Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 447-013
Date: Tuesday, June 19, 1973 at 12:10 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Kissinger, Henry A.
Recording device: Old Executive Office Building
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/447-013

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:07] I don't know.
[0:34] I don't know.
[0:35] I don't know.
[0:35] He said something about the fact that he just wanted you, Romico, and someone to die with him.
[0:58] And how they're able to do that, I don't know.
[1:11] But he's obviously trying to get away with it.
[1:14] He was a little prideful.
[1:14] I just think that's the thing.
[1:15] He didn't say that.
[1:15] He didn't mention his name.
[1:16] We can't go there without lying.
[1:18] Uh, I said, now, he raised his son, but maybe we should do a twin-street.
[1:30] And I said, well, we could create a twin-street because then all of the, all of the injuries are going to go down.
[1:33] Another reason is that we should raise his son.
[1:33] I think that's something.
[1:44] I said also on Friday, we'll get the Sunday news, but we can't get the rest.
[1:46] We have to build up to have a big ceremony at the White House.
[1:47] That's what we're going to stand on.
[1:48] I think that's pretty wild.
[1:50] The other reason, of course, is that it will look like the whole scene was done in a spaceship.
[2:12] And we didn't know if it was real.
[2:13] And this would also, uh... We can't get... We have to get out of it until it's possible.
[2:15] Well, anyway, I told him he had to be pregnant at this time of the night.
[2:16] Because we have to.
[2:16] We've got to get him out.
[2:17] But I told him to be pregnant.
[2:18] But there will be a point that there's something wrong with the project.
[2:19] But there will be.
[2:20] But I think they have to handle it from here.
[2:34] Let me just say, your standpoint, as far as your concern, I would just mention the department.
[2:42] I said, I said, I said, I said, all those things will go out of our hands.
[2:43] You've got to build up to that as we did in Moscow.
[2:44] That's all.
[2:45] And it's in his interest to do so.
[2:46] The...
[2:47] He told me he only spent four hours with us.
[3:02] But obviously, he wants to have...
[3:03] He also wants to have, uh, a property along with this, in person, like he did with us.
[3:22] Believe me, it's not gonna happen.
[3:23] Yeah, it is what it ought to be.
[3:23] That's good fun about it.
[3:24] It's gonna be the same thing I'm doing, because I've been doing it for a year and a half.
[3:26] No, I prefer to do it in person.
[3:26] I'll give you that.
[3:27] I, I, I, you know, things like that.
[3:27] I have a very good memory, and I'll just go with it.
[3:31] But I, I don't think this actually is a big problem.
[3:48] I just want to make that speech now.
[3:49] You put enormous emphasis on the personal relationship and all the rest of that, because I don't have any, any specific thoughts on that.
[3:53] But I just think it's very important to be, to be personal.
[3:54] I've always believed in that so much.
[3:55] And one thing we should do, uh, as presidents could tie down tomorrow, we have the F.R.
[3:56] thing.
[3:57] And they're so closing days.
[4:07] I know.
[4:07] We've got to have that job.
[4:09] And I will do that with him.
[4:10] I don't want Rodgers to be there.
[4:12] No.
[4:12] But I'd like to have you in the brain for that bill.
[4:13] We'll deal with Rodgers.
[4:14] And let him work on the Middle East.
[4:20] I think if it works out, we'll probably say that you've had a great experience.
[4:47] But the question you've got to figure out is the reason.
[4:48] Don't worry about Schultz's people.
[4:51] Just say that we're going, we changed plans, we're going to Camp David, and you're not going to vote on that because he's not giving an apology.
[5:09] Oh, can't you handle it?
[5:10] Oh, yeah.
[5:10] I just say, if you're all over this, no problem.
[5:12] We're having a meeting with the judges tonight.
[5:14] They changed their plans.
[5:14] So they have an exact, well, understand, he didn't nail it all down because they're going to apply that.
[5:17] But he probably mentioned only the Laker U and other times, maybe the other times, right?
[5:22] Now, with regard to other members of the jury, uh, you can turn it around to the extent that you want.
[5:41] So, like, you can have Senator Hissoff's number on the bulletin I gave you in the trial, but you have to figure out who goes.
[5:44] With Hissoff as a member, they have to have the money, you know what I mean?
[5:45] They can have the money, have whatever you want with them, what they want.
[5:47] I also go to my, my ear on the bulletin I gave you.
[5:49] Our security.
[5:50] Apparently, what concerns him, and we saw some stories about the companies and the authorities, and some stories about the Jews, and about the sense of the devil in them.
[6:08] And I said, like, how was it?
[6:16] I said, we had last night.
[6:17] I said, we could be in there for this.
[6:21] I said, don't you worry about it.
[6:24] I said, no, they're going to be there.
[6:26] They'll be over.
[6:26] Yeah.
[6:26] But you just don't have to worry about it.
[6:27] So I handled it that way.
[6:28] It's disgusting.
[6:28] These people, while he's here, he's here, would go down and try to embarrass him.
[6:31] You see how it's ended?
[6:31] So I think it all goes to the Jewish.
[6:33] They're afraid to go after a very kind Jewish.
[6:35] He won't have any demonstration, believe me.
[6:44] I'll get rid of that folder.
[6:45] I'll shoot every black in that place.
[6:46] That can't be...
[6:46] I don't like that one.
[6:46] I'm afraid of death.
[6:47] So I suggest don't worry about it.
[6:49] And he made it very good to say, bring the Senate down here, not to go to the Capitol.
[7:00] It's very good.
[7:00] Going out there to the Capitol, all the way to the Capitol, somebody would shout out, what are you going to do about this?
[7:04] Get their administrative decisions up there, and it's very bad.
[7:05] And these, actually, I thought the people who lived there,
[7:08] And they can breathe.
[7:15] Anybody able to breathe?
[7:30] Well, we're doing very well on it.
[7:33] I know it's pretty good.
[7:35] You know, if you realize that John M. Kennedy got even the oceanography of it.
[7:41] I mean, look at it.
[7:42] That's a test map.
[7:43] They drove that for two years.
[7:44] Which is a lot.
[7:45] We have a good transportation, even agriculture, this go-go thing.
[7:47] Today is the oceanography, transportation, agriculture, and cultural exchange.
[7:57] Every one of which by itself wouldn't be a headline story.
[8:00] Tomorrow we have a tax agreement.
[8:02] Tomorrow we have a tax agreement.
[8:04] On Thursday we have peaceful use of nuclear energy.
[8:06] And so on.
[8:06] Well, you've got to make a lot of money.
[8:14] You've got to solve principles.
[8:14] Well, no, no, I've got the growth conditions.
[8:16] That's all they expected.
[8:18] And actually, if we were not in good shape, we would have been a hell of a buy for the Chiefs.
[8:25] We've got to push back.
[8:27] We've got to slap the Chiefs.
[8:32] But it was not a good year to take them on.
[8:35] Well...
[8:36] I have the impression that the Chinese made that decision.
[9:03] You know, I talked to them about, uh, he said, uh, when he asked me at TMC, uh, what did you mean, I think it was, you know, something like that.
[9:26] And I said, uh, let's check it out.
[9:27] I said, no way.
[9:27] Yeah, we checked it out.
[9:28] We checked it out.
[9:28] But they, uh, they made that order.
[9:29] And, uh, well, he didn't say they'd come, but he just wrote it down, and he, he said, they discussed it in August, and I...
[9:34] But you see, we couldn't come out of that August trip without an announcement of an extension visit that we chose not to do.
[10:04] But it's a business I've set in, I don't know how many years.
[10:25] I would guess the company might be 100, 30.
[10:26] And he would never drop his pitch.
[10:26] He was always booked into that place.
[10:27] And so you'd think, well, what's going to happen to him?
[10:29] I would do it just oddly, oddly.
[10:32] Anyway, I said that I think maybe your touching patient was raised in the city, but they agreed to bond.
[10:51] It's fine, but I know for a moment it's a coin.
[10:52] I don't know that, though.
[10:52] I don't think it's a coin.
[10:53] It's just a picture.
[10:53] Oh, well, I guess that's out of the camp.
[10:54] All you have to do is send it in the newest load.
[10:57] It's good to have a few different things in there.
[10:59] Okay, and we should let them have their own way of everything?
[11:04] No, they don't have a scenario.
[11:07] And, uh, he took it quite well when I was trying to get him to be able to talk, and I put him in a bath, and the weather, and so forth, and so on.
[11:29] But, I just gave it to him to do it differently.
[11:30] We were down, it takes an hour and a half, we were down on that dinner, and we were going to sit down with him, and I want to talk to him.
[11:33] We were up at the camp later, and we were all very, very nice, and, uh, we followed him later, and, uh, we spent the night with him.
[11:35] And, uh, I don't know what to do next.
[11:38] Well, no Harry, it will be a historic week again, just to visit.
[12:00] I'm sorry.
[12:03] I'm coming back to this thing.
[12:25] I don't know.
[12:26] I don't know how this is going to work out.
[12:27] We're not going to do what he wants us to do.
[12:28] You shouldn't have to worry about the driver's thing.
[12:30] It's obvious that, to me, the pressure is pretty different when I'm up there.
[12:43] There's no question.
[12:44] But I don't know how they all even handle it.
[12:47] He's got trouble with Dodger.
[12:48] He just doesn't get everything.
[12:49] Now, with this nuclear agreement, he plans it against the NATO guidelines.
[12:50] You know, he's got to be pissed on it, to be pissed on everything.
[12:52] That's what he's talking about.
[12:53] Yeah, I'm sure it's not his assignment.
[12:54] He said he's disgusted without a charge.
[12:55] I think he's got it against the NATO guidelines.
[12:56] Those boys have no right to be disgusted without a charge.
[12:59] Secondly, it shows he doesn't understand that the British and Truman's work with us had been against the naval guidelines.
[13:07] They would have called it hate sport.
[13:13] But he won't really make trouble.
[13:14] He'll just... Once it's signed, it's the same as always, Mr. President.
[13:21] Once it's signed, it'll be signed.
[13:24] He hasn't made an agreement yet, but he didn't say ahead of time, you know, not, you know, the paragraph should be emphasized.
[13:46] It's got nothing to do with it.
[13:48] There's also a paragraph in there where my father says that this does not affect your commitment spirit.
[13:50] And there are articles that you want to present to your allies.
[13:52] And the other paragraph objected, it's not commitment.
[13:53] It's total nonsense.
[13:53] It just shows you have an understanding.
[13:54] Do you agree?
[13:56] Do you remember?
[14:02] Not one objection of what?
[14:10] That will be all right.
[14:13] Yeah, I agree.
[14:17] He cannot change one comment.
[14:19] That will not be an issue.
[14:22] Yeah.
[14:24] I may come back a little earlier on Thursday to help prepare for the briefing.
[14:36] If you might consider, when the salt starts, well, we can brief up on the hill, but you might want to do it before you can go ready for the briefing the next day.
[14:49] So there's no one there now.
[14:50] I see.
[14:53] But the point is, the question now has a great stake in this issue.
[15:13] I think it's time to secure it before we have to share it, before we have to then preach about the duration of it.
[15:15] We've got to share that word.
[15:15] He doesn't want it to be out of the way, but he must secure it quickly.
[15:17] He doesn't want it to be out of the way, but he doesn't want it to be out of the way.
[15:19] He doesn't want it to be out of the way, but he doesn't want it to be out of the way.
[15:24] You know, it's very, very sobering.
[15:44] It's all been so ironical with my peaceful Democrats and so forth.
[15:47] And he's come out of it happily so.
[15:48] The tree's red at this point.
[15:49] Oh, God.
[15:49] And then a little bastard moved now to his hand at the table.
[15:50] You can see that?
[15:50] Yeah.
[15:51] But that, I think, was just really, you know, just, oh, no, no, no, no, just horrible.
[16:02] It's a question that when you let go of each other, it's just, you know, you can't let go of it.
[16:05] It just can't be done.
[16:09] Well, it does not prove to you in any way that when money is, that if you were given money then to put it in trust is absurd.
[16:25] You've got no right to touch it.
[16:28] It was given to you for a purpose and you wouldn't carry on with it.
[16:39] No, we just have a constant arrest.
[16:53] And it's just as well, I think, that the church
[16:56] It's against the backdrop of a functioning president who's again done what he does best, good things for the world.
[17:13] And they'll be hacking away at a different image than they would be doing in this week.
[17:21] Next week.
[17:22] Next week.
[17:22] They'll get more coverage, but they're up against a tougher image.
[17:26] And they would have given him plenty of coverage this week.
[17:48] You'll get more coverage this week too.
[17:49] And the damage it would have done.
[17:53] Jackass Scott went with Mansfield.
[18:09] You know what?
[18:09] Roger Stewart, I hate him.
[18:10] I had to look good when he spoke to Mansfield.
[18:11] Well, I've already worked with him for 10 years.
[18:12] He said, you know, this thing is gone far enough.
[18:13] You know, continue to get over with it.
[18:13] It'll work better.
[18:14] Roger went up with Mansfield.
[18:14] I thank him for his turn.
[18:23] What a great act he's taken.
[18:26] He's mastered it.
[18:26] He's a political parasite.
[18:28] He's mastered it.
[18:28] He's a total bugger.
[18:29] Don't you agree?
[18:29] A total parasite.
[18:30] When you see that, to be able to suck up to the son of a bitch that way, you're giving him credit.
[18:33] I didn't tell Scotty that kid's got any credit.
[18:34] I didn't speak to him last time.
[18:35] I'm not going to.
[18:36] Ask Scott, I mean, to announce in the Senate the day that we get the Vietnam CSI agreement that he was going to back up any more than he could.
[18:59] We, in selfishness, will let the latter's weakness with selfishness make the very, very ordinary man just as good as he is.
[19:08] He had his extra genesis in the hospital, the college, and the jumpsuit man.
[19:25] On the extent that he's, I mean, he's all right.
[19:27] He's good.
[19:27] He's not bad.
[19:27] But suddenly, the big men are gone now, and they're whining around about this thing.
[19:31] And nobody can deliver anybody anyway.
[19:31] We couldn't make a deal with a hundred others, with a hundred selfish people down there.
[19:44] Well, whatever you want to work out, I guess they're having their lunch now.
[19:52] It's 12.30, so they're probably in the middle of their lunch.
[19:56] I'm going to get out of it.
[19:57] But listen, the other thing is, I've done my part.
[20:02] Don't let that foreign relations committee ban you for too long.
[20:06] I want that lunch cut off.
[20:06] But would you like to move the economic meeting to 4.30?
[20:07] Give them a little more time to rest.
[20:09] Sure.
[20:09] Make the economic meeting 4.30, and it is to adjourn at 6.00.
[20:12] We'll tell George and Shelton to get it over with.
[20:15] Yeah.
[20:17] Okay.
[20:17] Fine.
[20:18] That's a little bit better Henry.
[20:20] He'll like that too.
[20:21] Then we go 6 sharp on the boat.
[20:24] 6.30, 7.50.
[20:25] Okay.