Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 621 › Conversation 621-038

Nixon & Kissinger on China visit and Vietnam War

Monday, November 22, 1971 · 8:30 AM–8:50 AM ET · Oval Office · 18 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Kissinger, Henry A.; [Unknown person(s)]Conversation621-038 on Tape 621 (tape position 03:58:13–04:15:45)StartMonday, November 22, 1971 at 8:30 AMEndMonday, November 22, 1971 at 8:50 AMRecording deviceOval OfficeSourceNixon Library record for 621-038 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Henry Kissinger met to coordinate the logistics and public announcement timing for the President’s upcoming trip to the People's Republic of China, involving key foreign leaders and domestic advisors. The discussion also addressed the status of the Vietnam War, focusing on military operations in Cambodia, casualty reporting, and the administration's political strategy regarding withdrawal and ongoing peace negotiations. The participants further deliberated on managing public perception and responding to press coverage from outlets like the New York Times concerning these foreign policy and military initiatives.

Audio

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Position in tape: 03:58:13 – 04:15:45

part B, 1:45:40

621a.mp3
621b.mp3
621c.mp3
621d.mp3

NARA Description

On November 22, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House from 8:30 am to 8:50 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 621-038 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 621-38

Date: November 22, 1971
Time: 8:30 am - 8:50 am
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Henry A. Kissinger.

     The President's schedule
          -Foreign visits and visitors
               -Timing of announcements

**************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
[Privacy]
[Duration: 3s ]:

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1

**************************************************************************

                -Georges J.R. Pompidou and Willy Brandt
                -Edward R.G. Heath

**************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5
[Privacy]
[Duration: 3s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5

**************************************************************************

          -The President’s trip to the People's Republic of China [PRC]

               -Announcement
                   -Ronald L. Ziegler

An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 8:30 am.

          -Unknown woman
              -The President's date book
Show the rest of the log (81 more lines)
The unknown person left at an unknown time before 8:50 am.

An unknown woman entered at an unknown time after 8:30 am.

          -Foreign visits and visitors
               -Announcements
                     -Timing
               -Dates
               -Locations
                     -Azores
                     -Bermuda
                     -Key Biscayne
                     -Logistics
                     -H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman

The unknown woman left at an unknown time before 8:50 am.

     Vietnam
          -Casualties
          -Cambodia
               -Military dispositions
                      -North Vietnam
                      -South Vietnam
                      -Press reporting
                            -Washington Post
               -New York Times previous editorial
          -The President's policy
               -Withdrawal date
               -Conversation with Michael J. Mansfield
                      -Prisoners of war [POWs]
               -Withdrawal date
                      -Military aid
                      -POW wives

                -POWs
                -New York Times
     -Cambodia
           -Press reports
           -Military dispositions
                 -Bombing
     -Press reporting
     -Kissinger's speech to Air Force wives
           -Cincinnati
           -Withdrawal date
     -Negotiations
     -The President's opponents
           -Kissinger’s view
           -White House response
                 -The President
                 -Cabinet
                 -Congress
           -Goals
     -Peace negotiations
           -Le Duc Tho
     -Cambodia
     -PRC announcement
     -Military dispositions
           -Bombing
           -Kissinger's conversation with Thomas Karamessines
           -The President's conversation with Richard M. Helms
                 -Forthcoming conversation between Helms and Kissinger
           -Briefings
                 -Central Intelligence Agency [CIA]
                 -Joint Chiefs of Staff [JCS]
           -Military operations

The President's schedule
     -Previous speech to American Federation of Labor-Congress of Industrial
          Organizations [AFL-CIO] convention
          -Kissinger's conversations
                 -Kissinger's parents
          -Frank J. Lausche's call to the President
                 -George Meany

Barry M. Goldwater

           -Forthcoming conversation with Kissinger
           -Forthcoming meeting with the President
                -Kissinger's schedule

Kissinger left at 8:50 am.

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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You know what I mean?
Even people spend money.
People save a little.
They want to sacrifice a little.
They can go any place in the world.
You know, all you need to do is be alive.
The world has changed.
But it's all that's really for the better.
They just realize it.
Yeah.
Well, anyway, you can just don't fill that in.
I mean, three trips, I mean, three meetings in December that aren't in there.

— 1 min 22 s with no transcribed speech —

and the coach, George Allen, of the Washington Breslin.
Just let our dead spirits come out and suck your gold.
That won't happen.
I'm sure it's the idea that some want one and some want the other.
I see.
Oh, sure.
Well, they didn't want anything.
But, uh, that's all right.
That's all right.
Well, actually, uh, it's a real tough choice there is between the two.
I mean, you read about it, you know, you look at Kilmer, and here's a solid model that makes all the mistakes.
And here's Jurgie, who, of course, he's got the flair, but he's old.
You can put it down there, but you just don't know.
I was certain he was a leader compared to Kilmer.
That's what I was wondering.
Yeah, that's the big thing.
You know what I get down to, though, is that the person, the main thing, their team has got to stay up now for the rest of the season.
Now, they are out of them.
I saw the Dallas, I mean, I saw their Rams and Redskins, and their Rams are hot right now.
And I think they will pass on Dallas.
They, my God, you know some of those players that got out there.
There's nobody there.
And if they do later, that'll be quite a game.
And also, if I don't do that game, the Miami Redskins punch the Dallas more than the 49ers punch the Iran.
So next Saturday, you might still be back in first place.
So what do you think?
the rest of your season.
Now you've got Philadelphia next week, right?
And then the Giants.
And that's here.
That's the one I think maybe I haven't gotten to in a while.
I don't think you'll believe me about that.
And then what is it?
Then you go to Los Angeles.
Right?
You play the Rams out there.
And what's your last game?
Yeah.
Well, you really have.
They're all tough.
You're all tough.
And by golly, you've really gotten that rant in here.
Thank you.
No, the boys will be high for that.
But now, what about those dollars on the side of the rack?
Well, it still is, but what about the second place deal?
Aren't you very much ready for that?
Yeah.
Well, you're going to win.
You're going to beat Philadelphia.
In fact, I know you're going to beat Dallas.
Yeah.
You know, the other thing that was amazing to me is that, you know, the first night field goal was pretty warm.
The second one, I just thought it was automatic.
That would make a great difference in the psychology of the game.
And there, just float off for a bit.
A little.
And the right leg, I see.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, you've got to run over the other side, George.
Tell me about boys as a woman.
The main thing is just if he changes or he thinks now.
How about browns?
He comes back to the shape.
Despite that.
I'm worried that he can walk around in your head.
Oh.
I know.
How about that at all?
Yep.
Yep.
Yeah, I know, that was one of those passes where, because your defense was fantastic, and I wonder, too, if that's all over there, if that could look, if he could have gone back and gotten away as much, apparently, what do you think?
I don't know, it's a pretty couple that are coming up fast, isn't it?
And he sees that stuff so far in advance.
But now, what about the...
What about Seth?
Is there any chance to get him back?
Two more weeks, you won't have him third.
But you'll have him in the Rams.
That'll be an important one, because he isn't needed at all.
Austin, have you caught any passes?
Yeah.
Well, if you can get him back.
And what I think is this, if you can get him back for the Rams, George, I mean, that's going to be your game.
You're going to win that game.
Because everybody's good at it.
The next one's still going.
And your boys will be looking for one there.
Well, anyway, don't let those booze birds bother you.
And tell them that the calls are coming.
What are you going to have to do?
Are you going to come to church or anything?
Yeah.
Well, come on.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And also, the owner of that bus, Jurgis, is kind of the nature of the end-comer contact.
And the bus, though, Jurgis is off, and he is spying the end-comers.
And you've got, it's great to have that kind of quarterback.
Yeah.
When you really come down to it, you look at the Colts, you know, tomorrow night, it's not bad.
Well, it's, uh, it's, uh, just to see, I think it's going to flare up next week.
You've got to score a couple touchdowns.
Oh, okay.
Okay, good luck.

— 2 min 46 s with no transcribed speech —

We got everything all set now about the trip.
The British came back too.
The British wanted to announce it simultaneously.
The French absolutely refused.
So we finally told the British.
That's what we did.
That's what we did.
Then he started crying again, and so we said, well, if that's his attitude, we've got to delay it till January.
Then there's a good long stretch in between.
So we put it to January, the first trip?
No, no.
Then we yielded.
I knew he was going to yield that.
I said, then we'll test me for what we do in France, and then we announce your trip later.
So it's all set now.
It's a 48-hour interval.
So when's that?
Friday and Sunday.
Where do you say Friday?
British Friday.
German Sunday.
You ought to understand.
Also, there's a perfect reason.
Compton is the head of state.
That's right.
She has a perfect reason.
That's right.
Oh, yes.
It's...
He does have that petty streak.
And... Yeah.
Well, that will
But at any rate, it's done, and otherwise...
The dates are all set.
The Chinese thing is all set, as I told you.
That's going to be on... On Monday at 1 o'clock, California.
And that's got to be exact, because they're going to release us at the same second.
That's something we're just going to have to figure out.
Yes, you'll just hand it out.
No backgrounding or anything.
You'll do the next day, all day.
That'll start all of a sudden.
Why didn't we just say absolutely nothing?
Nothing.
Freeze.
But then what I meant is that the other trips are when?
Friday and Sunday, you know.
Open today.
The announcement will be next Friday and Sunday.
This is a little girl.
Freeze.
Oh, with my photo, my date book.
Okay.
Freeze.
Under 24.
Under 24.
Under 24.
Twenty-six, Newham, Washington time, British.
And twenty-eight, Newham, Washington time, Germany.
And then twenty-nine at one.
Twenty-nine at one, British, but not second.
That's right, sir.
13th and 14th.
We were talking about November.
Oh, you were?
Yes.
13th and 14th.
Leave the house at the same second.
That's something we're just going to take over.
Yes, you'll just hand it out.
No backgrounding or anything.
You'll do the next day all the... That'll start all of them.
But we'll just say absolutely nothing.
Nothing.
Freeze.
But then what I meant is that the other trips are when?
Friday and Sunday, you know.

Also recorded on November 22, 1971

  • 015-081 8:08 AM · 8 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 8:08 am and 8:20 am.
  • 015-082 8:20 AM · 7 min — President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and George E. Allen talked on the telephone from 8:20 am to 8:27 am.
  • 621-036 8:20 AM · 9 min — President Richard M. Nixon and George E. Allen met in the Oval Office of the White House from 8:20 am to 8:27 am.
  • 621-037 8:27 AM · 2 sec — President Richard M. Nixon met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:27 am and 8:30 am.
  • 621-039 8:50 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Henry A. Kissinger met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:50 am and 9:10 am.
  • 621-040 8:50 AM · 10 min — President Richard M. Nixon met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:50 am and 9:10 am.
  • 621-041 8:50 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:50 am and 9:10 am.
  • 621-042 8:50 AM · 27 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:50 am and 9:10 am.

All 59 conversations from November 22, 1971 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 621-038, November 22, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/621-038 (accessed November 2, 2026).