Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 702 › Conversation 702-007

Nixon, Kissinger & Mitchell on Vietnam War and 1972 Presidential Campaign

Tuesday, April 4, 1972 · 3:45 PM–5:06 PM ET · Oval Office

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Kissinger, Henry A.; Butterfield, Alexander P.; Mitchell, John N.; Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob"); Sanchez, Manolo; Lucet, Charles; White House photographerConversation702-007 on Tape 702 (tape position 00:58:02–02:19:43)StartTuesday, April 4, 1972 at 3:45 PMEndTuesday, April 4, 1972 at 5:06 PMRecording deviceOval OfficeSourceNixon Library record for 702-007 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon met with his inner circle and advisors, including Henry Kissinger, John Mitchell, and H.R. Haldeman, to discuss the intensifying North Vietnamese offensive and the resulting requirements for U.S. military response, specifically air strikes. The conversation covered the necessity of maintaining national resolve and foreign policy credibility amidst political pressure and the upcoming 1972 election. They also addressed the ITT political controversy, with Mitchell advising the President to handle it with caution, and briefly touched upon diplomatic staffing changes and the upcoming Soviet summit.

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This conversation has not yet been cut into its own clip, so the player above contains the full tape segment shared with neighbouring conversations. It begins about 00:58:02 into the tape and ends around 02:19:43.

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· Timestamps are positions within the full tape recording.
58:00And what happened was he would agree and he wouldn't have killed him because of that.
58:02You see the horror around that, what you described.
58:06But the leader class, there's where people have to concentrate.
58:10People talk about the masses.
58:13My study of history tells me that civilizations do not deteriorate.
58:17They do not become decadent because of what happens to the masses.
58:21That's a false, I don't know if you agree with me, but I think what happens is the leader class goes to hell.
58:28And what it does, I mean, someone's got to lead it, that's all there is to it.
58:33But you see, that is one of the first things.
58:36The radicalized, hella students, 5% or so, who are real ideologues and ferocious, these are always complaining about moral decadence and so on.
58:43and the lack of leadership.
58:45Well, they are themselves class, because these are the young people who come from families of Afro, that's almost all of them, who haven't had expensive educations, bad ones, who have all kinds of opportunities, and who will instead turn to a violent romanticism
59:02moral nihilism where their own lives are concerned, and hypocrisy and political demands, these are the decadent classes.
59:08These are the young decadents.
59:10Those who are complaining about decadence and immorality are themselves the decadent and immoral.
59:14It's the destruction of a class.
59:16And of course,
59:19That class, people will be, well, think of society, some will take the place, and it's the Poles, the Czechs, some will come in and take out their information, and some of the Negroes, many of the Negroes arise, and go have a new class, it's plentiful, and they're going at it very fast.
59:36That's where you had to get it.
59:37That's what saved this country, of course, through the years.
59:40The influx of the new people, when they kind of came in and they gave, they intermarried and so forth, instead of becoming incestuous, but inbred like the British and the French.
59:51And that's what's happened to them.
59:56Let's face it.
59:56And it has not yet happened to us.
59:59Of course, we're big enough.
1:00:01Well, I asked these questions to see how you would evaluate the current city.
1:00:06I'd like to remind myself of the phrase of Jim Adams, the funnest of the process.
1:00:12Adams was always kind of pessimistic.
1:00:15He said, the funnest of the process, and we're flying, we're going to put it into this world, as into an arena, and it's our duty to keep on fighting whether we think we're going to win or not.
1:00:25And, of course, if you play hard enough and believe you will, then you probably will.
1:00:30On the other hand, if one believes the prophets of doom, well, those become prophecies that work their own way, don't they?
1:00:36All those pieces.
1:00:37Yesterday, on the small scale, I said, when they grew up in schools, if they really believe they're going to pull nothing out, then they will pull nothing.
1:00:44If they're willing to fight, then they're going to get help from you and other people, and something will be done for them.
1:00:50They can't sit there and say, well, they're going to hold up unless somebody helps us.
1:00:54They've got to say, we've got to fight, and we're going to do it, and we're going to go out and talk, and we're going to get the contributions, and we're going to continue to work, and we're going to accelerate the pay rise.
1:01:01It's a tough deal.
1:01:04But I couldn't agree more.
1:01:05When the will to live goes, there's no chance.
1:01:08There's no way.
1:01:09And that's what's happening in lots of institutions.
1:01:14The will to live just goes.
1:01:17It's a...
1:01:19It's an interesting point for us to consider at the present time, because as you look around the world today, I mean, no one could have less illusions than I have about the terror, the desolates, the dreads, the dehumanizing effect of the social systems, all social systems, and the consciousness systems that I saw in Russia.
1:01:41And for a situation like Romania, you have a strong outbreak of all kinds of
1:01:47And, of course, you see it in China.
1:01:49It's in a very different form than the West, but I'm just saying.
1:01:57The difficulty, however, when you look at those terrible systems, and what concerns them, and I know I'm going to put a couple other people in there, is that when you look at the Chinese as people, you look at the Russians as people,
1:02:17because of the Germans as people and the Japanese as people, and you have four people that still have drive, that still, oh, I don't mean that they're all, that they're doing perfect, that they don't have their share of everything, immoral people and thieves, addicts, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, but they've got drive, sense of destiny, et cetera, et cetera.
1:02:44Now, when you have,
1:02:46peoples like that in the world, the United States, rich as it is, with a superior society, certainly materialistically sensitive, with all of our power, and also with all of our, well, let's face it, with a system of government which is infinitely better than any of those.
1:03:10But if the United States, and particularly its leader class,
1:03:15loses its drive, sense of destiny, and sort of isn't driven any longer, then we are in very serious trouble.
1:03:23Because there are other people around who are willing.
1:03:27Would you not agree with that?
1:03:32They're willing to pay the price.
1:03:33They're willing to sacrifice and so forth.
1:03:35Now, they will build, certainly, the Russians and the Chinese will build a kind of a world that will be horrifying as far as we're concerned.
1:03:45who knows what the Japanese returns would do.
1:03:49But at any rate, the spark of greatness that has made this country what it is is something that's got to be kept alive by people who have
1:04:54I had a chance to talk to you, and they said I followed your columns, but I re-read that little program from the Conservatives, and it reads well, and as time goes on, you ought to read it again sometime.
1:05:07I took up last night's final passage, and I don't have any quotes from the piece that I was writing.
1:05:13Yes, but I'm told that it holds up, and it's relevant.
1:05:17There's an article in the column, you know.
1:05:19It holds up.
1:05:20You must know what you meant when you took up that point in this book.
1:05:22It's very important.
1:05:24Well, you know, the way you break it down in simple terms, the problem of loyalty and all, uh, tradition, et cetera, et cetera, and people don't understand those things, and, uh, we, uh, we have, you know, the double don'ts that are supposed to say these profound things, but it's the slightest idea what it's all about, and it's, it's got to be, it's got to be raised.
1:05:49Who do you think, if you had to pick a book to read,
1:05:52Except for Bert, what would you read today?
1:05:53Of all the books that you've read, what's a social thought in that area, or history, or biography?
1:05:58What's the most interesting book you've picked to read?
1:06:01How do you do them?
1:06:07Well, that's a tough question to answer today.
1:06:11I often ask my name in Kissinger, and they're great.
1:06:16Maybe ten.
1:06:16But one of my favorites of the books in the century is
1:06:19Uh, T.S.
1:06:19Eliot, uh, notes, uh, towards the definition of technology.
1:06:21I don't see a yearbook about that.
1:06:22Yes.
1:06:22A yearbook that's about that.
1:06:23Yes, about that, yes.
1:06:24I'll have to talk about it with anybody else who's ever been to the Pentagon, I don't see anything.
1:06:32Right, right, right.
1:06:34You want to go back and speak to that, do you want to try to read all the dark sections, especially the other part of the culture?
1:06:39Yeah, I'll scan it.
1:06:40Tell them to go to the parts and see what they have, right?
1:06:43Well, good to see you.
1:06:45I wish you well.
1:06:47Tell me, did you say, is your wife here?
1:06:50Yes, she's helping me.
1:06:51I'm the employer.
1:06:52Oh, I'll have her come in and focus.
1:06:54She's been captain of the employer since 1960.
1:07:01Where is she also?
1:07:02Well she is in Chief of Mission also in Wisconsin.
1:07:06I'll call you when she's here.
1:07:08No, this is Kirk.
1:07:10Oh, this is Kirk.
1:07:12She's out in reception hall.
1:07:15Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
1:07:16All right.
1:07:19We'll get a couple of little trinkets here.
1:07:22We'll get a couple of trinkets.
1:07:25You're not a golfer.
1:07:25I'm not a golfer.
1:07:26Silly man.
1:07:27I just, you know, you've heard of him.
1:07:32So you're just here before the height of the season.
1:07:37What happens out here, you see these?
1:07:40And beyond that are flower and crown trees.
1:07:43They'll break out in about three days.
1:07:45It's terribly cold.
1:07:46It's been cold.
1:07:50And right beneath are tulips.
1:07:52This whole thing breaks out in tulips.
1:07:55Flower and crown.
1:07:59Something to see.
1:08:04President's here.
1:08:06Well, how are you?
1:08:06Nice to see you.
1:08:07Yes, very well.
1:08:10Yes, yes.
1:08:11If you want to take a picture of you, come on up here.
1:08:16Pretty girl here with the... Hi.
1:08:23Hi.
1:08:26Oh, listen.
1:08:27Listen, anybody with brains has got to have hair to turn around.
1:08:30I do a lot.
1:08:31And so I understand you are from New York?
1:08:35Yes, Long Island.
1:08:36We met on the street one day.
1:08:41I walked with you.
1:08:43Did you bring, let's see, for Mrs. Kirk a little compact and then an x-ray of those?
1:08:54That's all you got.
1:08:57I walked with you in 1960.
1:08:58I heard about it.
1:09:00In 1960?
1:09:00Yes, I was in college at the time.
1:09:02Where were you?
1:09:02I was at Deloitte College around the center.
1:09:06It's a small little Catholic college.
1:09:09And Russell was a specialty mentor in New York County.
1:09:12I was there, and so I was very active.
1:09:15Are you Catholic?
1:09:16Oh, yes, I'm Catholic.
1:09:17And Russell was a convert.
1:09:19Are you Catholic?
1:09:20Yes.
1:09:21Oh, I didn't know you were a Catholic.
1:09:22I wasn't when I wrote the book.
1:09:23You weren't at the time you wrote the book.
1:09:25No.
1:09:25Well, the Catholics have worked.
1:09:27I didn't know that.
1:09:30This is not just my story, but it's rather pleasant.
1:09:33It has a presidential seal, which you see in the card, which is the signature.
1:09:59We have children, too.
1:10:02We have three babies.
1:10:04Two-year-olds, three-and-a-half, four-and-a-half.
1:10:14Boys and girls.
1:10:15Girls and girls.
1:10:15Half of the church is girls.
1:10:17That's great.
1:10:17That's a good girl.
1:10:19That's a good girl.
1:10:23Children are appreciated.
1:10:26Well, we just...
1:10:30I was telling your husband that I had re-read his program for conservatives, and he said, you know, I pick up things now.
1:10:40Yeah, right.
1:10:41And how do you have time to read?
1:10:43Well, I don't very much.
1:10:45No, I sit in the evening, you know.
1:10:46Yes.
1:10:47And I don't look at television, unfortunately.
1:10:49That's very good.
1:10:50Except for Game Club.
1:10:51I'll go in and I'll have to.
1:10:53But it's a miserable thing.
1:10:54But, you know, you can sit and look at it.
1:10:57We know, did you tell me, Elliot?
1:10:59Yes, we talked about such things as kind of indulgence.
1:11:05Oh, yes.
1:11:05Elliot, I believe his statement in literature was to remind us of politics.
1:11:12I think that, in fact, as far as prose goes, I think it's actually probably better.
1:11:18No, I, well, in a sense, in a sense, yes.
1:11:20I proofread it.
1:11:21I used to teach English.
1:11:24I went there on a scholarship because it was free, and I went to St. John's.
1:11:33I do feel on the defensive about Columbia Teachers.
1:11:39I get an A in linguistics, which I didn't know what they were talking about.
1:11:51Oh, yeah.
1:11:52Oh, completely a waste of time.
1:11:54Oh, yeah.
1:11:55Completely.
1:11:55Yes.
1:11:55Right.
1:11:58Not a bad thing to do.
1:11:59I think you'll enjoy the Elliot.
1:12:01Oh, I will.
1:12:02I sure will.
1:12:02Someday I'll have an Oscar.
1:12:03Right.
1:12:03Right.
1:12:03Well, give the little girls my best.
1:12:05Yes, I will.
1:12:06Enjoy them when they grow up.
1:12:08Oh, yeah.
1:12:09Before they know it, there they are.
1:12:11Thank you very much.
1:12:12Thank you.
1:12:13Thank you very much.
1:12:14Thank you very much.
1:12:15I appreciate it.
1:12:16I was listening to that video about California.
1:12:21I'm going to keep the baby.
1:12:23Right.
1:12:25No surrender.
1:12:25Right.
1:12:31Sir, should I?
1:12:34No, I can't.
1:12:37No, he just came in to chat about it.
1:12:42He's got a new book.
1:12:45Oh, I, uh...
1:12:51I had a quote that I was asking.
1:12:54We talked about anything about the HP.
1:12:56I just don't think, well, I had to see.
1:12:59There was no question about it.
1:13:05Well, they took him.
1:13:09Man, what an out there.
1:13:10It was 4 or 8 o'clock.
1:13:13Boy, this is one time when we are ready for those bastards.
1:13:17We have got more.
1:13:19We need to do very, very well.
1:13:2181 of them, and so forth, just perched.
1:13:23And they just opened up.
1:13:23And they were stretched out.
1:13:24And see, that's a different from the air, I mean, the other area, because it's smaller.
1:13:29And then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then,
1:13:54A lot of people are getting the idea.
1:13:59Maybe we'll do something about it.
1:14:03Star Earth.
1:14:04Star Earth.
1:14:04Headless.
1:14:05Like Blitzkrieg.
1:14:06Blitzkrieg?
1:14:07Yeah.
1:14:11Yeah, I mean, ours is pending or theirs is coming out.
1:14:15Sure, but that's all right.
1:14:19Today, we finally, after three and a half years from the foreign policy thing, all water service leagues coming out of defense, coming out of state, coming out of here,
1:14:28focus on the massive invasion across the DMZ in violation of 54 and 68 understandings, conventional sophisticated weapons being used, supplied by the Soviet Union, different, you know, than previous .
1:14:44All right.
1:14:45Well, I'm going to start squealing.
1:16:05to tie it together, but I wouldn't say that because the convention costs more, we're going to go with that.
1:16:09I don't think it's IT&T.
1:16:11I think we should simply put it if we can, if we can stretch the point.
1:16:15I mean, not such a hell of a lot of it is that, isn't it?
1:16:17They can't get the convention costs such a time at any cost that we can afford.
1:16:52Henry just came in with a speaking request that I think he ought to accept, and that's Frank Stanton asked him to do the CBS station owners.
1:17:01Oh, yes.
1:17:01In California, 200.
1:17:03Yes, sir.
1:17:04Owners of all their affiliates, off the record or on any basis he wants.
1:17:08They're from California?
1:17:09No.
1:17:10They're from all over the country.
1:17:11It's every station, every CBS affiliate.
1:17:13How?
1:17:14To what extent does the CBS affiliate have the right to program?
1:17:18Well, they have their local news.
1:17:19They have a complete right to program it.
1:17:22They have the right to accept the network news.
1:17:25They all accept it.
1:17:26Yeah.
1:17:26But they have the right to put pressure on the network news.
1:17:29Plus the station affiliates, they run editorials now.
1:17:32All correct.
1:17:33And most of these affiliates are on our side.
1:17:35Most of these station affiliates are probably all correct.
1:17:38Damn right.
1:17:41But that's one I think he ought to do.
1:17:43I'm all for it.
1:17:48How did you...
1:17:52Mitchell seems to be feeling pretty good, doesn't he?
1:17:56He's feeling good.
1:17:57He's on top of, you know, what's going on.
1:18:02He's got his kind of strings in hand, and he has the feeling he's in the cycle.
1:18:06And he said to me, you know, I quit wasting so much time worrying about IT&T to get to winning an auction, which is a little more important.
1:18:16You know.
1:18:22No, I haven't been.
1:18:23He's in very good condition.
1:18:41And it's interesting, this time about the money thing.
1:18:43I talked about the concern on that whole thing.
1:18:46He said, Father, there's nothing you can do about it.
1:18:50You just gotta play this one cool.
1:18:53close to the vest, is what they say.
1:18:55We will, Congress has laid down what they expect to be done, and we will do it.
1:19:01We're going to be guided by that, period.
1:19:06And we're going to give a shit what John McGarvey wants to hear.
1:19:09If we have nothing to add, we'll do everything we can.
1:19:13He's not sure about that, so I may be wrong on that, but we may not be listening in 3D.
1:19:17I won't listen.
1:19:19Well, we may not be able to.
1:19:23Be careful of that.
1:19:24But the other thing they're doing is that we will not have this money on hand, so we won't have to report it.
1:19:32They're doing this prepaying, prepaying for their mailing stuff and all that kind of thing.
1:19:40They're prepaying the advertising group, which we own anyway, so that they'll have the money already out, and those people won't have to report it.
1:19:52So you get it out of the reporting area.
1:19:55So he, he, they've been working on this and all of those things.
1:19:59You know, I'm just anticipating what we, the questions we're going to have.
1:20:04Yep.
1:20:05How to handle it.
1:20:07I suppose that used to be an issue.
1:20:10What the hell?
1:20:10Well, it's not a question you should handle because you're on the, I'm not handling political stuff at all.
1:20:15Well, I'm not going to handle it.
1:20:16John said if the president's worried about it, tell the directors to release the names and we just won't get around to it.
1:20:22Blame it on us.
1:20:28That would take 200 hours.
1:20:28Nobody would buy that.
1:20:29No, I think if I get a question, I might get something to say about it.
1:20:42No, we've got to stay damn cool, sort of, about the battle.
1:20:46I think, in a sense, and I've been hit harder with some issues.
1:20:50But to be president here is the thing to do.
1:20:53And in one sense, let me say, well, it's, of course, not very dandy to go through.
1:20:58They never are.
1:20:59But having my kids around in Vietnam has its pluses as well as its minuses at this point.
1:21:06Do you see what I mean?
1:21:08Sure.
1:21:09Especially when you follow it out, it works.
1:21:10Well, it's got to work.
1:21:12It doesn't work.
1:21:14Oh, Henry, he sure is ecstatic.
1:21:16You know, ecstatic because he always likes the war.
1:21:20Yeah.
1:21:20The point is, we...
1:21:22He thinks we've got it all.
1:21:23But this convinces him that he's got a negotiation coming.
1:21:28Yeah.
1:21:29Well, he may have.
1:21:30I won't for the first time say so, but we've got to get a chance to bomb.
1:21:34Or...
1:21:36Or it could be a negotiation to suck up the peace.
1:21:39We can't do that.
1:21:40We cannot lose this war.
1:21:42We cannot lose this war.
1:21:44People can talk all they want.
1:21:45The United States will not have a viable foreign policy ever after this if they lose this war.
1:21:50No way.
1:21:50No way they can win.
1:21:51Nobody will believe us.
1:21:54Nobody will think we're strong enough.
1:21:55Nobody will be there with guts.
1:21:57Nothing.
1:21:57Nothing.
1:21:57Nothing.
1:21:58Nothing.
1:22:20I'll work on the Catholic education thing.
1:22:30John is trying to get a look at it, sending up a copy, maybe a copy.
1:22:35But I'll have him send it.
1:22:36Well, Senator says he's got a reworked copy.
1:22:38I would like to have a reworked copy, if I could, by, say,
1:22:46If I could have one of the people up tonight.
1:22:48Okay.
1:22:48I'll go over and I'll go over to the EOB and just drop over to the EOB.
1:22:51And if I could have a reviewer come, then I'll leave the apartment tonight.
1:23:01It's pretty much, it's pretty hard to say when you've got the report.
1:23:07Maybe that's all that we can say at this time.
1:23:08No, that's all Crowe feels he should say.
1:23:10Is that right?
1:23:11Yeah.
1:23:11Chuck's talked to Crowe about other, with him, he's...
1:23:17How long?
1:23:17Yeah.
1:25:22was pretty confident with me.
1:25:25Is he worried so much about that?
1:25:26He'd probably not be much.
1:25:30What do you think about it?
1:25:32We didn't even get into it.
1:27:54Good to see you.
1:27:55As it is now, have you informed Philadelphia?
1:27:58No.
1:27:58I want to be sure we've got it.
1:28:01I don't want to get another clap, but that's no problem.
1:28:04Well, sure.
1:28:04Tomorrow.
1:28:05I think we'll get a good reception up there.
1:28:11That's right.

NARA Description

On April 4, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, Alexander P. Butterfield, John N. Mitchell, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Manolo Sanchez, Charles Lucet, and White House photographer met in the Oval Office of the White House from 3:45 pm to 5:06 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 702-007 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 702-7

Date: April 4, 1972
Time: 3:45 pm - 5:06 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Henry A. Kissinger.

     Vietnam
          -Air srikes
                -Marine panes
                      -Maneuvers
                      -Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
                      -Quality
                      -Close air support
                           -Air Force
                      -Accuracy
                -Ceiling
          -North Vietnamese offensive
                -Troop withdrawals
                      -Impact
                      -Figures

                -Public relations
            -Cuts
      -US measures
            -Nelson A. Rockefeller
                  -Haiphong
                  -Support for blockade
      -Weather
            -Clearance
      -US measures
            -Haig
            -Proposals
                  -White House
                  -Gen. Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.
            -Personnel bombs
      -Air strikes
            -Targets
      -South Vietnamese strategy
            -News summary
            -Quang Tri
            -Retreat
                  -Value
                  -Russians, Germans, French
                  -[Napoleon, King of France]Napoleon [Bonaparte]
                       -Strategy
                       -Battle of the nations
                             -Cavalry
                       -Defeat of allies
                             -Austrians, Prussians, English
                       -Waterloo
                             -Mistakes
                  -Football
                  -Value
      -Counterattacks
            -B3 Area
            -Demilitarized Zone [DMZ]
            -Eighteenth parallel
      -William P. Rogers
            -Press conference
-State Department
-South Vietnam
      -Control of population
            -Amount
-Public opinion

     -Rockefeller's opinion
          -Support for the President
-North Vietnamese offensive
     -Stakes for US
          -Conduct of foreign policy
                 -Edmund S. Muskie's and George S. Mcgovern's charges
                 -Hubert H. Humphrey
          -Consequences of defeat
     -Countermeasures
          -Initiative from White House
          -Pentagon
                 -Inaction
                       -Tet offensive
                 -Surface to Air Missiles [SAMs]
                 -Sorties
                 -Air strikes
     -South Vietnam
          -Government
          -Problem areas
          -Joseph Alsop's comments about North Vietnamese Army
     -Countermeasures
          -Soviets
          -Haiphong
                 -Bombing
                       -Extent
                       -Docks
                       -Ships
                 -Mining
                       -Problems
          -Types
                 -Bombing
          -Eighteenth parallel
                 -Bombing in the North
-Soviets
     -Reconnaissance
     -Haiphong
          -Bombing
-North Vietnamese offensive
     -DMZ
          -Crossing violation
     -US response
          -Bombing in the North
          -Intensity

          -Haiphong
               -Docks
               -Domestic Reaction
               -People's Republic of China [PRC] and Soviet Union Reactions
               -Ships in harbor
               -Preparation for assault
                     -State Department
          -US measures
               -Spokesmen for the President
                     -Melvin R. Laird
                     -Rogers
                           -Announcements
                                -Bangladesh
     -Rogers
          -Retention in office
               -Timing

1972 campaign
     -Rogers
          -Role
     -Laird
          -Speeches

Vietnam
     -Rogers
          -Moscow summit
          -Trip to Europe
          -News reports
          -Moscow summit
                -Poland
     -North Vietnamese offensive
          -US responses
                -PRC and Soviet Union Reactions
          -Meeting in Paris
                -US refusal

US foreign policy
     -Kissinger's theoretical memoirs
          -Major decisions
                -Cambodia invasion
                -Nuclear war
                -April 1972 offensive
                      -Relation to election

                              -North Vietnam
                                   -Chou En-Lai's advice

    Vietnam
         -North Vietnamese offensive
              -B-52 strikes
                   -DMZ
                   -Orders
                   -Preparations
                         -SAMs
                   -Targets
                         -Vinh
                   -Opportunities
                   -Significance
              -US bombing
                   -Justification
                   -North Vietnamese mistakes
                         -Kontum
                   -DMZ
              -North Vietnamese intentions
                   -Alsop's analysis
                         -John Vann
                                -North Vietnamese demoralization

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 17s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2

*****************************************************************

    The President's National Catholic Educational Association [NCEA] speech
         -Quote
              -H[erbert] G. Wells
              -Educated elite
                     -Bellicosity

    Vietnam

           -Weather
                 -Clearance
           -Air strikes
                 -North of the DMZ
                 -Intensity
                 -Target areas
                 -Weather
                       -Report

Alexander P. Butterfield entered at an unknown time after 3:45 pm.

     The President's schedule

Butterfield left at an unknown time before 4:13 pm.

     Vietnam
          -Weather
                -Report
                      -Source
          -Abrams
                -Conversation with Adm.Thomas H. Moorer
                -Caution
                -Replacement
                -Health
          -Air strikes
                -Proposals
                      -Moorer
                      -Richard M. Helms
                           -Mining

John N. Mitchell and H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman entered at 4:13 pm.

     Greetings

     Kissinger's travels
          -Soviet Union
          -Mexico

     [David] Kenneth Rush

Butterfield entered at 4:13 pm.

     John D. Ehrlichman

             -Delivery of unknown article

Butterfield left at 4:13 pm.

     Laird
             -Rush
                  -David Packard

     Mitchell's schedule

Kissinger left at 4:13 pm.

             -International Telephone and Telegraph [ITT]
             -Key Biscayne
                   -Swimming Pool
                         -Charles G. (”Bebe”) Rebozo
                   -White House Staff
                   -Campaign
                   -Golf
                   -Fishing
                   -Boating
                   -Dinner

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 16s ]

Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 4:13 pm.

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 4:50 pm.

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5

*****************************************************************

     Vietnam
          -Weather

                -Bombing
                -Problems
                     -Air Force
                -World War II bombing runs
                     -Bad weather
                -Navy pilots
                -Favorable conditions
                -Bravery of pilots
                     -Prisoners of War [POWs]

     ITT case
          -1972 campaign
               -Disposal of case
               -Issue in election
               -Republican boycott of investigative committees
                     -Charge of harassment
               -Confusion of issue
                     -Newspaper reporting

Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 4:13 pm.

          -Mitchell

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 4:50 pm.

          -Vance Hartke

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 7
[Privacy]
[Duration: 5s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 7

*****************************************************************

               -Media representation
               -Conflicts with other Democrats
          -Susan Lichtman

     -Press conference
           -Location
                -Law office
                -Link to Democrats
                -News reports
-Harold S. Geneen

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 8
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 5m 35s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 8

*****************************************************************

                       -ITT case
                            -Admission of guilt

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 5m 14s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9

*****************************************************************

             -San Diego
                  -ITT contribution
                       -Amount
                             -Herman [first name or surname unknown]

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 19m 19s ]

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 4:13 pm.

Bull left at an unknown time before 4:50 pm.

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10

*****************************************************************

Charles Lucet and Kissinger entered at 4:50 pm. The White House photographer was present at
the beginning of the meeting.

     Greetings

     Ambassadors
         -Lucet's departure

Mitchell and Haldeman left at 4:50 pm.

     Photographs
          -Arrangements

     Ambassadors
         -Lucet
              -Stay in US
              -New post
                    -Italy
                           -Importance
                           -Number of political parties

     Italy
             -Proliferation of parties
                   -The President's 1969 trip
                   -Compared with France

                 -Constitution
                        -Gen. Charles A. J. M. DeGaulle
     -Current political issues
           -Need for a strong President
     -Manlio Brosio
     -Political Parties
     -Brosio
     -Giuseppe Saragat
     -Lucet's new position
     -Unknown Italian Prime Minister
     -Rome
           -Beauty

US-France relations
    -Assessment
          -Stabilization
    -De Gaulle
    -Georges J. R. Pompidou
          -Relations with US
    -De Gaulle
          -Meeting with the President in 1969
                -Intended trip to the US
          -Funeral
                -The President's attendance
                      -Cathedral
                      -Impressions
                -The President's trip to France

The President’s schedule
     -Trip to the People’s Republic of China [PRC]
     -Forthcoming trip to the Soviet Union

Vietnam
     -US actions

US foreign policy
     -Soviet trip
          -Opportunities for negotiations
          -Rogers’s trip
                 -Europe
          -Preparations
          -Rogers’s trip
                 -Brussels

           -Kissinger's trips
                -Japan
                -Rome
                      -Visit with Giovanni Battista Motini [Pope Paul VI]
           -US and French cooperation

     World War I
         -Sacrifices
               -France
               -Germany
               -Great Britain
         -Issues
               -Absence
               -Alsace-Lorraine
         -Guns Of August
         -Mobilization
               -Serbia
                     -Assassination of Archduke Francis Ferdinand
                          -Initial reactions
                     -Austrian ultimatums

     Ambassadors
         -Cooperation between Lucet and Graham Martin
              -Italy
                     -Current situation
                          -Lack of leadership
                          -Possible coup

     Presidential gifts
          -Ash trays
                -Presidential seal
          -Photographs

     The President’s forthcoming trip to the Soviet Union
          -Teheran
          -Europe
          -Rogers's trip
                -North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
          -Invitations to the President

Lucet and Kissinger left at 5:06 pm.

Also recorded on April 4, 1972

  • 702-001 2:47 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 2:47 pm and 2:55 pm.
  • 702-002 2:47 PM · 28 min — President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Ronald L. Ziegler, and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 2:47 pm and 3:11 pm.
  • 702-003 3:11 PM · 6 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander P. Butterfield met in the Oval Office of the White House from 3:11 pm to 3:12 pm.
  • 702-004 3:12 PM · 4 min — President Richard M. Nixon and John K. Andrews, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 3:12 pm and 3:45 pm.
  • 702-005 3:12 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 3:12 pm and 3:45 pm.
  • 702-006 3:12 PM · 14 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander P. Butterfield met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 3:12 pm and 3:45 pm.
  • 702-008 5:06 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 5:06 pm and 5:08 pm.
  • 702-009 5:08 PM · 52 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Russell A. Kirk, Alexander P. Butterfield, White House photographer, Manolo Sanchez, Stephen B. Bull, and Annette Kirk met in the Oval Office of the White House from 5:08 pm to 6:01 pm.

All 35 conversations from April 4, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 702-007, April 4, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/702-007 (accessed October 12, 2026).