Conversation 603-001

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The yellow old one with the two with the army and the cells and TIGO, the Secretary of the Most Market, the Secretary of Ms. Rogers, the equivalent of the Secretary of Rogers, and the two ambassadors.

One of them does not have a wife, so there would be 15 people.

And that would be the normal if you do not have the Agnes at that point.

And they're chief of protocol as well.

... ... ...

... ... ... ...

That's all.

I put it there to keep the protocol since I was there.

Right.

I've been a protocol.

You should be there anyway.

Be the one.

Heaven.

I guess so.

Okay.

And are you planning to receive the afternoon guest?

No, absolutely not.

Never.

Never again.

We'll never put that on there again.

That's right.

... ... ... ... ... ...

Who's going to pick you up?

We work at the same time.

Who's going to pick you up?

And maybe you talked about the Henry King's mind, but no, I didn't want the writers.

The argument for both Ron and Chuckie will do is that you're going to meet him.

Do less of building him up by getting the questions answered, getting him out of the way, than you are by letting him in line.

There's going to be a problem on the question setting and the date, and he's got to answer that and just say that the date hasn't been finally determined, or whatever our mind's going to be until the announcement goes, and we say it hasn't been finally determined, we're not sure.

But that's what he's going to say.

That there was no thought of any calls to the backgrounder.

That was not what they were talking about, and I reconfirmed that this morning.

What they were talking about was that Ron would go out and make the announcement, read the communique, not anything.

And then after Ron read the communique, he would say, Dr. Gibson is here to answer your questions.

On the record, no coverage.

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

10-0-5-5-6-7.

Alright, he's going to have a conversation with me again.

We all have these conversations, and of course, I'm going to show him real quick.

It's just, it's just like a, it's a wonderful way for us to show Henry all his conversations.

You can hear him?

Yes.

He really is.

I'm going to have a conversation with you all soon enough.

I think Schultz has come around the feeling that Peterson, I mean, Erich hasn't seen this, because Erich doesn't know the subject anymore, and I do.

You know, he's Erich, and he made the point, which is quite accurate, that Connolly doesn't have a good stand, but also Erich overlooked the point.

Also, quite accurately, Peterson doesn't have a very good staff.

He doesn't.

The only staff he's got is Schultz.

Schultz is the only staff, and he's got a good staff, but also, he's got a hell of a good mind and understands the problem, which he would probably, or Peterson, do.

Now, the thing is that Schultz made a very good statement, he said, well,

The trouble is that he is very insincerely insistent.

His comment was speaking about the fact that Peterson had come in with an 11-page paper, and just before his meeting, he had an effect, was to go back and fix parity, comparatively, actually, in the United States.

You know, in a sense, he had to deal with it.

He said, I didn't know that's what he didn't want.

I said, I certainly did not.

I said, he would never walk back to town.

That's the position he was covering.

And of course, what happened is he said, well, the trouble is that the Europeans come over here to see the Europeans.

They go to see Sandler.

They go to see McCracken.

They go to see Peterson.

They go to see Arthur Burns.

He says they can focus.

And he says they get several voices speaking on this.

... ... ... ... ...

George has learned an awful lot.

Because George got all the nerve to be enormously loyal and honorable man.

He's an honorable man you'll ever find.

But then they don't use him.

You read that in Arthur sometimes.

He tries so desperately, you know.

Yeah.

But he brought Peterson in.

He's strong for him and the rest.

But Bob Peterson has certain government weaknesses.

He does talk to him.

You've seen his papers, have you?

Yes.

You agree with him?

Yes, I sure do.

Is there papers or just... Look, I've seen them before.

They've been redone.

You've seen them after they're redone.

Because they go back, and we've sat down with them.

Henry's sat down and worked with them.

I've gone over and with them.

I've taken papers and edited them down.

And he won't take them down.

He rewrites them.

Puts them back.

He just...

What do you mean?

You can't change it?

Very much.

She's trying to change it some, yes.

Well, we'll try to move it.

I talked to Ron and he's going to get it together and do it today unless we are still swamped in this other thing.

Maybe we'll do it tomorrow.

Sure.

And we'll just have a plan on that.

It's just to announce that Pat will be attending in Ottawa.

And that's all.

Not to say who else is in the party.

Not to say what else.

He's going to be in the party.

He's going to love his job.

And that's at this time.

Erringstamper.

Ok. Erringstamper.

I'll show it on, and you won't.

And I said, he's doing it for his ego now.

You know damn well that's because I can read everything.

He writes it all out.

But he's going to wait a while, I think.

I talked to my kids with you last night, but he's going to wait a while.

And he waited with me all night.

I mean, we got a problem with Rogers, too, but Henry is a problem because of his desperate passion to be, you know, out there in front.

How in the hell can Rogers go over there?

Maybe in the meeting with Henry Kissinger.

In fact, I don't think he can.

He's got to be in sound.

And, uh...

I've got to have some of them.

First of all, is there any study on some kind of parking?

Oh, I had a lot of stuff, but Roger's too smart.

Roger's

He's getting on the trip.

Will you be sure to start working around the fact that we cannot have it in everything?

I mean, Henry's idea, too, that he...

He is the subtlest guy sometimes in a meeting, either evening or what the hell I'm trying to get at, you know.

I mean, he's good, but he's much better than Rogers.

Rogers is a person who's got division sometimes.

But Bob Henry's not the greatest connoisseur in the world.

You know, he's tenacious on earth, but he isn't disagreeing as bad, because he tends to be...

He gets somewhat blinded by his own people.

But he also gets by with a soft talk.

He's the first to realize and intelligent.

And if you're going to get off and talk about this thorough process and the rest, he won't miss the hard place.

He won't get down to it.

He doesn't understand.

He's got to be goddamn correct.

No, sir.

He does not think that.

He says no.

That it's cut the other way.

And he understands.

He got his orders clearly, and he said it that way.

He said that specifically.

It is said.

But he said, I can't.

But the way he's talked to him and said, Henry, you can, but there will be some critical matters, and we'll have to find a way to communicate that.

He cannot be there two hours.

I just can't have him sitting there.

That's just the way I want to talk.

It also, I think, inhibits me to feel the same.

Sorry, sorry, sorry.

Also, the other thing is this.

I want to be bound by everything Henry said.

If he said, Dr. Kissinger said something, I want to say, well, I don't know what he said, but this is my view.

See my point?

Don't put it on the face, it's gonna make rockers, man.

Put it just the way I don't know how to hurry.

I'm saying he's concerned about the space leaking next to him.

We've had enough, thanks very much.

He'll say, well, he never leaves.

What do you want to do on this push thing?

Do you want to announce the fact that he's... Oh, he announced the fact.

There's no reason to have a picture.

... ... ... ... ... ...

It was reported to the president and Rogers at breakfast this morning.

I feel drunk, so I'm sorry.

No, I'm not.

I'm not.

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Cut-off bombs and all those other things.

No way to do that either.

You see, we have this problem.

In a sense, we've won the vote for 29 years.

We lose the vote, so then we pick up our marbles and go home.

Do you understand my point?

Yeah.

And the way to do it, of course, is the way I plan to do it.

We're going to screw that goddamn organization and everybody that voted against us.

But we're not going to do it about the UN.

But that doesn't satisfy the regulars.

That's right.

That's the problem.

So, what do we do?

And it doesn't satisfy, which is only a short-term problem anyway, that...

There's going to be in the country, I think, a lot of value for the U.S. Well, just sort of on the fair play basis, people who don't know or care about communist China or free China, but they're playing at this world of China, you know, these brave souls, they fought with the U.N., and there they were, and there all this time, and paid their dues, and honored their elders, and off they go.

That kind of drumbeat is going to, I think, bother a level of people who don't know or care about it.

I was talking to George Bush as well.

I think I'd keep him here the week or two.

I just say, I would put out that you have ordered a full review of the whole situation in the UN, and until that's completed, George Bush is going to say it's going to be needed in Washington.

A full review of the UN?

Yes.

I mean, of the implications of that vote, it's not so much the vote, it's what this tells us about where the UN is standing.

Right.

How long do you want to start writing and keep him safe and keep him here for a couple of weeks, and then I don't want to see what the result of the review is?

You've got to do it.

Can we keep him waiting?

I talked to him on the phone, I didn't know.

Maybe I will keep talking to him on the phone.

Maybe this is...

What time was he supposed to come?

I don't know.

He's supposed to come at ten, I think.

See, Rogers may have had him come over there at five o'clock, so that's ten thirty.

Well, I don't know.

First of all, I'm not going to have a picture in face of you.

I'm not going to have a picture.

He's still out there.

That's what I...

I didn't ask the impression that he was here.

Or maybe so.

They didn't understand.

I thought that they were sure I was the one seeing the catalog in it.

That's what I told Rogers.

Senator Rogers was very vague in doing any advice about him on any of the media.

On what?

About any of the meetings down here, but he said Bush is coming down here just to see Secretary Rogers around then.

He was very big about any meetings with you.

Who raised the paper?

I did.

What did you tell him?

I told him that you would like to see Bush at 10 o'clock this morning.

He said fine, he would set it up.

And he said could we make it earlier or later because I have to testify on the Hill.

I see.

Well that's probably why.

What did you say?

I said I don't.

I said no, to have him come on down, and then that we would work out this morning.

And he shifted the meeting time.

So he apparently told him to come down.

Get your load free.

Well, that's fine.

Roger's bringing it in.

Tell Steve that we're cutting the bush now.

I don't care for this.

All right, I guess this is a little thing.

What's the strategy, Henry, on that?

You wouldn't get it very far in the breakfast this morning on that one.

Here's the problem, which I think we have to realize, and it does relate to your background, or at least how that, or what you did on that.

The problem is not

This changes somewhat.

It's not Taiwan.

The problem is the U.N. and the United States getting kicked around by a bunch of non-Africans and cannibals and horrible people and the rest.

And so basically they left Virginia out of power.

And of all the people, I mean, let's face it, Buckley, Goldwater, Reagan and so forth have been getting out of the UN for years.

And all those people are roaming around.

But it isn't just them.

Bob links up about a lot of people that saw that show on television were outraged by it.

I mean, just normal, decent people.

If you read the news summary, you'll find that that's sort of reflected true.

I mean, listen, it's not about Taiwan.

Now, there is some about the idea that Taiwan is a poor, brave little country, and why do you need to throw them out and keep all these smaller countries in?

This, of course, completely misses, totally misses the idea of two China, one China, etc., etc., etc.,

But he puts us in the position at the present time.

The other thing we will have to do is that it is not yet at a high level of visibility.

But our Democratic Party is trying to see any reason to blame us for this defeat.

I don't know very well what this is.

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We were losing all the time.

We were going to lose it anyway, and everybody knows it.

I told you in March, once we shifted our position, this was before I had been in Peking, we were lost.

And that's why we dragged our feet, and they wanted to go to that new position.

Ja, but not because of this last trip.

It was on the basis of the Peking policy.

Secondly, because I happen to believe, it doesn't make any difference, that the state deliberately put the vote at the time that I was in Peking, so that they could get that effect, because no one can convince me.

They told us, I had put it in my office, they told us,

And Hay can confirm this, that they could hold the vote till the 29th easily, and certainly till next week, and probably till next week.

And I think this, if not unintentional, this takes, this gives, takes Rogers, if they win it, Rogers gets a big play while I'm gone, and overshadows my return, and if they lose it, I'm the fall guy.

And in that body, in that madhouse up there,

Not to delay for a week seems to me inconceivable.

All the more so if they had told me that the vote wouldn't be before the 29th.

That does walk you down.

Anyway, he wasn't their choice, was he?

So you would have gone after the vote?

No, but if I could have come back before the vote...

Joshua, I don't think my trip affected one vote.

You go through this list, and I'd like to...

There's only one country whose vote could have been affected by that list.

I don't really care.

No, no, but it could have...

I have to tell you honestly, I think the basic objective of Rajah is to piss on the China trip.

Well, that's obvious to me this morning.

Everyone who was there with me thought that

In these two night sessions which showed what we did was a major achievement.

You know, nothing, when I think of how he, well, I don't want to get into that.

His negotiating tactic for him to tell me that I'm soft is just about the most absurd statement in the light of everything that's happened in the last three years.

But I'll let that go for the time being.

They are soft.

The whole thrust of what he was saying this morning is that we were getting taken by these clever, diabolical Chinese, and that he was going to be the guardian and going to make sure that you were going to be taken to the cleaner.

And, I mean, that was basically the thrust.

Well, I don't know if you ever saw that, and I agree.

I mean, there were just what many...

I think more of it, more of it really is that he wants to know.

You know, it's a little story.

No, he's going to piss on everything that's being done in China, I think, because for vanity, I... You think so?

I mean, what killed Rogers is the fact that we're going to be on television again.

Now, there was no way of avoiding it.

If I take credit for the things I did this year...

That I was going to be on television with the return and with another China trip and people that was more than his vanity could stand.

But I was going to get a good, a big publicity shot again.

Out of the trip.

Yeah, that's right.

There's no problem.

I mean, after all, on Sol, just as soon as I got out of the limelight, he was happy as a log, on Berlin, on the UN summit.

Hell, they even put out that crap to Newsweek, that you pleaded with the Russians on the summit, that the Russians wanted to send Poseidon, but you insisted on going there, because, just so that they could take away any possible implication that there had been some planning involved.

Well, the truth doesn't have to come out of here, because it's so totally different from the truth.

Is it possible sometimes, though, that we just... What do you mean by that?

What's so utterly untrue?

That doesn't matter.

That way, it isn't long-range planning.

Oh, that's right.

They were pushing for me to say, you see...

That's right.

Their version is, the version that Newsweek had was that, you see, you told Russia that you said there was a letter you wrote to Brezhnev.

Now that Brezhnev letter actually didn't even mention the summit.

The summit was already said when you sent the letter.

So the Newsweek story is that the Russian asked us to send Kosykin.

to take Kosykin when he was in Canada.

You then wrote a letter to President saying they owed you an invitation.

And that made it possible.

Now this sort of makes it look like... Because they had put out that you were going to see Kosykin.

They were actually building the Kosykin thing.

So it doesn't take credit away from you, but it makes it a little ploy.

And...

And I think it's killing them.

And we wouldn't be, it saved us domestically.

And I still maintain that the China trip will not give you the huge, the China, you will find that the Chinese...

are the toughest, but the most vulnerable of these communists you can deal with.

And that they have set up the whole foreign policy for us.

I mean, they are the ones that gave us the reputation of foresight, bold move, big play, and...

And I think Henry's analysis of Roberts in this respect is correct, Bob.

And you too.

I mean, well, let me put it this way.

First, the China thing.

The China thing, of course, is... And I didn't...

This is just Roberts, but I was thinking of that article of Star, which is now being picked up by... What the hell did I pick up last?

The Sherman article?

Yes, the Sherman article.

I don't even know Sherman.

I've never seen him.

What I meant is, I think it's part of the whole scheme.

The whole scheme is to say that basically that I have really nothing to do with the mining.

Who was published the other night, Mark?

It's the same thing, but the same theme.

The point is, the point is, what happens is, there is an establishment here, and it's in state, and it's just Rogers Manor, but it's there, and what they know about it, they're dying, they're dying, and Sherman is picking up the establishment line, not for the purpose of building fuel, that was going on, the overhead, the overhead, that's right, the overhead are the same thing.

But that's sort of the theme of the architect and all that sort of thing.

And the purpose of that is to do two things.

One, their purpose is a little different from the state's, but it's partly established.

The purpose is to drive paint over the wall, and the purpose is to downgrade.

And to downgrade you?

Right.

Downgrade.

In the case of this, in the case of this, what we are talking about is this, that we, within this job, let me say, I don't give a shit about all that.

I know that we have the big bold play, the bold play on China, led the bold play on Russia, the bold play on Russia.

I want to say it very clearly, you probably know.

You know, it had very little effect on this country.

We have less than 200 letters on it.

And the reason is that we make so many.

Now that doesn't that mean that you and I know the red flag of Russia is more important than the one on China.

In the short term.

In the long term, the other ones are more important.

But in the short term, when you consider what we're going to talk about in Russia, it's the continents.

China is the...

It's the long term.

I don't know what the score is here.

I already told you that with regard to the, that the, and I will, that I want to approve every individual press man and every individual member of the staff here, you know, except for example, I mean, he includes the monitors.

I also... Any press prefect that I, my strong view is, Mr. President, there's only one man whom we have to build up, and that's you.

For the country, for...

The election, all of us are second-ranked players.

Two years from now, no one will give a good goddamn whether Raj is or I signed the last paper.

If you are president, two years from now, our approach has a chance.

If you are not president, you all have to.

Who knows today whether Rassau or Russ was more important?

Or who gets it there?

And therefore, any briefing that I have ever done,

As I hope Bob knows, I have always been to view, I have never claimed credit.

I have never said that I designed anything.

In fact, I have never even said, except that it was unavoidable, like going to China.

We know that.

What I'm getting at is that we have faced two enemies in this respect.

We faced the State Department establishment, who had a disarmament because they didn't clean it up.

We faced the press establishment, who were missing under the name of the President.

One rubs on the other.

The solution isn't to let them do it, because if they did it, they'd take credit for themselves against you.

Then they would play the second game, that you are so... Everybody in trouble in lockdown is a piece, I suppose, now.

I'll do it today, because I'm going to call Hubbard, and I'm going to say, I don't care who gives you that information, scrub it from your list, it's a total bunch of baloney, that the president put in the list.

A year ago, in talking to Gromyko, they had nothing to do with it.

You can see that they were never in the cards.

I don't think it would be good, but Hubbard police are not very influential in the establishment.

I'll call Christopher, who's there for me.

It's probably a very competitive source to begin with, yeah.

If you know some devices, especially at a reasonable level, you can just say, you know, I know that.

I'm going to tell them it's not a big deal because I'm the way that they should have been at that time.

It's a responsible publication, you know, and you see, I'm not there to do it on the trip.

I got something in mind.

Neither one of them.

This is going to be the most interesting for us.

But either at the parade piece, for example, the one quote of mine they do have in there, is where I do say the president is the one who makes all these decisions by himself and thinks it all over.

No one gets to be president by taking somebody else's voice.

Correct.

And that's what the chairman had to quote from you.

I just read the Sherman piece.

That happened when I was gone, but I want you to know...

Your quotes are fine.

The problem is not what you say.

It's what they try to read.

I don't even know what he looks like.

I've never met him.

But never even met him.

I've never talked to him in the three years that I'm here.

So here we know it isn't something we took.

At that point you've got to realize that nobody is raising a question about what you're doing.

I guess that's the way it is in our energies.

You remember, for example, at the time...

about the war, he used to say, that what drove your friends at Harvard and the establishment of the wall was not that we were ending the war, but that I was doing it.

And that is really what this is all about.

Now look here.

Look at Hungary this morning.

You were hungry, I suppose, Danny, pissing on this thing.

Great diplomatic defeat, and all the rest of you in Hungary was all out for kicking China out of the United Nations and for the recognition of China.

See my point?

Well, of course,

because State played it.

I've been trying for two months, as you remember, Mr. President, to low-key it, because I thought we'd lose it, and because I thought that the countries we needed could be gotten without the big hoopla, but State, which incorrectly thought they had a chance of winning, if they had won it, it wouldn't have been your victory, it would have been their victory.

So they made that big hoopla out of it.

If you go through that list, the key countries we needed, we didn't need hoopla about.

Ireland, we could have got with landing rights.

Iceland, we could have got with heaven.

Well, then nothing would have worked.

Guyana...

So all I mean is, we didn't need a big diplomatic hoopla for those key countries.

Either we could do it by buying them, or it wasn't going to work at all.

And what made it a big defeat was the story every day of the huge pressure.

You remember, Bob, I didn't want us to go on television.

I told Haig and everybody in March, before we went to Peking, that once we shifted our position, we were down the tube.

That was my conviction all along.

The Peking thing was a marginal contributing factor.

If you go through this way... No, I don't mean my Peking trip.

My Peking trip made no difference at all.

My first Peking trip... All Peking trips were basically excuses, not reasons.

My first peaking trip, I might be able to find two countries it affected.

The second peaking trip, I cannot find a single country that it could have affected.

We have a massive problem of a department which, when it thinks it has a chance of winning, is trying to do it for itself.

And when it loses, tries to shove the blame in you.

And when you do something, try to start, try to cut away at it.

And you can go down in history as the man who opened up China if we play this thing.

cool and well, and if we keep our own people from destroying our victory.

And the same with the Russian summit.

Your big achievement, Mr. President, is what we have to build about you is the man of the cool, calm, far-sighted deliberation.

who doesn't panic, who knows what he's doing, to write a ploy letter to Brook to Breslin and get a ploy reply.

Anybody can do that.

That's Kennedy on the test bench.

Your game is that you foresee it in 68 and say to the campaign that you do it in 69 and that it works in 71 just as you planned it.

That's, I mean, that is your style.

And to the degree that they can say, well, he shut out the letter, and it was story-reader for more than it happened to work, you know, that's a clever, Madison Avenue guy.

Anybody can do that.

You think Robert knows how to get brains on it?

Of course.

He's got to know it.

That's

Of course, another part of the problem with him is that he's not stupid.

Not only that he isn't stupid, but he is not stupid in the sense of seeing what's going on.

You should have seen your actresses morning, it's just not the same.

When you talk to you, you need to ask them what they think was the reason for it.

And then you hear this guy, and you're like, nothing, nothing.

You know, to get the Chinese not to want us to sign short statements, but to be satisfied with what it's like to hear you talk, to let me hear you talk.

I come from Central Archives, and I'm also there floating, and I come in here.

Incidentally, I've got to give a press briefing.

I don't want to give a goddamn speaking press briefing.

There are only two choices.

If I give it, they'll take my lead.

If I don't give it today, they'll put out this stuff tomorrow and make it look much more mysterious.

Oh, that's great.

It's just, don't do a back-end.

Do it on the record.

Oh, even better.

That was, that, see, I've already gone through that with Al, apparently he didn't get to you.

No, no, he said on the basis of a background, and that, and that it is, what he's adhering to is the background.

No, then let's do it on the record.

He wants it, you do it on the record.

No, we'll do it on the record.

And then stay with the, you know, don't go into all the background type stuff.

No, we'll do it on there.

On the record stuff.

The line you want printed.

But you know these sons of bitches.

They put that vote on Monday night.

To screw me.

Are you feeling alright?

Do you want to take some time off now?

No, I'm alright.

That's not a good press.

That's one that is there to give the president the chance to have a great audience to make a statement on the court where it stands.

Well, you never will.

Reading them won't make any difference.

The press will never read them.

And it doesn't matter that they don't.

Because nobody read it if they did.

The point is that millions of people that saw them now have a history for the press of what he thinks, and there's no way the press will know what those people think.

There go Winston.

He just went right over the head of the press and the American car and everybody else.

He's not too far right from the court.

That's the other thing.

If you've got a guy, the one guy right next to him, he's only got a so long chance to get on that court.

If he just walked up and...

He is pretty far-eyed, isn't he?

Of course, he's way to the right as he can.

God, yes.

He's as righteous as a friend.

They know this stuff.

We put up, you know, some people learn, and others, as frank employees.

We're not employees, but, you know, we're leading down the path to us.

We didn't want them to go into the government.

We're leading down the path to certain names.

We'd ask you to see what other people were recommending.

And then the press jumped on and seized them on, but they attacked us.

Well, it isn't their philosophy, it's their mediocrity.

They walked right into the zone, and I picked two men.

He was first in his class in Moscow.

He was fighting the Kappa.

I believe, as far as the American fire committed, I would say, I would doubt that any member of that committee was first in his class in Moscow.

As I pointed out to the president, he said, you know, being first in Moscow, you see, I was third.

I was ordered to quit.

I wasn't first.

You know, that has an enormous impact on these goddamn stocks.

First in his class in Moscow.

Reckless was first at Stanford.

... ... ... ... ...

Vanessa Peterson.

Keep Peterson out of the International Monetary Fund.

He doesn't know enough about it, you know.

He thinks he should run.

It's not his fault.

It's just not a good arrangement.

I was thinking that I really shouldn't have to go through these rather, as I said before, rather tense sessions with

Well, here I was trying to report what went on and nothing we did was right.

Well, he came in with a fantastic accomplishment when you look at what you thought you'd get and what you got.

We got 100% of the technical arrangements at 90%.

I think we're a hell of a lot better off.

What difference does it make that they say they're supporting the seven-point program of the DRV?

No one knows what that is.

As long as you can say you're supporting our allies, you're meeting your commitments, you can come back and say we didn't give away a goddamn thing.

And

And he does that.

I remember after the other trip, he sat there in that meeting in San Clemente, and was making the point, gee, are we sure we really want to open the Chinese to the world?

They're so much smarter than everybody else, and we're going to have a lot of problems now.

We didn't notice that you could keep them locked up in a box and pretend they weren't there forever.

On the substance, we got 90% of what we couldn't hold.

My people always got to say, well, these are very smart people, and they're going to be very tough, and we've got to be careful.

And also, it's, of course, a little bit condescending, because I had forgotten more about negotiating with tough people on the international front than most people have ever learned.

Mr. President, if you were not in office, if one had to go through the list of leading Americans who could handle this, there is no one in the country who one could pick who could do it as well as you.

Interesting point.

If someone else were president and had to find a citizen to go deal with him,

You have the knowledge, you have the subtlety.

Indeed, I would say, I said it to Bob yesterday.

First of all, Mr. President, they killed it.

They had a field of humanity.

He'd come back, floating on the tremendous reception he had had.

Secondly, Joe and I would make absolute mincemeat out of him.

He is

You are literally the only leading American who can do it.

Nelson, whom I, as you know, admire enormously, he couldn't do this because he doesn't have the subtlety or the staying power.

You are going to sit there for five hours if necessary, and you'll fence with him.

And at the end of it, he won't have gotten a goddamn thing.

But the major problem is this.

We are committed to this Chinese trip now, Mr. President.

You know it, but it doesn't do us any good to sit in front of you.

It's going to be tough enough to fight the Chinese.

To have your two senior advisors sparring in front of you, what good does that do to anybody?

Even if I screwed it up in Peking,

What good does it do to do that in front of you, make you insecure?

His whole idea is, well, it didn't make me insecure.

I know what he was trying to get at.

What he wants to do is to say that he says, well, did you have anything in the cave?

Well, he shouldn't ask that of Henry in my present spot.

See what I mean?

God damn it, I mean, I can't have, maybe he has a communicator, but if he has, he's told me in conference, he should ask Henry Franklin, and Henry lies to him, or doesn't lie to him, a little too, but you know, that shouldn't put you, I don't think he should have put you on the spot in that respect.

You don't have a communicator.

As a matter of fact, I do, except for one character.

I said no.

That's what I said.

But the point is, if he makes me lie in front of you, he puts you into the soup with me.

If I lie to him privately, you can later on say, well, Henry was, you know...

Well, give him enough, frankly, like you did before.

But this is tough enough with the United Government.

But what I mean is like you did before on this thing and so forth and so on.

No, not too much, sir.

... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Ok. Ja.

And you told us, why don't you say it's part of your intention?

I didn't even let him sit in on the meeting.

Why not?

He asked you later what happened.

I told him, well, you know, I just had him been asked.

He was all right.

They had him talk cultural exchange.

They kept him so busy.

He's floating on air.

He thinks he did a great thing there.

You look at every picture of mine that was taken, you'll see Jenkins at my right side.

There was no picture that I hadn't taken.

I always moved him up with me.

So I tried to build the guy up.

Anyway, it's the writer's sentence, isn't it?

It was really glad you would have sat there.

And I sat there, because Henry, I mean, I was doing fine, because I was better off if Henry left at 5 or 8, so I decided that I was going to check out.

And Trish is calling you.

She called while you were done.

She's calling again.

Anyway, I talked to the...

Everybody here ought to be...

Oh, it was Henry, too.

That's what I mean.

Certainly with you, but I was also...

I was fascinated to know what the hell happened in the building.

He didn't show a goddamn good response.

He can't pretend to answer that.

It didn't seem to be asking any questions.

I asked questions.

I already knew what the answer was.

You noticed he didn't show a damn good response.

How they treated us, what they're going to do.

All he can do is express himself.

And that's so ridiculous at this point.

Because you can't undo it.

We cannot undo it.

We are committed to doing it anyway.

Well, when you come right down to it, the whole business...

We have to try to understand why the ideologues took an inevitable situation and made a bet on it.

Understand why the leadership in the world is in this kind of situation.

Where the historical forces had brought us to a point where we just, where only we could open the door to these sensitive issues.

And they are some of the issues.

And have some leverage with them.

Because of the Russians.

The Russians shouldn't even understand that.

That is, after all the video that they've been making, they don't know what's going to happen.

The only thing really that concerns me is the fact that it shows that Vietnam is being overthrown.

In fact, we have an intelligence report where Ledouin, their party secretary, in Hanoi says that the Chinese are hurting him.

And he said it to him.

Bill Swain, most of his, well, at least a third of his time, was talking about how the Canadian ambassador had been beating up the black painters, and so forth.

Well, now, I ought to read that intelligence report now.

I have to read the intelligence report and know that any communist ambassador, any place, will be as much revolutionary as him.

But what the Christ did was this.

So much with the black man.

What the Christ did.

We respect the communists.

When we've got to this trip, it's got to be a success.

We've all got to be enthusiastic about it.

In the history books, it will go down as a tremendous achievement, Mr. President.

About this, I have no doubt.

But even, I saw television this morning, for example, on both the Today show and the CBS, for the wrong reasons.

But nobody covered the UN at all, but both of them covered the China trip in a very favorable way.

Now, their reason is leftism, so I'm not a...

It doesn't mean a hell of a lot, but...

I was talking about this background.

It probably concerns me on the background.

Maybe we can handle it in a different way.

It probably concerns me for some time.

I had just put up another possibility with the low-key announcement made by my secretary.

And then, to a background...

Maybe in a few days, get one that's done.

And now, here's this event.

I think, coming off of the Taiwan event, the emotional feeling about it, to then have a big story about how we're moving with Red China.

I'm not concerned about irritating the likes of Buckley and Ray.

We'll be irritated anyway.

Reagan is going to make a party for Bob, and one of the reasons he would like for you to call him later today, if you will, is the threat that he might have to oppose the Indian trip.

Well, what he said, he said it's going to have a very sudden effect on the president.

Well, after all we're doing for Reagan, who is not the most smart in all the world,

He was off that last night when I talked to him.

He didn't say anything.

He wouldn't hit that with you, where he went with John.

He didn't mention it.

He's playing his little game.

He's playing his political game.

You've got to figure that he has around him a group of very, very far-right people in the British society and all that much support.

That's right.

And he's got the guys in his own staff that say, this is your chance.

He's got a staff that want him to be president.

That's right.

Who say, this is your chance to mobilize the anti-right-wing Communist Senate here.

That's why he rescinded his order on the United Nations, which is delightful.

That was a good move on his part.

That's correct.

John probably had an idea that was similarly unsound.

You know, John's always an actor.

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

I frankly have the impression that Cho was not eager to win that vote this year, that he would have preferred... No, we can't do it because we promised that we wouldn't set up a separate Taiwan as a state.

No, it's better not to do it, but I wouldn't mind having a story out if we could get some wild country talking that way.

Er...

No, it's an unsound idea.

It would lose three to one.

Under the background, here's the problem that I see.

I don't want to give our enemies an opportunity to seize on that and say the administration, despite the public uproar and the outcome, goes blightedly on its way

We better make the announcement at full anyhow I understand that

They said they were going to put out a story of the meetings and visits.

I said, no, it's going to create all sorts of rumors in the United States.

We had to explain what we said, what we didn't say.

Then he said, all right, why don't you put out the story you want, and we will then take our leave from that, and we won't go beyond it now.

I'm sure this is what they're going to do.

They've never broken their word to us yet.

So they are holding it.

I don't give a damn.

We're not talking about the person.

You understand what we're getting at here.

We're talking about this very delicate problem at the moment of power.

That's why we're being pushed.

I don't want to see Bush.

We've got to see him first.

Because of the nation.

I think if you make the announcement, there's going to be one hell of a lot of speculation anyway.

What would you visualize currently?

I would say, 10-15 at most, and maybe on the record.

My feeling is that it doesn't have anything horrible now.

No, but I thought I could say, No, no, but that's what I couldn't do.

You see, the problem is that if I go on the record, the last one I did on the record,

And there's a lot to be said for doing this one on there.

Oh, yes, this should be on the record.

I would say, here is how we spent our time.

We went to the Great Wall, we saw the thing.

Every place we went, we checked out what the technical problems are.

It takes a lot of...

So I can make it seem like a very low-key effort.

That way, at least our story is...

I would like to get the impression that this is where we started setting up the big...

I have to say nothing that we don't want to say.

I simply say that we check the logistical problems of the president's travel, and we check the manners of the press, and we check the manners of the communications, and so forth, and we work out an arrangement.

And we went over, they both believed that there was no substance, and I say we...

It did not go beyond anything, it was discussed in July, we just confirmed.

It was discussed in July, but arranged, but each, but of course the Chinese leaders have arranged their schedules so as to see what time.

I can take the mystery out.

You could also say that, yes, the president will meet with Mao, that's got to be confirmed.

That's fixed.

If they ask me what's the UN vote discussed, I say no.

I said it as we said it before.

This isn't true, but I'll say no anyway.

No, no, no.

and then said that they... Was Taiwan discouraged?

I'll say, I won't go into any substance, of course, they always mention Taiwan, but they know our views.

So I would low-key, when I came back the first time,

I managed to get the discussion in the direction we wanted to go.

My concern is...

It will go in the wrong direction.

Let me say this.

If you can keep it very short, very short.

I mean, no one will keep you in there for an hour.

Fifteen minutes.

Just keep it very short and not in the middle of monosyllabic.

And...

You're going to indicate who we're all showing and so forth.

I think I should say, so that they have something to write about, as the date of the president's trip, it hasn't been absolutely set, but we've got it narrowed to a short period, and we expect to announce it before December 1st, and this will stop that speculation.

It will be definitely announced by December 1st.

Yes, we've got it down within a matter of weeks.

And it will be definitely announced by December 1st.

An announcement of the dates of the actual dates will be made by December 1st.

Very good.

You can still know from there, because I say, well, does that mean you'll be leaving on December 2nd?

I'm saying, we won't, we'll give you the full details.

I can't go beyond that.

The date will be announced.

The date will be announced by December.

I'm saying that it will not be left until the first of the year.

You say that.

I say that.

That's not a bad idea.

I'm expecting it off of the day-to-day speculation.

Is he going to leave tomorrow morning?

It will be at the first of the year.

We'll say it will not be announced by December 1st, but

I'll do this on background, I say it's for your own information.

Yeah.

And deliberately rule.

Yeah, yeah.

You are safe in saying that it will not be before.

For the person here, obviously, and after announcing the date, the preparatory time.

Yeah.

I'll say so that you don't, you're going to be taken on one of the charges first.

Yeah.

You have to pack your bags.

You can say it because of the, well, you can say it because of the time of.

I don't want to say it's on the record, but I'll say on the Lindley rule, the time required to put it back, the time required, we know this doesn't require a great length of time.

So I'll say you're absolutely safe in speculating.

They may ask the question, if this makes them go in and so forth.

I say the composition of the party will be announced at a later time.

That's right.

And I'll get, I've got it all set to show all that.

For she shouldn't make any tantalizing inns anymore if she can avoid it.

And we'll just up and announce that at the time.

Because we can't.

Under no circumstances are we inviting any other women to go.

Well, I don't think they take anymore anyway.

I think actually, Mr. President, we can, when I thought about it, your instinct is right.

We can get along.

Won't have a hell of a lot to do.

Exactly, that's what I mean.

Although I think they are going to have a program for the press that their tongues will be hanging out.

They'll have them busy.

The local peaking press was who we think they kept them.

They didn't let them within 500 yards of the Great Hall of the People.

And they

Because you have to remember, Mr. President, for an American audience,

I spoke to a group of schoolchildren and to some of the families.

They do look weird because they all wear a uniform.

They all have a red star on their cap.

We understand.

That is superbly great for America.

I just want you to be aware.

That's just a contrast.

But on the other hand, at Jacob's request, Jacob told me on this...

Second incident, the treatment was superb, Mr. President.

He really, he was strong, but subtle and meticulous.

He was absolutely, and he said, for the sake of the President, when you see a crowd, see what response you can get out of them, just so that we have a feel for it.

And so we saw a group of schoolchildren, and the interesting thing is when they see one of their top leaders, they're in awe, they never approach.

Because their number four man was with me, which was deliberate of me, I thought.

So I broke away from him and walked over and started shaking hands with the kids.

And at first they didn't understand that at all, and then they started smiling, and then a few of them started clapping.

And I clapped back, then their leaders started clapping, and then a big ovation, everyone clapping.

So then...

Well, the real choice is that you can't evoke a human response to that.

Well, except if I were to be one of your own, but you may not be your own.

Joe wouldn't want me, of course, completely innocent.

I can't have a goddamn thing with him alone.

Yeah, that's right.

No, but no.

Excuse me, Mr. President.

You being alone couldn't do a goddamn thing.

Because they will never let an American alone.

You wouldn't get near a crowd.

If Joe is rich, you save the sports palace.

And if Joe starts clapping, you are in business.

If you are alone, you could stand on your hands, and you wouldn't get a response.

They don't get the signal, they don't respond.

When I walked into that meeting of the top cadre, they had assembled for me at the Peking Opera Performance, in the Great Hall of the People, I walked in, and it was the iciest atmosphere you've ever seen.

Then the marshal started clapping, and the foreign minister both started clapping, and then they started clapping.

So, I frankly think, Mr. President, Joe being with you, to me, guarantees the success of your visit.

Look, I think it's fine.

Whatever they want.

But if you don't want him with you, you should travel in your plane, and he won't come with you.

I think you'll have...

But being alone in a plane is doing good.

It's being alone on the ground.

I don't think you'll be there, then.

Daniela, you were met by local dignitaries.

I have already decided, Bob, that this is something that is my decision.

I will travel in airplanes.

That's what it's going to be.

Mr. O'Hughes.

If you travel in airplanes, the fact that Mao is coming to Hangzhou to see you, the fact that Zhou travels with you, makes you an honored state guest.

And that guarantees you a big reception.

That gets you the crowds.

You can't dive into a Chinese crowd anyway, because the way this thing is organized.

But it gives you... How about this?

It's all set.

Their foreign minister is all... Their foreign minister will take counterpart meetings.

Their foreign minister will take care of them.

He's going to be so busy that

He can't find anything so popular as exchange.

Oh no, we could get him things to talk about.

Let him talk about Taiwan a little bit.

It's the keystone of your work, Mr. President.

You get a good reception in China, which I know you will.

If we come out with a decent communique, you're in business with the Russians.

Then the Russian trip will be a great success.

He's concerned with good reason about what does the communique say about Taiwan.

But I think if we aren't smart enough to work out some fuzzy language there, then we're... That's right.

It's my understanding that the legal layer will be that what we say about Taiwan won't be in the communique.

It'll be done in the back room.

You are going to be more sensitive to what you can say than he.

You are not going to say anything that will hurt us.

I believe, actually, on Taiwan, they haven't met you yet.

We may even want to leave that open until you get there.

If you tell Mao, look, this is what I'm willing to do, but in order to do it, we cannot say a great deal.

And once they've seen you, and see that there's this feel there, then I think it will go, they're not trying to screw you, that's not the way they operate, they're not like the Russians.

The Russians get you by accumulating little things.

The Chinese operate like you do, they go for the big play.

They are not interested in, they do not want,

When I left, Joe said to me, I want you to understand that we have a big investment in President Nixon.

Everything we do is geared to him.

He said a lot of people have promised us things, but we believe only he can actually perform them.

And you have to say now, Bill was making a fuss about how they were growing.

That isn't true.

Yesterday, Joe and their foreign minister, leading a group of press, said absolutely no comment.

They can't have any interest in humiliating you.

Well, they were going to, Mr. President.

I think we ought to go the other way.

Absolutely.

Another thing is, there is one place where we can cut, we should definitely cut.

There's a stupid organization, that's one that Paul Hoffman works with in the UN.

He was in here and made a pitch to raise it to 100 million.

The budget is 75, 45.

That's the message.

And they want you to declare no benefit?

Turn it off.

Today.

I will not.

Nothing on the United Nations.

If it is, it will be black.

But I want him to get busy and kind of be the UN thing.

Maybe 10 years would be that.

Just say, well, this is part of our global deal.

But we don't think that that organization does us no good.

One thing we found in this U.N. vote was that while we supported most of these organizations around 30-40% and sometimes 50%, it didn't mean a vote for us in any case.

The Chinese were able to come in with a pipsqueak little thing, and the French.

I think the one thing, the people who oppose us ought to know, and we ought to play a hard game with them.

The other thing is, a conversation has to take place, and I must not be in it without a password.

Ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja.

I want a conversation to take place with Otto Pest with regard to support from all the national organizations.

He's against them anyway.

I think Bryce is the one to do it.

Bryce can go see him and say, look, that president has to be miles away from this, but Otto, have you ever chopped the liver of a Jesus out of these things now?

I don't know whether Ottawa, I think, has jurisdiction, you may say, only over the direct foreign aid type.

Then that's too bad.

But I'm referring not to everything.

I'm referring to, for example, the state is in here asking us to put in $15 million to some active development fund.

And I'd be to have a copy of the recommendation, and there'd be no more for Africa.

I want somebody to make a study of them, all the national things, how they could be cut.

Now, incidentally, don't put this through Peterson's office, because he'll talk right to me.

No, that should go through mine anyway.

Well, what I meant is, I don't want Peterson to know about it, because that's what might get my point.

I guess this has got to be closely held, because we'll have to act if we're not doing it.

But I want these things cut right off in the hidden pockets.

Fair enough.

But I don't want him to come directly.

I don't want Henry's office to talk to Otto.

That's too close.

But I'll talk to Bryce, me and him together.

Well, then Henry's people look over the whole thing.

I'll tell Reagan a few of those things very confidentially.

He doesn't believe.

I think that's right.

You can say that we are doing it, and we're cutting the UN.

He was concerned because he was angry because Rogers, and Rogers was right in this respect, said, well, the UN's appropriation would be cut, but it would not be because of retaliation on the vote.

No, no.

Bill was right on that.

You can't say... Maybe you can help... Well, you can say, well, we can't say it's retaliation, or there are things they can do to us, and also...

Anyway, I think you could have another talk with Reagan and say, now, look here, we need your support at this time, and there are a lot of more.

I don't know, what can you say to him?

I promised Reagan, but he had cooled off a lot last night.

I did it, I figured it's best...

So I called him after you talked to me, and didn't even talk about the UN, and I just said, I want you to know what a superb job you did on your trip.

I'm just off the plane.

And you really, I can just touch by the publicity you're getting in Peking.

You really must have heard them, because they were complaining bitterly about you.

And I said, well, I just want you to know, Mr. Cho,

That Reagan didn't just speak as governor, he spoke as president, special representative.

Well, he liked that.

Then he gave me his song in dance about the UN.

And I said, frankly, I'm just on the way of seeing the president.

Let me call you tomorrow on that.

I want to keep him quiet for a dance.

I would call him if you would, Henry, after we finish here.

Oh, it's three o'clock his time.

He's in three until then.

He said he's doing some... No, no, no, it's three thirty this time.

He will not be able to talk to me till three this time, because he's doing some dedication, he said.

So he wanted you to call at three, which is six o'clock, and getting down at eight thirty this time.

Well, I told him I'll call you first.

I'll put in a call.

I won't be able to reach him.

Well, it might be we're trying.

It's what I got him yesterday.

What I'm getting at is we're trying.

Now, I agree with you on Buckley.

I think Buckley is...

He comes in here, protests his interest and all the rest, but Buckley is basically a...

Well, he's playful.

He's a playboy.

And he does not, he doesn't really have character, in my opinion.

He's just, he basically plays to that audience.

And I just don't get a hell of a lot out of him.

I think, Bob, it's the point about your kindred's right wing friends.

God damn it.

When have they been with us when we did it?

I thought of it last night, then out screaming and organizing.

But after November 3rd, I called Buckley.

I said, give us a hand.

He said, well, it wasn't quite as eloquent as he would have liked it.

When my negotiations broke down in September, I got him in and said, we need some conservative support now.

When we thought that Congress said, can you organize it?

He said, no, this team is out of that.

So whenever we really wanted him,

I'm going to call Phil now, as soon as we're through.

And ask him for lunch at the earliest possible time.

Yeah, that's worthwhile, that's worthwhile.

The problem is that Reagan, for instance, gets a good chunk of his guidance.

This whole nutty Reagan plan yesterday came from Bill Buckley.

But Reagan doesn't think so.

No, Reagan isn't right enough.

And Bill knows that Reagan is much more affected politically than he is, so Bill thinks him up and then programs Reagan all the time.

On the United Nations,

My inclination is to bounce everything to Secretary Rogers' press conference yesterday and cover no new ground.

I will, however, be pressed on the funding question, because in the press conference yesterday, the Secretary said, I feel that the United States has contributed more than it should have.

So I will be pressed to answer, is that the President's view?

Is that the administration's position?

I could answer that by saying, gentlemen, the Secretary of State got into the details yesterday about our funding.

It's a complex question of any factors involved, including decisions in the Congress and even considerations...

Wait a minute, John.

In other words, talk around me.

We want to take a stronger position on that.

I'll pardon you.

I simply say that, I put it this way, gentlemen, you may recall that the president before this vote received the representatives of 350 members of the House,

... ... ... ... ... ...

... ... ... ... ...

The United States' decision has defeated and has had a very detrimental effect on the American people.

And that this is likely to translate itself.

Yeah, that it's out of certain circumstances that I... Then they say, well, now, what's the president's view of what we've done?

They're going to say, well, the secretary has stated the view of the administration, and it's the president's view.

I must not get an accusation of retaliation in regard to that.

But I think we could say, well, I think we could say, you know what he said?

I'd like that.

I'd like to leave the IDF delegation.

But we cannot say it.

You know how I feel, actually.

Here's the thing that I want to do.

I want to get in that that conduct was a disgusting spectacle to millions of Americans.

That it bleeds.

by delegates on the field of the United States.

Delegates of many countries that the United States supports, has supported very, very, very heavily, forging the economy of those delegates at a very, very, very high level.

And you can see it's the presence of you that we see here.

In fact, first as far as a vote is concerned, we, it is the President's view that we win some votes, we lose some votes.

That we understand.

But, insofar as the United Nations, the United Nations, in terms of its support,

Very seriously, the support for the United Nations in the country, among the American people and in the Congress, was seriously prepared because of the disgusting conduct of some of those delegates who showed such great glee in defending

And we believe that under our system, there's a particular coming from nations in the United States that's so generous, and it's foreign aid programs.

Now, have you seen anyone I can get across?

I'd like, you know, if you want to go a step further and say something about the dental effect that it has on the people of Congress, what's the foreign aid support of those nations?

That's good.

But we've got more than any deal up there right now.

Yes, I think that the result of this, I think that, well, I don't want to put it in my mouth, but I can say we, I think, support the United Nations.

It's enough, Mr. President.

But I think the idea that it is the President's duty, that the disgusting conduct, I think I should refer to that.

Well, of course, I didn't see it.

Oh, it's horrible!

Well, I would put it on the basis that we recognize a vote against us.

But for diplomats to turn this into a personal demonstration...

On television before the American people of their personal dislike of the United States.

Their personal dislike.

And their... And their... And their... And their...

You know, when you say undisguised, are there undisguised beliefs at the feet of the United States, particularly when it comes to the way violence is handled in the United States?

The United States has been very generous with its foreign aid groups, and that's the thing that should get across.

We could put it on this page that this was to a natural question of the principle.

Yeah.

We recognize it was a close vote, and that serious people could have different views on it.

We respect that.

We accept the principle that you win some, you lose some, you make a hard fight.

But on the other hand, in that great international law, then...

And then, when I was just in the president's view, what did he think of?

He said, yes, the president thought it was a shocking performance.

And just what it happened, the president thought it was a shocking performance on the part of some of the Donaldson.

Not commensurate with the seriousness of it.

Yeah, and not worthy.

Not worthy, and not worthy of this.

He said, now understand, gentlemen, that this was not true of all the Democrats who opposed the United States.

It was true of a great number of Democrats, and it has had a massive effect, very detrimental, to those many who support the United Nations.

And that will bother the Chinese too much, if we put it on the basis of it was a serious investment.

We have two questions.

One, there is a question of the vote.

We love the rest of them.

We love them.

On the other hand, we don't say, because we lose the vote, that we pick up our armless and go home.

That is not a tour, this is a way of a tour d'etat.

On the other hand,

Thank you for watching!

for the United States, for a position supported by the United States.

I think the undisguised is that something like a personal animosity?

Yes, the undisguised and obvious personal animosity displayed by some of the delegates for the United States

particularly by some who represented nations that have been very generous recipients of USA.

This has had a massive effect on the American people and the Congress, and it is without question that it is a serious rejection of us, the funding support of the United Nations, and also for all the national organizations

I don't know whether he wants to say just to make it concentrate more on the behavior, to say that the vote had come the other way.

It would have been just as wrong to turn it into a demonstration of personal... You see what I get now?

Yes, sir.

After saying this...

Are you suggesting, or by expressing this attitude, I would ask, that the president then supports a decrease in funds for the UN, and then come back to that?

Yes, well, you can say that the president is reiterating

At this time, the president has ordered to re-appraise, even though he's re-appraising, at the request of the Congress.

At the request of the Congress.

Because of the Senate and the Congress, he has re-appraised the support level for the U.N. and other multinational organizations.

Well, that would get you into a confrontation with the Chinese, wouldn't it?

Of course.

Yes.

Yes, he was.

As a matter of fact, the president and the secretary discussed it at great length in the morning before he had his press conference.

And I would say that the presidents just have not been able to go to that table.

The secretary discussed this at great length at his press conference.

The president and the secretary had a long discussion before the press conference, and that represents the president's views.

Let's leave it on Robert's record.

You see, what I'm getting at is this.

What you're going to get out of this...

Ron, you know better than either of us.

There we go.

That's bullshit about that.

We care about it at the level of support we bring to it.

What you're getting out of here is the disgusting confidence.

Don't you agree?

That's got to be your argument.

I want that to be your argument.

The disgusting conduct of nations that we hate.

However, they will, when I say, I just want to raise my hand very lightly, when I say, yes, the Secretary said he was under the Presidency, they were likely to say the President chides the United Nations for discussing conduct and indicates that U.S. support to the U.N. has been...

No, jeopardize.

I said that as jeopardize.

The secretary said that too.

Second, it is very jeopardize.

Well, what was your point?

Well, see, he said yesterday, I think the funding has spent too much.

Yeah, I will say today, I will confirm that.

Absolutely, I think it's spent too much.

I just wouldn't repeat anything.

I'm not going to go behind what the secretary said.

That was a very apparent statement that had been worked out by him and the president.

And I

Because I'm not yet 100% sure that the Chinese will in fact send somebody in this session.

And I think we'd be better off if they don't show up until you've been there.

You see, the idea of not being worthy, that it's not worthy...

That's a positive one.

Not worthy of an international, a Chinese American body.

Not worthy of delegates to the highest international body in the world.

And the other line here, which we'll play, is as long as it transmits itself into U.S. support for the U.N. And other multinational financing organizations.

Other multinational, we want to start.

And...

One problem we have is that a lot of the guys, when Humphrey may plead now about the defeat, they're just waiting for you to say something and then jump the other way.

although as long as you're criticizing.

So I wouldn't use the word disgusting, for example.

I would say it's restrained.

Well, you've got to use something quickly.

Shocking.

Shocking demonstration.

Undisguised.

Personal animosity.

For the United States, we understand being against, but the undersized elite and the shocking demonstration on television of undersized elite intransiters over the people.

That is the reports that we have received that have come into this office from all over the country.

And the Congress indicated this will seriously jeopardize the level of support for the United Nations at this point.

What is the level of support?

What do you think?

Did you change the President's mind?

Secretary of State?

Secretary of State said yesterday that he thought it was too much for the President's view.

Yes, that's the President's view.

Correct.

That could be it again.

I don't repeat anything Roger said, because then they would use that as the lead.

Just say yes.

I refer you to the Secretary's view.

The President, just say it.

John, on all questions on that subject, the President and the Secretary discussed it before his press conference.

I don't know whether we need that they discuss this before.

Just say the president stands behind the secretary of state.

They will ask.

Well, does the president still support the United Nations?

Is he in favor of a strong U.N.?

And that is a tough question, because they'll take the question and apply the answer directly to it with the story.

So the question is, is the president in favor of a strong United Nations?

And you'll say no.

Well, I don't think he could leave.

It would be a matter of all over the world.

And that's the problem here.

I'd say the president has indicated his support of the United Nations.

On a number of occasions.

Yeah, but I...

And I wouldn't go beyond that.

I think it is supporting the United Nations on numerous occasions.

However, that doesn't mean that we take lying down.

That doesn't mean that the United States takes lying down.

What we think is unnecessarily rude treatment at the United Nations, including the President of the United States, I should say, strike in Atlanta.

They've treated me rudely twice now.

Outrageous.

Ja, and we do not, that doesn't mean that the United States has to take the line down.

What is really outrageous, that's a good word.

Do you mind outrageous?

Does that go over too far?

Disgusting, Father.

All right.

Outrageously rude treatment of the United Nations in what is supposed to be a serious debate on a very important question.

I keep putting in the word good, and unworthy of the high purposes of the United Nations.

Right.

This is... Bob, you probably don't see this, you understand?

The whole purpose of this, of course, is to do with rhetoric what we can't do.

Red is still the goddamn Reagan law, you know?

Just kick the goddamn... Reagan will be pleased with this.

I think the rhetoric is more important to them than what you do with it.

Go ahead, Ron.

I think, what do you want to do on Bush?

He'll be in the argument again.

Apparently what Bill has specified, so what he's done is held him up so that he can bring him over.

I assume you want him to bring him over.

No, not necessarily.

But you'll want to come with him.

Do you not want him?

You have a problem.

Maybe we just won't bother having Bush today.

Why do you have that?

Why do you don't have to see him?

I mean, you have an analogy.

And Bush apparently doesn't.

Bush apparently has been told...

What do you think?

Maybe we just don't bother with Bush.

I think this is splendid.

Yeah, let's just say this and don't bother with Bush.

I'm just too damn busy.

All right.

Okay.

Let him go.

Just tell Bill that I got tied up, which is true.

I tied up the budget today and so forth.

And I thought he was coming in at 10 o'clock.

Just tell Bill that.

If he raises a question.

I'm sorry the president had 10 o'clock.

We're going to put a timeline on these semester terms.

Is that all right with you now, Andrew?

That's fine.

I don't mind the theme that you have to keep in mind.

Don't say anything against the Chinese or against the UN as an institution.

Put it on the basis of the conduct of certain governments.

Certain governments.

Because no matter what heat we take now, if the Chinese show up and keep clapping against us every day before you get there, that's an even worse price to pay.

They give some of the...

There is at least a 10% chance that they won't go on.

I think it makes sense, though, to really take note, for the president to take note of the conduct of certain governments.

Oh, no, that's good.

Is that what's bothering you?

No.

All right.

Okay, go ahead.

What's your question?

Well, no, this is fine.

What I'm ending up doing is answering the question, does the president support...

But you could even say, I mean, we can get the idea, George.

We don't punish the UN on the ground of a vote.

On the other hand, it's a democratic country, and therefore, the general, if a feeling is created here that this party contains so many people that vote on the basis of emotion, that may translate itself.

That's all you're trying to say.

Ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja, ja.

Secretary Conner, you can say this while you're at that.

I'm going to say that it's moving on the wire that they have...

12.30, so when I ask about the ABC, Atomic Energy Commission, I want that announced.

That will be very long.

I will be asking, and I'll see you later.

I've got to make the decision.

It will be announced at 2 o'clock today.

You don't realize it, or maybe you do.

That helps us.

Of course I do.

See?

Because they've all thought we weren't going to do it.

So right now we're taking an unmitigated view in order to keep that thing going.

With all the support of the right, we're going to try that.

We're going to try it too.

We're going to try it.

I'm delighted that you have two different things going.

It was supposed to be announced on Friday, but it's better to do it now.

It's better when you aren't there.

I'm here.

All right, well, good luck to you.

You'll end up well.

I told you to go.

I said, I just want you to know what's going to happen.

He said, we don't care.

We are exploring them.

He said, tell it to the Russians.

But the congressional guys do need some guidance on what you wanted to do, or if you wanted to do nothing, or whatever, on the 4A, 4A question.

I think we don't want them to cut the 4A.

Excuse me, sir, we did not resolve the question.

No, he's not coming.

He's not coming, so just ignore him.

I think our problem is that when you look at foreign aid, the real problem is that most of it goes to countries that voted with us.

That's why within multinational organizations, those parts are the ones that voted against us.

What they're considering doing is sending facts to many, and going on a continuing resolution to keep the money going, currently, but holding up the decision on the appropriation.

What do you want?

Psychologically, let's let a man get let off a little scene.

That isn't the way to do it.

Ford apparently has some interest in doing that.

No, I haven't done it.

I think we have to be careful not to build it into too much of a confrontation from which we have to back off anyway.

The foreign aid thing, no, it's best not to go on that.

All right?

Just say that that, like all we said yesterday, that we did not want to point out the foreign aid thing punishes our friends.

Including Taiwan.

Exactly.

Including Taiwan.

And it would be considered to slap Taiwan as much as anything else by our enemies.

All right.

Now, why didn't that be good?

We were just holding that till I got back.

Why didn't we decide to do that this morning?

Well, I think if this could have come out of a meeting with Bush, uh,

Then it would have been one thing, but now that you're, that Ron is talking, is saying this is going to be the biggest...

There's no reason to be Steve Bush.

Wow, you want, I mean, get Bush and Roberts over here to commiserate about the goddamn vote?

No, I'm only for the symbolic value, that's what...

The only reason he was brought down was the Mitchell...

Argument of calling him down and holding him here.

Do you want to just have him held in Washington for a couple of days?

I would do that.

And then it'll get out when he's down, consulting with Rogers, which saves you having to see him, and that's just as good anyway.

Well, Henry, do you want to get him in here today and consult him?

I frankly would like to keep you out of a confrontation with his...

I mean, what you've done now is the behavior, that's fine.

Well, you can wait and see how this bounces and what play you get.

And if you want to see Bush, you can.

If you don't, you don't have to.

Let's do that.

Fine.

Just tell them what you've done today.

But I think you ought to stay here.

You ought to sit here a couple of days.

Good job.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Henry, I've got a question for you today.

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

77 plus, whatever it was, 77.

Maybe we just go to the...

But I want to knock out the fire interceptors and all the cracks in the air.

Now that, I'm not going to do it the same old way, but what is it?

Do you have anything we can put it into?

Which would be, but frankly, that also would give us more of our position as a Soviet.

Now they're going to have to have guns.

I just

My own view, Mr. President, is...

The right wing is rabid on the defense side.

Secondly, it's a good signal to the Russians that you're not letting down your guard.

And thirdly, we need it.

And...

... ... ... ... ... ...

Why don't you say this?

Tell them that your instinct is that for the diplomacy you have to conduct next year, you cannot cut the defense budget.

On the other hand, too much.

On the other hand, you don't want to spend it on rivalries.

I think if you just decide flatly this afternoon on A.D.,

You're going to demoralize Schultz and Weinberger.

And then I can make it, I think, I know we can spend it for a useful thing.

Remember, I think that from a political standpoint at all, and an international diplomatic standpoint, we may need to do the 80.

That's my opinion.

80 or 79, whichever you want.

80 is just a better route.

Ask for it.

... ... ... ...

I don't care if you spend any money.

In other words, let's authorize some new Polaris or something that indicates a... Oh, no, we can do it.

We can put it into a...

It would help a lot.

That's what I mean.

Yeah, I'll get that worked out.

Well, it isn't failure.

It isn't failure.

I've got ten a day like that, you know.

I've got, well, you've got Peters and I've got Washington now.

I must tell you, Mr. President, you haven't seen other White Houses that way.

I told Haig when I came back from breakfast, he asked me, how did it go?

I said, you know, it's brutal enough on the President to have to get up for these two summits.

No President has ever had to do this.

It would be tough enough if he had his whole people enthusiastically behind him.

But to have to fight your own people while you are up against the absolute top class on the other side, it's inhuman.

This is the phrase I use.

I'm not going to spend any time with the goddamn State Department people or something like that.

God dammit, your whole foreign policy in a way revolves around this.

Even if he had reservations, the way to deal with it is how to overcome them.

You're going to go through a rather hellish year next year.

I mean, it's really, I know incidentally, I told you to Bob yesterday, I said we are really lucky that it's this president

Because nobody, there is one man in the country who could do it.

And...

Anybody can.

Oh, God.

Well, no, you can do it.

I do it while I trust him.

That's all right.

I just want to be clear.

Take your time.

This is important.

They will ask, are you taking in the...

undisguisedly in civil shocking demonstration as the personal front of the United States.

What I'm going to say is that we, what I'm saying is we are not going to accept without comment the shocking demonstration.

No, no, no, why don't you say this?

Oh, Mr. President, what I'm saying is that when I report to you, when I report to you,

I would say we do not conduct our policy on the basis of personality.

We're not going to change the policy because of this kind of topic.

This is not going to affect our policy.

However, this has a serious effect on Congress.

Did the President consider it shocking?

Very unfortunate, and not in the interest of the United Nations.

I think that's fair.

You consider this a crime.

I do not take it at all, but I don't take it personally.

We don't change our policy, but...

But they hurt themselves.

We'd be less than candid if we did not reflect the public.

It supports the United Nations.

It affects Israel.

It affects our topic.

It has support for the United Nations and other multinational finance organizations.

It's not that easy.

Well, probably I didn't just talk about it, but put it on the basis that I think that it was not because of myself, but because of the opinion that others did themselves.

Okay, I'm sorry, I did write a couple points here, though.

There's some confusion, or potential confusion, on the point of this afternoon's three o'clock meeting.

Ehrlichman thinks that it is the meaning that you asked him to have on value-added tax and domestic policy, for which he was to pre-grieve Connolly, which he has done, and pre-grieve Coulson, which he has done, and in which he wanted Connolly, Coulson, and the Attorney General to sit.

There are two different meanings.

That's what I thought.

Two different meanings.

The first meaning will be one and a half hour only.

The other chief of staff, Bob, early tonight, should be in the first meeting, Todd Colson, from the Attorney General.

And that was a meeting where basically, you see, he sat in the other meeting, and he's probably already, oh yeah, I don't mean to, he knows all, you know what the argument is, and it's that meeting that we're going to talk about, the defense might be very high, much to show us is...

So the group that's listed there should be here at 3 o'clock.

And then at 3.30, it's Kissinger, Conley, Schultz, and everyone.

Yeah.

That's right, because I have to breathe.

... ... ... ... ...

Oh, you don't have to worry about me.

I'm not sitting here.

You get a little tired sometimes.

I can worry about something.

Listen, let me tell you, you've been here a lot so far, and I know how terrible your trips are.

I can tell you.

Last week was not a very easy week around here.

President, it wasn't.

And I see what you're going through.

I'm not the kind of guy... We've got them.

You've got them.

You've got a chairman of your council, even on the divisors.

One of the sweetest guys in the world.

Never say anything without being naked.

Jesus Christ.

Well, that's good.

As long as you are this fixed about me, I'll be doing what I'm doing.

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Men, not to what he did to Henry.

I mean, that, as I expect, he and Henry fight.

That's it, apparently, and ever.

God damn it, what do you do to me?

I'm having dinner for breakfast, and I've been up late, you know, or working.

And I've got a lot of things on my mind.

All he did was just nitpick.

It was very long.

What did he do to that kid?

On your key point, I think, well, I, it's what I meant, man.

On your key point, I think it's because...

It's gonna be tough enough as it is.

You're gonna be up against the two toughest guys we've ever met.

The thing to do is to make it so we have no other way to go.

And of course...

If anyone had predicted a year ago that we could go into a meeting with Mao and show that a community is pretty well set, that I believe we can live with, I'll have it all typed up and you can take a look at it.

You're going to have to make an invitation to write or something.

What are you going to give me?

I'm just coming to send a letter.

Or write on something.

I'll give you a report on atmosphere today.

He was saying, well, he'd like to get the N.K.

and get a hold of him, because he'd like to work at Land Rover, because he usually doesn't want to spend as much time in the trap.

For Christ's sake, I forget whether it has anything to do with Henry.

Does he think for one minute that I don't know more about what that communication should be on Taiwan than he'll ever know?

I don't know.

These people, President Joe, I do not believe they're tricksters.

When Joe says we have a political stake, we have a stake in the president, he means it.

But you can't really believe it.

Bill would like to see the trip fail.

I think that's right.

I almost thought that he would.

What do you think, Arnold, that goes too far?

No, I think there's, I don't think maybe that's a conscious challenge, but I think there's a sort of manipulation there.

Let's say that it's also the personal thing.

He's almost insane on publicity.

And anything that gives me publicity almost kills him.

And he thinks it's all gimmicks.

I mean, no one could have tried harder for publicity than he does.

And if he had supported you, if he had been the strong man after Conway had made himself a big man by being the most loyal member of your cabinet,

The other thing now is how Peter kind of showed the situation, how he handled the request for burns.

Let me say this.

We really face a problem on Peterson.

I think we're going to have to get rid of him.

I think he's basically too incompetent.

He talks too much.

He writes too much.

And I think, fellas, if you really pin him down, we agree that he's a swear-baiter around.

Oh, I told him that yesterday.

He doesn't have the confidence to comment at all.

Connolly just goes up the wall.

He's mentioned it.

And Peterson wants to come in and tell me what to do with International Monetary.

Well, god damn it, Bob, I know more about that than he knows, and I don't know anything.

You know what I mean?

Peterson likes these guys.

It's too bad.

I talked to John Erickson.

John doesn't agree with this, but John actually said to Peterson, and here's Peterson's side of it.

He doesn't realize that Peterson is a hell of a good talker, but he doesn't know a hell of a lot.

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

The only way that I can do it, I'm just not going to speak here, I'm just not going to do it, that's all that's true.

You can ask Joss, but I told Joss to, I told Joss to talk to him, but I also have this song.

They have money instead of quadriathletes.

Why the hell don't they invite Peterson to sit down on this one?

Let him sit down, you see.

But he can gas that, but have Stoltz program it.

But I do not want, I'm not going to let the quadriath get it in the National Monetary.

We want to hold that very closely held.

Peterson, I mean Stoltz, knows that we, I mean,

Now, cut a deal, where the three of us are going to work this out.

We're not going to tell anybody, in order to keep it bouncing around in the press.

You understand why that has to be done?

Yes.

He's not going to come over here, he's not going to tell anybody else.

No.

Now, we're going to counsel them right away.

Okay.

Let's show us then, see, Peterson still thinks that he's operating this task force on the Internet.

I want to think about it, to make a decision.

But I don't talk to Peterson.

He just dabbles on about it.

He really does.

It's just about 70 cents.

No, I'm sorry that Michelle should have told you, but we all agree that the quadriad is interesting.

I'll catch up with George in a minute.

The quadriad takes care of the whole lot.

Sure.

I will not see birds separately without common under any circumstances.

I'll do that.

That's all I have to do.

Do you think that I want birds or no?

I think I want birds, you know.

And I guess... And have plenty to handle this.

But...

I want to see his candidates for the Federal Reserve.

And I've got others.

You know what I mean?

You understand?

But I'm considering several.

And before the decision is made, I will inform him.

But I'm going to handle this exactly as we handle the court.

I didn't handle the court by asking Berger to name the people.

The president's responsibility is to pick the people for the Federal Reserve.

He told mine, too, that I think he's stronger than me.

He always doesn't know God.

But the point is, the point is, we want somebody on the road, well, he's tough as hell, and he'll stand up against Archer.

Archer's got a soft head, nice Texas bend.

And the county will not buy it.

So, that's just...

So, if Archer wants to settle with Archer, he will buy it.

Well, maybe... Archer's lying.

No, county don't need to settle with Archer.

They said that you guys have to put me out.

All right, so we will.

We will.

We won't take you.

Fine.

I'll get somebody to say it.

But just say that I want to even submit his names, anything he wants, and with that, and that I have several other names under consideration, that Colin Connolly has submitted some names, is submitting names, I want him to.

I have others, and I'll make the decision.

And actually we'll discuss it, and then I will discuss it with him and Connolly before I think about it.

Now, another Connolly and Schultz.

What does that mean, him, Connolly and Schultz?

I don't want to discuss it with him.

Connolly and Schultz, fine.

I'm not going to have a worker.

There's one way to keep him alive a little here.

I said, the way I left it, I thought with Peterson yesterday, with Schultz yesterday, I said, look, you've just got to handle Pete.

He said, well, the problem is that he talks to everybody and writes papers on everything.

He's got a pension for that, and the difficulty is that's not the way to handle this problem.

I said, well...

I think what George has in mind is to give you some goddamn assignment on that.

Sort of work something on it so that he doesn't work through your opinion sometimes.

Okay.

On the budget meeting, do you want to bring Harper, Cole, and Inman in or not?

Do I have TAG and Colson?

What else is the budget doing?

I suppose so.

It always ends up on the rear.

... ... ... ... ... ...

It's a, it's a, you know, he'll come in the cab and watch him say to the meeting, say the right thing, because he's, he knows that.

He's, he's, he seems to have the confidence.

It's a, it's a, I do think.

... ... ... ... ...

I want to write that, you know, I mean, I'd rather see this than get a K, and I've got to see it.

We've got to keep, you know, it's in this period.

And, for example, when I were sort of like, based on what we had on him, that he had to sort of look over to be sure that we didn't get into trouble here about this.

Bill is not that clever, you know what I mean?

He just really isn't.

Not in this field.

His advice is sometimes not good.

But he always is looking for the immediate shot, not the longer shot.

He doesn't...

I have a feeling, I have a feeling, frankly, that he may want to have this thing.

Well, of course, when you come down to it, too, this business about running around and going to Russia, man, it's so painful.

I mean, it's... Have you ever thought about it?

I don't think they kept Henry an extra day.

He's confusing the extra day.

We kept him there the extra day.

Because the boat doesn't.

But his point is that they got the vote up so that that could be done.

He's just, when he came back in, he said, nobody convinced me that vote had to be last night.

But what did he think that we should have done the next day?

He thought it could have been later.

That we could have gotten the vote delayed.

But we didn't.

By a week.

A week the delegation could have.

By days or a week.

... ... ... ... ...

Well, let me say this.

I'm not so sure.

In spite of the fact I don't know my name, I'm not as sure.

I'm not so sure.

It is as big as we think.

Let me show you why.

That's it with you.

You can't say it's not.

We're here for everybody.

We think everybody saw that on TV, but they're not playing that deliberately.

They can't get rid of the crackers.

But anyways, you know what was the combination?

We're out there, the Green Bay Packers, the Monday Night Football, and the Green Bay Packers are doing good.

And the mic is the best game of the year.

The hell I was looking at then, I was doing a couple of other things.

But I can tell you there's most people, I'll bet you on that audience, that was not that big an audience.

Everybody was blue, it was the UN.

I just think it was, I can't, only a couple of people here that had a replay, can't find anybody who saw it, or read the song.

Now, I don't know.

I also think that the goddamn thing is,

You really come down to it.

It's pretty confusing.

I mean, what I say is not confusing, but they say, well, it's a bleak for the United States.

We can't put it in Taiwan out, but the communists did, and they only pulled all this stuff.

Frankly, it's a...

The majority of the people not available.

Well, the majority of the people seem to be all of our goals, very little, you know.

I've heard the Communist Chinese Commission.

I imagine that it's the majority of them.

Gallup and Harris said yes, and R.C.

says no.

But remember, I mean, I'm surprised at that.

When you consider that we keep Taiwan in, that then gets confusing, doesn't it?

The average person would say, well, who's going to represent China?

And the beat for the United States has to kick, kick, kick.

I think the idea of the peace, if you see this idea of the checklist, that's why I drew that decision.

That's why the checklist is there.

Goddamn dirty accidents.

And the people that we get foreign aid to.

I think, I don't know, it's hard to tell.

Ron runs, he argues that we should go very low on the whole thing, because it's going to be, it's a short-term story.

Why?

Because it's a big, big blip.

Now, because it's news, there's nothing else happening, but it's going to run out of steam.

Once it's done, it's done.

They're out and they're in.

Now we'll get another kick when the Chinese are on it.

The communists are on it.

But hopefully that won't be for a while.

If they decide to make a big deal and have Cho come in or something like that, it'll be a huge thing.

There'll be demonstrations.

The right-wing will want a demonstration probably in New York and all that.

Tristan, here's your pistol yesterday.

I know there's some papers popping it up to 1,000.

I guess that was pretty hard for them to do.

They had to, you know, give it a imagine.

If it had been some of our side, they would have said 386.

It was apparently about what it was in order to come down to a little 1,000.

But you know, some of the ground put it out to 1,000, correct?

So it sounds like it's 10,000, doesn't it?

I don't know.

But anyway, let me say that again.

But I don't think the clinic really looked at all that.

The clinic didn't get much control over me, did it?

Or did it not?

Did it?

It was a tough time making anything out of it at all.

The only thing that got us some arrests, even those, did not happen.

I think there's a few reasons that isn't that true.

So, yeah, which is why he was saying, urging that we not overreact, because he doesn't like this.

No, I don't get it, but I like taking steps, getting Bush down there, making him lose.

And the Bush thing, well, the Bush thing is, just watch that now.

That would be considered quite routine.

I mean, he is the best in the United Nations, and he has worked hard, but I think not saying that the day is good.

And it might be right, we shouldn't have done that.

Goddamnit, we totally kind of thought, that's a strange one.

When I talked to him, I thought I was going to see him at breakfast, and I said, we'll confirm the time of the meeting with the president.

He said, well, I would rather have it after I finish testifying.

We can't.

I said, well, it's just a pro-form meeting.

We'll leave it at ten, and have him come down, and then, you know, do some changes.

He said, fine, I will.

It was very weird.

No...

He obviously didn't tell Flanagan that I wanted him to work on Rogers and to work on the proposition of trying to get David Henry's enablement.

Has he worked on that?

Has he worked on Rogers?

He's here with me.

It's the same thing.

It's not going to happen.

It's about a win.

No.

We've got to get Mitchell to accelerate it.

It's going to happen, and it can presumably, and there'll be tomorrow, presumably be accelerated.

It stands to make, I can speak, but I don't think so.

It's going to make the point for the order of December 1st.

It should go beyond that, and it stands to argue that, and back up to January 1st, which is good enough, because by the end of the year, until Peterstein's going to get the post,

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ...

Well, he's taking a sentence on the whole congressional thing, come up with nothing, nothing.

Melvin's a man, what can I tell you?

God damn it, we can't do anything.

It's probably, I don't know if that's what it sounds like, or horrible.

It's a question whether Harlow's any good, whether we make him play.

He says he doesn't want it, and that's the standard Harlow has.

Harlow had a deal.

You could tell him, you know, on the ground, Harlow, he'd go out, he'd be fighting in the Congress.

How would he do on the country?

Something he did very well.

I don't know very well.

He'd know what his mission is.

It would be clearly understood that he's close to the president.

And that would be, I would think, flattering to the entire culture of animals.

Are there any illusions about him?

I won't inquire about anything, you know, what he did, what the purpose is.

Harlow and Buss is what there is now.

Harlow was West's

In a way, it weren't a detectable factor.

But we know what the hell the harbor would do.

It would be as though the harbor was not too bad of a salesman.

It was pretty good.

It made the speeches all over the country.

It could be wrong around here, though.

I don't know.

A lot of price, actually.

This is our first time doing the action.