{"conversationCode":"620-014","tapeNumber":620,"conversationNumber":14,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-620-014","startDateTime":"1971-11-17T17:50:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1971-11-17T18:13:00.000Z","startDate":"17-Nov-1971","startTime":"12:50 PM","endDate":"17-Nov-1971","endTime":"1:13 PM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\"); Sanchez, Manolo;","description":"On November 17, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman, and Manolo Sanchez met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:50 pm to 1:13 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 620-014 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"OVAL","recordingDevice":"Oval Office","latitudeEstimated":38.8974,"longitudeEstimated":-77.0374,"chronCode":2,"chronRelease":"Second Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"26-Oct-2000","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 620-014\n\nDate: November 17, 1971\nTime: 12:50 pm - 1:13 pm\nLocation: Oval Office\n\nThe President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.\n\n     Ronald W. Reagan\n          -Previous meeting with the President\n               -Report on trip\n               -Conservatives\n          -Approach to problems\n\nManolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 12:50 pm.\n\n     Items for Old Executive Office Building Office [EOB]\n\n     Refreshment\n\nSanchez left at an unknown time before 1:13 pm.\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n     Reagan\n         -Previous conversation with the President\n              -Peter M. Flanigan's brother\n                    -Reagan's previous conversation with Henry A. Kissinger\n         -John Flanigan's activities\n              -John N. Mitchell\n              -Civil Service jobs\n                    -Robert H. Finch\n                    -Peter M. Flanigan\n                    -Mitchell\n              -Finch\n              -Timing\n\n     Polls\n             -George H. Gallup on approval of the President\n                   -Timing\n                        -Phase II\n                        -United Nations [UN] vote on Taiwan, Republic of China\n                   -By region\n             -Gallup and Louis P. Harris\n                   -Volatility\n             -Gallup on approval of the President\n                   -By education level of the electorate\n             -White House handling\n                   -Supporters\n                   -Harris and Gallup\n             -Albert E. Sindlinger\n             -Margin for error\n\n*****************************************************************\n\n[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 02/21/2019.\nSegment cleared for release.]\n[Personal Returnable]\n[620-014-w001]\n[Duration: 2m 23s]\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n       Polling\n                 -Democrats\n                       -Edmund S. Muskie\n                       -George H. Gallup\n                               -Provision of information to Donald H. Rumsfeld\n                       -Dwight L. Chapin\n                               -Attempts to get information from John Davies\n                       -Timing of polls\n                               -August 1971\n                               -October 8, 1971\n                               -October 29, 1971\n                       -Louis Harris poll\n                               -Two-way\n                               -Edmund S. Muskie\n                               -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n                       -Gallup poll\n                               -Two-way\n                       -Harris poll\n                               -Edmund S. Muskie vs. field\n                               -Polls showing Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy ahead\n                       -Gallup polling\n                               -Edmund S. Muskie gains\n\n*****************************************************************\n\n     Polls\n             -Release\n                   -Timing\n             -News summaries\n             -Gallup on approval of the President\n                   -Timing\n                        -UN vote on Taiwan\n             -Swings\n                   -Harry S. Truman\n                   -The President\n                   -John F. Kennedy\n                   -Lyndon B. Johnson\n                   -Dwight D. Eisenhower\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n             -Gallup on approval of the President\n                   -Undecided\n                   -Timing\n                        -Current issues and events\n                             -Phase II\n                             -UN vote on Taiwan\n                             -Phase II\n                                    -The President’s televised address\n\n     Washington, DC\n         -Subway system\n               -The President's schedule\n                     -Domestic advisors\n                           -Possible motorcade to Judiciary Square\n                     -Walter E. Washington\n                     -Rev. Walter E. Fauntroy, Joel T. Broyhill, William L. Scott, Lawrence J.\n                           Hogan and Gilbert Gude\n               -Possible statement by the President\n               -Forthcoming vote in Congress\n               -The President's schedule\n               -Importance\n                     -National implications\n                     -Bicentennial\n                           -Visitors\n\n     Polls\n             -Gallup on approval of the President\n                   -By region\n                        -Possible issues\n                   -By age\n                   -By education\n                        -Possible issues\n                   -By region\n                   -Volatility\n                        -Lt. William L. Calley, Jr.\n\n     Votes\n          -Taiwan, foreign aid\n               -Impact\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n                       -Public perception\n                             -Media\n\n     Polls\n\n*****************************************************************\n\n[Previous PRMPA Personal Returnable (G) withdrawal reviewed under deed of gift 02/21/2019.\nSegment cleared for release.]\n[Personal Returnable]\n[620-014-w002]\n[Duration: 1m 55s]\n\n       Polls\n               -President’s view\n               -Trial heat\n                       -Importance\n                       -Gallup and Harris polls\n                               -Results favorable to President\n                       -Gallup polls\n                               -Edmund S. Muskie\n                               -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n               -Nature of polls for Democratic Party nomination\n                       -Two-way race\n                               -Edmund S. Muskie vs. Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n                               -Compared to Edmund S. Muskie vs. larger field of candidates\n                       -1972 Democratic Convention\n                       -Edward M. (“Ted”) Kennedy\n                               -Opposition in Democratic Party\n                               -Chances of getting nomination\n\n*****************************************************************\n\n     The President's schedule\n          -Possible speech to American Federation of Labor-Congress of Industrial\n               Organizations [AFL-CIO]\n               -George P. Shultz's forthcoming conversation with George Meany\n\n       Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542\n\n                       -Forthcoming report to the President\n\nThe President and Haldeman left at 1:13 pm.","filename":["620-014.mp3"],"tapeStart":"03:58:02","tapeEnd":"04:21:44","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")","Sanchez, Manolo"],"prevCode":"620-013","nextCode":"620-015","transcript":[{"start":27.82,"end":31.51,"text":"It really is fascinating when he sees everything as it's either here or it's there, doesn't it?"},{"start":31.53,"end":32.81,"text":"It's not all about it."},{"start":33.35,"end":34.1,"text":"Let's take this."},{"start":34.98,"end":35.72,"text":"It's great."},{"start":65.16,"end":69.64,"text":"I don't know what it is, but he didn't raise it with me."},{"start":69.76,"end":70.92,"text":"It's John Plunkett."},{"start":70.96,"end":73.08,"text":"It's John Plunkett and his other brother."},{"start":73.12,"end":75.06,"text":"I'll work out eventually what it was."},{"start":75.08,"end":84.15,"text":"It was a thing where we had a bunch of empty civil service jobs that Finch discovered and figured we could help them."},{"start":84.25,"end":85.55,"text":"It was a token gesture."},{"start":85.61,"end":87.93,"text":"We've got to at least fill those jobs in California."},{"start":89.15,"end":91.77,"text":"So John finally had nothing to do with Pete."},{"start":91.81,"end":93.57,"text":"Pete didn't even know about it."},{"start":93.59,"end":99.23,"text":"John was working the political thing with Len Fireshut and all out there, with John Mitchell's knowledge and good cards."},{"start":100.59,"end":103.63,"text":"Went to work to get the jobs done."},{"start":104.47,"end":105.71,"text":"That's all Pete knows about any of it."},{"start":107.78,"end":111.54,"text":"Well, you can see how everything would come to it as a, you know, a time."},{"start":112.22,"end":115.06,"text":"I assume it would certainly think so."},{"start":115.12,"end":124.55,"text":"They had to kind of go and do a civil service job before it would come to Bob."},{"start":124.57,"end":125.63,"text":"I don't know what..."},{"start":125.65,"end":129.91,"text":"It may have been that Bob was under one of his old peers."},{"start":130.03,"end":135.13,"text":"Except, and that's quite possible, it's all done, whatever it was, it was on our expense, I'm not saying..."},{"start":136.03,"end":138.94,"text":"And I'm sure it's a thing that he's always, he's old cases, but here he is."},{"start":138.98,"end":142.1,"text":"He sees Finch and Fleming, and I knew there was something like this in it."},{"start":142.12,"end":145.74,"text":"Otherwise, I knew there was something like this in it."},{"start":145.76,"end":150.47,"text":"It was a Finch, you know, Finch, wherever he had John Fleming working."},{"start":150.53,"end":153.17,"text":"And you said Fleming and Flemer, I thought it bothered me."},{"start":153.19,"end":154.05,"text":"Well, I don't know."},{"start":154.07,"end":155.49,"text":"I thought it was all too good."},{"start":155.51,"end":156.81,"text":"It's fine."},{"start":156.85,"end":157.73,"text":"I'm glad he did it."},{"start":157.75,"end":159.59,"text":"It was all right, except they should have told Reagan."},{"start":159.92,"end":160.08,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":163.06,"end":169.97,"text":"We've got a gallon coming out tomorrow that shows a five-point drop, which is kind of curious."},{"start":169.99,"end":170.19,"text":"Global?"},{"start":170.77,"end":171.27,"text":"Forty-nine."},{"start":171.95,"end":172.15,"text":"Yep."},{"start":174.23,"end":177.73,"text":"They make the point that it's a..."},{"start":178.11,"end":183.99,"text":"The high point was immediately following the nationwide televised thing on Phase 2."},{"start":184.05,"end":188.12,"text":"The latest survey was taken during the first days of implementation of Phase 2."},{"start":188.29,"end":191.12,"text":"It was October 29th, November 1st."},{"start":194.07,"end":200.77,"text":"and after the defeat of the United States to China policy."},{"start":201.19,"end":210.57,"text":"It's interesting, on the breakdown, the drop in the West is enormous."},{"start":212.32,"end":218.08,"text":"It had gone up to 52 in the West, and it dropped to 41."},{"start":219.07,"end":221.31,"text":"That's the only one where there's a really major drop."},{"start":222.53,"end":223.81,"text":"The 41 in the west?"},{"start":223.87,"end":226.07,"text":"I don't believe it."},{"start":226.47,"end":229.07,"text":"The east was 54 and it went to 50."},{"start":229.13,"end":232.01,"text":"The midwest was 52 and it went to 50."},{"start":232.55,"end":234.61,"text":"The south was 56 and it went to 52."},{"start":234.65,"end":237.19,"text":"The west was 52 and went to 41."},{"start":237.23,"end":244.41,"text":"Now before the big rise in early October, the west had been low."},{"start":244.44,"end":245.81,"text":"The west had been at 45."},{"start":249.31,"end":249.87,"text":"But it was 45-47."},{"start":249.89,"end":256.03,"text":"It was 45-47, so it was more disapproved than approved in the last one."},{"start":256.05,"end":260.13,"text":"Now it's more disapproved again, 41-43."},{"start":260.25,"end":264.13,"text":"What do we have?"},{"start":264.15,"end":264.18,"text":"37-14."},{"start":276.17,"end":279.37,"text":"49-37-14, I decided to disapprove 1-0-2, and I decided 1-0-3."},{"start":279.41,"end":280.77,"text":"Well, you had others."},{"start":280.81,"end":292.84,"text":"You had a... You had a pretty big ground fire right there, you know, about defeat and all that sort of thing."},{"start":292.86,"end":293.48,"text":"Sure did."},{"start":294.1,"end":300.68,"text":"In the press, remember, we said at the time we were having that, it would take its toll."},{"start":301.58,"end":303.64,"text":"But on the other hand..."},{"start":304.78,"end":307.5,"text":"And looking at it, it's looking at it in its coldest terms."},{"start":308.33,"end":309.03,"text":"So you've got $49.37."},{"start":309.11,"end":311.45,"text":"You know what I mean?"},{"start":312.07,"end":315.49,"text":"Yeah, it's one of those things."},{"start":316.11,"end":325.2,"text":"Also, I don't have the confidence, frankly, in either Gallup or Harris because I think they're, I know it isn't that volatile, basically."},{"start":325.22,"end":325.64,"text":"Do you?"},{"start":325.66,"end":326.38,"text":"I don't think it is."},{"start":329.82,"end":339.45,"text":"In August, it was 49, and it went up to 54 in October, and then down to 49 again at the end of October."},{"start":339.49,"end":341.77,"text":"Their education, that was kind of interesting."},{"start":341.81,"end":344.53,"text":"The college educated, you went up 58 to 59."},{"start":344.61,"end":346.83,"text":"You were already high, ultimately educated."},{"start":346.85,"end":351.55,"text":"It stayed there, in other words."},{"start":352.31,"end":355.63,"text":"Where high school went down from 54 to 48, grade school from 47 to 41."},{"start":355.67,"end":358.41,"text":"More of a worthy charge."},{"start":361.69,"end":362.53,"text":"30 minutes low, 38-47."},{"start":362.61,"end":366.89,"text":"We have to have the train on that."},{"start":366.91,"end":369.69,"text":"90 minutes, 52-34."},{"start":370.11,"end":373.79,"text":"The only thing we have is the subject matter."},{"start":373.81,"end":378.03,"text":"The fact that we have our own people."},{"start":378.05,"end":378.99,"text":"Oh, well."},{"start":379.23,"end":381.57,"text":"How do we get that?"},{"start":381.6,"end":383.22,"text":"I mean, our own political supporters."},{"start":390.12,"end":397.06,"text":"There'll be a lot of them between now and when it's managed, but again, I think we've got to follow just the practice we have."},{"start":397.1,"end":399.85,"text":"If we get a good one, we run out and crow about it."},{"start":399.89,"end":403.09,"text":"If we get a bad one, we ignore it."},{"start":404.11,"end":405.33,"text":"We've pretty well gotten to live with that."},{"start":406.27,"end":411.48,"text":"We've gotten some pretty good modern general reps, and not that they've used any of the other ground jobs as much."},{"start":411.5,"end":411.8,"text":"Oh yeah."},{"start":413.08,"end":415.98,"text":"And all the, well, I don't know, the hair or something, I don't know."},{"start":416,"end":420.85,"text":"I think they're out of gowns, too, because they've got a lot of stuff on, you know, the necks and rods and the poles."},{"start":420.93,"end":422.41,"text":"It was working into everything."},{"start":422.47,"end":425.91,"text":"And, uh, it's a problem with this."},{"start":428.22,"end":429.28,"text":"Does Harris have a son?"},{"start":429.3,"end":431.7,"text":"He doesn't have any poles."},{"start":431.78,"end":432.68,"text":"Does he?"},{"start":440.63,"end":445.33,"text":"What do you think?"},{"start":445.65,"end":446.88,"text":"Three degrees, actually."},{"start":447.66,"end":451.28,"text":"But even in three, we said five points."},{"start":452.98,"end":457.92,"text":"We should go in there, margin of error thing."},{"start":458,"end":463.64,"text":"That's how they can explain it all the way, because they get a three plus or minus three point."},{"start":463.74,"end":465.04,"text":"On that basis, there's no change."},{"start":465.58,"end":466.6,"text":"There may not be any change."},{"start":469.28,"end":474.56,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":476.76,"end":481.39,"text":"If they did, we don't have them."},{"start":481.43,"end":484.27,"text":"They did do the Democrat thing."},{"start":484.33,"end":485.45,"text":"This is the same poll."},{"start":485.79,"end":487.53,"text":"I also don't believe it."},{"start":487.63,"end":489.83,"text":"It's not the Democrat thing."},{"start":497.75,"end":502.66,"text":"I wonder what's, what's involved in order that there could be some handy-dandy involved in this thing."},{"start":502.7,"end":503.92,"text":"Maybe, because it's kind of interesting."},{"start":504.24,"end":515.31,"text":"Young George wouldn't give Rumsfeld any information, and so I had Chapin working on Davies, his contact again, and Davies didn't even return his loan to Cox."},{"start":515.33,"end":517.71,"text":"So, there may be something there."},{"start":517.73,"end":520.49,"text":"What do you think about this whole, you know, they were paying?"},{"start":520.87,"end":521.67,"text":"Well, one of the things,"},{"start":523.47,"end":524.33,"text":"Democrat thing came up."},{"start":524.37,"end":527.23,"text":"That's the first week we didn't know they were taking a nap."},{"start":527.33,"end":532.57,"text":"And they took it too soon to get it, which is another curious thing."},{"start":532.63,"end":536.01,"text":"They waited, you know, for that nap from August to October."},{"start":536.05,"end":538.25,"text":"It didn't take any, and then they go in three weeks."},{"start":538.27,"end":541.69,"text":"Now, they never take a poll within three weeks."},{"start":541.83,"end":542.65,"text":"They always wait."},{"start":543.13,"end":544.61,"text":"Their normal pattern is one a month."},{"start":546.79,"end":549.24,"text":"They did one October 8th, and then go out to another on October 29th."},{"start":549.25,"end":551.25,"text":"It's curious."},{"start":554.35,"end":555.35,"text":"I don't think it's curious."},{"start":559.05,"end":572.34,"text":"They can do that, uh, that, uh, now they, uh, they, uh, certainly be, uh, pushing on."},{"start":576.37,"end":578.91,"text":"Yeah, there's something phony about that."},{"start":578.95,"end":580.27,"text":"Don't you think so?"},{"start":580.31,"end":581.55,"text":"It sure looks like it."},{"start":581.57,"end":585.67,"text":"Because it's a different question than, as they point out, it's a different question than Harris."},{"start":585.73,"end":588.96,"text":"Because Harris is a two-way between Muskie and Kennedy."},{"start":589.52,"end":591.52,"text":"Where this is the whole feet."},{"start":591.58,"end":593.88,"text":"Gallup is a two-way."},{"start":593.92,"end":595.62,"text":"Muskie and Kennedy, Gallup is a two-way."},{"start":595.64,"end":596.26,"text":"Harris is the feet."},{"start":599.34,"end":604.07,"text":"that comes out ahead because Gallup explained it."},{"start":604.35,"end":609.47,"text":"Gallup says, and that is explainable, but Gallup says, the monkey makes me rise."},{"start":609.55,"end":615.02,"text":"Gallup, I don't think, pulled it before in a two-way race."},{"start":615.12,"end":615.56,"text":"Yeah, he did."},{"start":617.08,"end":618.62,"text":"I'm not sure."},{"start":618.92,"end":621.16,"text":"And maybe I'm wrong."},{"start":621.2,"end":622.48,"text":"I don't know."},{"start":625.75,"end":626.54,"text":"I don't know what it was."},{"start":626.57,"end":628.45,"text":"This comes out suddenly, doesn't it?"},{"start":639.5,"end":650.12,"text":"They certainly shut off the contact area, didn't they?"},{"start":650.16,"end":660.56,"text":"The bomb detector had that much effect, that sort of thing."},{"start":660.58,"end":661.12,"text":"That vector, that creep."},{"start":661.52,"end":663.54,"text":"As I called them, you saw here's the rest."},{"start":663.56,"end":664.6,"text":"Well, there was talk, in all that."},{"start":664.62,"end":666.22,"text":"This was taken from what they write back to the first."},{"start":666.24,"end":667.68,"text":"That was the UFO."},{"start":674.42,"end":679.48,"text":"As of earlier that week, 24%."},{"start":681.63,"end":699.22,"text":"That's when they showed other prisoners, children, strangers."},{"start":700.44,"end":701.28,"text":"87 high to a 23 low."},{"start":701.4,"end":702.42,"text":"We don't swing that."},{"start":702.48,"end":705.66,"text":"That was the other point they made in this."},{"start":705.78,"end":709.74,"text":"Yeah, pretty much swing here."},{"start":709.8,"end":713.48,"text":"They make the point that this 49 is right on the part of the 50 which has been your average."},{"start":715.92,"end":718.06,"text":"Your average in the current year is 50."},{"start":718.26,"end":720.1,"text":"Your average since taking office is 57."},{"start":720.2,"end":724.52,"text":"Your high since taking office was 68."},{"start":724.58,"end":725.48,"text":"Your low was 48."},{"start":729.95,"end":732.31,"text":"35."},{"start":729.99,"end":732.31,"text":"Truman, 87 to 23."},{"start":732.47,"end":740.96,"text":"I thought it was 49, right?"},{"start":741,"end":745.62,"text":"He was from 79 to 49."},{"start":745.7,"end":746.06,"text":"Kennedy, 57."},{"start":746.38,"end":746.72,"text":"83 to 57."},{"start":746.78,"end":751.95,"text":"Johnson, 80 to 35."},{"start":752,"end":753.27,"text":"Johnson averaged 54."},{"start":753.33,"end":754.03,"text":"Kennedy averaged 70."},{"start":754.31,"end":756.83,"text":"Eisenhower averaged 66."},{"start":756.87,"end":757.89,"text":"Truman averaged 46."},{"start":762.58,"end":763.86,"text":"There's a new average, 57."},{"start":773.24,"end":775.08,"text":"Take the 14 and decide at this point."},{"start":775.14,"end":776.95,"text":"You may have to reallocate to the other side."},{"start":776.99,"end":786.97,"text":"You have to give some change on the 8."},{"start":787.01,"end":788.49,"text":"Because it's 49, 47, so the 8 and 6."},{"start":789.61,"end":790.51,"text":"So it's really 57, 43."},{"start":793.58,"end":800.88,"text":"I don't believe that kind of a shift took place in three weeks."},{"start":800.98,"end":812.03,"text":"I can't believe it because we were doing a hell of a lot of things in that three weeks."},{"start":813.15,"end":813.67,"text":"What was it?"},{"start":813.69,"end":818.64,"text":"They said right after the flood that this was taking place."},{"start":821.34,"end":825.28,"text":"during the first days of the implementation of phase two."},{"start":827.44,"end":827.86,"text":"Which isn't true."},{"start":827.94,"end":833.08,"text":"That's an interesting point."},{"start":833.12,"end":837.33,"text":"Phase two implementation didn't start until November 13th."},{"start":837.42,"end":846.83,"text":"And after the defeat of the UN and the United States two-channel policy,"},{"start":850.96,"end":856.28,"text":"Section 54 was conducted immediately following the nationwide TV address on Phase 2."},{"start":857.83,"end":858.4,"text":"That's correct."},{"start":859.13,"end":861.47,"text":"She did it on October 7th and they pulled on the 8th."},{"start":863.57,"end":864.09,"text":"To 11."},{"start":865.39,"end":865.71,"text":"Right."},{"start":875.05,"end":875.87,"text":"Your domestic..."},{"start":877.09,"end":881.63,"text":"Advisors would like you this afternoon to motorcade to Judiciary Square."},{"start":883.48,"end":886.72,"text":"Be met by Mayor Washington."},{"start":886.76,"end":889.6,"text":"Congressman Fauntleroy, Roy, Old Scott, Hogan, and Goody."},{"start":891.14,"end":899.6,"text":"Climb down the stairs into the construction chamber and observe the progress of the Washington subway system and come out and issue a statement saying that it's got to be built."},{"start":901.22,"end":902.64,"text":"No, not now or ever."},{"start":905.17,"end":909.23,"text":"There's going to be a vote tomorrow, apparently, without a statement."},{"start":909.55,"end":917.79,"text":"And if it doesn't pass, it's the end of the settlement, which would be a million dollars wasted."},{"start":931.09,"end":942,"text":"I would recommend that I not raise this, and they asked would I please raise it anyway, and I told them I would do so, but I would keep the recommenders anonymous for the sake of their own long-range..."},{"start":947.82,"end":952.26,"text":"Well, the argument is that this has great national implications for rapid transit."},{"start":952.64,"end":954.81,"text":"Oh, and, well, here's the worst of it."},{"start":955.43,"end":962.4,"text":"And because we need it for the bicentennial, because 40 million people will be visiting the Capitol in 1976, and they won't have any way to get around the line."},{"start":975.32,"end":984.67,"text":"When you see those western, those regional periods, that's where the weather is."},{"start":984.79,"end":985.25,"text":"The east is rough."},{"start":985.27,"end":986.03,"text":"East 50, midwest 50, south 90."},{"start":986.15,"end":988.33,"text":"What was it before we came?"},{"start":989.35,"end":991.7,"text":"You take the three."},{"start":992,"end":994.52,"text":"The mid-June is the last regional that we have."},{"start":995.14,"end":998.24,"text":"And the mid-June, the last, before the October one."},{"start":999.14,"end":1001.66,"text":"And that was, your overall mid-June was 48."},{"start":1002.97,"end":1006.93,"text":"And then you went up to 54 and then back to 49."},{"start":1007.01,"end":1008.07,"text":"That's the overall group."},{"start":1008.13,"end":1010.39,"text":"Now you take it by region."},{"start":1011.07,"end":1012.65,"text":"The East went from 46 to 54 to 50."},{"start":1012.71,"end":1018.23,"text":"In other words, you only lost half your game."},{"start":1018.29,"end":1021.37,"text":"You gained big points when we lost 400."},{"start":1023.57,"end":1025.89,"text":"The Midwest went from 47 to 52 to 50."},{"start":1029.44,"end":1032.46,"text":"In other words, you held most of the game there."},{"start":1032.5,"end":1034.66,"text":"That's a big question."},{"start":1035.84,"end":1039,"text":"The Sado went from 51 to 56 to 52."},{"start":1039.18,"end":1046.31,"text":"In other words, you lost all the game in the Sado, but the Sado was the strongest one-point in the region."},{"start":1048.01,"end":1050.81,"text":"The West went from 45 to 52 to 41."},{"start":1055,"end":1060.4,"text":"So you know, they lost the game, they lost four more points than the West, and I don't understand that."},{"start":1061.16,"end":1061.88,"text":"Communist China."},{"start":1061.9,"end":1062.06,"text":"The U.N."},{"start":1063.64,"end":1072.09,"text":"I think the West cares that much, but the U.N."},{"start":1072.21,"end":1074.33,"text":"The old folks, the 50 and over, went from 58 down to 49."},{"start":1074.39,"end":1080.41,"text":"Now you know damn well that that's the place where we believe all of them."},{"start":1082.09,"end":1085.17,"text":"The 30 to 50 age group went from 55 to 51."},{"start":1088.39,"end":1095.48,"text":"And the under 30 stayed about the same, 46."},{"start":1096.66,"end":1096.82,"text":"Where?"},{"start":1096.84,"end":1098.3,"text":"55 to 50, oh no, 58 to 49."},{"start":1098.42,"end":1102.78,"text":"So they looked pretty good."},{"start":1102.88,"end":1107.14,"text":"No."},{"start":1107.16,"end":1110.16,"text":"The college educated state went up, 58 to 59."},{"start":1115.21,"end":1118.49,"text":"It was going way down to college educated disapproval went from 35 to 31."},{"start":1118.65,"end":1122.69,"text":"Oh, there was no reason for that."},{"start":1123.55,"end":1127.82,"text":"If you were not a part of the U.N. thing, they were the ones who would care."},{"start":1128.08,"end":1128.76,"text":"And born in Haiti."},{"start":1130.18,"end":1134.18,"text":"You know, they were the ones, if there was any support for it, it would seem to me they didn't care about it."},{"start":1136.1,"end":1139.82,"text":"They didn't think so."},{"start":1139.86,"end":1141.72,"text":"The disapproval, well, West approval went to"},{"start":1144.16,"end":1144.61,"text":"That's a strength."},{"start":1144.69,"end":1147.63,"text":"There's something screwed up with these figures."},{"start":1147.65,"end":1149.63,"text":"The West District Rule only went up four points."},{"start":1150.23,"end":1151.69,"text":"The undecided went up seven points in the West."},{"start":1153.75,"end":1155.93,"text":"But what if the West District Rule is what now?"},{"start":1156.19,"end":1156.83,"text":"Forty-three."},{"start":1158.49,"end":1159.03,"text":"Forty-three."},{"start":1159.13,"end":1159.63,"text":"Forty-three."},{"start":1159.65,"end":1160.79,"text":"Yeah, the undecided."},{"start":1160.81,"end":1161.19,"text":"That's correct."},{"start":1161.29,"end":1163.75,"text":"Decided on the way up."},{"start":1163.79,"end":1165.1,"text":"The undecided in the West was low."},{"start":1165.12,"end":1165.89,"text":"It was only nine."},{"start":1165.97,"end":1167.82,"text":"Where it was about thirteen."},{"start":1167.84,"end":1169.14,"text":"That's up to sixteen."},{"start":1169.16,"end":1170.1,"text":"That's up to sixteen."},{"start":1178.92,"end":1198.88,"text":"Assuming that this, if you have this kind of a drop on this sort of a deal, that can, that can wash out, you know, a mere pop or a drop, as a result of an event, in one calorie or anything else, it washes out."},{"start":1200.3,"end":1202.38,"text":"Because I got a voice out of a very high level."},{"start":1202.4,"end":1204.76,"text":"I don't think we did something."},{"start":1204.78,"end":1207,"text":"I don't think the U.N. thing bothered us."},{"start":1207.04,"end":1211.16,"text":"I still believe in the U.N. before anything."},{"start":1211.18,"end":1212.06,"text":"It's not as a complicated country."},{"start":1212.12,"end":1214.08,"text":"No, but it had a big media, immediate media effect."},{"start":1214.44,"end":1215.92,"text":"And it could have made a difference."},{"start":1216.28,"end":1221.6,"text":"And the fact that we were counted, and the terrible loss for the United States, for the United States as a presence."},{"start":1221.62,"end":1222.12,"text":"Yeah, that's correct."},{"start":1222.14,"end":1228.26,"text":"But I'll bet you a say that it would change."},{"start":1234.88,"end":1237.47,"text":"Yeah, let's just say we still do very well in the polls."},{"start":1237.55,"end":1240.31,"text":"His trial in the evening will be extremely good."},{"start":1240.35,"end":1245.97,"text":"That's more important than the others."},{"start":1246.01,"end":1247.95,"text":"His last trial in the evening was Gallup."},{"start":1247.97,"end":1249.15,"text":"He was extremely good, wasn't he?"},{"start":1250.69,"end":1251.21,"text":"Yeah, they both were."},{"start":1252.29,"end":1254.3,"text":"Well, I know that Harris was, but I meant the Gallup one."},{"start":1254.39,"end":1256.32,"text":"That's the one, unless you recall, was him."},{"start":1256.34,"end":1262.86,"text":"I can't get that to put it, but I don't know."},{"start":1262.9,"end":1263.16,"text":"Oh, whatever."},{"start":1270.4,"end":1275.38,"text":"But you, the parrots are in the gallop trend and the muskie men are not."},{"start":1275.4,"end":1280.29,"text":"You just sense that it's just coals, but there just isn't anything about the muskie men."},{"start":1280.33,"end":1286.57,"text":"It's not getting across to too many people."},{"start":1287.31,"end":1293.47,"text":"It's alright to keep them up there."},{"start":1293.49,"end":1295.17,"text":"It's just the way all of it is."},{"start":1295.19,"end":1299.61,"text":"You can't, on a party thing, you really can't put the thing to a two-way horse race."},{"start":1302.26,"end":1306.1,"text":"You can't look at how you'd vote between Muskie and Kennedy because that isn't the choice."},{"start":1307.16,"end":1308.88,"text":"The choice is Muskie versus the field."},{"start":1311.22,"end":1315.09,"text":"Unless you get a convention down to a certain ballot, but then there's all kinds of other factors."},{"start":1315.12,"end":1315.85,"text":"It never works that way."},{"start":1315.9,"end":1318.47,"text":"There's several people in there."},{"start":1321.09,"end":1326.89,"text":"What that two-way thing does tell you is that there's a whole lot more anti-Kennedy than there is Kennedy."},{"start":1327.41,"end":1327.89,"text":"That's true."},{"start":1331.2,"end":1333.6,"text":"If that doesn't necessarily mean Kennedy can't get the nomination, I suppose."},{"start":1333.64,"end":1343.22,"text":"It's going to be a whole fine thing."},{"start":1343.24,"end":1343.53,"text":"Look at that."},{"start":1343.55,"end":1350.23,"text":"Look at what they've got to go through before they get to where they get whatever it is."},{"start":1350.31,"end":1354.91,"text":"There's some problems."},{"start":1354.93,"end":1355.57,"text":"Well, that didn't work."},{"start":1360.46,"end":1363.8,"text":"We'll keep the, uh, we'll know nothing more about the labor event until then."},{"start":1363.82,"end":1368.22,"text":"Do you guys think our plan will be to go down tonight?"},{"start":1368.24,"end":1371.96,"text":"We decided to go at about 9 o'clock."},{"start":1373.48,"end":1373.66,"text":"Mm-hmm."},{"start":1373.68,"end":1380.22,"text":"Well, you hear, uh, show us, check with me on 7, something like that."},{"start":1380.24,"end":1384.04,"text":"Show us, check with me, get the people, everything, and give me a report."},{"start":1384.12,"end":1384.76,"text":"Yes, we will."},{"start":1386.14,"end":1386.42,"text":"Good."},{"start":1394.28,"end":1394.47,"text":"Thank you."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and H.R. Haldeman met to review recent polling data, discuss political appointments, and address various scheduling items. They analyzed a drop in the President's approval ratings, speculating on the impact of Phase II economic policy implementation and the recent United Nations vote regarding Taiwan. Additionally, the President reviewed a request to visit the Washington D.C. subway construction site to influence a forthcoming congressional vote, and Haldeman provided updates on upcoming labor-related meetings.","topics":["Public opinion polling","Nixon administration","Phase II economic policy","United Nations Taiwan vote","Washington D.C. infrastructure","Political appointments"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-07T01:01:52.825Z"},"topicSlugs":["public-opinion-polling","nixon-administration","phase-ii-economic-policy","united-nations-taiwan-vote","washington-d-c-infrastructure","political-appointments"],"audioDurationSec":1395,"audioFiles":[{"file":"620-014.mp3","bytes":55797354,"durationSec":1394.79,"bitrate":320032,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:51.998Z","findingAidSource":"nixonlibrary.gov subject log (2024-05), reslice-v2","findingAidUpdatedAt":"2026-09-18T08:44:08.623Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/620-014.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/620-014","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/620/conversation-620-014","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}