigation down, and God damn him, that's doing a different.

Walters, about everything else in the Stokewood Fugitive, must hit the point, but that, the threat of death that his reckoning is, that his recollection is, that Gray will dissuade him from a recovery of retreat ammo?

This is nothing but our first point.

I told Ray to get off his goddamn ass, and I said, Pat, because he said, I think you're being misled by some of your top people.

I said, Pat, go after them.

I don't care who they are.

As high as you want.

Now, goddamn, for a president to say that when some of his friends would be involved, it's never been heard of before.

That's right.

Amen.

We've got to get out of that out in the press, too.

I think that that, you see, we can make an SLO on this.

If we have a problem.

How do we get it over there fast?

I'm not getting every second.

But I, I, I'm going to do it.

I'm going to do it.

That's right.

But it's going to involve.

Go ahead.

I'm sorry.

Go ahead.

What do you mean?

No, no, no, no.

You know, he's mad.

You know, they killed us.

I've got a family.

Should we do it or not?

Because Rovers is not going to deliberately involve.

There's no way to stop it.

I used to go, I used to lay it all, hang it all out, you understand?

But, he is not to put implications on all of the earth and go around there.

But you see, Paul and Herod might both have been interested primarily, as I think they were, in the national security aspects.

I agree with that.

Walters had more confidence than anyone.

Walters, Walters had bought that sword of ours.

He's the only man I know that would have done it.

He might have bought three of them.

All of them.

So, funny enough, he did it.

He emphasized above everything else on Glenn Gray's head.

I'm sure the planes integrate very well with some of the other companies which are very supportive.

What was that when you came out and you said these companies are very good?

The middle level guys in the White House, they've managed it.

They already have their own company.

They're very active.

They have a show.

Any authority can work with them.

That's, you know, that's the middle of a ride.

You didn't say it in the bottom.

I figured you had all the courage.

I don't think there's more to say about this.

It takes time.

I think that the job that Dean did, and the guys, and some of the guys that worked on all the other jobs,

You're right, but I shouldn't see Walters.

Get his ass down there.

Believe me, I want you personally or somebody, adult people, to hear Walters.

And he said that.

Now, Walters has got to be sure Helms knows.

Helms' ass is out here.

His whole career is out here.

And Helms knows that

conversation is correct.

And second, when Helms told me later that CIE was not involved, you know, I mean, in a very brief meeting in the Oval Office, after a meeting, he said, I just want you to know that CIE is not involved.

I said, thank God.

That's what I said.

That's all there was to it.

But he's got to be dead.

Well, Helms would never agree to it.

It's all the time that comes from everything he's done.

He's never going to say that he participated in a cover-up.

But the main thing is, he's got to be sure to call it.

Now, we're going to have a probe in this, well, not particularly probe, but goddamn it, I don't want him screwing around.

He's either going to stand up or he's going to be nominated.

I have very little other problems.

Goddamn it, I can nominate people.

I don't want this to be sure.

Let me say this.

We're always talking to him.

He's got to talk to her.

He's got to talk to you.

But I put them in the White House files because any notes that are made that have to do with a national security item in the White House is the property of the White House, not the property of the CIA.

Right?

That's what we should say.

And, uh, don't you think that's it?

And how are we going to make this proper here?

How are we going to make this proper here?

But it dealt with a number of items other than this involving national security and highly classified operations the CIA needs to get.

And therefore, I don't know, well, Mr. Waller, do you think you didn't keep a copy of the old collection?

And I knew, and I knew that they were available at any time to us.

Under some circumstances with our society rules, we make as few copies as possible.

Now, most of the time,

Holy!

It may have any doubts about the president, but let me tell you, I'll withdraw their goddamn nominations in the next five minutes, please.

I don't have any screwing around.

That's it, you see.

Here's Eric Richardson.

That's it, it's very loosey.

If he's loosey, screw it!

Out, out, out!

Oh, no, I thought that was his hearing.

Oh, no, that's it.

He's got to be all the way with the President.

General Preston is kind of a strong man.

All right.

Why don't that President ask me to get rid of him?

Well, that's what Colby has recommended.

Because Colby's strong.

Colby is a strong professional.

He's just got to know that

And I want, I want rollers to build our company.

Rollers is a very good association.

It's a great, it's a great, kind of, it's the best group of bonds.

God, I thank you for this.

I like it.

Ask the Lord.

Thank you.

Oh, I think there was a misunderstanding.

I just held it right here.

What it is, is that some of the files from Hoover were delivered, you know, after, you know, Bob delivered the same, which was supposed to be your office.

I mean, that's what it is.

I don't know.

Nothing was delivered to you then, huh?

And, uh, not my father, you know, or anybody else.

Yeah.

Well, that must be something wrong.

Okay.

Thank you.

What?

No.

Let me... Al's here.

Al will check.

If you don't have any work with me, we're not trying to con... You know, we're just trying to find out where the hell the damn things are.

Right?

Okay.

All right, fine.

That's good.

All right, fine.

It wasn't time to fight, boy.

That's right.

I'm not your soldier.

I'm not.

But, my God, I don't know where they sold you.

But what's the letter to these guys?

But we need it.

We need it because of that guy.

You know?

I'm not dead, but I'm frightened because of any one of the three was getting out of the service and then one time they were murdered.

Um, where did the murder go?

I don't know.

Okay.

Nixon, Haig & Bull on Watergate and Vernon A. Walters

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Nixon Library Finding Aid

Also recorded on May 11, 1973

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