Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 642-027
Date: Monday, January 3, 1972 at 11:15 AM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); MacGregor, Clark; Smith, Jody; Sanchez, Manolo
Recording device: Oval Office
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/642-027

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[4:19:11] Oh, that sort of thing.
[4:19:12] I'm not interested in shooting the room, the shots, the feet, the two shots, the rest.
[4:19:16] I mean, there's only one thing.
[4:19:18] How does it look in my pocket?
[4:19:20] And we must not, we must not rationalize here.
[4:19:24] We've got to be absolutely ruthless.
[4:19:27] It may be in trouble, and it's so heavy, and it's unemployed and good, just simply aren't up to it.
[4:19:33] We need the best possible, the absolute perfect best in this respect.
[4:19:39] Yeah, there was one shot that wasn't good.
[4:19:44] There's no question.
[4:19:46] There were some other shots that were superb.
[4:19:49] And the second was extremely well done.
[4:19:54] It makes a difference.
[4:20:02] I saw that
[4:20:21] Well, there's another tractor, which would be interesting to see, because I'll get there without cooling and get there at race 11 and then see what I get and then travel on.
[4:20:42] They can only do so much that NBC may have done.
[4:20:45] The network would be ABC people by now if we had that problem.
[4:20:50] We can't order them to take the shot we want.
[4:20:52] We can only persuade them.
[4:20:54] But the first question is whether they were satisfied with it or whether you were trying to persuade them.
[4:21:02] I'm not sure they know nothing about it, Bob.
[4:21:04] I'm really not.
[4:21:06] I'm not sure.
[4:21:06] I don't know as much about it as anybody in the business.
[4:21:10] Okay, well, nobody knows more about it.
[4:21:13] And he's better than most at getting people to do what we want them to do.
[4:21:18] Well, maybe he's best.
[4:21:19] But let's see what he's not damn sure that we are getting.
[4:21:22] Now, I think you may be right, though.
[4:21:26] Maybe CBS or something didn't want to go there.
[4:21:31] See, for most people, it's...
[4:21:35] what they want them to take.
[4:21:36] Most of them want them to shoot down, but we have fun and we know that you shouldn't shoot down.
[4:21:46] And there's just no question about that.
[4:21:47] And you always get a benefit if you shoot it out of the check around, just to get an honest opinion.
[4:21:53] People always tell you what you want to hear.
[4:21:55] Why they help you check with the few people around here is because they're young people, young people who can.
[4:22:03] Sapphire, Garmin.
[4:22:04] I mean, people ask where you can get some television from them because they know a hell of a lot more about television than the people that sit in there, you know.
[4:22:10] They watch it all the time.
[4:22:12] Watch this.
[4:22:15] I mean, at least our own people, let's see what they know about it.
[4:22:18] More, more is different.
[4:22:23] I mean, if you didn't feel it, it was a two minute shot, so it would seem better.
[4:22:30] I didn't think it was bad.
[4:22:32] I mean, that's the way they felt.
[4:22:34] It wasn't bad.
[4:22:36] But it ought to be the best, it ought to be the best.
[4:22:38] Listen, for Christ's sake, one is to be on the whole road.
[4:22:42] But in God's name, there isn't any excuse for not having a good child.
[4:22:46] That's right.
[4:24:05] over the weekend.
[4:24:07] We're gearing up and I think we're going to be well prepared when they come back on the 18th.
[4:24:23] I plan to see you the 20th.
[4:24:30] I think that's wise.
[4:24:37] That's good.
[4:24:38] If I'm late, I wouldn't be here.
[4:24:59] I hope that consistent with what I expect you to be doing all year, if you would be very much the President of the United States and giving a vision, constantly demonstrating a difference in your stature vis-a-vis that of most of your opponents.
[4:25:15] Well, I request that it's time to see you, and it's a very unusual mission, Mr. President, because it's out of my field.
[4:25:24] But it comes...
[4:25:27] My reason, the fact that I have been, Barbara and I have been friendly over the years with Anna Chenault.
[4:25:36] Anna called me a week ago today and said she had a matter of great importance and she wondered, could she come in and talk privately with me?
[4:25:42] And I said, of course.
[4:25:46] So she came in and she said...
[4:25:50] that earlier in December she had talked personally with President Tu, with President Park of South Korea, and with President Marcus.
[4:26:02] And she said the heads of government of five anti-communist countries from Thailand, South Vietnam, Philippines, Republic of China, and South Korea
[4:26:16] had been talking among themselves about the five of them getting together.
[4:26:23] And they did not want to pursue this inquiry to you through regular State Department channels, but they wanted to know.
[4:26:35] And again, I have to, I don't know about Anna's credentials or how close she really is or whether she's trying to puff herself up.
[4:26:43] They wanted to know if it was the embarrassment to you if the five leaders did get together either in Bangkok or in Manila before February 21st when you opened your talks in Peking.
[4:27:04] You felt it was not helpful they would postpone that meeting of the five heads of government until after you had visited with the leaders of the People's Republic of China.
[4:27:19] What I think that she was really angling for was to know whether there was any possibility that at some time after February you might meet with these five
[4:27:33] heads of government.
[4:27:35] And I said, what about Australia and New Zealand?
[4:27:38] And she said, no, these are the non-whites, the Asians, and they have a feeling, she said, that as things are developing, and they're developing very fast, it will be necessary for the five of them to develop a closer working relationship, or there he said.
[4:28:10] Mayor, I just want to congratulate you on the day of your inauguration.
[4:28:16] And as the youngest mayor in the country, winning a very exciting campaign, I'm sure that you're going to do a fine job.
[4:28:25] I mean, your town is one of the largest, but it has all the problems I'm sure that other towns have.
[4:28:32] And at least this is the beginning.
[4:28:34] I just wish you the very best.
[4:28:41] I understand you work hard as a bus driver, right?
[4:28:48] Did you play basketball and baseball too?
[4:28:51] Yeah, you know, even if it's so hot, I didn't have air conditioning.
[4:28:56] And, uh, you worked in your father's garage.
[4:29:01] Well, I worked in the service section.
[4:29:03] My wife was in the service section, so we had something in common.
[4:29:06] And, uh, it wouldn't be a better arm to teach you what people were thinking.
[4:29:11] Right?
[4:29:12] Well, I guess we should at the very end, uh, we would have to take their oath even as we've been called by and send my congratulations, will you?
[4:29:27] I see.
[4:29:27] I see.
[4:29:28] Well, I'm sure you are.
[4:29:30] You don't have to get done with it.
[4:29:33] It was a nice place at that time.
[4:29:39] I see.
[4:29:40] Right.
[4:29:41] Well, good night.
[4:29:43] That was a thoughtful thing to do.
[4:29:47] That'll set that mayor up for a long time.
[4:29:51] That's true.
[4:29:51] Thank you, sir.
[4:29:56] The great people like
[4:30:29] So you'd like them to be these four on the first?
[4:30:33] Yes, sir.
[4:30:41] This is an unusual mission for me.
[4:30:44] I probably should have discussed this with Henry first.
[4:30:47] He was ill. She came to visit me on Tuesday.
[4:30:49] Well, I thought I'd best just come to you with her.
[4:30:55] I just wanted to get
[4:31:13] She's a very good gal, I tell you.
[4:31:21] And, uh, you know, amazing woman.
[4:31:25] She really is.
[4:31:26] Oh, she had, you know, got the Chinese erasers.
[4:31:30] She never said it, I'm sure.
[4:31:34] Did you guys support him?
[4:31:40] My guess is she's very close to 50.
[4:31:42] I can't remember exactly when she married Claire Chenault.
[4:31:47] I was over there at the time, Mr. President, serving in Burma when she married Claire Chenault.
[4:31:58] I'm 49.
[4:31:59] I don't think she's any younger than me.
[4:32:01] She could be a year or so younger, but I wouldn't think closer.
[4:32:04] She's much closer to 50 than she is to 40.
[4:32:13] Speaking about our shop, I'd like to take a moment to share.
[4:32:17] Don Timmons and Dick Cook and Tom Corlew and some of the others share my optimism.
[4:32:29] They may not be quite as bullish as I am about revenue sharing, health legislation.
[4:32:39] and some compromise on welfare reform that probably won't be acceptable to you, both governmentally and politically.
[4:32:50] Oh, the Senate's going to cut up Title IV, which isn't family assistance.
[4:32:55] They don't like to hash it.
[4:32:59] But in conference, we're optimistic that something that would be acceptable to you can be worked out that won't cost you
[4:33:09] any more than you've already been.
[4:33:11] If they could just take the time for it and make it start on the program, that's all we want.
[4:33:16] That's the answer.
[4:33:17] If they all want to get reasonable and do it, then I'm off the hook.
[4:33:21] That's right.
[4:33:22] That's right.
[4:33:22] I think that's best.
[4:33:23] I'm not sure that that's any more my song for you.
[4:33:27] No.
[4:33:27] I'm not sure it's going to work.
[4:33:29] I wish it were.
[4:33:30] I wish it were.
[4:33:31] But I can't be so damn sure.
[4:33:34] I'm going to oppose that on 200 million people.
[4:33:36] It's just a terrible risk.
[4:33:37] Yeah, it is a risk.
[4:33:38] So let us try to experiment with it.
[4:33:41] That's good.
[4:33:41] My point was that the climate is such right now so that I think notwithstanding the fact that it's a presidential election year and notwithstanding the fact that the Senate has just shot through with candidates, you have in Bob Byrd, Harry Byrd, you and I can tick off the list of Democratic senators,
[4:34:05] You have in, who are in a leadership position, and you have in the Speaker and in Hale Boggs and George Mahon and a few others, you've got the fabric along with tighter and tighter Republican cohesion and unity of effort behind your initiatives.
[4:34:26] You've got the makings of another three or four or five productive months.
[4:34:33] in the Congress, where they will be giving you what the press calls victories for the president.
[4:34:40] And indeed they are.
[4:34:42] They're legislative victories that benefit the whole country.
[4:34:45] But as you know, we've been having this trade legislation meeting, and I wouldn't look to see any
[4:34:56] We look to see a record, Mr. President, five months from now, which is considerably better than the record you have now, which everybody says is a whale of a good record.
[4:35:19] Over the Christmas New Year period, Barbara and I went to a number of gatherings where most people don't think as you and I do.
[4:35:27] And they're very complimentary to your performance.
[4:35:32] This very liberal Mel Elton, who is with Newsweek and who substitutes for Vronsky, invited Barbara and me for a New Year's Eve thing at their house.
[4:35:42] He said, you may not see too many people who think of you, Clark, but they're interesting people.
[4:35:48] And so I said to Barbara, well, let's go.
[4:35:51] so we did and aside from the garments and the sapphires everybody there was you know galbraith and k graham and you know but it was very interesting to hear uh complimentary comments about your capacity to to uh to leave well they uh
[4:36:21] They have a great big issues out of those things.
[4:37:38] What is charisma?
[4:37:42] What is charisma?
[4:37:46] Jack Kennedy made that charisma look at the lousy performance.
[4:37:51] Yeah, but you know what it is?
[4:37:53] It's on the media.
[4:37:58] Besides, I can talk about those teenage girls jumping up and down and squealing when you came out of the Capitol after that, after that Armed Services Committee.
[4:38:07] They do.
[4:38:08] They do.
[4:38:09] They're pretty selective.
[4:38:10] So they call that grief?
[4:38:12] I've got one picture of that little girl.
[4:38:15] She was screaming down her face.
[4:38:17] Well, I don't want to make a lot of noise.
[4:38:22] You've got a good job in your spirit.
[4:38:24] You're up all the time.
[4:38:25] And you've got to be.
[4:39:17] That's the main thing that I'm trying to get across to them.
[4:39:19] The regular intent that in the foreign policy, it's the long view that comes.
[4:39:24] Like, if it had survived any young people, I heard that they should have been appealed to for that point.
[4:39:29] I'm thinking about where the hell are we going to be 25 years from now?
[4:39:35] I mean, that's when you find out that because of China, China caused Korea.
[4:39:40] It had contributed to Vietnam.
[4:39:42] Our 20-year-old daughter sat with us last night, sat with Barbara and me, watching it, and she was absorbed by the whole thing.
[4:39:56] She didn't say a thing until the George Wallace question came, and she had it.
[4:40:00] paper or something in her hand, and she threw it down, and she said, that's no question to ask the president.
[4:40:05] In other words, she was irritated at not only the content of the question, but rather his manner in asking about, did you think George Wallace was a minister of the country or something like that.
[4:40:16] Our 20-year-old was incensed that that question would even be asked you.
[4:40:19] She said, that's no question.
[4:40:20] I thought it was better to twist it.
[4:40:23] Oh, sure.
[4:40:24] It's a question for the other party.
[4:40:26] It's a question for the other party.
[4:40:28] It's not our problem.
[4:40:33] Thank you for the time that you've given me.
[4:40:38] I've been embarrassed by the
[4:40:41] rumors that have been in a number of publications.
[4:40:44] And so I, and I can make light of it until finally they seem to be so persistent that about a month ago I called Dick Klein.
[4:40:51] He said, Dick and I work together all the time.
[4:40:53] We work very well together.
[4:40:55] And I said, this is Emily Dick.
[4:40:56] I'm embarrassed by these stories.
[4:40:58] I don't know where they're coming from.
[4:40:59] They're certainly not coming from me and not coming from anybody I can control at all.
[4:41:04] And he said, well, Clark, I can answer that for you.
[4:41:06] They're coming in part from me.
[4:41:07] And I said, well, why would they be coming from you?
[4:41:09] He said, well, the press is after me to find out, you know, when and if John Mitchell is going to step down, am I going to be the attorney general?
[4:41:16] And when I say, when I answer them, I'll do whatever the president wants me to do.
[4:41:20] I'd be happy to do it.
[4:41:21] Then they say, if you're not going to be the Attorney General, who else?
[4:41:24] So he said, I always liked your name.
[4:41:25] I said, well, please stop.
[4:41:26] I said, please stop.
[4:41:27] Then a story appeared shortly before Christmas that I was actively seeking it.
[4:41:32] And I asked John Mitchell if he'd step into my office.
[4:41:35] He did.
[4:41:35] And I said, that's a lie.
[4:41:36] I wrote a letter to the press and had them retract that.
[4:41:40] But I didn't feel I had to bother you about it.
[4:41:44] I just wanted you to know that I said I wanted all of it.
[4:41:46] I like the job I've got.
[4:41:47] I think it's an important job.
[4:41:48] I think the President wants me to stay in it, and that's fine with me.
[4:41:53] Let me say at this point, there is nothing more I'm hoping that you could do.
[4:41:59] Nothing.
[4:42:01] Should we survive the Great Battle of 72, then I think you should do something else.
[4:42:11] You should prepare somebody to do this.
[4:42:18] that you should do something else.
[4:42:21] And it should be, of course, cat and dairy.
[4:42:27] Because it's my view that if you give your cat, I think they should always drink coffee.
[4:42:42] And, uh, I'm being a cabinet officer.
[4:42:45] You can't pay any ads.
[4:42:46] I mean, uh, except that you're gonna be writing your own show, and something that an individual should welcome to join at some point.
[4:42:51] And, uh, that, uh, and, uh, as far as, uh,
[4:43:06] I would hope you keep in mind this as long as you can.