{"conversationCode":"664-004","tapeNumber":664,"conversationNumber":4,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-664-004","startDateTime":"1972-02-02T14:13:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-02-02T14:14:00.000Z","startDate":"2-Feb-1972","startTime":"9:13 AM","endDate":"2-Feb-1972","endTime":"9:14 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"estimated","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Bull, Stephen B.;","description":"On February 2, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 9:13 am and 9:14 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 664-004 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"OVAL","recordingDevice":"Oval Office","latitudeEstimated":38.8974,"longitudeEstimated":-77.0374,"chronCode":3,"chronRelease":"Third Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"28-Feb-2002","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 664-4\n\nDate: February 2, 1972\nTime: Unknown between 9:13 am and 9:14 am\nLocation: Oval Office\n\nThe President met with Stephen B. Bull.\n\n     [Funeral for Gregory P. Foster and Rocco Laurie]\n          -Telephone list\n                -Operators\n\nBull left at an unknown time before 9:14 am.","filename":["664a.mp3","664b.mp3"],"tapeStart":"00:18:38","tapeEnd":"00:19:11","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Bull, Stephen B."],"prevCode":"664-003","nextCode":"664-005","tapeTranscriptFile":"664a.mp3,664b.mp3","transcript":[{"start":1120.39,"end":1124.35,"text":"What's your judgment then about us taking on or not?"},{"start":1124.37,"end":1126.59,"text":"I think what we've done now, but leave it at that."},{"start":1128.45,"end":1131.19,"text":"And if Rogers doesn't want to do it, I wouldn't break his arm."},{"start":1133.23,"end":1145.26,"text":"I think it'd be important, the reason it'd be important for Rogers to do it is to get him positioned so that he can't, and his people, his people can't go piss on him."},{"start":1145.32,"end":1147.46,"text":"That's true."},{"start":1147.54,"end":1149.18,"text":"The way they did in Newsweek."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":1119.625,"end":1150.875,"startMethod":"silence","endMethod":"silence"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Stephen B. Bull discussed the tactical handling of Secretary of State William Rogers regarding his involvement in the funeral arrangements for fallen New York City police officers Gregory P. Foster and Rocco Laurie. Nixon sought to manage Rogers’ public position to prevent negative press coverage and potential internal dissent from within the State Department. The President concluded that while Rogers' attendance would be strategically beneficial, he preferred not to force the issue if Rogers remained reluctant.","topics":["William P. Rogers","Police funerals","Public relations","State Department","Internal administration politics"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-07T02:12:28.925Z"},"topicSlugs":["william-p-rogers","police-funerals","public-relations","state-department","internal-administration-politics"],"audioDurationSec":33,"audioFiles":[{"file":"664a.mp3","bytes":177528371,"durationSec":7396.96,"bitrate":192001,"missing":false},{"file":"664b.mp3","bytes":43392312,"durationSec":1807.95,"bitrate":192006,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":true,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:54.976Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/664a.mp3","https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/664b.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/664-004","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/664/conversation-664-004","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}