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Conversation 617-016

TapeTape 617StartFriday, November 12, 1971 at 4:26 PMEndFriday, November 12, 1971 at 4:30 PMTape start time02:13:07Tape end time02:16:33ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Rumsfeld, Donald H.;  Bull, Stephen B.Recording deviceOval Office
AudioNARA Description

On November 12, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, Donald H. Rumsfeld, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 4:26 pm and 4:30 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 617-016 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 617-16

Date: November 15, 1971
Time: Unknown between 4:26 pm and 4:30 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Donald H. Rumsfeld.
[The recording begins at an unknown time while the meeting is in progress]

     Unknown event
                                               23

                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                      Tape Subject Log
                                        (rev. 10/06)



     The President's previous meeting with Congressmen
          -North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
          -The President compared to the Congress
          -Statement by the President and Clark MacGregor
Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 4:26 pm.

     The President's schedule
          -Paul W. McCracken
          -John A. Volpe
          -Elliot L. Richardson
          -Maurice H. Stans
          -William P. Rogers
                -Stans
                -Henry A. Kissinger

Bull left at an unknown time before 4:30 pm.

     National economy
          -Pay Board
                -The President's conversation with George H. Boldt
                     -Retroactivity

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 4:26 pm.

     The President's schedule
          -Sultan Mohammad Khan
                -Kissinger

Bull left at an unknown time before 4:30 pm.

     National economy
          -Pay Board
                -Charles W. Colson
                -Boldt
                -Retroactivity
                     -Vote
                     -Possible order
                     -Arnold R. Weber

Rumsfeld left at 4:30 pm.
                                           24

                          NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                   Tape Subject Log
                                     (rev. 10/06)
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Walk out there.
I want you to walk out there.
For me, too.
I talked about it Friday night, but did you all see those two people sitting there?
Maybe it'll make us lose the goddamn picture.
I think so.
I think so.
I think so.
I think so.
I was going to put it right to them.
They knew it.
But there was no gun.
I'm glad you took the hard line, rather than trying to write something down.
Take it back now.
I agree.
I think that you're right.
Yes, sir.
I think it's just right.
And, uh, from the way Clark and you spoke about it, it sounds to me like it's just what they needed right now.
We will have to let the McCracken slide, as we're right with the, uh, the, uh, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,
And I want to end this every time.
And I want to end this every time.
And I want to end this every time.
And I don't blame you for that going any further.
I know.
I know.
That's the way I see it.
And I deal with them all the time.
I'm confident.
I was confident.
I've got the report right up to you.
You go there every Friday.
All right.
So do you want to see this man sulk and cunt as far as Secretary Plank's standings with Henry now?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just bring him in.
Yeah.
Sure.
Sure.
Sure.
We'll have the...
Yes.
All right.
All right.
Just stay here.
All right.
Anyway...
We've been working on that, you know, Colson.
Oh, Colson has hung anybody's property.
But both of them, all of a sudden, both of them know.
I didn't want to do it, but I just knew.
I know that.
You can't break the contract.
Don't you agree?
These guys feel very strongly.
Are you with us?
Well, listen, they want to roll out of the thing.
Are your neighbors happy?
With retroactivity?
They know we gave good faith that we turned two business members around.
They know damn well we turned two business members around.
Eight to seven.
So now, it depends on how it actually comes out.
We've got to keep pushing.
These guys are convinced that it's unfair to the rest of the people.
And they are representing us.
On the other hand, what I'm getting at is, are they going to put out an order making them not recognize that they're debating the model?
And we're still about to lose, Senator.
Absolutely.
Do you agree?
Ideally, yes, sir.
Or do you think you've got to lose on that?
I agree.
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