Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 521-008
Date: Tuesday, June 15, 1971 at 3:32 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Watson, Arthur K.; Kennedy, Richard T. (Col.)
Recording device: Oval Office
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/521-008

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:01] Well, over the work, I, uh, I, uh,
[0:30] I would love to see Frank Shakespeare.
[0:40] He thinks he's got someone, Frank Stanton.
[0:48] He's a good producer.
[0:50] Frank Shakespeare comes from CBS.
[0:51] He should know how to get at it.
[0:53] Just keep the heat on him.
[0:54] You keep the heat on him.
[0:55] Watch the other ones.
[0:55] If you watch the movies, tell somebody.
[0:56] He said I'd have him there within 48 hours.
[0:58] I'm going back tonight because I have a thing happening tomorrow.
[1:09] One thing, Mr. President, I think that's something that made a big mistake.
[1:19] Uh, send a message?
[1:20] Uh, yeah.
[1:20] That's it.
[1:21] And I believe it.
[1:21] Yes, sir, it did.
[1:22] Both of them almost went back and back.
[1:24] You know, that's all I know.
[1:25] Why do you think that you, as an ambassador, can't send a message?
[1:32] I sent a secret notice to the President of the United States and the Secretary of State.
[1:37] And now I'm in the Senate to change it.
[1:38] What do you think?
[1:45] Again, I'm not... You know, this is my...
[1:52] This is my...
[1:53] It's the most reckless, irresponsible thing 100% of newspapers do.
[2:05] Now you can't say, well, it's a news story.
[2:09] Now listen here, printing top secret information.
[2:10] I don't care how they feel about the war, whether they're for it or against it, Susan Cannon should not do it.
[2:13] It's an attack on the integrity of government.
[2:15] And by God, I'm going to fight that son of a bitch in favor.
[2:16] Come hell or high water, I have already.
[2:17] I have all my capacity.
[2:18] They don't know what's going to hit them now, though.
[2:20] We're going to fight them down the wire.
[2:21] Mr. President, I have no vendetta for anybody.
[2:24] I'm only working for you, sir, and I'm going to do the best I can.
[2:28] But I want to just make one point on this oil situation.
[2:32] The Algerian oil thing, you know, it's the only thing that's going to make it.
[2:38] It's the only thing that's going to make it.
[2:39] It's the only thing that's going to make it.
[2:40] And what we're doing, if we get down there as a nation, this will be the first time in our history, as far as I can tell, that we have ever agreed to buy petroleum raw material from a source that has been expropriated and for which proper compensation hasn't been paid to the former owners.
[3:02] Wait a minute.
[3:02] Who's doing this?
[3:02] We are.
[3:03] We have written, the State Department has written a letter blessing the loan which held Hudson...
[3:09] put in for use on the East Coast.
[3:21] The Ex-Im Bank has gotten a letter from the State Department.
[3:26] There's no international relations repercussions.
[3:29] It's OK.
[3:31] The French did not object.
[3:33] This was the original margin of that case.
[3:39] And in the course, very cordial, in the course of the conversation, I said, Mr. President Pompidou, he said, now, he said, we can't put pressure on you because what you do in Algeria is all right.
[3:52] But we backed you in the OPC, the Gulf State negotiation, and stuck with you when we could have given the order to the Algerians and bought it back.
[4:02] But I changed my mind.
[4:03] I defeated them.
[4:04] I didn't refuse them.
[4:04] Now, he said, if, without my putting pressure on it, if you could delay this until we get our consent, it will be very helpful to us in our negotiations.
[4:15] And this was the message I sent back.
[4:20] Then this thing came out in the press, and the first thing he said, how could you betray my conscience?
[4:24] That's the first question.
[4:32] The second thing, and that's the end of it.
[4:33] I think it's the case that I got it.
[4:34] I think it's a question, in my judgment, where the African desk was so anxious to get a relationship material.
[4:47] It has not gone through yet.
[4:49] What is it?
[4:49] The letter has gone to the Ex-Im Bank.
[4:52] And, uh...
[4:55] I didn't see such a letter.
[4:58] We didn't approve of your decision.
[5:00] This was the State Department's letter that went... You know what I mean?
[5:05] I sent a letter to the Department.
[5:06] Let me say this.
[5:07] You say, was this expropriated?
[5:10] And compensation was not provided?
[5:12] One-eighth of what they, they gave one-eighth of what they asserted.
[5:16] A hundred million, about seventy-eight hundred.
[5:18] And they did.
[5:18] And the French did it.
[5:19] And the French don't like it.
[5:20] No, and yet they don't want to put pressure on us.
[5:24] But my point is, my point is, they didn't expropriate it, did not compensate it.
[5:28] If I were any clearer about that, is that absolutely clear?
[5:30] This is a goddamn, I told that, I told that in that matter, I guess, and a Latin American that said it.
[5:38] That's the one thing.
[5:40] I mean, if they expropriate and pay, that, I suppose, is right.
[5:43] I don't agree with that.
[5:45] But nevertheless... You can't fight that one.
[5:47] That's what I mean.
[5:49] I don't agree with it, but I mean, I could go along.
[5:52] But if they expropriate and don't pay, we are not going to give a copper to those bastards.
[5:56] Well, I'm glad... Now, we've got to... Would you...
[5:59] I don't mean... Henry may be fighting some game here.
[6:01] No, I talked to Henry, Mr. President, and he's completely in agreement with that.
[6:04] He's all out this deal?
[6:07] Uh-uh.
[6:08] What I mean is that... What I mean is, did Henry know?
[6:13] No, no, no, sir.
[6:15] Because I talked to him this morning about it, and that's the only reason I wanted to ask about it.
[6:21] Not because I have an undenial, but...
[6:22] I understand.
[6:23] You stay out of it.
[6:23] I just want to know what the facts are.
[6:27] God damn it, they should have not done it.
[6:29] Why would they leave this?
[6:30] Who in the hell would leave it?
[6:30] That's the reason.
[6:31] You said it was leaked.
[6:32] Well, it came out in the Maund paper.
[6:35] from your office?
[6:38] Not possible, because only I know.
[6:45] I need to, I really got to know about this.
[6:47] I want to know, I want to know who the hell it went to.
[6:51] I believe that my employees, I am not going to approve any loan to any company.
[6:59] I know El Paso Gas is a good company.
[7:02] God damn it, I may let them make their profit somewhere else.
[7:06] And, of course, as you know better than I, Mr. President... You know what?
[7:11] If they do go over there, they'll expropriate them.
[7:13] Well, that's number one.
[7:14] And number two was to prevent the Saudi Arabs from expropriating Iran.
[7:18] And they'll pay them one-eighth of what it's worth and then say, well, you did it now.
[7:26] Gee, here's what I came to do.
[7:27] You see, this is a violation of something I've laid down earlier on this expropriation.
[7:32] I know how the State Department feels.
[7:33] The State Department doesn't give a damn about expropriation.
[7:41] They're all like goddamn socialists in that African desk.
[7:44] But I'm not.
[7:44] And I've got as long as I'm here, we're not going to have this sort of thing.
[7:48] That's all there is to it, Mr. President.
[7:53] That's the story.
[7:54] The poor man on this side, Jim Higgins, D-A-K-K-I-N-S, who's their speciality in oil, and this is the part where he fought a losing fight, and he feels the way I do.
[8:01] We fight over the African density.
[8:03] The African desk, and I don't know who else.
[8:08] Unbelievable.
[8:08] Well, the one implying point is we cannot look as though we are knuckling under French pressure.
[8:20] No, that's why your letter had to be in confidence.
[8:24] I know that.
[8:24] And that is what I was asking.
[8:25] No, I'm not making this decision.
[8:26] I would not make this decision on the basis of what Papa Lucero did to say.
[8:30] That's it.
[8:30] But the reason that I would make this decision is because I do not, I am not willing to approve anything which encourages
[8:36] expropriation without their compensation.
[8:39] Now that's it.
[8:40] No action this government will encourage appropriating without active compensation.
[8:45] And that's got to go all the way up to the line.
[8:50] And so I want to be sure that if you would, would you also make a few follow-ups on this?
[8:56] I want to be sure that he can break the terms of my line.
[8:59] Thank you very much.
[9:03] How's it going otherwise?
[9:05] Well, we'll be in by year end.
[9:08] I got a new man.
[9:09] Yes, sir.
[9:11] We're scraping the barrel.
[9:13] I got Bill Burden over there.
[9:14] Bill Burden?
[9:15] Nancy's taking him through it.
[9:17] I think she's taking him through it today, hopefully.
[9:20] We need some money.
[9:22] Okay, sir.
[9:23] And I can't go out and ask for it directly, but... Well, he's a good citizen.
[9:42] Yes, we have him for dinner.
[9:44] I must say the other thing, just in the past,
[9:48] Don't be too worried that occasionally the French seem a little more independent, because the Russians are coming to town in October, and the tide's going out, and once they leave, they'll come back into the crowd.
[10:06] I don't, uh, I don't expect you to play the role.
[10:07] Well, get Bill, uh, when you get older, if he leaves, he's getting out of private.
[10:11] Yes, sir.
[10:12] I mean, he's having it back in the embassy.
[10:12] I don't think he's doing it well.
[10:14] He's certainly not.
[10:14] I mean, he doesn't have to do this kind of stuff, so you do.
[10:16] I'll get him.
[10:16] I'll get him.
[10:16] Listen, you're terrific, and I agree.
[10:33] I didn't relate to the French, and I spent time with those people.
[10:52] And I was just sick and tired of them saying, I just want to say, you know, I'm not as skeptical as I can be.
[10:56] And I came back absolutely convinced that you're doing the only sensible possible wise thing there is to do when you're completely in your corner.
[10:59] I would urge some of the other fellows...
[11:00] Or is it not?
[11:04] They've already had him burned.
[11:05] I think some of the other key ambassadors would do well to just kill him like that.
[11:07] I went to Lundham and I went to Galleon.
[11:31] Right.
[11:34] You have to be up to a long, long, long path.
[11:39] So now, when something comes up, I say you're wrong.
[11:41] I see.
[11:41] Stay with us.
[11:41] All right.
[11:41] OK.
[11:41] Thanks a lot.
[11:42] We'll see.