Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 590-015
Date: Wednesday, October 13, 1971 at 2:57 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob"); Bull, Stephen B.
Recording device: Oval Office
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/590-015

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:08] I don't think they did.
[0:23] If they are told they're going to have conversations and then don't even for five minutes, you can't do it on the basis, well, the president's busy today.
[0:32] See?
[0:33] We just don't do it.
[0:39] I mean, I don't want to do it that way.
[0:45] We ought to do it.
[0:46] What I regret...
[0:47] I said not technically.
[0:49] Earlier, they were committed to conversations.
[0:50] We're expecting them.
[0:52] They should not change them.
[0:52] They told me not to know what the event was, and to tell us just to squeeze it down on the basis of...
[0:55] If they were not committed to conversations, we're just going to shake their hands, have a picture taken, and I'll squirt them to the door, and then do the next.
[0:58] It's way too just to be done anyway.
[0:59] We're just ridiculous.
[1:01] and have a conversation with them another time.
[1:11] Stayed trying to wrap.
[1:11] Rose makes one point, which is, she says that Alex called over and put somebody in a casket for the Tito dinner, and she had it filled without a toner.
[1:21] Bob Brown or something like that.
[1:23] I asked, did he put Bob Brown on it and that's what he did without a toner?
[1:25] That's the problem.
[1:26] You see, he had a bill, and Victor Roussel was next in line.
[1:31] And so there's some, you know, it's a coastal system.
[1:35] So Chris, she said, which is now, who's making up these lists?
[1:46] Am I or Alex?
[1:51] And I said, you are.
[1:51] You know, that came up before, and I said, she's to do it.
[1:53] So Alex just should have told her that's all.
[1:54] I didn't mind him on the Brown list, but it may be that if she had to herself, he may come in at Brown.
[1:57] She said she already had three blacks in there anyway.
[1:58] So it wasn't for the sake of a black, it was for the sake of Bob Brown.
[2:00] He had a morale problem then.
[2:01] comes up in cycles every six months or so and we've got to do something for his wife if she gets left out of things.
[2:14] Yeah.
[2:14] He's maybe used to let him go.
[2:16] Well, I've raised that with Earl and raised this with me, and I've raised that at that point.
[2:21] Maybe we should.
[2:22] And John said he's doing such a good job in his job.
[2:24] He is great as far as the one around and all that, but his wife gets to eating away and every once in a while we've got to do...
[2:28] They can't do it.
[2:35] They can't get anyone on this one.
[2:35] Well, she's barely sent the invitation out.
[2:36] No problem.
[2:37] She said she didn't know.
[2:38] They already invite her, so she'll have to knock somebody off.
[2:56] She'll line the way for Christ's sake.
[2:58] That's no problem because they have a...
[3:00] They'll line the way.
[3:00] They'll line the way.
[3:00] But he's the main one.
[3:01] It is true.
[3:01] He's going to do it more.
[3:02] He's one of the two.
[3:02] That's right.
[3:02] Because they all come here and, you know, the rest of the thing.
[3:04] That's right.
[3:04] And she makes up the list for that.
[3:09] Exactly right.
[3:25] Oh, she just called her.
[3:31] Yeah.
[3:31] Behind that, anybody.
[3:31] I had to do it sometimes.
[3:32] Just tell her.
[3:32] She'll work it in.
[3:32] Who does?
[3:33] The Adventurers Association.
[3:33] We don't have very many assholes.
[3:34] Oh, thank God.
[3:34] Well, we have quite a few.
[3:35] You need a little regret for this year, huh?
[3:36] Do we?
[3:36] Do we have to have that goddamn entertainment thing that people ask you to have something here?
[3:38] The main problem I'm concerned about there is the handshake deal.
[3:43] There's no way you can undo it without the handshake.
[3:45] You have to get in it.
[3:46] All I can do is... Sure.
[3:47] You know, when they come up the other way and come in, then they pounce on me.
[4:04] Our aides are not.
[4:05] Just keep them away.
[4:05] See, so that's why I'd much rather shake all their hands and have some church administrative system, which is usually what it is of a congressman, come in and grab me than when I'm trying to talk to the head of IBM.
[4:12] See?
[4:12] Well, our plan was to have them come up at the same time the others were going into the room.
[4:15] Yeah.
[4:15] So they just were ushered right into the eastern...
[4:18] at the same time the others are ruptured into the eastern, which is, seems to be a .
[4:24] So they don't get it.
[4:27] I don't think they have to meet us.
[4:45] It's awkward for them to mill around.
[4:49] It really isn't necessary to meet us.
[4:50] We've gone through this in the church.
[4:51] What do you think?
[4:51] Are we running a big group after dinner?
[4:53] Somebody has requested that we have so many names.
[5:02] Alex Ray Grayson.
[5:03] They've got so many names, as you know, to talk about.
[5:07] Well, it keeps coming up.
[5:09] Rose raises it because she's very big on the after-dinner thing.
[5:11] Then Pat gets into the handshaking.
[5:14] Yeah.
[5:14] But I thought she agreed.
[5:14] Now, let me suggest this.
[5:15] And I don't think we should put the speaking guests through the business of shaking hands with administrative assistants.
[5:20] Frankly, that's what it gets down to.
[5:22] Or whoever they are.
[5:27] Well, they don't have to shake your hand just because they're out of your house.
[5:33] I mean, you don't have to.
[5:35] It doesn't have to be.
[5:35] They come, they hear the entertainment, and afterwards they dance.
[5:38] And they see the stage guests when we come in.
[5:39] We come into the room and we go up and shake hands with them.
[5:41] It's a big deal.
[5:41] Yep.
[5:42] Right?
[5:42] Yep.
[5:42] And what the hell is a handshake?
[5:44] They don't even, they just say, hello, thank you.
[5:47] I agree.
[5:49] Then I have to wait and spend the time in the States against many important people.
[5:54] I'm going to have to do more of them.
[5:56] I'm going to have to try to tell the folks how to bring them up.
[6:04] It's a hard thing.
[6:04] We must make a good deal out of it.
[6:07] Well, I'm glad I could agree that we could feel that we were going to shake hands with him.
[6:15] I don't think you should take an old man like T to meet a bunch of bad people like us.
[6:20] I think we'll see.
[6:28] That's right.
[6:29] Let's do that for all of them.
[6:29] No.
[6:29] Even if the partnership is in the air, it's got to happen.
[6:30] He said shake your hands with him before.
[6:32] Let's see.
[6:36] At the line they all go down because they think they're supposed to.
[6:41] Don't worry, it's set up.
[6:47] They didn't have us shake hands with them, did they?
[6:53] Our trips abroad?
[6:53] Well, we didn't have any big dinners.
[6:56] No, we've done some where there were after dinner guests and you didn't shake hands with them.
[7:01] In other countries, because I was in the after-dinner group sometimes, and there were a number of countries where we, the rest of your party, did not meet the head of state.
[7:15] We just went by Franco, we wouldn't meet him.
[7:25] The big thing is to get the invitation to get dressed up to be in the White House and to dance.
[7:50] Dance and see to the entertainment and whatever the thing is.
[7:51] That's what she wants in the Dallas White House isn't it?
[7:55] I said, Christ, we haven't had anyone else.
[8:08] And she isn't complaining that she hasn't been here.
[8:15] She's pushed in to get out and go out and make money.
[8:17] Oh, I see.
[8:17] And all that.
[8:18] It's just, John, I raised it.
[8:18] Now, we didn't want to do it with the Gandy dinner because of, you know, the more that it's, the ratio is out of hand.
[8:25] It could have been for one of the others.
[8:40] I don't think it's a problem.
[8:43] John felt it was a good move to head off with John when it comes up.
[8:44] Good.
[8:45] It's fine.
[8:45] No problem.
[8:45] My idea is probably just a kind of emotion.
[8:46] Rose being weird, too.
[8:47] I don't blame her.
[8:48] It didn't feel good.
[8:48] Anyway, you know, she's very emotional about it.
[8:50] And I said, well, I said, well, I said...
[8:51] But Davey and I had a relationship as well.
[9:06] We called over, and Lucy sent out the invitations without telling me.
[9:07] Now we're over on the dinner.
[9:08] I don't know what to do.
[9:08] You know, of course you don't know what to do.
[9:09] It is a problem.
[9:11] They're not over on the dinner.
[9:11] No, I know what it is.
[9:12] But it is.
[9:12] The point is, you should practice.
[9:14] You should interfere with it.
[9:14] You should let it be done in the channel.
[9:15] Be done.
[9:18] I'm going to stay here all about the dinner.
[9:20] I mean, I don't think that's important.
[9:35] In other words, that time, you know, we had something to have dinner, or it wasn't going to be able or something like that.
[9:40] She did what she did.
[9:40] She thought we'd changed it.
[9:41] It was not a problem.
[9:41] It was just the fact that we decided to have dinner.
[9:42] It was a working dinner of some kind where they, if it's here in the States, set up for us.
[9:46] We ordered up the invitations and they sent out a rosary to her after the dinner.
[10:02] Oh, was there?
[10:03] Yeah.
[10:03] I don't know.
[10:04] Which was a mistake.
[10:05] But, you know, nobody even thought about it.
[10:06] We're not, the rest of us are not that sensitive.
[10:07] Yeah.
[10:07] She is terribly sensitive about her priorities.
[10:10] That's a goddamn good thing for her to do, too.
[10:11] It's very depending on what she has to do.
[10:12] She knows how to balance it all.
[10:13] She calls them out on everything.
[10:14] And so I think we're able to do it in the absence of things, both times.
[10:16] So I said, Bill Bundy is handling it.
[10:29] And I had already notified the press.
[10:36] The press and the high-level officials and a lot of pallbearers not really appreciated the fact that I made that very much so.
[10:42] Just that it was too late to change it.
[10:42] It was a very thoughtful thing.
[10:43] They appreciated your wanting to come.
[10:44] They understood that.
[10:46] Yep.
[10:48] Oh, I don't think so.
[10:50] And that's where we get the Mrs. Atchison.
[10:52] I think it's a hell of a lot.
[10:56] I mean, that's something.
[10:57] Someone will know.
[10:57] I don't feel like I should have been there.
[10:59] No.
[11:00] Because the other thing's already announced.
[11:01] It isn't as if it were a monster.
[11:03] It isn't as if he cranked up something to avoid it.
[11:07] He called her and sent the video to her.
[11:14] I'm going to have to hurry tomorrow.
[11:15] I'm going to go over the southern defense.
[11:17] I'm trying to get it boiled down some.
[11:33] I think just you and I.
[11:35] We can help shape it.
[11:37] I think it's a little better.
[11:37] But you know what I mean?
[11:38] You can shape it and we'll have those orders there.
[11:39] Or you can shape it and it should be sitting on the ears.
[11:41] There's no problem as far as Henry's concerned having him sit in it.
[11:42] It might not be a bad idea as far as the...
[11:44] No, you should be here to back up what I'm trying to do.
[12:01] I mean, I'm going to knock the 7 days down to 4, and I'm going to knock off the 6.
[12:02] But it's taking me just a very kind of week for me to get such things, for example, as I decided just to go to Big Canyon, not to do other cities.
[12:07] I mean, that's... Henry will be all for that.
[12:08] But I don't care.
[12:08] That's his concept.
[12:08] Yeah, but I'm not going to shoot for... That's fine.
[12:10] so that we can get some sort of pictures over there.
[12:30] I heard that there was a disappear behind those blue curtains.
[12:31] That's really true.
[12:34] I was really curious what you told me there.
[12:36] I would bet that's what he did with the staff, the way he came in there.
[12:38] It's not acting for it, so it's just the way he presented it.
[12:39] He does it in that sort of,
[12:40] And really, I was going to turn around with that, but I can't argue with that.
[12:57] He's very serious.
[12:58] He says, well, everybody here, well, the president will be making this announcement.
[13:01] And he reads the thing on the note, and he says, now let me question against any view for it.
[13:05] and immediately was in the negatives and never did give it up.
[13:17] I'm just saying this is a wonderful, wonderful accomplishment.
[13:19] And I can't explain it.
[13:19] I had all the attention to it.
[13:20] I had all the attention to it.
[13:21] It's just a question of the mood.
[13:23] And we got that across pretty well in our case.
[13:27] I thought we had a congressman feeling we're not trying too much.
[13:31] They have that big feeling about it.
[13:33] Well, the staff did, too, because that was big enough you couldn't kill it anyway.
[13:50] Maybe it was better, too.
[13:50] The question of his race and his style, I think I've told you.
[13:52] I have proved his vengeance for the Russian criminal, not me.
[14:00] I can't believe you purchased it.
[14:13] Seriously.
[14:13] It's good to me.
[14:13] And be gracious with you and say, well, it has to go.
[14:14] It's been attending for a long time.
[14:15] Yeah, yeah.
[14:15] We had a close one until after a year.
[14:16] Thanks for protecting the path.
[14:17] Keep your hands up.