Conversation 505-004

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I was wrong on that police thing.

We had not done anything on the funeral.

We hadn't.

No, I knew they were doing something, and that's why I raised it.

So what they were doing was pre-on trying to, it doesn't do us any good from a public viewpoint, trying to get some, get the FBI into the thing there.

They asked for help, and we had been trying to get some federal, I want you to put more, right?

Nothing else.

Somebody was going to be put on this.

I want to find out what the hell did happen.

Let's see who dropped that and whether or not it was me.

See, I know they're having a riot, Travis.

around here, Morris, not one of them, who are really concerned about the fact they're getting on the side of the police.

I am not concerned.

I believe this.

I believe it very deeply.

And God damn it to hell, I'm getting on the side of the police.

You understand?

Sure.

And I just can't understand how we missed that.

It's the biggest damn story there is now.

It's the big story.

We've got to not only hear substantively and not any other way.

Substances make a bullshit bit of difference.

Diddly doesn't mean nothing.

I know the substantives.

What about law?

We can't support that, but that's a hell of a strong bill.

We've got to do something on it, and I want Mitchell to come up with something.

We've just got to quit crapping around and shooting these goddamn police in the back.

I mean, I see all the telephone calls, as I said, except for now and then they all place a nice call to somebody from Vietnam, which I like to do.

Most of them, there's somebody that walked a pollution barge or some other goddamn thing.

I don't give a shit about that.

And it's not our constituency, if I can just say that.

It's not our constituency.

Do you think you could put one man on a gun?

Just one single little man?

He very much got the point.

Did you call him?

Oh, yeah.

And he realized it.

Yeah.

Maybe I should call him.

Maybe I should call him a widow's son.

Well, I raised that point.

Who are you?

Why not?

I don't want to go in publicly now.

That's right.

Publicly.

God damn it.

It looks like just like the way they followed up the Washington riot thing.

We waited until Saturday rather than doing it Thursday.

They were coming in with a recommendation.

Anyway, there's also a phone recommendation to the...

There's a widow of a cop here.

There's a guy up there, too.

The black?

No, he's not.

No, no, no.

No, no, two police.

Some other, the police benevolent association guy, I guess.

And they had some point in mind of working with him on something.

Yeah, Colson.

Right, wow.

I don't see a reason to get this point across to anybody.

I don't understand it, Bob.

Will you please tell them more?

I feel very strongly about it.

Just the way I feel about it.

I feel about the Black Panthers and the rest.

You know, you read these papers, you get the impression that Bobby Steele was let off, Schick was let off.

They just couldn't get a jury.

That was the only problem.

It had nothing to do with the merits of the goddamn case.

Well, they couldn't get a goddamn jury.

No, no, they got a jury.

I know that they had two racists on them.

That's what they say now.

They could get a jury to come into the court.

So the judge let him off.

So now he's free.

That's the court thing.

That's that's.

The argument is that the jury was 11 to 1 for acquittal.

10 to 1, 10 to 2 at one point and 11 to 1 for acquittal.

That there were two racists that wouldn't acquit.

I think he was 12 racists.

Everybody's bending over back to third.

That crazy woman out there will probably get out of here.

No, this is one man away.

I want a goddamn strong statement on marijuana.

Can I get that out of this son of a bitchy?

Yeah, domestic counsel.

Sure.

I mean, one on marijuana that just tears the ass off of him.

I see another in the news summary this morning, but... You know, it's a funny thing.

Every one of the bastards that are out for legalized marijuana is Jewish.

What in the Christ is the matter with the Jews, Bob?

What is the matter with them?

I suppose because most of them are psychiatrists, you know.

There are so many.

All the great psychiatrists are Jewish.

By God, we are going to get the marijuana thing.

And I want to get it right and square and close.

I want to find a way to put more on that, more on somebody else.

Would you do that?

Yep.

I want to get it.

I'm against legalizing all that sort of thing.

Maybe do it through the comments.

I don't know.

Yes.

That might be a good idea.

Right.

All right.

Sit down.

I, uh, just wanted to check on that pew thing.

Yeah, let's put it off.

All right.

You get in today.

You could give me two days, uh, such so that they go off.

Good.

I agree.

You want to get out of the hubby thing?

Or do you want to do the hubby thing?

All right.

50 pence after the 18.

What is the lucky date?

Lucky date is the 24th.

24th, 25th, 25th.

Let's get out of here.

We can get out of the Fed NGO in California for that.

Your budget and gold sessions are the following week.

Well, they need to do it.

All right, Bob.

All right, let's do it again.

Bob, that's all I've got to say.

That weekend of the 23rd.

Why do you want to do it on the weekend?

That's terrible.

No, we can do it in the middle of the week.

It's just better for us.

It could be.

We'll probably get the North Vietnamese answer the following, the preceding weekend.

Tell me what the weekends are.

19th and 20th is one weekend.

Why don't we have the next week?

Father, we don't have anything.

You're going to have to follow him.

That Sunday father just bothers to hell with that.

And what does the following week, next day do?

Nothing.

Well, no, no, the 29th is that productivity committee meeting.

To hell with that.

I don't have to go to that.

That's one of those shows.

I do not have to go to that.

Yeah, that's one.

We really do have to be committed.

Not on my mountain.

Well, it's the 29th.

We'd be back by then.

No.

No, it's the 29th.

We need to do this.

We should have it in California.

Yeah.

That's the only thing you've got.

We're clear on anything else.

Yeah, what is it?

29th.

Which is the following Tuesday.

No problem.

We should have the few things enough behind us in case I go out to Asia, arriving on the first, so it should be... 24th or 25th, it'd be distracting.

Why don't you get it down to 24th instead of 67th?

Behind the 4th?

23rd, 4th, and 5th.

23rd is a little too soon because we've got to announce it after the meeting in Paris.

We shouldn't announce it before.

What's the meeting in Paris?

Probably the 18th.

Or 19th.

That's five days after.

Why do you want to put it off the 1st of July?

Well, if the Chinese think I'm through, I'll be on the trip on July 1st.

And I should know what went on there so that I'm not

I think we ought to have all the cards.

Well, except it's one of the factors they'll take into account.

Yeah.

And do you want to do it so that you can go right on?

That doesn't have to be.

24, 25, 26 is fine.

All right, 24.

What's that?

The first day.

I say you do it on a Saturday or Sunday.

Well, what are the dates?

What are the dates?

23rd, 4th, and 5th.

What is Saturday, Bob?

Saturday's the 26th.

Oh, the 24th and 25th.

Saturday's a lousy day for it, too, though.

How about the 27th?

What's the matter with that, Senator?

Okay.

Well, 27 is something.

Father, 28, what's the matter with that?

That's fine.

28 would be okay.

Well, it would be good.

28, let's go with 28.

28 would be best.

That's right.

28, let's do that.

Good.

Give you a good time.

That's good.

That would be good.

Oh, no.

Exactly.

Sure as you do that.

So, Breeland got the letter from Presidio now, and we'll just...

But we have, we'll exchange them, and I'll also hand him that little note.

Right.

Together with it.

And the Vice President, Walgrast, I called on Monday on behalf of the President Johnson to say how much they all appreciate it.

How beautiful.

Yeah.

Yeah, well...

That's right.

The Vice President is bugging that if he breathes it out of me, what Korea is setting to do.

Well, A, he wants to travel all over Asia while he's doing that.

No.

He should stay out of countries that I may visit on this trip, because it would confuse things.

But the major thing is that he's got his heart set on Greece.

Let him go.

Chip, we've done enough.

It doesn't make any difference, for Christ's sakes, on Greece.

I mean, we, um, let me ask you this.

Do you think anybody is against the Greek Congress for me?

Uh-uh.

I don't think so.

Come on.

Not for the money.

No, no, no.

But I mean, the point is, for Christ's sake, everybody, I'm for NATO.

Greece has got 18 divisions, and I don't have critics about three continents.

We'll just stir everybody up, and we get nothing out of it.

That's the only, it's a purely personal thing, which is understandable.

I think he'll settle for letting his family go to Greece, and as long as we let him go to some other European country.

God damn it, why is he going to go to all these places, Bob?

He shouldn't be sticking around here.

They're doing some work.

You know what I mean?

Really, I mean, he's doing work, but that means there's more mileage for him to make here now than right now if he goes abroad.

He's done well abroad, but if he goes abroad and screws something up, it's a bad, bad time.

All right, he's going to Korea or what other country over there.

But he won't.

What?

Well, he wants to go to Thailand.

He wants to go to... That's an honor.

No, no.

He wants to go to Japan.

My only concern is, since I need to visit some of these countries to cover my trip, we don't want to give the impression that we're cranking up something, and I don't want to be tied up with him.

When does he, uh... Well, I'm using the July 3rd Korean thing, and I'm going with him as a cover if the Chinese thing comes up.

Oh, okay.

But then I was going to leave him and hop around until the next weekend.

Yaya Khan.

Yaya has, incidentally, he's set up a tremendous cover operation.

Yeah, until... No way the Chinese are flying to his place rather than you're flying to their place.

Yes.

That's what I was thinking.

Yeah, that's... Well, because Mr. Benson... Our ambassador feels, and I think he's right...

that it would be bugged by the Pakistanis and given their volatile political situation.

We don't know in whose hands.

All it involves is hopping over the Himalayas to an airfield on their side.

It's only an hour's flight.

And it's probably less noticeable than the Chinese... Chinese delegation coming here.

Not coming there.

Well, we don't have to be opposed to that.

But it may not be.

Oh, no, no.

I don't know.

Give him another year.

He can go to any country.

Go see the Pope.

Has he seen the Pope?

No.

Christ, everybody's seen the Pope.

Go see him.

Roger's seen him.

Hope he's not going.

He hasn't, but he can go to Italy.

He can go to Spain.

He can go to Portugal.

He wants to go down there.

He might think a little of the Congo would be good.

I think he wants to take his wife and daughter, frankly.

All right, so it's a nice place, Kenya.

All those places are beautiful places to go to.

Why don't you try that for me?

See if it's your answer.

No, I really ought to do things like that.

I think it's just an environment problem if you agree with something.

I had thought every time we sent one of these chem drugs to God, it's a real pain in the ass.

Maybe because they had to report to us.

Finch and Rumsfeld believed they hid the drugs, but they come back.

That was all, but...

Boy, Maury, he...

He sure got a few reports, didn't he?

No, I'm saying that today.

You're saying that?

Crank, you wrote a report.

I read the report.

He calls every other day, and I don't want to test it.

I don't see a cabinet officer when he wants to do it.

And I've... Now I've told him to send over his... That Gleason thing, and we'll approve it.

But anywho...

I don't know.

Get down to some inoculum or something.

Go to the zealot.

Kyle, that's all right.

I'll stir it.

It might be all right.

Go to the zealot.

Go to Rand.

Go on.

That's good.

Say that aloud to the others.

These are more sensitive areas.

They put my ass out through that door, first time, and nobody ever tested it with it.

But Christ, we have got these cataracts involved, my friend.

So goddamn spoiled that every time they turn around, they want to go here, there, and every place, and take Air Force One.

See, he takes Air Force One.

Remember once you didn't give him the DACA because the president needed it and he carried on as if because he was getting around to this plan.

Billy Graham has been calling that nothing you need to do about it about the daughter of some Jewish lady.

who is being tried in Riga, and every Presbyterian, Jewish, and other group is passing resolutions.

All I want to hear is...

I'd rather be able to say the hell out of it.

There's nothing going to happen.

Listen, you know, when I saw Khrushchev, they had me talk to him, and I did.

I talked to him about the flyers and also about their handling.

The flyers, he expected to just give them that pig-like look, and that was all.

But when I mentioned the Jewish people there, the right thing to do was to

He said, uh, what's his name, uh, who was the, the army?

He's Jewish.

He is Jewish.

They go on and on.

He, he, we get to know him.

Right, that's the one thing that they're just sensing.

They're rat.

And they are, they are, and also they are basically anti-Semitic.

Of course they are.

The Russians are the people who are anti-Semitic.

And the fools are.

Like talking to Eastland about Negroes, it's just, you know, it's in their blood.

Seriously, it's just...

The Poles are terrible, terrible, and they're, as people, they're wrong, even though their great positions are Jewish.

They deserve to be nice.

And God says we'll have a heart attack.

I just mentioned it to you in case Graham gets through to you so that you know I've...

I don't know him myself, but he did want to go there, but let him go with the war.

It really is a way to pay attention to that.

Congo is good.

Get out those goddamn fireboats.

Ken, frankly, it's a great thing.

It is.

Have you ever been there?

I've been there.

I don't think that's what he's got in mind, but I'll... Yeah, he wants to only want to go there.

Uh, but not with his wife and daughter.

That's nice, sir.

I think what he really has in mind is a sort of vacation trip through Europe and... Well, Christ, six weeks in the Mediterranean, cruising... Why doesn't he get some of the countries that he forgot?

Austria would love to have somebody come.

That would be great.

Salisbury's a marvelous time to go.

We should go to Austria.

How about traveling to Hungary?

You want to go to Hungary?

No, here's a good idea.

You should go to Budapest.

But he could go to Scandinavia.

He could go to Denmark.

Yes, not Sweden.

Denmark is good.

No, he'll catch all sorts of hell there.

Scandinavia is a smart country.

Austria is good.

He can go.

I don't know whether he's feeling true.

I mean, he can't do any damage there.

That's no problem.

We may have that settled by then.

It's up to us, and that's why I think I ought to put it to Dupree in another 10 days.

Because why should we pay for a summit and then after they've got Berlin, after they've got the trade, then they may really discuss it.

That's what I thought.

Did you talk to anybody about the post-conference things?

Did you talk to anybody about it?

What is the general feeling?

General feeling is that Tuesday's probably better.

The audience that we're still trying to get a better fix on it, it's probably better Friday.

It may be better Friday, but it's probably not going to be as great of a cut as it is.

See, the only one that did more is the reaction Friday's better.

Because that Memorial Day weekend is a period that you may just totally dominate if you did the thing on Friday.

The argument for waiting until Tuesday is that yesterday was a big deal.

And that for a weekend, your West Point pick will get a flip on Saturday.

I don't think it will.

I don't think there is a...

It looks like another argument can get lodged.

You'll get more, maybe, at West Point than any over a weekend.

All right.

Why?

Because he thinks we've got enough going this week that we don't yet.

He's thinking of writing about it.

He should be thinking of writing about it.

Okay.

Well, I'm going to leave it at that.

I don't care.

All right.

I'm no expert on the publicist Tuesday because over the holiday people will be occupied with other things and Tuesday you'll be starting the new week dominating.

The thing, Bob, is this, on the other hand, people are going to be thinking over the weekend.

You know, when they go out, it's not good.

Or maybe people, when they go out on the weekend, don't talk about what the hell it is.

They haven't been able to find it.

It's one of those things.

You can't have a good press anyway.

Well, it's like you can't ride on a good press.

You have to keep pushing it.

We're going to do something about these cops and I swear to God I'm just talking to Bob and I'm giving this whole staff hell because they come in here and they always want me to do something for the environment most of the year and save development of the year and all that bullshit.

For Christ's sake, here are two copters shot in the back in New York and a copter shot in the back here in Washington.

And we've got to get on the side of the police.

Absolutely.

Goddamn it.

You notice even the neighbors are on the side of the police up there.

There was one Negro policeman who was shot in the back.

The one yesterday was blind.

The one they buried yesterday.

Up in the garden.

Yeah, that big zero was a blind man.

Forty-five cities around here.

A Negro minister got up and spoke about it now.

Bobby Steele was let out.

All the rest of the goddamn country is outraged now.

I can't understand why nobody saw this.

Can't they see this?

He's on the other side of it.

He's liberal.

Morris sees it, doesn't he?

Oh, yeah.

Why didn't he say something then, Bob?

Why in the name of God didn't he say what he said?

The president should write a letter.

The president should make a telephone call.

The president should call the widow.

The president should have a thing.

You see, the difficulty with mention, there's no God in imagination.

None of you shop over there with regard to how to...

to get on the right side of this issue.

I feel very strongly about this.

I don't worry too much about civil rights doing the right thing rather than getting on the right side of the issue.

Doing the right thing, good God is doing the right thing to be on the side of the police.

He's doing the right thing.

I don't disagree.

Is there anything I disagree with that?

No, I don't think so.

You can't on this issue.

It's a black place.

So they think, you know, the cops think it's a plot now.

A plot.

To kill the police.

I agree.

Yeah, because they've killed three in New York for quite some time now.

They've averaged they've killed three policemen every two weeks.

Oh, really?

Yes, sir.

More than the first five months of this year and all of last year they've killed already.

One other Jewish prophet there, Max Fisher and Rabbi Schachter have been trying to get in to see you for three weeks.

And we've been sitting on it for days.

Well, but there's a telegram on the flight of Soviet tourists, and again... Well, I'm all for that.

Just say it.

I'm all for it.

You know, I didn't know very well how to get them in here.

But moreover, it'd be long now.

It's just going to catch you.

It's the one issue that knocks the load on you.

I don't mind locking a Soviet out of a box for something that has to do with their interests, but nothing that has to do with their emotions.

I think the State Department, I've drafted something the State Department can apply and which they can quote something you said last January 11th.

So it isn't a new deal.

If you agree with that, I... Oh, sure.

I shouldn't see it now.

I just don't want to get into it.

So we have got an external presence taped up to this.

And it will infuriate the Russians for no good end.

Henry, listen.

Fucking can't be.

It isn't worth a damn.

We're talking politics.

It's a political issue.

People say, what the hell are the Americans going to get into a fight with the Soviet about the Jewish persecution?

They don't want it.

Now, that doesn't mean that we don't stand up for it, but the American people now, at this time, are goddamn sensitive about getting into a fight with anybody except for themselves.

The country is solid.

Most of them don't really want to do that.

Hell no.

I was over at HCW this morning talking to the staff about your foreign policy.

Did you bring it with you?

No, I got an ovation.

I said, the hell with me.

I said, I won't even talk to you about Vietnam.

Ask me questions if you want to look at the revolution this president has brought in foreign policy.

And there was only one question on Vietnam.

It was the senior staff.

There was only about, what, 75?

That was the line I took with the Southern editor yesterday.

I took the line.

Well, now, Vietnam, I'm not going to go into detail about that one, sir.

The Russian problem.

That's sure the way to put it.

In the context of the large problems, in the context of the Soviet, the Chinese, the Soviet Union, it's turning to death.

I don't spend all night talking about Vietnam.

Getting back to private, I just don't know what you're going to say.

Oh, excuse me.

I prefer Tuesday.

By instinct, I'm no expert on audience, but people will be coming back from a weekend wondering what's going to happen now.

Then the president will step in.

If you do it right, it's the end of the period.

And on Memorial Day weekend, people will probably be occupied with, they probably don't want to hear about Vietnam or insult.

But Tuesday, they'll be charged up and you can take command of that next phase.

I think that's how it looks to me.

Without another factor, this is not making the trip.

Yeah, the following weeks.

If you were making the trip, then that's true.

They voted strongly for doing Friday.

Yeah.

Because you get a bigger time.

Yeah.

Two big events, but without the trip.

You know, we might do this.

I think it might be a good idea to make it to...

Ducey, how about announcing it in advance?

Announcing it Friday or Thursday?

Yeah, that's what I'm getting on the press conference.

And he got all that knocked down and so forth.

Sure, issues may come up we don't like and so forth, but they come up anyway.

I never met a press conference and it wasn't some goddamn thing that somebody came up and that's what we're here for.

All right, have him announce it.

Let Ron announce it to you during the press conference.

Well, you should announce it now.

Once you're in the press conference.

That gives you the ride of, you know, the fact that it is going to come up.

Another item, Mr. President.

Indira Gandhi has written you a letter.

I don't know about that.

And I think...

Well, no, we should answer it.

Let me say one other thing.

Well, and you can tell her, you can use it to bring pressure on her not to take military action.

Also, I talked to the Pakistan ambassador, and he said that Yaya might appreciate a letter, which would give him an excuse to answer all the things, by listing all the things he's doing, because he can't get any publicity here.

Oh.

And conversely, Indira Gandhi, I'll check with the Indian ambassador.

We're getting so deviant now.

She would like to be able to say that one result of her letter was that you've written to Yahya, so everybody's happy.

The Pakistanis will be happy.

No, but we don't say against Yahya.

No, no, you just say you hope the refugees will soon be able to go back to East Pakistan.

He will then reply to you, that's exactly what he wants.

I've got it all arranged with him.

Go ahead.

Then you can take credit.

You can tell the Indians to fight down.

And we'll keep y'all young.

They're such bastards.

That's another thing.

Incidentally, I've been meeting with Brampton.

I've shown him a few of dissolved studies.

He's doing a book on your foreign policy.

Oh, yeah.

He may change his mind by the time the book is published, but right now he says this is the most out there.

All of it is out there.

Right now they are... Well, no, no, they really...

I haven't heard now since the election

All the newsmen that I meet socially now go back to the line of October that this is a great period in foreign policy, you know, good in domestic policy.

But foreign policy, it's a great period.

We have to remember, Henry, that as far as the people concerned,

I agree it is.

We know we're doing the right thing as far as the people are concerned.

This is not domestic reform policy at the present time.

It is not good.

10.7 is February.

It is not good.

And we've gone from the main, there's what happens to all the rest.

It's that.

And so therefore, as far as the equity, the first concern we give them about all this stuff, one day you're an intellectual student now, I agree.

But as far as that's concerned, that's why in Vietnam, and we're, we don't want to do anything wrong, but we've got to remember, we've got to bring this one jump ahead of the sheriff.

There's a terrible solution.

And we did that, I've analyzed it all.

Look, it didn't have to be a bomb today, we beat them.

They're not rebels.

On the other hand, they look at us like we're a goddamn moron.

You don't see anybody that wants to win and you don't see anybody that's interested in honor.

But it has to be weighed against where we would be if they had hit us in August.

I have no, I have no doubts, whatever, about what we have done or what we're going to do.

I think we're absolutely right when we look at that wonderful show.

And it's not about this issue.

We have to realize, though, in terms of the effect on us, that it's a drag at the moment.

It's like a, it's a drag.

And it's a curious thing.

It's a...

It has to do with the securitism factor that, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, uh,

And he said, in our country, in our part of the world, we say trust is like a thin thread.

Once you break it, it is almost impossible to splice it together.

You see, with the Laotian men, it was the...

Not because we did it wrong, but because we did a lousy job at the beginning of the summit.

We should have gone out and explained it from the beginning.

That son of a bitch Abrams should not have gone out when we were in Florida and rushed out and put on that black hat and all the rest of it.

After all, Laos is a bloodhound.

The crisis of casualties never went over 100 during the whole period.

There was only a number of people who got underserved.

But my point is, the press did a job, and it had an effect on the trust of American people.

What is holding us up now in the present time is not foreign policy.

Not at all.

Matter of fact, most people don't know where the hell China is or Russia, except it's far away.

They have a little interest in the Mideast, but that's a goddamn small constituency.

You notice how few questions we get in the Mideast press conferences.

The Middle East.

A few questions.

It's horribly important.

The Cuban continent, they understand that.

It's close.

But the point is that at the present time, that the Mideast side, you know, and all of its ramifications

The economy has, shall we say, prepared the last November and October.

It's 30% better.

In other words, people feel better, even though the market's taken a few steps over the last couple of weeks.

But you see, the difficulty with the Vietnam issue is that

That the best example of it is that, is that Paul Bader, the time he met with the Senators that day, remember?

Here's one of the strongest talks we've ever gotten.

I remember how he's crying around, he says all of his people want to get out of Vietnam.

Well, he's wrong.

He's talking about some of his people and also he's showing lots of, an abysmal lack of guts.

But on the other hand, uh, on the other hand, Bader is reflecting what is a current situation.

Now some are at fault.

It's the fault of Abrams and all the rest of them.

They screwed up this goddamn thing.

As it was, and still, even when it's, even what happened, it's had a good effect.

Because I don't, I don't dare to dream, but...

It is just fairly possible that by the middle of June they'll accept our basic proposition.

They could.

If they do.

Even if they don't, let me say, the main thing is to have an announcement.

First, have a preliminary announcement.

If they don't, this is our main preliminary announcement.

offering the deadline for the ceasefire, they will turn it down.

And then immediately after the election, the South Vietnamese announced that they were going to get out and get out.

That's all you have to do.

That's, uh, because there's one thing that I realize is funny, isn't that?

Last year, all the polls were loaded, but one thing that was not loaded was whether the people believed we were going to be out.

And they don't think so.

They do not think so.

They have been so brainwashed by the press, by our critics and the rest of the press, they don't believe it, that we're all the way out.

They don't even know it.

I don't think we've come down and had people have a couple.

That isn't just a young couple.

Every book shows that, including ours.

I think it's better for you and me to pull ourselves.

Now, what happens here is we're fighting an establishment.

uh, people that have no, no, that's diverse, but, uh, got in, they had a paranoia on this subject.

On the other hand, I noticed that at some rate, there was a couple of very bright spots, got that one on that graph, oh, I was surprised they voted down that Nelson amendment.

And strong.

And they held out a lot of them.

A lot of them.

Captain Kennedy, I don't know whether that was his decision.

Come on, let's go read and listen.

Oh, we didn't listen, don't stop.

Uh, 3,000 strong opponents.

Yeah.

He was against that.

That was voted down strongly, not as strongly as military.

Uh, two to one, but bang, bang, bang, they all went right down.

You see, uh, you see, it does mean that, thank God, our senators at the end of the day couldn't, but you see, they're intelligent people who agree to all these elections.

Yeah, but I think that's a bit... We have no illusions.

We must have no illusions about the fact that on the critical issue of Vietnam,

While even our own polls show that, at least on the plus side, our own polls, if you give a precise question, say they favor our withdrawal policy in second, they favor, or they're evenly split, to be quite honest.

They're approximately even split on the president's conduct in the war.

They have sort of a gut reaction if we're doing the right thing.

It's better to be even split, 49-40.

But be that as it may, my point is that without Laos, could it be 63?

See, Laos hasn't had, we haven't realized, in all honesty, we haven't acknowledged that on the credibility of that.

And it had an effect because these goddamn television people hit it daily.

And we had nothing else.

Your thin thread analogy is absolutely perfect.

We had a thin thread of confidence.

It wasn't so much as confidence that we were getting television.

Well, there were three things wrong with love.

One was that we didn't go on.

I think we should have explained it at the beginning because no one really understood it.

So we bought ourselves a little time, a little quiet at the beginning at the expense of the basic problem later on.

The second thing was the news blackout which started it all growing and compounded it.

And the third thing was the way Abrams bungled it.

We had come out with an overwhelming success as we were with an ace of doing.

That's what breaks my heart.

I've studied every document.

We were two weeks away of a...

You know, Henry, the thing about it is that all battles of war are that way.

They're all goddamned close.

Nobody wins all the battles of war unless you're fighting the Italians.

Now, under the Serge Texas, what you have here is that, you know, there's the great battle of the Civil War, and I ended up fighting a two-man job.

I blame myself.

I... Well, I should have gotten that in the lair, gotten that in his ass.

He was in here.

Now he's put a miscropion on us.

Who's this Colonel Henderson screwing up Pop-Pop now?

Is he still in the service?

Get him out.

He's the one that's under corporation.

All right, then.

Put him in the plane.

Fire him.

We trusted Abrams.

Actually, Westy, whom, when it didn't look right to me, I got Westy over and for once he was right.

But that's when Leia complained to you about mixing it with...

I'm trying to run an order from here.

Put that in the record.

It is.

No, I don't care about who did what to whom.

Except that I think, Henry, let me say, having said all this, on the field of foreign policy, we're doing a hell of a job.

If we have trouble, as the country does, though, we have that.

By the country, I do not mean your country.

Your country is a very different country.

You live with these high circles of all these intellectuals and these smart people, which have said the rest.

But I need my country.

I need that average guy out there across the country.

I don't need Morgan like son of a bitch and head off and so forth.

The guys who fight the wars and all the rest.

And my country, they don't know about Sullivan.

They don't know about...

China, and this and that.

We just want to be left alone.

Patriotic as hell, just want to fight and so forth.

But we're just pissed off because, oh, Bryce, we tried.

He's been there six years.

Ain't that tough enough?

Let her get out.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Now, on that point, what we have to do over a period of time, and the only thing that's going to change my country,

is really some stunning successes that they have seen.

They will read no columns.

These people do not read.

They look at television.

They look at the view of the television that says it will have some effect on them.

But usually what will affect these people are not what Eric Severide says.

Or not what one of the, or not what John Chancellor said.

It's just pictures, pictures, pictures, pictures of blood flowing.

Or pictures that are fantastic and realistic.

You see, we live, unfortunately, we live in a different time.

We live in a time when, you know, we just stand more accurate on television.

The American people take four or five more years.

What time?

35 years of sleep?

What the hell does that mean?

That's the way Lars killed us.

Because that enables TV to put it on as a shot then.

No, no, but that enables them.

And it showed even before then, every night they had pictures of helicopters and so forth.

And they had helicopters.

But even then, I remember after the phone fell, things were turning.

And of course, I don't believe it, but if the 10% chance of these guys negotiate this summer, it will all be forgotten.

No, it will be forgotten.

Let's not even think that there's any chance of that unless that context is afraid.

It's like making up a following from the package.

Maybe they'll follow very often, not the old days.

What we really have this time is a surrogacy in our own minds.

And that's what I told these people yesterday.

I said this one thing.

Oh, there are uncertainties in other areas of the foreign policy.

There's a surrogacy in another area of the foreign policy.

As far as Vietnam, which appears to be one of the most difficult, is actually the most certain.

Because we've got to fly.

And the American involvement is going to end.

Period.

That's all.

Do you realize it?

Vietnam is the one thing between now and likely future.

We can't count on the Russians.

We can't count on the Chinese.

We can't count on the Middle East.

We can't count on Berlin.

We can't count on Cuba.

We can't count on Vietnam.

And the main thing is to

I think it's in our interest to both pull it off and keep Saigon from collapsing before November.

It's blacks fighting the whites.

That's the national problem.

This race thing, Henry, is so bad.

The blacks are inferior.

And you see a fellow like our Colonel Coffey, and you know that any general statement is wrong.

He's superior to any of our other agents.

Believe me, there ain't one of us in his class.

There's not one.

Not one in terms of quiet, poised, brave.

and so forth.

Some others have, you know, more personality, more safety, this and that.

But he's the bad guy.

On the other hand, the blacks can't understand too much.

It's about a penalty.

I hope somebody got on it right away when it was turned down in the house and made a positive out of it.

At least it goes forward.

Everything's just hunky-dory and so forth, right?

Police does, except for the air.

We don't have police and we still give them to them.

The House has no authority on this.

You took the action and you submit the action to the House committee for a 30-day review.

They don't like it.

Now you can do what you want about it.

And the California political thing, I think your way is, and I'm honest with you, the other side of the coin is whether you get a lot of paper, a lot across the paper or not.

And I suspect they won't care about what the committee did, what they want to do, if they want to bring the word out.

Let me come down to another thing.

The thing I have to realize, Bob, is that

We tried to get to Kansas City, but I'm not angry about it.

But we've got to think in terms of our own situation here.

Like I say, there's one exception, two exceptions, but they are exceptions.

The fact of a summit meeting with the Russians will be helpful.

The fact, and this is a much longer chance of a meeting with the Chinese could be helpful.

Now, on the Chinese side, I've got to get Rodgers, and you, Roger, and I don't know who else, have got to talk about this Chinese U.N. position.

Absolutely.

Because he's got to get all the code on it.

Right.

And I don't know.

And he wants to do it.

He wants to do it.

I think the best would be the three of us, Mr. President.

It's really a close decision because...

The reason that it's close is this.

When we take a position against the two China songs, as you well know, many of those who have been given this credit are going to say, oh, these sons of bitches are black and the other lies.

Or they're going to say they're cynical bastards.

Or they'll give you credit for being cynical.

In which case, you will do... No, no, but they may give you...

Some of them may understand what you're doing and say this is a cynical ploy to kick the Taiwan out.

So then you won't gain among your right-wing supporters for having stuck to principle.

That's one of the problems.

Well, how are we going to do this without Rogers?

Well, we can do...

I talked to Rogers yesterday about it.

Yeah.

And he's very, he recognizes the... Well, why don't you do this?

When you finish, he finishes.

You tell him I'm speaking to the Council of the Arms.

And that I think this is a subject you, he, and I should discuss along.

Without there, without, well, not this.

Just he, you, he, and I.

Let's have a talk.

And for him to think of any way we can handle... Well, one way we could do it... You bring in a poll, let's be sure of this.

Well, unfortunately, since our China initiative, so we don't have one.

Well, the poll shows that majority of American people are against the vision of a communist China for the United Nations.

Period.

Which would count for speaking without a trial, isn't it?

A trial.

If you don't make any points by admitting the bad news.

One thing we can do is to start consulting now.

and just find out, and that would get us into trouble.

Well, you could say something to Rich, but ask him if we could just have time.

I feel that I'd like to see Kendrick get his own shot, but I'm not.

I'm torn.

I really don't know.

We just want the best advice.

We'll meet this afternoon sometime.

It's very nice.

It's 5 o'clock.

I would ask you.

No, I have a question.

I don't believe you.

Oh, shit.

So how about tomorrow afternoon?

Or tomorrow?

It doesn't have to be today, could it?

No, I'd like to get it.

Well, as a matter of fact, this is bad for you.

It is, Bob.

Will you change it?

I have a meeting from 3 to 5.

All right, Bob.

Why don't you go to the room?

I want you to think about it instead.

And then off to the rest.

I'm going to have to call him anyway, your brother.

I'll play golf.

So I'll, I'll mention it, and we'll be talking about China, and let's be thinking about it with me sometime tomorrow.

It's good.

And I already put the press conference on Tuesday, very good.

And he wants to talk about MPFR with you too, and that would give me the chance to talk to you.

No, but I think that we ought to have a guest chat about these things on a very private basis.

Yeah, good.

When do you go to Paris?

I'm leaving Sunday morning, and I'll be back Monday night.

I don't have to be like this.

I have a view.

I mean, just so we don't run a risk, we don't be desired.

I have a feeling that it's not going to want you to be there, and that sort of thing.

That goes, that goes.

If something should serve us on this trip, I don't curse that shame.

I don't know what to do.

He doesn't know about it.

I understand.

You know how the French do.

I know, I know, but always assume it's the first time.

I've been sure so often.

Actually, we landed this time at an American airfield.

Just to minimize it further.

Indicate, without indicating what you're going to do, that, uh, that...

And that I could tell Rogers, you know, his whole concern has been, just let me inform you, I don't need to be in it.

I understand.

I don't want to, well, not only are you going to go eat with our Vietnamese, but if you could put it on the basis of me, you're going to see something.

He's asked you to come over.

He may have wanted to go over sometime.

There's quite a number of things.

He's totally known for this.

It's a private thing.

He's meeting with a few friends.

You're coming back, and if anything develops in that particular

before the troops.

We should do it next time.

I think this time.

Next time I could go to England.

Oh, I know.

I'm not worried about next time.

You'll have next time well covered.

I'd just like to head you over there in some kind of a cover.

Some kind of a way that... Because now I'm going over...

It's all set up for going over secretly.

I then have to change it to open list.

You don't.

I don't.

You're going secretly.

That's my point.

You're going secret and it ain't happening.

I've got to say hello.

It's an absolutely secret trip because he doesn't summon me because of the fact that he's not in the government and so forth, doesn't want it to be any other reason.

He's asked to, he has some information, he's been talking to people that might be of interest.

He said to us, and I said, you'll remember Bill.

He's got something.

I think it's a wild hare.

I don't think he's going to come.

I don't think Henry's going to go.

He's going over Sunday and coming back.

I just want you to know that anything happens.

On that day, as you see, where I said I don't want you to put anything down, that Henry will be gone Sunday and Monday.

Now, he will respect it if I talk.

I don't put it on you to rebuild it.

This is a better, I mean, Bob, this is the better way to handle this.

Or would you not talk?

I could either way.

Probably.

I think probably it's better to tell him on the basis, and it might help, that well, and that it also sets you up for, you've got some painful problems coming, which is at some point you're going to be right back in the same soup we were in last week on salt.

Henry, when we get it, for example, you get a China break.

Or you get this break.

I can't be in a position where I say, what am I doing?

I'd like to set it up so that you're trying to demonstrate it.

I want you to go and just talk to people in various places.

I really don't know what the hell you're doing.

And I'll say, I don't know a lot of it, but Bill, don't worry about this.

You're not going to be having press conferences.

You're not going to be making lectures at all military colleges.

No, my judgment is...

Unfortunately, I think Bill will try to talk anything he thinks I'm doing.

And he'll start a sort of frantic activity.

The thing that quieted him down last week, he's actually quite happy now, is that he didn't, that I didn't get any publicity.

Now that's fine.

You'll get a letter.

No, I don't give a damn about my not getting a letter.

I know you don't, but he knows about them.

Well... No, no, the point is, that's what bugs him most, that he's been...

I think he's right.

That he's in a subsidiary position.

I'm a, the thing that more than anything, the other thing that you gotta, there's another factor that's very important there too, which is, the other thing that blows him is, that he doesn't know.

That he doesn't know.

You see, I have no problem, you see, the more I go, the, every time I go there, he'll get more suspicious.

I have, I don't think, I should, I don't think you should tell him to be telling you.

No, you see, what I think we should do is this.

We shouldn't tell him this time.

And the next time I go, when I go to London, we should tell him I'm going to have all the secrets that you see sent to me.

We won't get it out anyway before, you see what I mean?

Before the next time, then we are covered.

The next time we should do this, we will send it to him.

That's a good idea.

That's a good way to get, to tell him that you've been doing this other shot.

You see this?

I just, with him going off to Europe, with him being in Paris, with him thinking that I've seen Santini, he'll want to see Santini.

You know how he is.

He's not doing it yet.

If this were Richard Smart, tell him the whole thing.

I trust Signica.

He's quite rational.

Actually, with his relation to me, it'd be better said so than to move in.

You know?

Yeah.

I see, you do.

You know, he's so amazing that I'm...

Anyway, you know, we'll have to let you stay in the hotel after we have our meeting in the afternoon.

Like, for example, in the Mid-East, if he doesn't tell us, we're not telling him.

You've got to do some things.

I just want you to know that I have a letter.

There will be no question of information here, not so quick or so long.

It has been Henry's consideration if he deals with this crime or whatever.

My worry, Mr. President, on this trip is the next time I go, I might still have to go six degrees there.

We should tell him and we should say I'm going to see St. Denis.

And that's when we'll get the answer.

We won't get an answer this time.

There's somewhere to not tell him to go before he goes to Europe.

That's another thing that worries me is he may feel that if I do it, he's entitled to do it.

This month we are at one more chance.

If it covers, if it breaks, you would say that people are over on personal business to do the food.

You haven't had a holiday and people are over for a couple of days in Paris.

This time you've been here for three days.

Because of the weekend.

Because the plane was going over in a train station.

You went over there.

You wanted to see some friends in Paris.

You haven't seen them for years.

That's what it is anyway.

That's the cover we need.

You wanted to see them and call them and answer some questions.

We don't want any blame.

That blame's not the point.

We want you to come out smiling like a rose.

What I want you to say is, yes, Peter, I, I, I, a military plane, Major Hughes, General Hughes had a plane coming over in Paris.

And I have some personal friends I wanted to see.

I came over and I'm going right back on Monday.

That's it.

I just thought it was a chance over Memorial Day weekend or something like that.

That's the point.

Be prepared.

Always be prepared.

And next time we'll tell him.

I've already told him I'll go to England and then I'll just tell him I'm hopping over to Paris to see Santonette.

Yeah.

That's a secret.

That's Anthony said he wanted to see you.

He said that he, you know, keeps coming up with these ideas.

Do you believe in the Council of the Arts?

Not particularly, but it's a nice...

I thought the art was at all a damn thing in your place.

You were out in the 19th.

I don't go out in the 19th.

How is the 19th?

The credit is not low, but I don't go out.

Look, uh, on the, uh, I'll tell you what, I'm going to be handling this conversation.

The writer's wisdom.

I'll handle this, and I'm going to call up a few of my besties and talk to them about this.

And I do expect to have a private meeting on the 3 of us sometime tomorrow.

They're not listening.

I know.

Do you want to play golf tomorrow?

No.

Well, we'll set a time.

Hello?

Bill?

I was hoping to call you to tell you that the guy who played golf, David, is going to leave Saturday for his tour in the Mediterranean, but I can't go today.

They piled up some more things.

They shot two.

Isn't that horrible, the shooting of those policemen in New York?

And fortunately, one of them was a black, and one had to be shot.

But, uh, goddamn, I told Mitchell to get some sort of legislation that he has to break the Constitution to do it.

This is... You know, they shot this poor little bastard here in Washington.

Another one.

I mean, in the back.

He never had a gun in his hand.

He goes to church in bowls.

I go to church in bowls.

Somebody shoot me in the back, I guess.

Yeah.

Oh, it made me sick because, you know, I could see her, poor girl, fat and unattractive, and so she goes running off and plunges out, you know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

Incidentally, I want to tell you, I'm going to send over that memorandum that I spoke to you, and I'm going to send it by military man, and I want it to be delivered privately to you.

Will you take it privately?

Okay.

The second thing is that I would like to sit down to talk about the Mideast.

We're alone with you and Henry, just the three of us.

I don't want to hedge with the NSC.

I don't want to get everybody else.

I'm sorry, not the Mideast, but about China.

Yeah, you know, about the China thing.

And Bush raised the thing, you know, on the planet.

But what I would like for you to do, and I told Henry to do likewise, and he's going to pull everything together, all of the considerations and all the other things, and Bob is going to hold for it.

What I'd like you to do is to raise the strongest arguments that you can get, in other words, from your shop, but on the ground.

But I'd like to keep it in a posture where it doesn't appear that the president is wavering and all that sort of thing.

Because, as you know, it's a damn close appointment at the moment, particularly with the Soviet thing going on and a lot of other things, and also with the very negative reactions, John.

Have you seen the new Chinese ambassador yet, Jimmy Chien?

You haven't?

Did you talk to him about this?

Yeah.

Well, I'll try to get it.

He's an old friend of mine.

He translated for me every time I went over there to see the old man.

And, uh, nice call.

But, uh, well, anyway, get your, get your arguments in a row.

Get the thing up.

Yeah.

They're gonna get

Well, that's true.

I think, of course, there's this principle thing that they're worried about.

And also there is a problem we've got, which is a very significant one within this country, as to, I mean, you could start, I mean, it's amazing.

We kept the right cool quieted down on Russia and on China today.

But there's one thing, you know, they've got a committee of one billion voters and all the rest.

And the old gentleman, he can stir up those people.

Well, Bob Haldeman called about the date.

Uh, if you would, uh, if you and Eddie could chat a little and see if there's, see if there's a duplicate with regard to the pair.

I guess the trailers will sit down.

It's taking an hour and a half or so to find out what the hell, uh, we want to do about it.

Because you've got to know before you go to Europe, don't you?

Yeah.

What time do we meet, you say?

Tomorrow morning.

You've got to buy something.

Oh, wait a minute.

I've got to buy something.

Well, that's all right.

I can do it earlier than that.

FISA doesn't take any time.

What is the situation?

Because you have FISA arrival and FISA meeting.

What time is FISA's arrival?

10.

10 o'clock?

Yeah.

Okay.

FISA lunch.

Yeah.

Well, you're coming to the FISA lunch?

All right.

Stay in.

Right after the FISA lunch, could you stay and we'll do it then?

Well, that goes a long way.

I think that was another big one yesterday.

Actually, I think this sold sick last week.

Well, uh, you're absolutely right.

In fact, none of the stories in that story.

You're very correct.

Play that, brother.

You did it, so work on it.

Yeah.

None of the stories and all this is written is going to play out.

Mr. President.

I think, Mr. President, what we need at this moment is to win one.

It's to win one.

If we did it, the President, the President, the President.

We can help them all.

So, listen, everybody else is here for a sufferance.

You know that?

Everybody else is here for a sufferance.

You have had the best sufferance.

You've taken the lead.

If this foreign policy works, there'd be enough credit for everybody.

Let me say this.

Foreign policy is goddamn good.

And the main thing is, it's for the good of humanity.

It's good for all of us.

And I think by next year, Mr. President, I keep saying, hearing from people, it will take a while to circulate in the public that you've got... Mr. President, I don't want to downgrade you as much as I have to you.

I don't want you to think this.

People do not understand, because what the intellectual elite do understand eventually...

It eventually trickles down, just like money in a capitalist society trickles down.

It takes a long time because it will trickle until it will let their clothes, but until it so clears their room, they feel it marrow their bones.

With any luck at all by next year, we'll be able to say we had good relations with both Russia and China.

We kept the peace and we ended the old wars we found.

And that's

that's not so immediate to the average person, but I think they'll understand that.

One thing.

You're all set up here.

I think it's very fortunate that those schedulers do not put that whole 31 on this week.

I've added a fewer in that 34.

That's the way to do it.

34 is the number we can live with.

I don't think they catch them now.

In fact, I don't think they do.

I don't think they do.

Unless you give them one or two.

You know, if they do a lot, they'll hide.

You gotta go pretty high before that's... All right.

We don't do that.

And we don't play this trip in that way at this point.

Could you follow?

There must have been at least 30...

at least 30 bands and or other organizations that are on the line of room in Birmingham in the 80s, 20s, or 50s, or 20s.

I mentioned this once before, but it's probably been forgotten.

I remember I said I want a certificate of appreciation to go to every band.

I don't mention the bands anymore.

I can't.

I haven't got the time, but you can't mention 18 bands, right?

I want a nice certificate of appreciation for their participation in me.

Participation in me.

For their involvement in me.

Participation in me.

Or get a real award.

A real award.

Get somebody to write more on me about it.

The...

The presidential visit to Birmingham, where they heard you're in one on this and want to find that I was pretty good.

I think that's the one they used.

That's the one I didn't like.

Yeah, I changed it.

They changed it.

Now, would you go down to the advanced man?

No, advanced.

Oh, sure.

Yes, sir.

All right, that's their job, and I do appreciate it.

Advanced man, we'll do that.

Absolutely.

And as you get this, uh...

I have a Xerox, which I made just to have one copy of you on.

What?

Don't bother changing the servers.

The most important part of the air country is of the air country.

Don't retype it.

That's why I waited until he left the brain in before he finished.

No, no, but I just know that the... ...sensitive about this issue, doesn't believe that we've got some Jewish votes.

We're not doing what some of the Jewish writers do for us.

I want you to start calling the people with regard to the contract.

It's slightly larger and much larger.

They must have a new one by this time.

I don't want that.

I can't read it because it's too big for me.

This is almost correct, but the eyes are not as good as they were, and I'm just being a little bit arbitrary, but I don't like to have those terribly bright lights on.

They're slightly larger, but I'm not quite as good.

So I didn't really try something like that.

Well, I'm not going to hear any more of this crack from the Jews.

I mean, I just saw Max Fisher last week with his fellow cracker.

Now he wants to come in with Rabbi Schachter to talk about Jews.

And so he does.

I am not going to sit.

I like Max Fisher.

I appreciate his work.

I think he's a wonderful friend and so forth.

But God, I am not going to have Jews come in and lobby me about Jews.

No more.

And don't you agree, Bobby?

Attorney General, there is a point that at the main bar where you're going for this speech, he and Richardson aren't having a meeting today on drug abuse with 40 foundations.

I'm going to drop by today.

Artisan.

Attorney General, John Ingersoll.

My consent goes, I won't drop by if it's an innocent citizen.

Is it for the purpose of them or the purpose of, the purpose of the problem or the purpose of publicity?

I'm not doing anything except for publicity anymore.

He's told him too many things about, you know, all that sort of grievous publicity on interviews.

You know, that was the goddamn thing I did on that drug thing.

I've done it over and over again.

I went over there to that Dog and Pony show that John Irving had, and nothing ever came out of that.

And the only publicity at this one you get would be the fact that you went by the publicity stuff.

Would you check to see Bob and she?

To weather over the weekend.

Monday.

Have you had anybody check Jack Dreyfuss' place up there in Maine?

Yeah, Don.

He's checked with the girl.

Anybody there?

I don't know.

Could there were problems for you?

He thought that...

I don't want to stay there just tonight.

I just want to go to New England for some purpose.

Yeah.

I think it would be a nice touch to go up there.

Let me check it back out a little.

See if we can go up Saturday.

There's a problem with the weather up there.

The weather's lousy.

If this does this time of year, it might be very good.

Drop by this evening.

Gentlemen, don't do this.

Buy a house.

Gentlemen, don't get any too much advance on us.

Get over to this.

Let's take a look at it and see what it looks like.

Where is it?

The main ball in this thing?

Yeah.

This is what it is.

So is the other one.

What is your, uh, what is your general...

I'm reading the news.

Oh, it's Garmin.

Is he there?

Garmin's running over.

He's good.

Oh, sure.

Sure, I can handle it.

And she's over there, the woman.

Uh, he's planning on still letting you go over.

My Christ, I think this is a lousy political issue.

So this is what on its own.

They're right, they don't have any people covered.

Unfortunately, you know how they're well.

Yeah, they're well.

Christ, and here we are for the very, very unboxing of the arms of people who don't have to eat.

Christ.

For that.

Well, I think we're doing it.

No more.

You're following, too.

Are you doing that, uh, public television, or, uh, what are your, uh, boats?

Noodle, that's right.

That's out of two ways, so I thought I'd have both ways to do better.

I really gotta find out, you know, who's pulling my leg there.

Somebody is, uh, because the planning thing was basically a cover-up.

You know, well, we've got Frank Pace.

We've got Bob and Al Cole, and all that shit.

They all want to spend on public funds.

Geez, I'd like to drop it down to two.

But I agree to the summary.

It seemed to me that we certainly got a lot of coverage on our trip down there.

It was primarily because of the loss

All of a sudden started a lot of interest in it, but it's, I think anytime you go out, you watch that, you're going to get coverage.

And I think we just got a new, you're talking about the Midwest stuff, we ought to go in and get out of small towns.

Yeah.

But we go to places like, well, DLS, that's exactly the kind of city we ought to be in.

I think so.

Yeah.

You don't think we should go to Chicago on our next investment briefing?

We need something in Chicago.

Yeah, we've got to do something in Chicago.

I agree.

Not in the suburbs, but in Chicago.

Let's see.

Crank it up.

Because I gave these Midwest, these southern editors a real, you know, when I do the other editors, I'll vary it by giving them just a Q&A, which is just easy.

I mean, there's not that many questions except from them, and they love it.

The point is that they, I didn't want to do it in the south, because they'd all be positive.

But basically, the southern editors got it.

For them, it was just editors and, of course, a lot of TV people they got.

Hello is really quite something for them to get, you know.

I mean, it's like coming into the office.

That's great.

That's great stuff.

What a ripple effect that has.

Did you ever have a client check to see, did you get the check at the client editor's meeting, the other editor's meeting?

That's pretty good.

Well, the only reason to chat is to know whether there'd be any things I could help you send back.

I know, I know.

I really don't want to see it so much as I don't want you to analyze it.

That was, uh, in terms of the schedule.

One other thing that occurred to me.

I feel it in the part of my hearing dead that if he had had a chance to talk to you, that, uh, that would have been the best time.

Thank you.

That would have, would have switched that thing.

Well, God damn it, I checked on that.

Harry Hinn knows perfectly well.

He approved the list that was put out, and they ran a switch on Harry Hinn.

Now, he's playing games, and he wasn't consoling these folks yet.

Harry Hinn appealed.

Harry appealed.

There was Harry Hinn.

He didn't complain.

He was just set up to get me, said that he had...

working with the model of the advanced man turned it down.

Now, quite honestly, I don't really think that the advanced man should have absolute authority, but I think with regard to a top White House staffer, they just should have the opportunity to talk to you about it.

All right, but what happened?

See that box on the events end?

We had a group list, which was Jim Martin and all the party officials.

It was all on my list, too, which then had worked out.

That's right.

Then they said, can we add

Fifteen fat cats.

And the advancement said no to that.

So they did.

They got full of the old shell game on Dent and the advancement and cancelled everybody we had approved and brought us fat cats anyway.

A mistake they made.

Again, we should have got here.

But Dent wasn't ready to happen at that point.

I just wanted to be sure that you didn't ever leave.

Never leave when they passed, ma'am.

I'm just saying that I'm not a political person.

It's not a decision I'm completely carrying with us.

As you mentioned, it doesn't know if it's one sun at all or another at all, and naturally it would do anything, right?

If somebody is, uh, somebody is playing a switch like that, uh, then that may have a problem then.

Yeah.

Right.

It's, uh, about to, because, uh, we're also going to expand it so we can use a little larger number.

We should have, we should have just, uh, but we didn't know that I had a dress marker.

Oh, the box was on the trip, you know, it was great.

Oh, yeah.

We've all got our thoughts by this state chairman.

How about your wedges and what does the staff reaction look like?

How are they feeling about it?

Very good.

The ones that are not there.

all these good places out here, good people, because it was a lot of good people, people, you know.

And the undisputed, probably.

Even though, you know, they made political points.

I said, go and make pictures over Roseanne.

The other week, my town had their politics over.

Well, they said, Alabama.

Everybody said, well, it's going to be very Alabama.

We went there to see the folks.

That's perfectly clear.

Don't you think, does the picture mean you really got a good ride?

Yes, a ride.

They all had to play across as far as the French Yard.

A very interesting point, because I'd like to read a little about Yardwood.

If you'll read it this summer, you'll notice that Frank Cormier said there were no demonstrators, you know, on French Yard.

Rather, it may be that it's a little odd here,

Or, most is commentary about three, three women.

There were three women.

Remember?

Sure.

Now, I really feel that this is just straight goddamn bad courage.

Three signs.

Out of a thousand, maybe, but not a thousand.

Well, three or four hundred times at least there were people with signs.

Well, I don't know.

Fine.

And that would be really bad if it comes in that people are the ones who expect the next step.

Isn't that good?

That's a lot of that, I'm sure.

I...

This is distorted.

I don't know if you've gotten the hang of all this stuff.

I think you ought to be called on that, don't you?

Yes, I do.

That's exactly what we're saying right now.

Or maybe... No.

You know, I've often said, why not ignore him?

Now, say there's a crack in the last place or something, so he does this.

Would it be better to ignore him?

What do you think?

I don't know.

I don't know what's the best thing.

Really?

I don't think it's better to ignore him.

He's sensitive to...

Thank you