On April 21, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, and John W. Dean, III met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:50 pm to 1:43 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 484-013 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
Yeah, I was, I didn't really have anything to pick from.
I just wish for it to make me feel good about the country to find this little, little, mincemeat man.
He was so proud of 43 years at Chrysler, and he's proud that he knew something about arc welding, and he's on the management consultant on Goodman's.
God damn, I don't want to tell you that, your eastern establishment friend would have laughed at this boy.
And not taking $50.
All of my professor friends would have taken this $50.
And saying, I don't want a phony prize.
He probably did get a phony prize anyway.
No, he was very, very good.
And that till tomorrow is plain as light.
Well, no, his plane is late.
His plane was captured at 3.30 this afternoon out of New York, but now his plane's from Moscow, isn't it, Phil?
By eight, we probably will miss each other.
For lunch on Friday, if he doesn't call me tomorrow.
We might as well find out what they've got to say, if anything.
And if he has nothing, that too will be significant.
So I just wear this out.
In that case, we have to go unilaterally.
I just make my salt off of that puddle.
Me and my husband.
How do you recommend that you might make the throne of the public?
You know, I think the idea that Baker has, that somebody needs an ICBM, let's have an ICBM, not a free zone like that.
It's a clever damn move.
Nothing's going to happen to make it one.
We hope.
Well, I think we know.
We have... Why does it?
Defense weapons are no threat to anybody.
Why don't we treat the offense?
Well, we offer them...
But we have proposed to this an offensive statement.
That's what I'm getting is down in the Senate, down in the propaganda.
Let's think about it.
Tell them it's a propaganda.
Why don't they put in a motion to do that and start something else?
If they're all talking about 18M, why not let's have a reason out there?
See, that is our guys' contribution to war.
That's our way.
That's our way, sir.
Gregor's out there, let's get out.
I thought I'd have bacon for lunch sometime or so on the hill.
Well, isn't he perfect?
I don't know him at all.
Well, it's probably worth it.
I think, though, that there isn't any reason really to try to, he's basically simply reacting politically to a situation.
And, you know, I guess the Gurneyans, they both are, I mean, Baker's a very capable man, but some on the lazy side, he's potentially, he's extremely articulate and extremely active.
The Gurneyans are a little on the dumb side.
But usually on our side, all of us don't.
The problem is, though, that both are simply reflecting their male and reflecting the rest.
I must say, I wrote them around the whole month, though, that I...
I don't think that that type of meeting was what I planned.
I told them to get together.
four or five senators who wanted to come in and say, look, we support the president.
We don't give a goddamn what it is.
What can we do to help?
Instead of going in with a crying talk session with a bunch of people.
And I look around that table and I'm lying, wandering around, understanding that Collard didn't and some of the rest, some of the good guys like Bellman and Collard and the rest didn't.
But we shouldn't have the others there.
What the hell was the reason for having them?
The point is, Henry,
Let me put it this way.
I know, good God, who knows better than I that everybody wants to get rid of the war right away?
Who knows better than I that they'd like to get out this summer?
I know it.
I know it.
You know it.
And actually, that's why none of them, well, not them, eight of them at least, the rest, they wouldn't have made the speech, I mean, on April 7th.
They would have caved.
And that's why we got such a, I mean, I can see where Gregor's from.
It was greater than perhaps, you may have realized, I knew it was great.
But Gregor, see, wherever Gregor gets down there, he gets that kind of crap from our friends like Baker.
He has to reflect that opposite.
And Gregor's a stand-up ball.
But the point that we have to bear in mind is that I think the very critical thing that they made, you know, that I've mentioned to you before,
Well, we know that the issue is we put having communists in the streets of Hue or Saigon next year could be destructive to us.
We must also realize that we can
be destroyed also by not finishing it this year.
Do you see my point?
See, I did, and that's really the point they were making.
He said you've got to end it this year.
Well, I did clarify what he meant is tell us an incentive.
They must know.
That's my point.
We've got to pull the rug out from under this year.
So I'm negotiating tracks over him.
The thing to do then
That's over.
Let's have no illusions about that.
They are right.
We wouldn't have lost SSC except for the war.
It would not have been lost.
And also, we wouldn't have the problem that we have on national defense if it were not for the war, curiously enough.
The difficulty is you see this enormous frustration
play it all off before, these dirty bastards.
No, what we've got to do, we've got to get the war off our hands in the right way so that we can turn stronger on national events.
I'm convinced that whatever we deal with the Soviets, we're going to have to do with our events.
They're never going to make a good deal with us.
But let's have no illusions that on that, I think that's the main thing that I got out of, that was, that out of Baker's, of old Baker, Baker, Kirby, and Bob's, all made that, that, gee, that our, that for them to get, to get support for our national defense issues among that kind of people, and that's what we're really talking about, that kind, and the waivers on the other side,
The war presents a very serious problem.
You see, the war has eroded America's confidence up to this point.
People are sick of it.
And so therefore, our aim here, of course, must be to
We've played it right to the hilt with no support for gunmen as far as the last Laotian thing.
Goddamn poor execution on the part of the military.
No support from anybody else.
It's a poor execution of the military.
On the other hand, we also have to realize that simply ending the war in the right way may not save the country.
At this point, it goes too far.
Let's put it this way.
Let's suppose the war ends.
Let's suppose it isn't known until next year.
And the war is over.
And then politically we go down.
No way.
You understand?
Oh, yes.
Everything has to be played now in terms of how we survive.
It has to be played that way.
Not because of the war and not because of Asia, but because of defense.
Goddamn, nobody else is going to be for defense.
Who the hell else is going to be for defense?
Who's going to be sitting there?
Well, of course, it depends entirely how one interprets ending the war.
I...
I think your strength is that you've been a strong president.
That's true.
I agree.
I agree.
I'm simply saying that we realize all the time.
Even if I think the polls, if you had announced a cave-in on April 7th, I think in two months you would have been the way that Johnson was after Glassboro.
You would have had a big rise and then a drop.
But I'm no expert on that.
Let me put it this way.
I had no intention of announcing cave-in, as you know, and I had no intention of it.
As a matter of fact, we took the Laotian gamble solely for the reason that we had one more.
The Laotian gamble cost us.
It cost us very, very seriously.
Because we probably did, well let me put it this way, had it not been done,
I think the comfort we can take on, had it not been done, there certainly would have been a big summer offensive by the communists this summer.
All right.
On the other hand, Dewey did, as Bishop put it pretty well, he felt the war issue was finished last fall.
A lot of us thought it was finished.
Everybody was relaxed.
And that's why we held up rather well in the polls.
The action allows itself, drop this 10 points in the polls, you know how good, just the action.
And then the coverage of the action.
continue to drop us.
We held it off just a little by a press conference.
Then, of course, the 9x9 on television continued to drop us a little.
Then came the Defeat Weekend, which took us a while.
Then came KELP, which took us a while.
And then, for the first time, we got a little bit of a boost by reasons doing something that people wanted in KELP.
But even after the speech, we have to realize we're only back to where we were, not to where we were before we went into the box, but where we were after we'd taken the bubble going into the box.
See my point?
Now, what I'm getting at is that from now on, we have to ruthlessly play for the best news that we can.
No question.
That's why, Henry, that's why I was disturbed about Avery's statement about... You see, it's that, it's what we have to realize from now on, Henry, that people have got to be reassured.
On that I agree, and we have to, well, see, a lot will depend, supposing Hanoi fights at this proposal.
Then, of course, we'll settle the war.
Then we'll settle the war this year, and then we have no problem.
But assuming Hanoi rejects the proposal.
There's where we go.
You want us to re-examine Hanoi.
It doesn't assume rejection.
We've got to examine...
the strongest possible thing we can do this year.
That's my point.
Or we may erode so much that next year won't matter.
I don't assume, you see, Andrew, you've been calculating, and we've all been talking about, well, we'll make a final announcement in April or May of next year.
No, no, no.
The final announcement must be made late this summer.
That's what must be made.
People have got to know.
People have got to know.
I don't mean to put the date on us, sir.
People have got to know before it's over.
They've got to know that.
Preferably it should be made after they leave in the connection, but... Well, we can make it all that long.
But we can wait, we can do...
I'm just saying, we've got to examine it.
Let's remember, if we're going to make a final announcement, don't hold it.
Don't worry so God that much about the PSP's election.
We've got to worry about our own.
Well, I think the final announcement should certainly be made this year.
And it should be part of the next November 15th.
Or it could be November 1st.
Whether it's the 15th or the 1st of November, October 20th, that makes no difference as long as the Vietnamese election is behind the second that we can during the summer.
We'll take a look at the Vietnamese elections.
We'll see how it comes up, who shapes up, who's getting into it.
We'll see.
This summer we can announce the end of American ground combat.
And we can probably, and I'm just going to drive it, announce the end of draftees being sent.
I think you've got to drive that.
When I say that, I think that is... Look, when a guy is hawkish, he's still laughing.
He's hitting it.
God damn it, let's just do it.
Now, I'm getting sick of the military anyway.
They drag their feet about everything, and the bastards want everything, and they're selfish.
You see, for example, if you had a meeting in Midway with Pew...
at which you announce the end of American ground combat plus the end of American draftees those two things that would be a pretty big story that would take the mothers off your back immediately if you could announce that after July 1st no more draftees would be sent to Vietnam can you drive that?
I'm driving it like crazy, Laird is fighting it probably because he wants to leak the thing himself
Aren't you planning to have him in for breakfast one day?
Yes, tomorrow or Friday.
Do you want me to work it out now?
Yes, that would be a good one.
But I wouldn't mention this one to him.
No, no, no, I'm mentioning it for other reasons, Uncle Rich.
Then I suppose you could take him on a boat.
I think breakfast would be plenty for him.
I think he'd prefer to be alone with you because you can talk a little bit.
I think he'd like it, but that's up to you.
No, he would like it.
No, I should come.
He would probably want to pitch about the joint, too.
Another thing we could do Mr. President for this summer is supposing Illinois turns us down.
Then I think out of the midway thing, we should offer a deadline.
We know they're going to turn it down anyway.
You've offered a deadline, but not, never publicly, huh?
By that time, we'll have offered the deadline privately.
They'll have turned it down.
Then we'll offer it publicly.
By that time, that will get the doves off our back for the rest of the summer.
then you can do it unilaterally.
At that time, the offer would be release prisoners, cease fire, and the deadline.
They will then refuse that.
Not bad.
I mean, we'll know about as far as we can go.
I'm just asking how far we can go.
On the other hand, if they have accepted our proposition, so we are not...
then we don't announce that at Midway we'll just get it done during the summer.
And if they have accepted our proposition, the more squealing our opponents do, the better off you are.
Because you know you're going to pull the rug right out from under them.
So either way, once we've made the proposition to them and they've rejected it, we can have a very successful Midway meeting.
What's the situation with regard to...
Well, the rain engine you will see tomorrow and Friday.
I'll ask him for lunch on Friday.
Are you?
Well, that doesn't make any difference about whether you appear to be two leaders.
Sure.
Right now, there's no evidence it's cold turkey.
It's cold turkey.
I'm just going to tell him.
All right.
If he has nothing.
What's up?
If you have nothing, go and see the artist tomorrow.
Well, there isn't going to be any...
There's not going to be any rockers trip to Moscow, honestly.
Yeah, but that's being handled the way the Middle East thing was handled.
They've been preparing that for six weeks.
Well, then nothing should be made.
No, but the way that will work is, the president will bring a letter back from Grubniko.
That's right.
I think it will be outright.
It's Henry and the purpose of where, yes, he will be, and nobody else.
Nobody else will be there.
No, I think it'd be best just to see if that's what it is.
Well, there's a little guy named Chrysler.
He's a fantastic little man.
Is he?
Oh, he's a nice, just a kind of middle-of-America, good citizen, do-gooder type.
Because if we just fell into it, I can't believe how much...
He's terrific.
It's really odd when he walks in this door that we're going to sort of have a little fun.
But he had really...
He could have been a left wing son of a bitch.
He could have handed you a petition to end the war.
That's right.
Well, we knew he wouldn't do that.
You never know exactly what his personality was.
He was terrific.
He didn't take $50 pocket money from the Chinese who offered it when he arrived.
What was the situation?
John Early was telling me that I didn't get to read that it was some of this information.
That apparently those veterans down there were pretty struggling on television.
Oh, they look disgusting.
Oh, they look awesome.
They all keep becoming, they keep becoming a celebrity.
They went to Arlington Cemetery and put a wreath on the soldier and then gave the communist salute.
And I understand that the Ramsey Clark gave him that communist salute.
Did you know that?
I didn't know that.
No, Montgomery gave him the lead.
Mr. Montgomery gave him the lead.
The Ramsey Clark gave him that.
I'm not surprised.
Well, there's a corridor.
I know.
And I heard her.
I said, Jesse, you're just a delay.
Just a delay.
I said, well, you just don't...
In the first place, I said, I don't want a hand laid on them.
I said, you can go in and enter the order and say, gentlemen, you're asked to leave, but then just leave them alone.
Let the sons of bitches air.
And I want them up there in the Capitol.
I'd like a few scrubby people up there grabbing Congressmen when they come through.
The speaker threw in their secretary.
The Southern Democratic chairman then was the speaker this morning.
And they all urged him to get to you and urge you not to do anything to move the veterans out.
They said, just leave it there.
It's, you know, where it ought to be.
And the speaker called Clark and told Clark that, well, there's a reason for doing this all on the ground.
It's the same thing.
They were not doing themselves, they were doing their own cause harm.
That's right.
As soon as you move in on it, you're going to get a massive television coverage.
And that's what they want.
Of the federal government and the president, even though it's Washington police, it will be the president.
They've said on television that we won't go without a confrontation.
But they look at...
Well, he doesn't know anything.
No, he doesn't.
He doesn't know if the conversation has potential.
Yes, he does.
Stable call.
Quinty's trying to adjust.
Do you want to talk to him?
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I just got to be sure.
Dean, John Dean.
I laid it in, and I just said, well, a lot of them ought to come next week to Rock Creek Park.
I said, let them go down here.
Well, that'll pose a security problem.
I said, screw it, let them go.
Now, that's one we really want to think through.
That's where he did this.
Yeah.
So, what'll he do?
And they're talking about 70,000 of them.
Yeah, they won't do that.
Camping in Rock Creek Park, and it seems to me that's the time.
That's the one he wants.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I ought to be sure, I talked to the attorney general this morning earlier this year, that nothing is done on these veterans, is that what you said?
No, no, it's a word out that they are not on the function, they're not to do with the bank.
And if you've got any questions, just say, well, I said it came too late, and they're only going to be here a couple of days.
How do you handle it?
Go ahead, Dylan.
Just let me know.
Tomorrow, I'll go up front.
You just kick it around and kick it around and kick it around and don't do a damn thing.
Get all of the district employees.
They're not going to touch it.
They're going to do nothing.
Just let it raise hell.
Okay.
That's pretty good.
Let's get smart for a change.
You just might be better off to have a confrontation.
and let it run its course, or let this one run its course.
And the veterans are going to go, these people are going to do it.
I saw them on every show.
They look awful.
They really do.
And they had a great quote from one of them.
They said, when are you going to leave?
And one guy said, we're not going to leave until the war ends.
And the other guy says, the hell we aren't.
We're going to leave when the beer in the pot runs out.
Has anything gotten through?
I told Tony that something did get through in terms of the fact that the little thing project I started with regard to how many are veterans.
He's got three reporters in trying to work that and they've got a bunch of non-veterans.
How many found on that memory?
He said, you know, Colson was almost in tears last night.
He said, you know, the problem is the press don't want to run that type of story.
They won't.
They do not want to find the fact that some of these are non-veterans.
They will not run it.
They've got all the veterans organization guys are now coming in, and they're going to rise up in indignation and say, we represent a half a million Vietnam veterans.
That's right.
This is 1,000.
that claim to be Vietnam veterans.
They don't represent it in all that, so they're taking it.
They look like a sick bunch, Mr. President.
Really, they had some clean-shaven...
American saying, I was for the war and now I'm doing it against it.
That would hurt.
They could have really done some harm.
Those guys that put on their neat uniforms, worn their ties, you know, done themselves a look like Calvin.
Wore all, a little like Calvin, didn't run.
Worn all their medals on their, on their prisons.
They, they looked like.
They could have really shook the people.
How many are blacks?
Not many.
Not many.
Just look at the pictures I've seen.
Looks like mostly whites.
And the one black they had on television last night was a real troublemaker.
the leader, that guy that he was on Sunday.
So they're being stupid.
Now they're going to come here on Friday afternoon to turn in their medals.
And we've gone around what to do on that.
The way we're going to do it is just have a White House messenger, just a guy in the mail room,
take the, whatever they turn in, and take it away.
And when somebody asks who he is, they say it's a messenger, an incoming witness to the White House, he receives it.
And no buildup to it at all.
Now the Gold Star mothers have risen up and have said that they want the medals turned over to them.
I don't think we should do that because it makes too big a thing out of them.
that they're going to show up, apparently, at the same time.
The veterans come to turn in there and say, Gold Star Mothers are going to come and bitch about these people.
They're disgracing.
You know, my son turned in a lot more than his medals.
And I said, well, how many, I wonder what kind of medals they've got.
I think some on the reporter, I don't know who the hell these people are.
I'm like the money, there are not too many of them that have terrific records.
There are some.
They're bound to be, they've got, I don't know how many years, but they're probably the ones that are.
They started to think that, that rumor that, you know, that you had said at the Congressional meeting, you know, that 30% would have change or something.
And so that, that got them stirred up.
So they're all supposedly turning in their discharge papers.
Uh, but who, in fact, did you find out who put that out?
No.
No?
Well, then, then, uh, about somebody that got laid quite only by somebody on the Hill did, and I talked to McGregor, and he said that there was no discharge.
I seem to remember.
McGregor was there?
But I thought there might have been some before you came in where I suppose there was somebody else who might have made the same.
I bet you I understood something.
Well, it could be also all of our people, the Cochran's office and all these other things have been playing it down.
You know, there's a hell of a day on all veterans.
Somebody here could very least have said that to him.
But it was not even discussed.
That's what ran my time with you, though.
And somebody at the start of Congress went back and said a different thing.
That's where it came out.
It was on the Hill.
The White House had said this.
It goes to our mother's story.
Has it been knocked down enough or not, the story?
Oh yeah, that story didn't get any right at all.
They said there was a rumor and it was denied by the White House and that was the end of that.
Alright.
But it got then started turning in their discharge papers and now I think somebody, we've got to get somebody to ask for the discharge papers to look through them and see how many veterans there really are there with honorable discharges that serve in Vietnam.
You can tell that.
This is a discharge paper to show the data.
It really is.
It's the scum of the...
It's exactly...
It really looks like the unemployable scum of the...
If there's a thousand there, that's one twentieth of one percent of the men who served in Vietnam.
And that's about what you expect.
And it's the scum of the guys who served in Vietnam.
And it's guys that probably got hooked on dope when they were over there.
They look awful.
They speak into hearing aids.
They look like the sort of person that I think the more they can get on television, the better off we are.
You won't get any violence out of them in any event.
That's why we shouldn't arrest them.
Because they would just let themselves be all the way.
And then, well, the TV camera would go in on some guy with no legs or something, and they'll be thrown into a batty wagon.
Well, this order's not carried out.
We have a new council on the high house.
Oh, it's not carried out.
No, I told Lee, I told Mitchell, there's no question on this.
Well, I know that he was, Mitchell was arguing strongly about the law this morning, and I said, God damn it, forget the law.
He's worried about the Rock Creek Park.
Well, forget it.
Well, the Rock Creek Park, when is the other one, please?
And he said, I was talking to him this morning, he said, there's no problem on that.
We can stall this one.
And then go right ahead on Rock Creek Park.
We have plenty of time.
That's not further than a week.
It might be worth busting them and getting a confrontation.
Why?
Because they'll run loose and tear the town apart.
They want one.
They start busting windows and all that, and they don't have uniforms or medals.
They're just plain shit.
That's like the Chicago rioters.
And that's going to help out.
They'll try to do what they did in Chicago.
That's how they did it in Chicago to try to cancel it.
I thought you said, Bob, this is going to be a peaceful demonstration.
Now, this part, the Saturday one is.
The big march is Saturday.
The big march is Saturday, and that's the National Coalition for Peace or whatever it is.
And that's...
They're going to march the way up.
They're going to gather on the Ellipse, and they're going to march down Pennsylvania Avenue to the Capitol, and they're going to have their activities at the Capitol, and then they're going to come back and have a rock concert in the Sylvan Theater at the Washington Monument Saturday night.
That's Saturday's demonstration.
How many do we expect?
At least 100,000, maybe 200,000.
Based on the bus load, they've got buses and trains to 25,000.
The factor has been the past 4 to 1.
What figures are we getting out?
Is there actually half a million?
Half a million.
Half a million.
And we're trying to push the million, but it's kind of hard to get stuff to carry the half a million.
Half a million is being pushed.
Yeah, and it'll be the biggest demonstration in this year.
Well, they have to go to 400,000 to make it the biggest, right?
It won't be as big as either the biggest or the second biggest.
It'll be the third biggest if it's, you know, which is this big.
Oh, it'll be big enough.
It'll be big enough.
It'll be big enough.
A lot of people.
But don't assume that they aren't going to get it over us, too.
Don't assume it.
How about if they break some windows?
Well, they've made very well.
And they know.
I just think they're better.
But if any Davis group, you can be damn sure it's going to work.
They're working hard.
This group is working hard not to be.
They've got your Quakers.
They're all mobilizing marshals.
And they've got 10,000 marshals, they say, to make sure that they keep them peaceful and quiet.
And they can go that way with their urgency.
All they're going to do is, you know, we lose our point if we get by, if we have any bottomless mess.
They really believe in that.
I mean, he can do a lot of that personal present.
I think he could, you know, kind of reaction to it.
He said that he thought he could handle the problem as far as the Malibu Car, Malibu Marble, Marble Cow, Marble Cow.
Yeah.
I just don't want it to be built up into a huge park.
I don't think it's going to be, but I think it needs, it's, John Stanley's view is exactly right.
When something like that starts to buckle, it can actually go into top class.
Don't let it, don't let it, uh,
Yeah, this is not to go, this is not a demonstration point that I made.
Those bachelors in the bureaucracy over there are out to cut our throat without any question.
They don't even allow something that they know is not a State Department initiative, you know.
Good, sir.
Well, what do you think I saw?
Can I prove that I did?
Kevin Wilson wants to see you.
Oh, hi.
He said, well, he's got a problem.
He's here the 28th through May 4th, which is when you'll be going.
Well, on James, California.
But, oh, you'll be here the 28th.
You get the press conference on the 29th.
Do you want to see him for breakfast on the 30th before you leave for California?
Yeah.
Oh, that'd be all right.
Excellent.
Good.
That's nice.
I'm inviting him for breakfast.
I believe a 9.30, so we have items to .
8.30.
8.30.
It's just an hour.
8 o'clock.
8 o'clock.
Or 8.15, why not?
In that same time period, we've got a bunch of things to get out of the way the next week.
The, uh, the, uh, uh, Mark wants a very, uh,
a brief appointment with Dr. Franklin Williams, who's your representative for negotiating the trust territory for civic violence.
And it's mainly to get a photograph of the guy receiving the commission.
All right, all right.
Anything like that, just to know what you know.
I know what I have.
Anything you know I have, you just put them on.
Okay.
I don't have to prove it.
Then there's the question of meeting with Senator Long on the welfare reform package.
I don't think he's doing that right now.
Is he taking it up?
House vote will conclude here Tuesday.
The rules have come clear for House debate in the third week of May.
They'll get it through the House.
So the thing is to prepare for the Senate Committee on Finance to move on and have this recess, which they think they can do.
What I'm suggesting is a meeting with Long and possibly Bennett.
But Hodgson, Richardson, Schultz, Sterling, why don't we interview?
We're suggesting April 26th.
In other words, before the Senate consideration.
All right, all right, fine.
I've got a drinking meeting, though.
Right.
If I would hop in another area, just in the office.
All right.
The only other one is...
I don't really think we're ready to go there.
We talked, you know, when you had Malik in here about the idea of from time to time you meet with a group of presidential appointees to give them a presidential charge.
Yeah.
Which is a good thing to do, but the group they're suggesting starting that, I don't think it's the right group to start with.
All right.
It's something we want to do, but not figured.
I think maybe so.
Okay.
But I, uh...
I have a very strong interest in the Derry and Gaff highway operation.
Well, I'm just like, yeah, but the question is whether you want to come back to California a day earlier.
No, we're going to attend the signing ceremony.
Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,
I have one reaction that might be the best regarding the welfare thing.
Certainly a number of people think we are right on their life.
and other things as well.
I don't know what he ran into, but apparently it's been quite, quite outstanding.
I don't know.
How is it played?
How did they learn about TV?
They must have got very good television players, right?
They play the right kind of thing.
Somebody apparently said they had something about, you know, the working thing.
I think that's what my mother and my
The kids from Rio Grande, I think I was allowed into it, yes.
But they've got your working pitch in.
I think some of them thought they were hurting you with it.
Like the Boston Globe played it.
It's a very big thing.
A lot of it.
It was played big in the press, too.
Yeah.
And I think a lot of the opposition press played it thinking they were hurting you, but because I didn't call them to go to work.
Did you talk, have you talked to Colson since he was at the hard hat dinner last night?
He was at the construction deal.
And he said the guys there were just ecstatic about it.
A number of them made a, he didn't raise the question, made the point to him, by God, the president really put it to them on welfare, and that's what he's got to do, get these people off their ass.
Of course, that's the labor guys.
Greatest of all, of course, all of them were doing it.
It should be great.
Even the president for me, all that bullshit.
Jerry Porter thinks that, too.
He was all upset about it.
You see, Reagan's been hitting a raw nerve in this thing.
And we've got to hit that nerve too, Bob.
It's, I see what I'm trying to do.
I've got to turn around Hodgson and Ehrlichman and Chelsea and, you know, and Richardson.
I don't think Ehrlichman's too hard on them.
I just can see he doesn't have any problem with Ehrlichman.
Ehrlichman believes in the hard-knock mode, but the others don't.
You know, they basically think we've got to play the liberals.
Screw them.
I could not damn liberals go to hell.
Let them be for helping these bums.
I was wondering if there was a way that you might take that and put it in the ad lib things.
Maybe you've already thought that it's having to sit out and mail strongly to Republicans.
Well, if you're serious, how would that be?
I mean, the speech itself, somebody maybe just saw part of it.
And also get
Don't just send, see what I really mean from the standpoint of the average person with the personal records that I had lived.
So they must be put in and actually edited and cleaned up and so forth.
Not just a handout in the press.
Bedpans and that sort of thing.
Made a lot of people realize that they had to hand over a mother, you know, some of that could get out there too.
What are you doing, sir?
Messing.
and get household help.
And then one of those ones where you hit the right, hit the right chord.
If you've got a, let's get a good little melody song and get the, get our, with a letter or something.
This is a time somebody said this or something like that, maybe from Dole.
And I'd be able to do this with a letter from Ronald Reagan and Nelson Cronkite.
One of the governors, Ronald Reagan, said, why don't you call her?
Why not Reagan?
He's going to cover the whole spectrum.
He's going to be likely to bail it out if he thinks well of it.
I see.
I could give him a better shot.
Why not have Louie done to it?
After all, he's the Chairman of the Republican Governors.
You can do anything you want.
And he'll write a lawyer letter.
I'm the Chairman of the Republican Governors Conference.
I'm very proud of what the President did and so on and so on.
How's that sound to you?
Where's the band?
No, we got off on this.
You said quite well on that Monday that you'd do that.
The daughters are all pleased.
I watched by the general coming back from Arlington, the shaggy veterans went by, some nice little lip-syncing, some of the D.A.R.
ladies were on the steps, and some nice little ladies said, I don't think you're doing our country any good at all.
And they started immediately up the chant, one, two, three, four, we don't want your fucking war.
And said all the ladies just stood there for about a second going,
We sell so much more art than you really think we do, don't you?
Oh, yeah.
I hope so.
I don't know whether there's enough spirit left in the factory.
Did you get the little memorandum I dictated on the meeting with the...
Yeah, it was partly gargling when I was going to check the deep garden, but I don't, it doesn't matter.
I've got enough of it.
You've got the sense of it.
I've got the point.
The curtain doll, I mean, I don't think it has the area, but the same kind of problem with that is it does have a purpose in the plant.
But I think the problem here is that Clark got his whole group and he had his whole staff there and so forth and so on.
And we had plenty of people in the room finding it.
And so it just turned out to be a big session.
What I had in mind was to get five or six guys that really want to come down and say, look, we want to help you.
And we just pledge our support.
And you have them in the back.
And I guess a fire alarm is.
It's a team.
That is the crew he's using as the lab.
I know of some of them.
He has some others.
Well, I don't know.
I think there are too many.
Is there any question about that?
Too many?
You can't have too many then.
You can't have too many staff.
I mean, he actually had himself.
He had tenants.
He had Baloo.
And he had the fellow who used to be with Scott's office.
Four there.
And one other staff.
There were five staff people.
And there were senators.
So, you know, that just doesn't wash.
I mean, they don't have any.
I didn't mean it.
Well...
And it's a thorough school where he wants to come in and go to work.
The other thing is that the full distribution of giant
Did Colson raise that with you this morning?
I asked him to.
Yep.
And they were hand-delivered Friday afternoon.
And I think that is, I think every office, and I've now got McGregor, that's my point, calling back to every senator saying, we're deeply concerned that we've made a very strong effort to get that material to you.
It was hand-delivered to your office Friday afternoon.
And given that and those questions,
I'll read this question.
No, it had a lot of trouble.
No, but it had the handling of the Vietnam War.
Yeah.
And they apparently didn't have that.
And we're going to, which we've got to counter-challenge sometimes.
They always bitch about we don't return their calls and handle their requests.
Now we go back and say, obviously, your communication has some problems, too.
Now, what can we do to do it nicely?
Sure.
to get these things through so that they didn't get your attention.
What I was thinking, though, was that in the future on polls, I'd handle their review.
But you remember I said that system where you could be the two of us together long ago about calling the cabinet people on the phone?
I really feel about that.
That's worth a little time by upset people.
Oh, I can just call the senator or the congressman and say, would you be interested in this?
And I'm sending you a copy.
See?
You have the two numbers.
I think there's some way we've got to get out of that section of the poll, which I don't think Gallup will ever pull on.
Not just, are you a favor or a date, but are you a favor or a date yet?
And then add.
And then include in that also.
Add again.
Hypo again.
What you did at the war.
Do you know what I mean?
He was so aware of all of this.
I mean, he obviously is better staffed, which he would be as an athlete.
and knows, you know, the right stuff gets to him.
He's aware of what's going on.
These other guys, well, stumble along.
These other guys stumble along.
But as I say, even before a meeting, I didn't do this.
That's the way it is.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Sure.
Perfect.
How do we do it?
I know we get this stuff out.
Price index is good.
It is good, I know.
Talk to Schultz.
Three and two.
First quarter, two and a half.
It's 2.7.
Is that adjusted or wrong?
Must be adjusted, but it's the lowest, 67, so how old are you?
Christ, first quarter last year was 6.2, second quarter 6.2, third quarter 4.2, fourth quarter 5.2.
Third quarter is 2.7.
I would rather be that, but nevertheless... Yeah, these are adjusted, all of these are seated now.
That's how they go.
Later on, you know, real life, McCracken's going to breathe.
Let's get a McCracken.
On this one, you know, they breathe something.
I just told Schultz, when the number is good and you can't do anything to knock it down, let him go out and breathe.
What the hell do you know?
Everyone's just going to get someone else to say it's good news, and he'll go out and say it appears to be moderate.
So you go out at the end of the day.
Right.
Well, could I suggest this?
This is a vehicle that we would get from a grader, and if you call people on the hill, and for them to, you know, I don't know, put you in the yard, break, and tell them.
It really is, some of the rancor about this thing.
Let's just start with this one.
I spoke.
You know, I am so reminded of those people.
The first batch that came in are so lovely.
The veterans are, because the veterans had a potential.
Oh, boy.
But what I heard is that I'm so glad they're so lovely.
Television, I think, also does.
Well, actually, for me, you know, you know, you're waiting for the podium.
But the veterans could have been, if they played the smart thing, could have been all shaved and cut their hair.
And, you see, all the shaggy hair, beards, and all that stuff and stuff.
And that just really got them very impressive.
And they were in some cranky fatigues.
Of course, I didn't know what I was doing.
I mean, they got all the fatigues.