{"conversationCode":"719-008","tapeNumber":719,"conversationNumber":8,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-719-008","startDateTime":"1972-05-04T14:22:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1972-05-04T14:31:00.000Z","startDate":"4-May-1972","startTime":"10:22 AM","endDate":"4-May-1972","endTime":"10:31 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\"); Butterfield, Alexander P.;","description":"On May 4, 1972, H. R. (\"Bob\") Haldeman and Alexander P. Butterfield met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:22 am to 10:31 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 719-008 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"OVAL","recordingDevice":"Oval Office","latitudeEstimated":38.8974,"longitudeEstimated":-77.0374,"chronCode":3,"chronRelease":"Third Chronological Release","chronReleaseDate":"28-Feb-2002","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 719-8\n\nDate: May 4, 1972\nTime: 10:22 am - 10:31 am\nLocation: Oval Office\n\nH. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman met with Alexander P. Butterfield.\n\n     Unknown woman's schedule\n\nThe President entered at an unknown time before 10:25 am.\n\nButterfield left at 10:25 am.\n\n     Vietnam\n          -Poll questions\n                -Prisoners of war [POWs]\n                      -Number\n                      -Length of imprisonment\n          -Naval blockade\n                -Imposition\n                -Conditions for cessation\n                      -Return of POWs\n                      -Ceasefire\n                      -Presentation of terms\n                      -Public support\n                -Results\n                -Soviet ships\n                      -Interception by US warships\n\n     Decision-making process\n          -Effect of press reports\n          -Charles W. Colson, John D. Ehrlichman, Haldeman\n          -Lyndon B. Johnson\n          -Ronald L. Ziegler\n\n                                         (rev. Jan-02)\n\n           -Ehrlichman\n           -Richard G. Kleindienst\n\n     Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI]\n          -L[ouis] Patrick Gray, III\n               -Nomination as director\n                     -Announcement\n                           -Problems\n               -Confirmation\n                     -Political associations\n               -Temporary appointment\n                     -Conditions\n               -Permanent appointment\n                     -Ziegler's announcement\n\n     J. Edgar Hoover funeral\n          -Lighting\n               -Television coverage\n\nHaldeman left at 10:31 am.","filename":["719a.mp3","719b.mp3"],"tapeStart":"01:41:25","tapeEnd":"01:49:42","participantsList":["Haldeman, H. R. (\"Bob\")","Butterfield, Alexander P."],"prevCode":"719-007","nextCode":"719-009","tapeTranscriptFile":"719a.mp3,719b.mp3","transcript":[{"start":6168.75,"end":6169.45,"text":"We'll be right back."},{"start":6213.05,"end":6217.49,"text":"It doesn't make any difference how the poll comes out in about years."},{"start":6217.71,"end":6218.75,"text":"But you'd know what's right or bad."},{"start":6218.79,"end":6221.99,"text":"You'd know how hard it's selling and how much you have to sell."},{"start":6223.15,"end":6227.75,"text":"Probably the polling, I think, on the Fed is they will say, the answer will be you've got 75% yes."},{"start":6227.77,"end":6231.94,"text":"I don't think so."},{"start":6232.03,"end":6238.8,"text":"You'll see the danger, light bulb, light bulb."},{"start":6238.84,"end":6242.24,"text":"Even though this would mean stopping, even though this"},{"start":6248.41,"end":6248.61,"text":"Arms."},{"start":6249.65,"end":6250.04,"text":"Good luck."},{"start":6277.77,"end":6280.02,"text":"The boy's gone, you know."},{"start":6280.04,"end":6281.16,"text":"The boy's a friend."},{"start":6281.18,"end":6281.6,"text":"Quite a nice fellow."},{"start":6308.4,"end":6312.44,"text":"You know something?"},{"start":6312.54,"end":6326.45,"text":"Everybody who's in government, particularly anybody in this office, is out of his mind, particularly when he has a major, has major decisions to make."},{"start":6326.47,"end":6335.57,"text":"Ever to get involved in the fifth squeak, shit ass, comms, the weekly or the news last night, who did this to why, what's that thing?"},{"start":6336.54,"end":6345.23,"text":"Provided, Robin, this is the real condition, and folks like you, Colson, and Hurley are acting just like I would act if I were in."},{"start":6345.45,"end":6347.85,"text":"You've got to know the answer to the question."},{"start":6347.91,"end":6349.62,"text":"You've got to stay out of it."},{"start":6349.66,"end":6350.24,"text":"I'm sorry."},{"start":6360.5,"end":6363.48,"text":"He would have been worried about how Sigler handled it."},{"start":6363.54,"end":6365.97,"text":"The announcement there, I said, all right, it's done."},{"start":6365.98,"end":6369.79,"text":"He could have grown up mad and could have eaten common."},{"start":6369.91,"end":6373.93,"text":"I mean, he had grown up and all the rest of us both worked it out in the plantation."},{"start":6375.09,"end":6376.69,"text":"The work of mine didn't come too bad."},{"start":6377.45,"end":6382.76,"text":"Of course, okay, it didn't come out the way it should have, but it was a trouble that isn't going to do any harm."},{"start":6384.48,"end":6386.36,"text":"We didn't make a strong enough case for Gray."},{"start":6387.42,"end":6388.26,"text":"We'd still do that."},{"start":6389.82,"end":6390.54,"text":"of disqualification."},{"start":6390.6,"end":6390.7,"text":"Yeah."},{"start":6392.86,"end":6395.28,"text":"There's no problem on the acting director thing."},{"start":6395.39,"end":6401.21,"text":"I don't think we're going to have as much problem as I thought we were."},{"start":6401.25,"end":6412.43,"text":"You know, they'll start to plot that for the first time that you've got a political associate in the president's running bureau, which is a dangerous thing."},{"start":6430.85,"end":6432.83,"text":"And the point is, he's taking the point temporarily."},{"start":6434.23,"end":6438.47,"text":"You and I both know he's considering permanently if the thing worked out."},{"start":6438.49,"end":6444.87,"text":"But that's up to how he builds himself in that drive, how he gets along, how he handles it, where he engages."},{"start":6444.97,"end":6451.79,"text":"I don't think you can do him permanently unless by that time, his general feeling is that he should be quite much right there."},{"start":6451.85,"end":6453.29,"text":"You know, he's a pressure to the left guys."},{"start":6453.31,"end":6456.17,"text":"You know, we know they'd be able to say that all that decision."},{"start":6458.57,"end":6460.09,"text":"a number of people under consideration."},{"start":6460.67,"end":6462.17,"text":"You know what I mean?"},{"start":6462.27,"end":6463.05,"text":"That's what Ron said."},{"start":6463.89,"end":6466.15,"text":"He said, well, does he want it permanently after the election?"},{"start":6466.17,"end":6468.61,"text":"Ron said, not necessarily, but it is in the rule of law."},{"start":6468.67,"end":6473.22,"text":"You should say one of those would be considered."},{"start":6473.3,"end":6474.86,"text":"One of them would be considered."},{"start":6475.62,"end":6476.36,"text":"There are others as well."},{"start":6476.38,"end":6480.7,"text":"The very important one is one of the best families in the country."},{"start":6519.69,"end":6521.07,"text":"I don't know whether they got a light over there or not."},{"start":6521.09,"end":6524.45,"text":"I think we should take it off."},{"start":6524.49,"end":6527.17,"text":"I think you better take it off."},{"start":6527.23,"end":6528.68,"text":"They said they checked it out."},{"start":6528.81,"end":6530,"text":"They worked on it."},{"start":6530.24,"end":6530.56,"text":"I agree."},{"start":6530.58,"end":6530.76,"text":"I agree."},{"start":6530.8,"end":6533.4,"text":"I agree pretty well."},{"start":6533.74,"end":6537.64,"text":"I've been seeing this light under television."},{"start":6571.45,"end":6574.41,"text":"America's pride has always been its people."},{"start":6574.43,"end":6577.17,"text":"People of good men and women, men and demons."},{"start":6577.19,"end":6580.53,"text":"Of great men and women in remarkable numbers."},{"start":6580.55,"end":6581.15,"text":"And once in all, why?"},{"start":6581.19,"end":6581.62,"text":"Of giants who stand head and shoulders above their country, setting a high and noble standard for us all."}],"transcriptBoundary":{"start":6089.375,"end":6581.625,"startMethod":"silence","endMethod":"silence"},"transcriptConfidence":"high","transcriptSource":"bigtape","aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon, H. R. Haldeman, and Alexander Butterfield discuss the administration's strategic response to the Vietnam War, focusing on public support for a naval blockade and the conditions for a potential ceasefire. The participants deliberate on the political optics of nominating L. Patrick Gray III as FBI director, weighing the risks of appointing a political associate versus an independent candidate. Additionally, they address logistical preparations for J. Edgar Hoover’s upcoming funeral, specifically concerns regarding lighting for television coverage.","topics":["Vietnam War","Naval blockade","POWs","L. Patrick Gray III","FBI","J. Edgar Hoover","Public opinion polling"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-07T03:14:07.138Z"},"topicSlugs":["vietnam-war","naval-blockade","pows","l-patrick-gray-iii","fbi","j-edgar-hoover","public-opinion-polling"],"audioDurationSec":497,"audioFiles":[{"file":"719a.mp3","bytes":175539721,"durationSec":7314.1,"bitrate":192001,"missing":false},{"file":"719b.mp3","bytes":162858630,"durationSec":6785.7,"bitrate":192002,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":true,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:19:57.687Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/719a.mp3","https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/719b.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/719-008","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/719/conversation-719-008","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}