{"conversationCode":"448-017","tapeNumber":448,"conversationNumber":17,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-448-017","startDateTime":"1973-07-11T18:28:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-07-11T18:34:00.000Z","startDate":"11-Jul-1973","startTime":"2:28 PM","endDate":"11-Jul-1973","endTime":"2:34 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.;","description":"On July 11, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the President's office in the Old Executive Office Building from 2:28 pm to 2:34 pm. The Old Executive Office Building taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 448-017 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"EOB","recordingDevice":"Old Executive Office Building","latitudeEstimated":38.897567,"longitudeEstimated":-77.039147,"chronCode":"5.5","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part V","chronReleaseDate":"21-Aug-2013","aogpRelease":"Abuse of Governmental Power Release","aogpSegment":"Segment 0","lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 448-17\n\nDate: July 11, 1973\nTime: 2:28 pm - 2:34 pm\nLocation: Executive Office Building\n\nThe President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler\n\n[See Conversation No. 41-61]","filename":["448-017.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Ziegler, Ronald L."],"prevCode":"448-016","nextCode":"448-018","transcript":[{"start":0.23,"end":26.28,"text":"So, Ron, it occurred to me, uh, that, uh, one of our boys, uh, uh, you didn't mention the fact that I'm just a worker, but, uh, they, they should know they carry the, uh, tree peppers on a daily stream."},{"start":26.3,"end":29.13,"text":"They're carrying them, so if I watch, I understand the reason for that, but it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just, it's just,"},{"start":29.55,"end":56.58,"text":"And anybody who's bossed into this, this is just, you know, an effort."},{"start":56.6,"end":57.95,"text":"We're aware of the struggle, but why don't we just forget about it?"},{"start":57.97,"end":58.06,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":58.09,"end":58.19,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":62.44,"end":90.25,"text":"I know that you can't be, you know, you can't be obvious or mean or proud or something like that."},{"start":90.27,"end":91.23,"text":"There are ways for us to be, not the rest of us."},{"start":91.25,"end":92.31,"text":"I think that we are aware of the importance of truth."},{"start":93.47,"end":120.47,"text":"You might say we're gonna score some calls Okay, all right Yeah"},{"start":145.14,"end":169.85,"text":"You might think, of course, fighting is worth it, but we probably can't do it without it."},{"start":169.87,"end":170.81,"text":"It's not that playing about it is so important."},{"start":170.83,"end":171.93,"text":"No, I was the one who stopped them from putting it out."},{"start":171.95,"end":172.13,"text":"You know?"},{"start":172.15,"end":172.25,"text":"Sure."},{"start":172.27,"end":172.37,"text":"Sure."},{"start":172.39,"end":172.85,"text":"I didn't have to do it."},{"start":172.87,"end":173.59,"text":"There, see, I'll do that every time."},{"start":173.61,"end":173.71,"text":"Good."},{"start":173.73,"end":173.83,"text":"Good!"},{"start":181.07,"end":201.22,"text":"You won't be very articulate, but you'll be very believable."},{"start":201.25,"end":201.93,"text":"Getting worse and worse and worse."},{"start":201.95,"end":202.11,"text":"Alright?"},{"start":202.13,"end":202.47,"text":"Cut closer, yeah?"},{"start":214.41,"end":234.44,"text":"Who's after him now?"},{"start":234.46,"end":234.6,"text":"Whiter."},{"start":234.62,"end":234.78,"text":"Thurman."},{"start":234.8,"end":234.96,"text":"Thurman."},{"start":234.98,"end":235.14,"text":"Thurman."},{"start":244.35,"end":268.22,"text":"They don't want them on there if you don't want to do that."},{"start":268.24,"end":270.2,"text":"That's what it seems to me."},{"start":270.22,"end":270.5,"text":"You know what?"},{"start":270.52,"end":271.19,"text":"For God's sake, can't be invited."},{"start":271.2,"end":271.93,"text":"And why don't they want Mitchell on?"},{"start":271.95,"end":272.33,"text":"You don't know why."},{"start":272.35,"end":273.09,"text":"They don't want good weapons on them."},{"start":273.11,"end":273.83,"text":"Trying to get in the hell off of it."},{"start":273.85,"end":273.95,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":274.1,"end":301.55,"text":"Yeah, sure."},{"start":301.57,"end":301.91,"text":"Or tomorrow, too."},{"start":301.93,"end":302.13,"text":"Thank you."},{"start":302.15,"end":302.57,"text":"You should know that."},{"start":303.21,"end":324.7,"text":"How does it start?"},{"start":324.72,"end":325.08,"text":"How does it begin?"},{"start":325.1,"end":325.42,"text":"How does it end?"}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald Ziegler discuss media management and the administration's public messaging strategy. The President emphasizes the importance of credibility and selectively managing public statements, specifically referencing his direct intervention to suppress certain information. They briefly touch upon the current media climate and speculate on the motives behind the exclusion of figures like John Mitchell from press coverage.","topics":["Media relations","Public relations","John Mitchell","Press management","White House communications"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-06T20:48:01.044Z"},"topicSlugs":["media-relations","public-relations","john-mitchell","press-management","white-house-communications"],"audioDurationSec":337,"audioFiles":[{"file":"448-017.mp3","bytes":10776576,"durationSec":336.63,"bitrate":256107,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:20:06.081Z","transcriptGapSeconds":220,"transcriptGapShare":0.65,"transcriptQuality":"incomplete","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/448-017.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/448-017","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/448/conversation-448-017","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}