Nixon, Kissinger & Haldeman on Vietnam War and Middle East diplomacy

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript is incomplete. The transcription skipped stretches of speech — roughly 8 minutes of this recording (about 25% of it) is represented by only a few words. Listen to the audio rather than relying on the text below; a corrected transcript is queued.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

Download transcript (.txt) · JSON data

Click a timestamp to play from that point; the page address then links to that moment (e.g. #t=125).

I suppose it is.

.

I'm just, I think it would help to spread the apron so he could hear firsthand from you and from somebody who's confused.

As long as it's in two weeks, if Hanoi does start a negotiation with us, it would be important for him to talk to the Congress about what it is we need to tell them.

Yeah, if it's a report, I don't know what to hear.

No, I don't care about it.

I think in a long day, we didn't say much to each other, and it's not good to complain.

Well, I talked to the senators, and they said, well, they have to see me.

And basically, they said, they wanted to support us.

I was surprised with the proof of the case.

They said they wanted to support us.

No, it's about me eating Joe Mangy somehow.

Get Mangy as they're damned.

Here's what it'll be.

We've been trying to do this, and we're trying, and we can say that they called for a bug out.

And they're the party that bugged out, and we brought this thing to a conclusion.

They're every acting, strangely responsible.

I'm not Kennedy, individually, and not Bill.

Well, of course, I'm Andrew, and both of us have got to understand.

My pleasure.

It's a good idea, frankly, because after all, look, we need them all.

We need them all.

And then we could all debate on the treaty.

And I just wondered, you know, all we know is that

Is that correct?

Well, this has got to be a time travel thing, because the test manager that says, yeah, I need a chance.

I need to send a different letter to the chief.

I'm on a very blind personal challenge there.

So I'll work some time on that.

I thought I gave that letter.

I don't know if it stands for it.

That's very, very perceptive.

I can use most of this.

Yeah.

I'm looking at it politically.

He's having a match.

You know, he's doing terrific, doesn't he?

They have Ross there.

You know, again, he's a fine fellow.

He's 70 years old.

Gets me 70 on it.

I'm 27.

It was a wreck.

Yeah.

Well, we'll wait until tomorrow to see.

I have a, I think it might be a good idea to have, I want to get a company and do all these dull goddamn things up there, you know, and I was thinking that we could end it with our small group.

We'll call it an NFC meeting.

I'll come home here and there.

He's never breathing, my boss.

What do you think?

I'm good.

I'll come home here.

And Rogers can say something.

He's asked about it all the time.

I've got him here.

They all need to hear it.

See, we haven't given anybody a reason not to.

And I just think Friday would be a good time.

Is there anything else you'd like?

a week, a month, even a month.

So if there's any other items, we can pull off further.

We're just thinking on that.

We can do it on that.

That's worthwhile to do that.

But I think you have them all.

That's, by that time, only a few of them involved.

You're going to have committees blow up in about six weeks.

I'm just glad I don't have to.

On that bright day, I don't know.

I think that's what we're going to find besides Tennessee.

That's right.

We ended up not doing it because you wouldn't be ready for it.

We could do one after.

We're swearing in right after that you could do it in Tennessee.

That would be a good idea to sit in, too, for that briefing.

It'd be good to have him sit in on the briefing.

In other words, let it be called one of those where they get all ready.

And that's never going to be a good one to let Shakespeare sit in on.

He's going to come in and say, you know what, let Shakespeare sit in on.

No, that's what I intend.

That's what I have.

Make it a formal meeting and let the others sit in so they all get the feeling that they're in an NSC meeting.

And then you see when we don't have Shakespeare, he comes in.

Well, if you have a swearing-in at 10 o'clock, why don't we have the NFC meeting at 10.30?

10.30 to 12.

I mean, 10.30 to 11.30.

10.30 to 11.30.

What do you think of the Mideast law, Bob, like this?

Well, I don't know.

I think what's going to happen, my prediction, this is not what you've been told.

The Israelis will refuse to withdraw from 67.4.

This goes with Russia, Venezuela.

They'll refuse, and they'll come to you rather than sitting by and giving you the scenario.

Then they trade, they'll refuse again.

And how we play, the Arabs may start fighting again.

50-50 chance.

I consider...

Practically certain that the Israeli is not that serious about not accepting this in the second quarter.

That's what he is.

That's my judgment.

I have no way of knowing.

But I think it's critical to the rest of the United States, because it has a certain service.

I think it was said about it before.

I think that would be excellent.

But do we still do the other NSC on Monday?

The following Monday, yes.

That's acceptable.

You still can't.

I can't.

Do you think the cash is only $1.59?

$1.59.

You wanted him to check, go to the job he did?

I was in there, remembering from the ground, going in.

He did it to me when he was here, and he did it to Walter Stile.

And I noticed, too, it was contracting what everybody said, and I like that.

It's a special part of the language specialist design in the Interpreter Services.

Let's find out.

You know what I mean?

I want to know.

I want to know what it is.

He's 37 years old?

Yeah.

Good God.

Maybe he doesn't know anything else.

So it shouldn't be too useful to us.

Well, it doesn't seem water to you, does it?

If you want to get along with that kind, he's apparently a follower.

If he's more attracted to my heart, that's it.

Who can sit in a conversation without taking a note and writing it down, and that can be a very valuable man to have around.

Just a recording.

You know, he's just a language specialist that's attached to the Interpreter Service Division.

Oh, he's just a... Come over here.

What would he be?

A reporter.

That's a story.

Sit in meetings and then wrap up.

And not just...

I mean, I won't be able to...

I mean, obviously... You said...

He does the kind of thing that Walters can do, but at a level where you might use it on every project.

I just sort of thought that the, we thought Walters certainly isn't a good use of his time.

I understand.

— 1 min 22 s with no transcribed speech —

Yes, sir.

I didn't know whether it was out of Texas

We've given it a special time and reason that we have it.

You know, every hour of the time you spent with Scully and the Chancellor, these guys' time, no one takes off.

If you could find the time to just see these people on the TV, very regularly, I'd see a TV man a day.

I'd keep going around.

I didn't even go to the college.

I'd take anybody.

I'd take any TV man.

But now that I've had it for a long time, he's asked me to meet with a small group of his colleagues.

I'm going to go to the chancellor, and as you say, but also as I say them on a person-to-person basis, I would do RAP.

I would do the other, well, I would try to get Scallion, Sephirot, and those guys too.

I don't know, they're all in the art house.

You have to go from there.

I'm going to get Kronkite.

Why don't you have him separate?

How's that right?

You do a lot of good things on him.

Well, I know.

Cranky.

Cranky, right.

Well, Cranky was such a dole.

You know, he's worse than Severine.

He's as blind to me enough as he went out there once.

That's a dangerous thing.

Uh, uh, go to, uh, Quintero.

Oh, now, you know another thing you might do?

Why don't you see him in New York?

It might be an idea.

You know, they're both out there, etc.

Sure.

No, no, he's here.

He's in London.

I think, uh, don't you think that Cronkite, like a Cronk citizen, actually ought to, what, spend it in New York?

No, he's here.

I think Cronkite, don't they have, they have been radio broadcasters for the next week?

Yeah.

When I call them and see whether he's coming down for them, whether he wants to have lunch, that will be it.

All right, we'll put the two things on the schedule.

You would inform, what do we have to do?

Let's have more grief on Vietnam, rather than like the border to the border, as the chairman of the Chinese army, the military situation.

And then we'll get CISCO and the Middle East.

CISCO and the other informers.

And is there anybody else that should appear at Vietnam?

Is that about all?

Well, you can get helms on the situation in northern Laos, that's... Look, we just had an intelligence briefing of both the Middle East and the U.S.

I mean, you can always take... That'll give them a feeling of a, no, 15-minute briefing.

Okay.

And that'll give us a good subject, and we ought to do that in any way, to close them all together.

And it's a subject that we can discuss with everybody else.

So we may as well have it at the tank, too.

Right, that's good.

Right after Bush is sworn in, invite Bush and build up the whole NFC plus Bush.

The whole NFC plus Bush and, of course, the economy.

I don't want that, but not bad.

I don't want him.

He's not on it.

Just the NFC plus Bush.

I have let the undersecretaries come this time because they serve a blessing.

The attack is coming.

You know, if they do anything, we don't tell them not to.

But I'd let them come.

Don't you think so?

Right.

It'd be good if they're around.

Right.

What folks should come to see on that thing, too?

Well, it would get too good to do military.

Okay.

All right.

If Moore wants me, my life's more than... Moore will do.

No, Moore will do.

Volk isn't on the group.

Incidentally.

Moore will do a good job.

Yes, he's a good job.

— 1 min 30 s with no transcribed speech —

I don't know what kind of being Henry is up to, I don't agree with that.

being over the weekend and being a little panicked to get into the base and, you know, you don't hate me.

And I'd be like, oh shit, you can't send me to that dance.

It's the one area where I think that I'm on a blind spot.

He says to me, he says, gee, as he says, rug, rag merchant, catfish, you know, this man and the other thing.

It's three problems.

One, he is military.

Two, and he just cannot help it.

And two, he is all about the fact that the so-called peace initiative is called the Rogers Peace Initiative.

He gets that sometimes, but not very often.

Rogers is a terrible one to say that.

The President's always, the President's recently.

But Henry, Henry knows.

It often does get called the missing Rogers.

In the assembly, in the whole business of this, he realizes that the committee's things should be settled.

We're trying for Rogers.

Can't stand that.

That's it.

Two points, plus the fact that he's on the plate and his character is too good.

You can see with that kind of thing, you cannot throw him into that area.

He's got nothing to play with.

We cannot have a situation here.

It wasn't intended this way, frankly, where the national security advisor and the president runs the whole goddamn foreign policy.

It doesn't work that way, Bob.

It does not work that way.

It only has.

That's what we need is to redefine the goal beyond it.

I want to run, I can assure you, I'm going to run some of them at the major base flights.

In other words, the Soviet thing, the one that, I don't mind this, this, the one around McRaven, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this.

Well, that very conversation wasn't part of the problem.

But we've really got to start fighting this thing.

I mean, I don't know, but I just can't see how you can have a situation now.

Whether Dale will lie, I don't know.

It's just possible that he's...

He said, I just don't know what more I can do with this thing.

He said, I don't know how to track down who leaked that.

And I said, well, I have a blanking hand in my hand.

He said, I don't know.

He knows Dan Wally, you know, somebody over there put that thing out.

That's right.

Trying to screw us.

And they did.

They tried to screw Henry, but the process is through the credit.

That's right.

Which is what they regularly do.

That's right.

And it doesn't get done here.

The NSC people don't do that.

That's... Henry's right.

But...

This kind of stuff is really ridiculous.

I've got to do more to try and turn some of this on, too.

He said it all blew up in the van when Henry put that thing out to the paper.

He said, son, we should have done it.

We've got all the expenses and so on.

I know Thomas Smith blew up and apparently demanded to see you at the time.

Apparently it was quite a laugh on the horse.

That Smith is about, I want you to let Bill know that my confidence in him is very, very good.

I'm just letting him go over there, but I've got a letter to bring myself to go see him.

Now, that'll be a problem.

That Smith is a disloyal son of a bitch, Bob.

He's not playing our game at all.

Bill recognized the problem, and he knows it's kind of derivative.

Bill is sensitive enough to know that it's a hell of a burden on me, following around.

problems in the economy, and there's your own staff, and you know, and the war and everything, and to have people like this, because you always do, you have to deal with people, you have to, I don't, I don't, I don't, this does not bother me much, except, except that I must say that I, uh,

Childish, that's really what it gets to.

It's just childish and petulant.

And Frank was wishing something to happen for the wrong reason.

I got that.

He shouldn't want this to have a war in the Mideast.

You know that.

He shouldn't want that to grow up here.

Oh.

On the other hand, we wanted to succeed.

You know that well.

Do you disagree with me that he doesn't really have a bias on the Israeli side?

I think he probably does.

I really don't know.

I sense it every time he brings it up.

You know, he doesn't.

Yes, I don't know whether it's a bias on the Israeli side or whether it's a bias.

I agree.

He's tangled in that.

Yeah.

I mean, all this stuff is personal.

He's a...

It's very cold and detached.

Oh.

Childish.

Every head of them can be bad.

Yeah.

and does a superb job in going through mess.

Well, he is detached.

He's a brilliant analyst and strategist, but we've got him.

I think I have done it myself.

I'll let him.

Well, we've had some crashes and some crashes.

We've let him get them.

I'm also about to play him up too much.

That's another thing.

We put him out there in those damn breathing sessions.

I think that's all right.

Don't you?

I don't think Roger's objects to that.

Background talks.

He should go.

Anything this week.

Let's wait a week.

Let Henry do it.

Get all his current...

He's got too much to handle now.

This may involve, this may involve the fact that the Sapphire has a more, the project has a more, very mindful about the Sapphire business.

Larry called me and said, Sapphire's going to order you to talk to me.

What am I supposed to talk to him about?

I thought I ordered through you, but he said something else.

He said something else.

Why does he want to, he wants to go over and talk to me?

This is what he's always done before.

He shouldn't review the speech.

I'm trying to save him.

This, this, on this one I can't understand.

Good God, he has absolute confidence in him.

Sapphire's an editor.

He's going over to see what this, uh, is that a problem?

That's a problem.

Good God, I didn't realize that would be any problem.

I didn't either.

Well, that's the man.

But Jesus Christ, Sapphire has to do a thing without checking with Henry in their schools over at Emory.

And Bob Emory is a lousy writer.

That's the problem.

He goes and reads the speech that will come back and says, I've got that dirty phrase that I've got to rewrite or Sapphire's got to rewrite.

So why not get him in on a diverse instance?

See, that's why Price did so much trouble working with him.

It's because he said, all right, listen to this.

All right?

I just thought that this was

This was so difficult.

Yeah.

What do you think of the, of the, of this?

There's no lie that we can fight against that.

Nixon, Kissinger & Haldeman on Vietnam War and Middle East diplomacy

AI Summary

Audio

NARA Description

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Transcript (AI-generated)

Also recorded on February 23, 1971

Cite this conversation

Nixon, Kissinger & Haldeman on Vietnam War and Middle East diplomacy

AI Summary

Audio

NARA Description

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Transcript (AI-generated)

Also recorded on February 23, 1971

Related conversations

Cite this conversation