Conversation 607-011

Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

He said, I hope he gets it out of there.

We can't all say a word about it because of the fact that John Spartans didn't help us with it.

But he is an artist.

But he's not waiting till after we get the bills on his head before I don't see it.

You know, he's got a lot on his mind.

He's a wonderful chairman.

Tremendous.

And then, if, uh, if, uh, Spartan loses, I always like Spartan.

Oh, Spartan is such a nice man.

Oh, he's a good man.

His, uh, his, I mean, his...

His problem, of course, is the age factor.

He's 73, and he shows it now.

John has got a... Not his head.

His head is withered, but you notice somewhere his face has become...

He looks very much older than he has all of a sudden.

I'm so surprised he's got a son who didn't get her.

We might have been tired of that song, but I like it more.

I like it more.

It's funny animation.

See, this was when they killed the first.

Well,

You know, let me tell you that I have a feeling, I have a funny feeling about these things.

I don't quite understand what you're saying, but I will report or be an expert.

particularly on the international side, and I've gotten to become there, because it involves such large political considerations.

I've gone along, and Henry and I have done, I've gone ahead, and I'm hoping to get your view, because I've gone ahead and get everybody's view, the treasurer, the shell suits, the teachers, et cetera.

But Henry's got it.

I don't want him to get involved in the monetary decisions, but it's very important.

for Henry to know the validity of the survey.

You know what I mean?

So you level with him totally.

I want a picture of this.

Yeah.

Well, anyway, talk to Henry mainly, if you will, not about the business.

whether you go off-gold or off-gold, but mention it.

But the main thing is to give him a feel of the political, you know, about this.

Now he knows, for example, Henry knows we've got strokes or, you know, they're very important.

He knows we've got strokes with the Bronx, and he thinks we've got some of the politics, I don't know.

He thinks, as far as Heath is concerned, it's probably a lost cause because Heath is going to do anything to get into the market and cater to just the French's ass.

That's, uh...

You know, Heath is playing that.

The British is out here playing a very bad game, too, aren't they?

They're up in the hole in the East.

The Bastards are, you know, playing the French.

You know what I mean?

They used to be in the middle, but they're doing everything that's stuck up in the French, so this just isn't in your field.

But anyway, I don't want to talk about it.

Henry's pretty tired, but sometimes, actually, you know, the old words, it's okay to laugh.

It's okay to laugh.

The political .

My impression that many of the comments on here reactions more to their past .

Well, Henry feels that way.

This is, Henry feels that way.

Let me say, my, my relationship with, uh, first of all, is very good, and for a reason that should have nothing to do with it.

I'd like for the Shawcroft to be after the end of my, my career, rather than at this point, show off the way it's made.

It's, you know, I mean, it's, it's indeed, it's an in-house thing.

Anyway, now, I've got to say, because I went to New York, I actually ate booty, which is possibly some bad thing.

He had a great emotional, personal reaction to it.

He said, well, Michael, you know, this is a nice gesture.

Oh, yes, as they call it.

Remember, Henry thinks that there's maybe something more we can do with attraction than others do.

I get along with you.

Well, Henry has a great respect for the man you know.

What does he got, Mr. Stark?

Mr. Stark.

He's an old friend of Henry's.

Henry's the way he was.

Years ago, I don't know how it was.

Years ago, it was, you know, Henry grew up.

But on the domestic side, you feel basically that the company isn't as bad as some say it is.

I wonder if we aren't being just too good.

You know, this was my...

What's technical in here?

Look at the band, man.

You just can't detect anything significant.

It's the little people.

Where is it?

This is number 10.

No, this is 71.

Yeah.

But do you see anything a little away from us?

No, they're looking.

Well, I think there is one problem here that I've said I would like to, I'd like to have coasts of rage.

a committee of, I guess, the voters and shakers, that it has to be, something last year, three or four others, to put on some sort of a dinner at, and dinner's better than lunches, at Nathan and William's or something, or one of their clubs.

And then they have about 14, 15 people.

The kind you had here at the White House, Latin name.

Yeah, that's right.

Well, there was, where is it?

And then you just go out and talk about the policy, but also,

This liquidity problem is just bullshit.

I mean, for what the figures you showed us today, these people are, they're finding reasons not to do something rather than pass on it.

But I think it would be helpful if the kids actually knew of this.

Now, on the other hand, on the other hand, let us not,

Now, overlook the fact that, as we often say, what people think sometimes becomes a fact.

And that's why all this money supply data, if you can find ways to, you know, waggle it around, do it, you know what I mean?

I'm not talking about the do, but you know, you know the problem.

You know what I'm saying?

When you say what people think isn't important in itself, the fact of life that you have to respect, you have to push that.

We've got the people who think that money supply, we find sometimes, is not growing fast enough.

It does, but they have to leave down the line.

All right.

But that's very little.

They don't say so.

No.

What they're saying now is that we do just the right thing.

So you've got, look, central bankers, Mr. Carson, have to take punishment.

That's their job.

They never make anything by what they say.

I'm just keeping in mind what I said.

The other one's got one.

There's...

This will be the last and serving administration in this city, in Washington.

I've got a strategy, and really, what we really want, I don't want to go up and down fast.

I don't, I, we can take some high-employment prisoners, but we've got to get moving down, just moving down.

That's all, that's all.

That's on this track, too.

You notice he didn't disparage the others.

The council, though,

I don't want to see interest rates exploding on the next year.

Yeah, but I can lose control of my board.

Well, then they start... What's going to happen to the economy?

It's going to be so much of a downward drop that we can't curb it.

No, not the economy.

They have the economy just liquid.

My God, there isn't any problem there.

It's frozen.

Full of money everywhere.

The banks are looking for customers.

The corporations have got mental liquidity.

The corporations, I suppose part of the problem is that in the period of the sanctions, there was such a huge investment in capital.

I mean, planned, but we overdid it.

We overdid it.

And now, while retail sales so very, very well, the business centers don't need it.

So they're not doing anything new.

But this means we're stuck then with a recession next year?

No.

I know.

But you're also thinking, you don't predict a recession next year.

No, I predict a recovery and a good, good recovery.

But isn't this not a recovery?

Then he will continue upward.

That's your present view.

Yeah, I have no doubt about it.

Now, I expect I'm going to have one hell of a time with this son of a bitch, me.

I know him today.

Well, this is a problem.

But I'll play hard.

You have to play hard.

Oh, yeah.

You're not supposed to be low.

Suppose he walks up.

All right.

What would you do?

Well, well, the fight.

Now, then, then.

You go before the country.

You indicate that you will now.

The country knows what happened.

Where is it again?

That?

No, not yet.

Not yet?

Do you expect Ukraine, in spite of us,

Yeah, it's actually strange.

You know, when I'm in Greece, when I'm hesitating to forget that that's where I'm from, and that later, as late as post-election time, you know, and the blame will be, I think, once frozen, when the country is sick and tired of the terrorists.

Oh, I agree.

Oh, I agree totally.

I know the Greeks are trying to get me in the game now, aren't you?

is I think we've got to go be sure that the labor leaders at the beginning have some responsibility, and then if they won't, I want them to say we didn't try.

I can't have them be trying.

We've got the extra hour on the street.

I get you, Mark.

I think this is the problem as far as I'm concerned.

And it is.

Now, I've heard people say, I had a fight with this at the meeting with the business council.

You were the first, I was the first on the ground.

Cost of living, housing, she looked at, you know, power, and that was her, that was the plan, and then he gave his ultimatum, and then you yielded, you see.

You've got to appear very strong.

Now, for you, one thing, they criticized you for that.

Like, well, I and others, we had a good contingent from the government down there.

I think we did a fair job.

Well, they praised you for your statements on profits and everything.

several people.

I heard in New York when I talked to the board, it's not popular.

I know.

I said it.

I know.

The fellow president said it for years.

You don't get to be, I don't know if he put it that way, but it is what I say.

It's very effective.

What kind of an employer would you want to work for?

Would you want to work for an employer who's not a virgin man, but who says, what do you think is effective?

Let me, that's a very, let me tell you, the guy that asked that question when I was in Detroit was a labor leader.

Steve.

And after he made profits.

And I said, look, just let me put it in context.

And I said, and just speaking to you, Mr. Blank, I said, you as a labor leader, when you negotiate a contract, you would much defer to negotiate with a company that's making profits and a company that's losing money.

Everybody laughed.

He laughed.

And I'm like, hell yes.

They're not going to make any deal with a company that's losing money.

And the individual worker, he wants adventure, he wants job security, he wants to be promoted, he wants an increase in pay.

But then on the main thing, as I said, we had to, you know, through the tortures, we had to do that.

We had some, had some, I think, some of the first meeting.

I think you did the right thing.

Now he's gone.

But he's detained in flight ship.

He's mean.

Oh, he's a mean bastard.

He's partisan.

Partisan.

He's good, but he's partisan.

Yeah.

He is very mean.

Look, you don't have too much time.

I know that.

Look, I want to get you one item.

I wrote you a letter, an indicator, one item.

I want to talk to you about it first, and then I'll put it down.

All right.

During his night on that leave, he said it was a difficult discussion.

trying to find somebody, if possible, who could be an honest broker among the different, you know, government's finance ministers, central managers.

And I talked with some of the British.

They raised the question.

Talked to a little bit of Europeans.

They were enthusiastic.

Talked to a little bit of French.

And then finally, doing some sympathy, you see Schweitzer here.

by virtue of his position, would be a natural for it.

But he doesn't have the personality, and people don't have enough confidence in him.

You could see what kind of fellow he was when he was in here talking to me, you know, crazy.

And then he becomes explosive with the scissors, and he's at very, very size.

So, you know, it's the worst curse.

I tell these people, I never agree with anything that matters.

You know, when I go to these days, yeah, but don't you have any groups that you take?

I don't know if you know that more than one great big never, well, when I, well, for example, if I'm in the state, I won't touch a thing.

And I can't imagine I won't touch a thing.

But when I am, for example, even in the state, I don't drink a little wine.

I won't touch a heartbreak forever.

Last night, when he was there, he, of course, he said, he broke my secret.

He popped on a couple of scotches with him.

And, uh, but it, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was,

Now, on this thing here, is this the Zylstra thing?

John Ray.

Well, not by John.

Well, it was John.

I wasn't going to tell you about that.

I was just going to tell you what it was.

He wasn't going to tell you.

He just said it.

Well, I don't know.

I don't know.

I'm pretty cautious, man.

I have, by training, the, I figured out something.

Next.

When did John, John said, just for, just for, you know, prime minister of his own country, university professor, head of the BIS, head of the Central Bank, highly respected every day.

And believe me, before I could entertain Telstra, I searched his opinions very thoroughly.

I found that what he wants and thinks is right for the United States goes beyond my expectations.

And I'm pretty sure of that.

Well, Connolly, Paul, and Tim Hanson.

The foresowing of this thing, I checked with Connolly again.

And this guy, he said, well, I don't know whether the finance minister spoke to you.

I said, well, this is the biggest thing that's going on.

This is our government.

This is the finance minister.

It's a political responsibility.

We work with them.

I said, well, thank you.

I said, if you don't want to do it, I'll call the law.

He said, well, then we've gone so far.

Fine.

He does a great job in this kind of research.

I'm not a wild man, Mr. President.

Yes, you got him.

Yes.

Now, the...

This has seeds.

None of these are going to be hurt.

Look, my credibility is very high, Mr. President, if I say so myself.

He will know me for years.

I'm straight, simple.

The, uh...

Humbley is suspected the world over.

That's a fact of life.

If he refuses to speak, Gilson is, my God, this will be whispered in all the town.

What does he have to decide when he returns?

Yeah, look, I told you.

Why don't you just keep it to yourself?

Let me see when he returns.

I mean, let me see what the situation is, but let's just remember, he is...

He probably said he feels that he shouldn't do it because of his ridiculous luck.

He feels, you know, because this is bad.

So you know what he can do?

Let him meet with Joseph.

These little gay social kids are letting him tell nothing, and the formalities are still absurd.

Actually, I think it's the wrong way to go about it, but for him, since the worst thing he can do is to say, lastly, I'm not going to do it.

When Jilstra, Jilstra has been talking to everyone.

Now, what he's finding out, I don't know.

You don't have to listen to him.

Everybody's on his own.

That's the complete understanding.

And this whole thing has been kept secret, usually.

Not a word about it in the past.

We'll see what happens.

But let's keep it all a fan.

I'm sure it will.

The, uh...

I think you need to have quite a neat look.

We've been talking about ourselves about an average rate of appreciation of 10% is probably all we need.

Yostra told me 15.

We've been talking about a turnaround of $13 million that's necessary on balance payments.

The IMF, they came out with eight, that's their estimate.

The OECD came up with it.

He told me, well, he thinks it's closer to 10 or 11.

He said, well, his thinking is in our direction.

Like I said, he's a very solid, friendly man.

But commonly, I'll tell you what happened to him first.

I mean, what was it?

I'm going to say it.

My mistake was in not talking this over with him first.

Now, oh, I did.

I talked to him twice.

I'll mention it.

No, my mistake was not talking it over with Paul Volcker.

Ah, second thought.

Paul Volcker is, again, responsible for this.

Now, he feels hurt because I didn't talk to him.

And you know why I didn't talk to him?

Paul is this way that we still use talking.

He's a good technician, but apart from that, he knows nothing, and he has no chance.

But I still made a mistake.

And so he's going to stir it up.

And John knows me.

Now, John knows so little about these things, really.

And he gets so emotional.

And he suspects foreigners.

And he doesn't know foreigners.

And he just picks us up.

Well, that's that.

Look, I've got a problem with the board.

I know to be sure that you know my problem.

And I'm not going to.

We have an immediate opening and another opening in January.

And there's a possibility that you have now an opportunity for us to meet and talk to Rogers on a very quiet basis.

We hope.

I've got a man now.

I've got to get three names.

Three possible, three possible.

First one for one, or all three, or bird.

The one I want is Carl Thompson.

And he's willing to take it.

Let's take a look at it.

Here it is.

He's an extraordinary man.

And I've worked on him for two months.

He's a man of very considerable wealth.

And he's willing to come and arrange an affair so that we don't have to convince him.

Well, let me say this.

I think we ought to do this harder when causing an attack so that I have a chance to look at this.

It's kind of like an appointment to the...

He knows it.

Oh, I'm sure he would.

They've got apartments, actually.

Connolly is in Louisiana.

I think it's like an appointment to the...

Sort of like the court.

Oh.

There's lots of candidates.

Let me look.

I have no candidate myself.

Well, he was an accident.

Some people say so.

Here's another problem.

He was very good at it.

But if you want a business man, I'm looking for a business contractor.

Here's another man.

I know less about him, but he looks awfully good.

He comes from Georgia, Atlanta.

Let's go to this problem.

He was a chairman of a man's hockey team.

And I'll keep it.

Do you want me to keep these two?

They're kind of sweet.

I'll have them.

What does that have to do with Carl Thompson's background?

Well, I don't need any of you.

I don't need any of you.

That's fine.

The other two.

Okay.

Now, I want to kind of point you to one.

I want you to think this in a private way.

The, uh, one possible California.

I have a number of good names.

Yeah.

One is Marty Anderson.

There are, there are strong classes.

There is, you know, he's a connoisseur, but he's smart, he's young, and he's a board of old men to a certain degree.

He'd be completely loyal, thoroughly dependable.

The main thing is, from my viewpoint,

See, let me just show you the act.

I want you to know this.

Just a second, sir.

You have to watch this ball right away.

There it is, man.

Take it off.

All right, sir.

Well, I'm going to turn it to the next one.

I'm going to turn it to the next one.

and that is not quite .

Yes, he is. .

Some of them are .

They do look bored.

They have others.

They .

Well, if you would talk about .

Morris and I got better of ourselves.

I mean, it's only a week until we finally reach Granada.

I think we're going to need to admit that.

Anyway, it'll be over next week.

Sometime for a good talk on the other.

Yeah.

We've got to bring an end to this game.

Oh, darn.

You understand?

Maybe I'll listen to considerations about me and the others.

Yeah.

Well, then, you've got to make up your mind.

Good.

If you wouldn't mind, maybe we should stick your head in this office as you go by and talk to you and not chat about it.

You'd be well seen next week.

Thank you.