Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 497 › Conversation 497-005
Nixon & Haldeman on Public Relations and Federal Relocation
Tuesday, May 11, 1971 · 12:07 PM–12:22 PM ET · Oval Office
AI Summary
President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman discussed a wide range of administrative and political concerns, including public relations strategies for the administration's domestic programs and the management of federal personnel relocations. A significant portion of the conversation focused on the political repercussions of moving federal staff from Ohio to Florida, with Nixon emphasizing the electoral importance of Ohio and the need for better oversight of bureaucratic decisions. Additionally, the two discussed potential budget reallocations for NASA, specifically shifting funds from moon missions to other space projects to maximize public support and political utility.
- Public Relations
- Federal Relocation
- Ohio Politics
- NASA Budget
- Electoral Strategy
Audio
Download MP3 (part 1) · 167.3 MB ·Download MP3 (part 2) · 155.4 MB
This conversation has not yet been cut into its own clip, so the player above contains the full tape segment shared with neighbouring conversations. It begins about 00:57:04 into the tape and ends around 01:07:09.
Transcript (AI-generated)
This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.
Download transcript (.txt) · JSON data
· Timestamps are positions within the full tape recording.
57:18I think you ought to, for the other reason that they're supposed to sell you.
57:46What I'd like you to do, Bob, is that you really need to focus on your girlfriend.
57:53And I can't say this to you for a minute.
57:56I want you to use Skelly more.
57:57Have you ever talked to him, William, about your ideas?
58:01Skelly more.
58:03Why don't you get a...
58:08Early man, Schultz, and I.
58:10Move the program, you understand?
58:13We can help a lot of people.
58:18and they've already been doing it, right?
58:19And yet it's a hell of a thing that we ought to really, really, really jump in on.
58:24All through this government, this family, this family.
58:28But there must be ways that we can turn on tires a lot of things.
58:31I don't know.
58:33The parks, the people, the water.
58:36What else we got?
58:37We're gonna react to it.
58:40We have some to share.
58:43Oh, we've got our, you know, LEAA, we've got, and God damn it, I've got a name for you all.
58:54We may get some breakthroughs.
58:56We're getting some breakthroughs.
58:59We just called the marijuana industry the other day.
59:06Some possibility of a breakthrough with jerky apparently.
59:09He did.
59:09He had it very close in his speech.
59:12I saw that it was in his thoughts.
59:23It's a great thing that we have a president who acts the way he believes he should.
59:31You know, it was a great plan.
59:33I had a suggestion to somebody.
59:35We did it ten minutes ago.
59:36We're out of time.
59:37Now I'll get some others to do the same thing.
59:40We're out of time.
59:42I started writing this and seeing how the paper drove Mitchell for an office season.
59:46People were dating this journalist, a journalist.
59:48They thought you were dating the wrong guy.
59:50This poll center just takes my shots at people.
59:52This is one poll I predict that kind of has to affect how people get to the city.
59:56It's a surprise to us.
59:58We do it all that way.
59:59We do it all that way.
1:00:01We do it all that way.
1:00:01We do it all that way.
1:00:05We do it all that way.
1:00:07We do it all that way.
1:00:09We do it all that way.
1:00:13to pay for the demonstrators, which you know is a clear goddamn failure.
1:00:18Right.
1:00:19And let's get this around and really broker this one like you've never brokered anything before.
1:00:24I give it to every dose.
1:00:27Again, I'm really quite excited about this order.
1:00:31I didn't put it in the news.
1:00:35But I agree.
1:00:36I think you may have hit the one that, you know,
1:00:43I wish we could do something where you could take it out of NASA.
1:00:46Well, no, it's where you could put it in NASA.
1:00:48Take it out of NASA.
1:00:49The thing to take it, cancel the rest of the program and say, well, why not with the space lab in Mars?
1:00:56We're not going to do any more of the landings.
1:00:57That's right.
1:00:58We're going to take all that money, which is, you know, $500 million or something.
1:01:01We're going to put it down as long as possible.
1:01:04I've been sure we'll run the track that we've been on because
1:01:08Well, you look at it and you're not surprised.
1:01:12Death has surprised me a bit.
1:01:13People in Texas are opposed to the space program.
1:01:15Everybody is.
1:01:16Everybody is.
1:01:18They're all against SST.
1:01:19In fact, they've got to sell it.
1:01:21Well, they're all not being opposed to the space program.
1:01:23Well, but we are.
1:01:25We're doing too, I think, too many sums.
1:01:28Well, we don't have too much money.
1:01:31You already go to the departments of people.
1:01:32I'm not going to tell you that letting London Moons tomorrow isn't going to add all that much.
1:01:36I tried to time house to start the space lab and the station.
1:01:40I think the London and the Moon thing, see what we can do in terms of the bugging out.
1:01:44I mean, now they all go squeal around, but I mean, you've got to put the money...
1:01:50I hear you with astronauts.
1:01:51What it is, you know, it's like this.
1:01:53What the hell with the astronauts?
1:01:54That's a half a dozen, you know, a couple dozen astronauts.
1:01:56But there's a lot of other people with them.
1:01:58That's a lot of people.
1:01:59But they can, some of them can ship to water and some of them can ship to...
1:02:02I want to know a couple things, too.
1:02:05I, uh, Saksby mentioned the fact that they are moving 1,500 people from Wright, Patterson, Air Nation of Florida.
1:02:12And if they're in both years, moving days,
1:02:19I was trying to send this to McGregor about that, and they both said, we're out of our freaking minds that we've got a thing going there.
1:02:24And the point is that Roe appropriated $27 million to build it, and we let the federal government have it for nothing, and it's moved to Detroit.
1:02:33And why are they moving to Detroit?
1:02:35Who the hell is making these decisions?
1:02:38The federal government doesn't get it.
1:02:39This is a matter of designation.
1:02:41Who invented AIDS?
1:02:42We do.
1:02:43And why did Volpe use the name of Florida?
1:02:47Well, he hasn't yet.
1:02:48No, I don't think so.
1:02:49I think that's Florida.
1:02:50I understand.
1:02:51Florida, as Jim was saying, we're out of our minds.
1:02:53Florida's important to us.
1:02:55Texas, I mean, Oklahoma, which is the other one under consideration, is important.
1:02:58But Ohio's more important.
1:03:00Ohio's, with the congressional delegation, with the way we bring the taxes, has to be around to work with us.
1:03:05And with the electoral votes, Ohio is the place to go.
1:03:10We've got to do it.
1:03:12And I think you can win Florida for another reason.
1:03:13Sure.
1:03:14That's the point.
1:03:15We've got to go on Florida.
1:03:17Florida's going to get plenty.
1:03:18I mean, they're going to get the boom of tourism and good times and everything.
1:03:23I think Florida will do all right.
1:03:26Listen, I'm not surprised that's the reason, but I didn't know about this.
1:03:29No, he didn't.
1:03:30He just said that.
1:03:31He just said from a political standpoint.
1:03:33He said, I just think it's a mistake.
1:03:35And he says, I just don't think you ought to.
1:03:37I don't want the right actions.
1:03:43Goddamn Defense Department.
1:03:45Now you see, now the White House is supposed to watch those things.
1:03:48Somebody's supposed to watch.
1:03:49Who in this government is watching such things, Bob?
1:03:51Catholics, you can't watch all of it.
1:03:53You know, that's the only way.
1:03:56The congressional guys are watching.
1:03:58Well, get on top of it.
1:04:01Do something regarding it.
1:04:04You don't have to.
1:04:09I think this kind of thing, captain watching can be very helpful, but the real key is to put, is to replace Ernie Webber with a public blood guy in there.
1:04:18I think we've got to insist on that.
1:04:22Just go out of that way.
1:04:25Because that's the guy that could be just the watchdog.
1:04:31There's nothing to sit here and look at how these things are managed so as to do us the most good.
1:04:37Get one and nothing else.
1:04:39And that has been in these people.
1:04:41I don't think, Bob, that it's really, that you really can do it on the basis of.
1:04:49Okay.
1:04:51Why do I have to do it without sitting down and talking and so forth and so on?
1:04:54I think what you say might is maybe you do a great number of them at one time or some damn thing.
1:05:00You know, I have talked to them.
1:05:01Maybe that's better than bringing four or five, you know.
1:05:05How do you select four or five general counsels?
1:05:08Well, you can do this.
1:05:09You just do it on the basis of asking the appointment, and then see if you can get up to five, four or five new applicants.
1:05:16I think you're all out of time.
1:05:19I don't know how much.
1:05:25I'm not sure about that one.
1:05:27I don't know.
1:05:29I don't know.
1:05:32I don't know.
1:05:33I don't know.
1:05:34I don't know.
1:05:35I don't know.
1:05:41The known absentees.
1:05:44The 15 others that are... We've got a better idea than the majority of us.
1:05:51I'm not believing that much is going on.
1:05:55You could be, but that's...
1:05:56It's a big deal.
1:05:59It's a big deal.
1:06:00Ideas, slogans, so forth and so on.
1:06:04It's a...
1:06:18Hit it a little on me.
1:06:20It's okay, that's it.
1:06:20Keep the person's toes up and don't take a breath.
1:06:25That's it.
1:06:26That's it.
1:06:27That's it.
NARA Description
On May 11, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:07 pm to 12:22 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 497-005 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 497-5
Date: May 11, 1971
Time: 12:08 pm - 12:22 pm
Location: Oval Office
The President met with H.R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.
The President's schedule
-Possible press conference
-Schedule
Haldeman's schedule
-John A. Scali, Richard A. Moore
-John D. Ehrlichman, George P. Shultz
The President's programs
-Water
-Parks
-Breeder reactor
-Revenue sharing
-Law Enforcement Assistance Administration [LEAA]
-Public relations needs
-Drugs
-Marijuana
-Turkey
-Police
-John N. Mitchell's speech regarding the President's role in Washington, D.C.
demonstrations
-Other speeches
-Polls
-Coverage of Mitchell's speech
Demonstrators
-A poll
-Effects
-Poll by the Washington Post
-White House efforts
National Aeronautics and Space Administration [NASA]
-Possible water projects
-Reallocation of funds
-Moon shots, spacelab to Mars
-Public support
-Texas and elsewhere
-Compared with Supersonic Transport [SST]
-Programs
-Frank Borman[?]
-Apollo
-Effects, future
-Skylab, Space shuttle
-Jobs
Ohio
-Wright-Patterson Air Force Base [AFB] staff move to Florida
-President's conversation with William B. Saxbe
-Transportation training center move to Florida
-John A. Volpe
-James B. Rhodes
-Clark MacGregor's and William E. Timmons’ views
-Rhodes's offer
-Detroit, Florida
-Volpe's actions
-Florida
-Timmons
-Oklahoma, Texas
-Ohio importance
-Robert A. Taft, Jr. and Saxbe
-Cooperation with administration
-Ohio's importance
Florida
-Economy
Federal facilities
-Saxbe's meeting with the President
-Wright-Patterson AFB
-Defense Department
-Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger's role
-Congressmen
-Weinberger's role
-Arnold Weber's role
The President's schedule
-General counsels
-Frederic V. Malek
-William M. Colmer's lunch
-Colmer
SST
-Possible vote
The President's schedule
-Luncheon
-Possible meeting on Capitol Hill
The President's programs
-Public relations needs
-Shultz
Haldeman left at 12:22 pmAlso recorded on May 11, 1971
- 056-005 9:45 AM · 13 sec — unknown person(s) met in the Cabinet Room of the White House at an unknown time between 9:45 am and 11:59 pm.
- 497-001 11:04 AM · 17 min — President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, John D. Ehrlichman, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:04 am to 11:20 am.
- 497-002 11:20 AM · 31 min — President Richard M. Nixon, William B. Saxbe, and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:20 am to 11:51 am.
- 497-003 11:53 AM · 8 min — President Richard M. Nixon, John W. Barnum, Richard S. Bodman, Robert W. Fri, Stephen Kurzman, William N. Letson, Phillip V. Sanchez, Frederic V. Malek, Daniel T. Kinsley, and White House photographer met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:53 am to 12:07 pm.
- 497-004 12:07 PM · 42 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 12:07 pm and 12:08 pm.
- 497-006 12:22 PM · 8 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at 12:22 pm.
- 497-007 12:22 PM · 6 min — unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 12:22 pm and 2:10 pm.
- 497-008 2:14 PM · 44 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Rose Mary Woods, Alexander M. Haig, Jr., H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Stephen B. Bull, and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the Oval Office of the White House from 2:14 pm to 3:08 pm.
Cite this conversation
Conversation 497-005, May 11, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/497-005 (accessed October 11, 2026).