On May 15, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, Stephen B. Bull, John B. Connally, and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 2:25 pm and 3:32 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 724-002 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
He's a rat.
A rat.
You know, he said, I see things very well.
It's the same.
The press has done all this.
None of it is true.
Nobody knows better than him.
He's quite a deliberative man.
And in Canada, I didn't know the name of Canada.
I didn't realize what he said.
He's a candidate.
He said it.
He said it.
What did he say?
So they talked to Turner, who was a Canadian minister or something like that.
I'll have some consomme.
I'd love some coffee.
I'd love a little cold.
I haven't had much tonight.
Yeah, I do, and I had mine this morning.
But anyway, the point is, he said that it was his mistake, and I said, here, this one can't be.
I'm trying to figure out what impression it was that he had recently.
What a goddamned thing.
I mean, these, of course, have Canadian governments, a bunch of liberals who have been screwing us for years.
That's right.
What the hell?
In our case, it's the thing, one, that acts as if it isn't great, that we're trying to get along with the God that we need.
It's not wonderful.
What a hell of a thing to say.
You know, I don't know.
I swear to God, he's really got that idea behind him, trying to mutter up these bastards.
But he's – I don't know where – Well, there's no question.
I think the man's – he's an ego maniac, this president.
He hasn't changed a damn bit.
Now, what he's done is created your initiatives in the International Monetary Review, and he's made our negotiations infinitely more difficult.
Yeah.
And he's – and all that work – I look forward to sending these people to the United States.
But that's a hell of a thing to have to say.
That's a gas table on your own chair in the Federal Reserve System.
But he said, the truth of the matter is, he doesn't say much in his ten points, but he said it all out in ten points.
And you remember in the paper that I was preaching, he had ten points on the domestic issue.
Well, to my point, the reason that it burns my table is that we haven't talked about it how many times sitting in this room.
I said, please, for Christ's sake, stop it.
Well, I've got an independent position.
That's right.
Oh, goddamn him.
He's got an independent position.
That's what it's going to be.
And I don't have any problem unless we need him for the monetary thing.
But I hear that some people think he's going to sit down.
Well, he's got to go to the monetary thing.
And so he's got so good money.
Did you decide whether or not you wanted to pay a price for Bremer?
No, I said, you know, I have a January.
Bremer also is a looser money man.
I trust him.
I trust him.
Okay.
So I don't, I wouldn't give him a gun.
He just has a master ship that you really want to give him.
No one else wants you.
We can make him.
Well, you can't.
There's nobody who's black.
That's what I saw.
But on the other hand, it really isn't working.
Just like right now.
I didn't need to look at that one.
I didn't need to look at that one.
But you've got the impersonaries looking to fit down under control there.
No, I'm not sure of that.
But I'll say this.
He has to work it.
And as soon as you get this new fellow, Jim Butcher, in there, he'll have to work more.
He's our guy.
Jim Cutter from California.
Thank you.
Well, so...
He's a good, strong person.
I think he is.
And I think they should get him off real well.
Arthur just wants to preempt.
He's done it now.
So he'll have it on the record.
And he planted this story because the press immediately picked up this was his paradigm speech on the international front.
You see, you remember?
about the neighbor, or basically the triples.
And a lot of them, well, he lived, this had lasted two years around here, you remember?
And now he's made one in the International Department.
It doesn't say a lot, and much of it I can agree with.
But the point is, he states in such a way, and handled it in such a way, and he's smart as hell with the press, that it came out of the fact that it was made out of a program.
is particularly smart with the kind of precedent that we're in.
That's right.
There's a hell of a lot of Jews now.
And I, yes, I'll tell you this, I just think you ought to be very careful about how many more you put.
And I'm sure you just like that.
The next time I really need to, I really want to be careful.
Brother Lamar, I'm out of here.
to get a check to see whether he was a Jew or not.
He says he isn't.
I said, Gary, who is Malakoff?
I said, Benang, is he a Jew?
He said, Gary, Benang is a Jew too.
Anyway, he's not a Jew.
But I said, now look here, we've got to eat.
I said, you have to go through the whole, got all what we call Schedule C and above jobs.
And I want the whole damn list.
I said, one thing, I said, I only want, I only want 2% of those Jews, because there are only 2% of the people in this country are Jews.
Of course.
feels as strongly about it as you and I did.
I said, well, of course, you know, there are a lot more of them that are really qualified because they're college grads.
I said, all right, 10%.
But I said, I don't want 30%.
I don't want 40%.
We are not going to have them.
And I said, as far as new appointments are concerned, just go to places where they aren't in school.
In other words, you've got to go to the Midwest.
You've got to go to the South, because there are areas like that.
So I said, I don't want anybody from Harvard.
I don't want anybody from Yale.
I don't want anybody from Princeton or Columbia until we get them.
So they're getting more balanced.
And he said, well, I think you have to have that.
We've got to .
I said, we've got to.
So he said, we're going to have to realize
And I said, I want to look over the whole list.
I don't care how many.
I said, even if we put them on.
I said, we hired some guys, too.
And I said, if we make mistakes, by God, we're going to change them now.
So it's going to be done.
That's why they make mistakes.
And that's the truth.
Some of these fellas change, you know, once they get in.
They're attitude changes.
They become, they even, they become something different from what they were.
Oh, you never gave me that.
Oh, well, sure.
You never know when it gets here.
What's going to happen to it in Washington?
I've seen one.
I use my example of Potter Stewart.
Here's a guy who was on summer.
Basically not bad.
Nice fall out here now.
And it happens to a great many people when they come to Washington.
There are good people in Iowa or Texas or California, but they come here and get
They get captured by this environment.
These luncheon, two-hour luncheon, it also happens.
The embassy crowd.
The embassy crowd.
They're all the same job.
They're all the same.
It's the same battle.
The new veterans parties, how odd is that they're the same person?
Well, of course, you can't be the same.
You're always the same.
This is this.
This is that.
This is that.
You know that.
God damn it.
It does...
the same business group, the same lawyers, the same bunch.
They all signed each other's ass.
Of course, another thing here takes me very far.
This is where we started.
I didn't go to Montreal.
I didn't go for several weeks.
I canceled Montreal because I thought I was going to South America.
But I didn't want to go to South America for just two days.
I wanted to go to Chicago.
spent 10 days to make the .
But here's what we had in Montreal.
Now, keep in mind that this was a meeting of 100 banks.
50 in the United States, 50 in the rest of the world, private teams, no government sponsorship at all.
It's 100 buyers.
And we had all over, 100 secretaries of trade, North America, the government of America, we had the chairman of the Fed, we had Governor Dewey Daniels, another member of the Fed, we had Herb Stein, the chairman of the Council of Economic Advisors,
Uh, we had Peter Flanagan, the chief of average registry, the council of international economic policy.
Uh, we had Arthur Burns, the chairman of the Fed.
I think we had six or seven of the top people in government.
And it's ridiculous.
They all go up there.
Everybody wants to say something different.
Everybody wants to make news.
Everybody in the government.
And it's a self-defeating thing.
But we just do that and go to the business council.
And nothing ever comes out of that, the business council.
Thank God.
I cut people to cut them out.
The business council, as you know, doesn't get involved in that.
We're down the campus up and low because I didn't go and so forth and so on.
And I can't go to call them and talk about it.
It's time that the business council came and said what they were going to do for us, rather than me, rather than when I go and say what we can do for you.
She says, God damn them.
Who stood up for business?
Who the hell was fault of their battles?
Those bastards.
He says, nothing good there.
And they haven't said one damn word in their own defense.
Yeah, not only in their own defense, but let's take them on an issue about Vietnam.
You see them up, sending wires, coming in here like the labor guys.
You see the head of the business council saying what George Meany said.
Now, Meany is a son of a bitch, but Meany's a patriot.
Now, what the Christ is the matter with those guys, John?
Will you tell me?
They got no guts.
I tell you what's wrong with them.
That's right.
are some exceptions.
The first one is the selfish.
Selfish don't think about it.
He doesn't look at himself.
They're winners.
That's right.
And they're winners.
And also they're very established in the types, you know.
The business council is black.
Ha, ha, ha.
All that bull.
Ah, they don't send me to them.
Well, we don't send one or two people.
Oh, we sure send a secretary of Congress.
That's fine.
And then somebody else is a speaker this time.
Rock is one of them.
Well, everybody, my God, I mentioned to you the other day, to all our people out there, probably 15 of us last year, is that everybody got with them.
Because some of the people that ought to be, frankly, kissing us and that, they ought to crawl out on their hands and knees, because you've been there, so I can also do.
When you stop to think, John, of what?
Hubert Humphrey would do to them, and worse, what McDonough would do to them, and even worse, what Kennedy would do to them.
You know what he would do to these bastards?
They know.
Don't they know, too?
Oh, boy.
No, I'm not a bit bitter about it, but I'm very sanguine about it.
I'm not going to go down there.
I told them.
I said, well, the business council's fine, but I've got a hell of a lot of people I've got to see, and I'm going to see them.
You know?
So we take care of it.
The other day, at the time, they consumed what people had discovered.
It's incredible.
Individually, they bought individually.
They had four or five units a year.
They have to come in and buy a shoe.
They want to come in individually and all the rest.
And they're supposed to be the hot shots of it.
So most of them couldn't shine the shoes.
A lot of guys, I don't know, in the business across the country.
You know, I was thinking of some of the stalwarts that I know.
We're not a religious council.
taking a very old man on our boats.
He's now old.
He's 87 years of age and all that sort of thing.
But Jesus Christ, he's made three fortunes in his solace.
And in terms of character, he's got more than any one of those assholes who have in their old body.
He has this little thing.
You remember Bob Abel?
That nice, honest-looking guy.
Bob Abel is the only person on your video.
That's worth more than almost any member of the business council.
Because business council are managers.
They're not owners.
That's right.
But they don't think about that almost quite as much, because you know, a lot of clubs are out in the belly of that house.
You know, he comes from Yonkers, that's right.
He's got a specialty like that in the West.
Well, of course, because he's real.
He's right.
And I would say, look, that's my kind of man.
I love that.
Another one's old John O'Keefe.
You know John O'Keefe?
I know the Irishman, you know, who contributed a million dollars in 19 years.
No, they don't like John Mulcahy.
John Mulcahy is just a fellow that said, all he's got is $50 million in cash, just cash.
I mean, then he can have it invested.
And that's why he gives so much.
He doesn't want to die with that money.
Now, how many of those guys have come in?
If you go over to Annapolis and ask how much they've contributed to our R68 campaign for this time, I'll bet you it wouldn't add up to $500,000.
Really?
Much better.
We're lucky you got up to $150,000.
There may be 5 or 10 guys.
That's right.
If at all.
If at all.
If at all.
That's correct.
And 5 or 10 is much these days.
But anyway, it's a CR committee.
Is he going to do what he was?
But he hasn't gone in years, you know.
And his reaction is the same as ours.
He knows he's going to pick him up.
Well, CR says it's like an old shoe.
That's right.
Right.
It used to be.
I hope he hadn't changed.
He hadn't changed one hour.
And he said, of course, I don't know what that is.
But he promised me.
It's good to know.
It's good to know.
He said, I want to hear you guys.
Bridge, bum, tea at this time, sit around and discuss things in the world about this and that and the other thing.
But I'll never forget that they didn't come around after November 3rd.
They didn't come around after Cambodia.
And the students were riding around here on three different occasions.
I had never had a word for only one of the classes.
I remember .
that there's many things on it.
Don Kendall just joined them.
And of course, he's messing around.
He's got a new wife.
She loves social stuff.
But generally speaking, it isn't their bad view.
No.
But they've got no guts.
That's right.
They're not going to do it.
You know, I'm just looking and thinking.
I don't know whether this is totally incorrect.
As you know, we have a large, wide male reception system.
Boy, they're the heart of America, and they're going to be a hell of a kid in April.
But I have a crew.
They came in and said, what are you going to do with VIP?
I said, I have a crew.
The only business councilman I saw was Russ Leon, who was from Africa.
That's common, huh?
We sent out 50 wires to the business council.
They were condemned on it.
We were saving, we're really saving the honor of this country.
And they know how hard a decision it was.
They think that's beneath them.
to send you a wire on an issue like this.
They think this is the act of an unsophisticated, emotional type of plebeian American.
This is not the act of a sophisticated intelligence business.
They think that they're going to pressure you, that they ought to be able to come in and advise you.
I see.
Now, that's exactly right.
I'll talk to you.
Yeah, that guy was going to tell me about how to deal with the Russians today.
I think that's what I'm going to do.
He does it most of the time.
Yeah.
But what I meant is, he doesn't know.
None of them know.
They all say, oh, Jesus, they've got all this trade.
I'm going to give them this now.
And they don't realize it.
Who knows better than I do?
I sit on a penis all the time.
And I say...
I said, what do they want?
They want X and Y curves.
because they haven't got anything to sell us.
So they want long-term care to start to buy the brain that they need because a third of their crops have been wiped out.
This is the reason.
A third of their crops have been wiped out by COVID.
Second, they want paper nation treatment, which I wrote to Congress for.
I said, now, they didn't want these things.
And I say in return for that, that by 1965, Peterson had written this, that their trade with the United States could equal as much as $1 billion.
Now, that's a hell of a big thing.
$100 billion in trade for a trillion-dollar economy.
I said to somebody here, I said, now, isn't that a hell of a big thing?
You know, this economy's going to grow by $100 billion in one year.
So $1 billion worth of trade with the Soviets, is it all that big?
I said, that's what's in it for us.
What's in it for them?
The things they want.
Computers.
I mean, some great things.
I said, that's all fine.
We're glad it happened.
But the main thing is,
We're not going to give them a goddamn thing unless we get some political trouble.
See, they want our trade, so they're going to pay.
And they just don't understand that.
Of course they do.
They understand.
But you don't give it away.
Those business guys don't understand.
Well, no, of course they won't.
They want you to give them something, so they think they can get something.
Don Kendall wants to sell Pepsi-Cola.
They've got to go to Iraq.
That's right.
And a bunch of others around here have been dying to see you.
And they're all good friends of mine.
And the Texas Easter drive, because they've been over the Russians.
So there's a well, and gags, and so forth.
Well, that's fine.
It may come.
George Kirby.
George Kirby.
It may come.
But I didn't know what he was saying.
No, no.
Because they heard I'm telling you that because they've got a co-seeker.
They want to come tell you what a co-seeker is.
You know what I'm saying.
You know what I'm saying.
John, we know what we're seeing, has said that not only him, but every other body person is talking.
We know it's back there.
Tomorrow night, we know what the Soviet needs from us, and what we need from them.
We're going to make a straight deal.
We don't give it for nothing.
That's all.
And the Prime Minister said, okay, how do you do the running world pressure?
The news, you know your problems, you're still on them.
Well, it looks to me like your guests have had any indication of cancer.
It's too late for them now.
I think they used to.
If they do, they get cancer.
We just went through them.
Tomorrow, we're announcing Christmas at their, at their, you know, their approval, you know, right?
We announced that our recorders are going to go there tonight to have it canceled.
They've already, they've sent us over, in the last few days, they've finally agreed on statement principles.
We have some, we have another understanding that they've agreed on.
Uh, they, uh, there was a provocation yesterday about what gifts they want to exchange.
They want to do hydrofoil, which they're making.
I don't know what that is.
What the president wants to do.
The president wants to divide the cars.
We're trying to work out a Cadillac for him.
So they're going to go forward.
They're going to go forward.
And so all of these doom-criers, World War III-ers, and Turkey, and the foreign policy, and all that, are in doubt.
I think they're coming through.
Now, it's still a blow, but I don't think so.
But you've done it.
I don't know if it's worth it.
I was pretty well prepared to take that heat.
But I don't know that right now, what's happened is that it's hard to realize that we do the best that we can.
Now, as far as Vietnam is concerned, as you know, we've had a couple of good days even on the battlefield.
The reason is that the morale that I feel for the moment has changed.
You know, we talked about how it had an enormous impact on morale of our 60,000, morale of those guys who were just in with that.
It's also had a great impact on these, these down the floor where they keep withdrawing horses and the rest.
They don't know what the hell's gonna happen.
But when we put it this way, they, well, many of them survived.
So those two actions, the one where they, the landing behind the lines and then coming back through another area, retaking the fire base, that's strong, which they did not lose.
You know, that's the way these things go.
But, uh, the, uh, we've been running 1,100 sorties a day.
There it is, this announcement.
1,190.
It's just been unmerciful reporting to these bastards.
That's great.
And it's just COVID.
And finally, we noticed about that Red River Bridge, which they never knocked down in five years of bombing.
They never knocked that dam down.
At least we put it out of commission every three months.
And again, several more oil depots.
Oh, I don't think there's more to get.
going on and we used all these people that said, well, like, some said, will it work?
No.
But the others just said, well, it won't work because the CIA said it wouldn't in 68.
It's all again and again.
In 68, the Shino Bill in Cambodia was opened.
It punished 90% of the oil for third and fourth part.
That's closed now as a result of what they did in Cambodia.
Second, in 68, the ports were open.
Anybody could close them.
Now they're totally closed.
So, and third, in 68, they were operating a war not based on mechanization.
Now they need oil.
They need, they need rolling stock in order to, rather than the guerrilla type of war, this sort of thing.
Where are they going to get it?
They've got to bring it in across those railroads.
The Russians have got to ship it through China, across those railroads.
And all we have to do is to keep those railroads out of condition.
My God, we won't keep them out of condition.
With 200 sorties a day for F-4s that go into the Air Force.
Who knows?
My God.
It's unbelievable.
So no, they are going to have a new kind of bomb, apparently, and the rest.
So not to be too sanguine about it, because part of the community is going to go to Moscow and try to hack it.
But I think, John, what has happened is that we've taken a very big risk, a necessary risk.
But by going to the jugular, we finally are going to precipitate this out of this thing.
But it's going to come, I can't say.
We believe, basically, that it will not come in the summer, but be that as it may,
That's their choice.
If it doesn't come in the summer, I mean August.
But if it doesn't come until August, we are going to tom the hill on them so that when they do settle, finally, they haven't got much left to start another offensive for two years.
By that time, it's South Vietnam, East Canada, they never named another.
I don't like to honor the Russians very well,
healthy after the summit, really healthy.
But I don't think I'm going to get credit for the summit meeting.
First of all, they were really healthy.
But if the North Vietnamese come to the peace table in regal terms after the summit, then the Russians can always claim they did it.
In the world opinion, there's probably a little bit of time left.
And I'm not any expert on Russia, but that would just be my analysis.
So I think you're right.
Well, it's, uh, you know, the Russians, we've been, since we last started, we've had two communications twice a day from, from Russia.
So if they're going to knock it off, they're going to almost, you know, you can't, you know what I mean?
They're, uh, they're very, they just can't, because at this point, uh, they have to leave a lot of this much of it and why they can't.
Oh, that's great.
And, uh, but let's say we, uh, have a little bit of both here at this
continuing the attacks, or continuing the pressure, or continuing the bombing of the north.
So one of the most silly, common, old stories is this one.
Some person, not in the state, but a sociopath, did the effect that we could turn off these mines while I was there.
Of course, the point is, it can't be done.
You can't turn them off.
So, you know, and of course that's a sign of weakness, and of course I can't get you to tell me.
The brain says, don't believe that.
We can't turn him off.
We could.
We wouldn't.
We're not going to.
And that's all.
We don't have any more trouble with bureaucracy than that, right?
I don't know if that's what it is, but I think it's...
I think one thing that is kind of extremely encouraging this Monday, I think far better than the media ever expected was the public support.
You know, the polls and everything, you know, we've got, including Harrisburg, we've got it all.
Even Harris did it, person to person.
He said, of those who had an opinion, 68% favored.
And of all people, if you're even including the no opinions, 59 to 24, that's over two and a half to one.
That's correct.
That's a, what the hell is that?
And all over the country, if you go around, it's just, it's fine.
What's wrong is the part of the strategy.
You were very compassionate.
Well, I talked to John again, too, when I was at Pennsylvania over the weekend.
He said, very nice.
And he said, everybody up there.
He said, boy, that's great.
Boy, that's great.
He said, every man, you know, just.
And it's just, well, it's very wild.
It's risky.
When I say risky, it really is.
The thing that, you know, that meeting we had together on that day a week ago, the thing that almost everybody who opposes or does not support strong action,
refuses to do is to look at the alternative that you don't have.
Now, if we didn't have her, we would be dead.
UAE would have been falling.
We would be evacuating Americans from the Nang.
And I don't go to the goddamn summit.
That's right.
That's correct.
That's right.
So you see, the way I saw the summit was down to two meters.
I mean, you could assume it was worse.
So, yeah.
Oh, that's right.
And we still have a few days, you know, to see these demonstrators and this and that.
But the hell with it.
They're not going to hurt you, though.
They'll relax you a little bit, you know.
You know, and they've been so stupid.
They had these senators up here, both 29th and 14th at the Democratic College, condemned the fact of your action.
But they didn't have to do that.
They should have known that in 90 days, you're going to know one way or the other.
Then they can blame you.
As a man.
Yeah, now they put themselves on the record.
It's a problem.
Without knowing what the outcome is, you didn't have any way of expecting to have any election.
You should have waited in the most according.
But that's how stupid they are.
They can't.
Well, they act like they're just dying to get out and take the position.
Well, also, they're dying to get out and kill the rest of them.
That's right.
I mean, that goes a bit far, doesn't it?
God, my name is just unbelievable.
And they had all these arrangements raised by the 14th.
But they told me, oh, yeah, I got it.
It's a good 14.
It's a good 14.
But they wouldn't do it.
Yeah.
Well, anyway, let me go a couple of things.
I thought what we would do today is the night at C. Schultz at 3.30.
Good.
I hope you first.
Coffee, please.
Okay.
I'm just going to tell it.
It's going to be quite a shot.
The way I see it, when did you come?
December 15th.
That's when you announced it.
You announced it, I believe, December 14th.
I actually was sworn in on February 11th.
Yeah, but you were right.
I was born on December.
That's right.
I was saved on December 14th.
You came for a year.
And this is just thinking out loud.
And this is when I felt like the second one out of it.
that, uh, that I, uh, that, uh, that I, that I obtained.
He agreed to stay, and I requested an order.
I agreed to stay another six months.
You know, that period is up.
This is now negative.
You see, that's what we did for the rest of the 18 months.
And we did, uh, and I got a self-serve, but we had talked to him over, and I agreed that he was the best man for the job, and I agreed to take him.
And after I get ready to get through with him, I couldn't get by him.
I'll say, I need to look over and pray and talk to the child.
You know, take the wage, get the devices, and I'm going to carry on some of this for my family.
And I don't know what they call the mechanics of it.
How will it work?
I mean, is it, does he, I will nominate him.
I mean, we'll nominate him tomorrow.
Yes, right.
There was actually, Bob and I talked about this.
I'm not sure you can name him.
I said, we just have not talked to anybody.
I'm not sure you can name him, actually, when he's not in the department.
I see.
You may have to nominate him.
Then tomorrow afternoon, we can chat and see whether or not you can name him after you.
I see.
But we ought not to cover that.
You ought not to name him after you.
I just want to nominate him, yeah.
You stand by what you will agree to.
Well, he is confirmed, if you want me to.
Because he didn't confirm.
Well, I think he confirmed very quickly.
And, uh...
All right, say you want to name somebody else.
Actually, if you can't name him, that's fine, too.
I'll say.
Oh, I don't want to have somebody else.
No.
Well, I don't want to put him to vote or everybody else to.
But I think if you could stay until he's confirmed, probably.
Also, we need that for transition purposes.
We really need it, I think.
It's a hell of a big job.
And I just don't think he ought to say no.
You walk out of Georgia.
You see, the thing I'm concerned about is the effect on them.
business community and conference and so forth.
It's going to be quite a blow to that.
You know, they, they, they, George is a, a lot of them, I'm sure, is a, a liberal and economist and all that.
And he won't have the confidence.
Now, we don't, you and I, but he's a market-free trader and, I mean, a free advisor to them and an art trader to these people.
And they've got to learn to know him.
That's what that's all about.
That's right.
You know, I had a hell of a lot of that respect by talking to people around.
And I will.
I had nothing to do with it.
I think we just get it out the way that it's not going to be like it's been.
Two weeks I was there to get back from Russia.
Russia, I would say, you know, I'm not waiting in particular.
I'm not in that big of a hurry.
Why don't you just make an announcement?
You're going to stay right there.
I'm not going to do anything for two or three months.
I'm going to wait at both conventions.
I'm not going to do anything.
I'm going to take some time off.
And we may, when we do get it for you, we may travel a little bit.
We may not.
Maybe we're going to go to the ranch.
I'm trying to get my personal bearers in some kind of shape.
But we may go to Europe for a couple weeks.
But we really need to make it happen.
See, we've got this new law on how it's on your desk, or on Charlotte, if you want, creating these additional positions.
Of course, I haven't done a thing.
Not the only thing.
So George takes over.
He made these decisions.
about who he wants to do the first shots.
And there are things that come along, and I believe that the movie is going to be a very good one, with George in the background, in Bunch to Furnish, with his relationship with Kev.
he's going to be able to blend treasury and budget to a remarkable degree during the fall when you're planning to sell your whole budget and what you're going to need.
as much help as you can possibly get of that type to really squeeze this whole budget.
And I've been working on it a little bit.
We haven't done transitions in a long time.
I think what you say about it will be very critical in this respect.
It was a perfect call.
I couldn't reassure.
You know, there were some people that mattered around the country that were not also in that connection.
In fact, it occurred to me that there's a very good, good personal connection.
And also, there's, there's, there's, you know, there's a few different problems.
Well, I think it felt like even, which would, in my heart, encourage you, like I believe Graham, to be, you know, very, you know, very intuitive of this sort of thing.
If he gets the wrong impression, you see what I mean?
And, uh, just, uh, I think he did well in advance, well in advance, and showed a great deal.
So, uh, we'll spend some time with him tomorrow.
Very, very useful.
I think George is very capable.
Extremely.
I think he's honest.
He's honest.
He's able.
He's bright.
He's diligent.
He's hardworking.
He's systematic.
He's got a very even temper.
He'll work well with your staff.
They all have respect for him.
And I really think he did an excellent job.
The thing I had, the way I thought we would handle it so that we didn't have to make a lot of calls.
I thought what we would do would be to have the cabin at 1030.
And invite the senior staff to sit around the edges.
And I would just sit there.
And if you could say a word about the whole thing, and then after that, you would be charged.
And then I would walk out to the press, and I would go up there, and I would say that.
I can say that I can leave it more of a reassurance to people.
I'm going to do the work that he allowed me to do.
I agree it's the best man for the job.
I wonder if you want to direct me on B.
Now, Mr. Trump, is Biden going to be confirmed?
Yes, he is.
Yeah, since they had to do the Senate confirmation, and I had an opportunity, of course, to go to the Senate, if your questions are.
The Secretary will be.
I thought I'd play in just a light, low-key way, and just press as you come and try to help our team.
It really would have been for a year.
That has been extended considerably beyond that.
I have done my best to help.
I hope I have done some help.
But more than that, I have done my best.
And this is time for me to go.
As I've told many of you before,
that they have to come.
I didn't anticipate that I would be here beyond the year period, but I've stayed conservative beyond that.
It seems to me that no man is indispensable in the nines for the time of the United States.
As far as those economic affairs, those of which I had any, of our responsibility in international monetary freedom, we had the Smithsonian Agreement in December.
We're working on the board for a particular negotiation.
Our economy's moving.
The control program is very much on track, it seems to me.
It's coming out of control.
It's coming out of control.
There's an enormous expansion.
And I'm sure we still have some problems.
But you always have problems.
And so I suppose there's no good time.
We might also say that you, in particular, your initiative,
I appreciate the opportunity to serve as a member of the National Security Council.
I was sitting in here totally supportive of the president's recent decision.
That's why I'm at a meeting with him.
So I'd be delighted to be able to talk to him about that.
And then if I get a chance, what I'm going to do is say, oh, I can't wait to be done.
And just, I don't know of any better time for the president if I move in.
People would support me and say, well, what does this mean?
You're going to go back?
Because this means you're worried about Texas.
I said, no, not at least.
It has nothing to do with it.
They said, well, what does this mean?
You're going to go back and try to pitch a political house order?
I said, no, it doesn't mean that at all.
It means I came up here to try to be helpful.
I've tried to be helpful.
I've stayed my time plus some, and I'm invested in doing it.
They'll ask you, of course, as we were saying, they'll ask you one question, probably a question of that.
Well, they'd ask me about, you know, the finesses of the opposite, repeatedly die, and those are the kind of questions that no one knows what the future holds.
Well, it's just when you're not going to,
uh, be available for future government services.
I hope that he had it all.
He said, this thing's over.
But, uh, that mean that I'm removing myself from the human race or from future political activity or government services.
This means it's the end of this period.
And I don't know whether the new one will ever start, but if it does, you will know about it.
Just leave it at that.
So...
But I don't want that to hurt you.
But I'll play it the way you want to.
I think the only thing I think that we should avoid is any of the, I suppose, the speculation of leaving to
the president has my full support and then i'll allude to that and i think this is one time
I think that's good.
That leaves it hanging.
And today, did you see where Rockefeller beat over Busty in New York, you know?
Busty Marjorie.
Crazy bastard.
Did he really?
I don't know.
Well, I mean, he said the court had a constitution three years before him.
You know, the liberal street always comes out on the small street.
Always the story of God.
He vetoed an abortion thing.
He vetoed that.
He vetoed the Forest Hills, you know, that Forest Hills project.
He vetoed something on the throw it out.
He vetoed it and said it's discontinued.
That's every council.
That is not the future of this country.
Integrated housing, busing, and the abortion thing is a very close one for lots of people, because, you know, when you think of some child getting knocked up by some black or something like that, that's tough.
But for a religious family, I mean, you've got to respect the Billy Grahams and the Cardinal and Cooks that are against that sort of thing.
That's the only thing I can say.
That's why I say, I just simply say, it's a personal matter for me as to what it's up to people to vote for.
Relax the way you need.
And Mr. President, after George officially takes over, I'll be available too.
Because I say I, when I got out of the governor's office, because of the security circumstances, Mark wants to, we moved the very day to Houston.
I just started work on commuting.
Yeah, so you haven't settled for 10 years now.
12 years already, because the last 18 months I was with Rich and Bass, Mr. Rich had died.
And we were working on his estate day and night, trying to wind it up.
So it was 1959 now.
I had basically no time.
And so I don't plan to do anything for three months anymore.
It's way out of the subject.
And any time you want me to do something, or any time you want me here, I'd be there in three or four hours' notice.
And I don't know that I'd do that.
Would it be useful, I had thought of this, would it be useful if you were to, you may not want to do this, but if you were to go there or so,
not so great for private citizens to go on some sort of a mission.
Sure.
See what I've been at.
We could just go down there now.
There must be something we can pick up.
I think that would be a way in order to go down.
Great.
I could go then.
Probability would be I'm going to go to Europe and spend a couple of weeks
and looking for them.
But if we could think of a good old casket of two, four or five of the Latin American things, but they always, all the African countries.
Not many people want to go, but I don't know.
What we might do is, but I have this thought that's occurred to me since June.
I'll talk to you about it.
After the Moscow summit,
And after the other vote, they were sworn in, you know, again and again.
And goddammit, that, uh, that finance committee shouldn't, Russell Long shouldn't get George Shultz in the ass, you know.
I don't think so.
I mean, I don't think so.
But anyway, what occurred to me is that you might go, you could say, well, you've been in the Security Council for months, and you could say just to go in as the President's personal representative to talk about some of the matters that,
Well, you know, you've got sort of a banner there that you could, what I can't say about a banner, a re-cover, a cover, a cover.
We could pick three or four major countries, Brazil, Argentina, and Africa.
Well, hell, it's...
I don't know that Africa would be more fun.
I just mentioned it simply because I don't mind going there.
The only place that's worthwhile in there, you can't go to the southern end.
Yeah, that's right.
Which I like to go to.
Have you ever been there?
No.
Don't.
It's an awful place.
But you can't go there.
There are these awful blocks.
I have to admit, it's not that it's going to break in the Mideast.
One of the best places you could go to would be to the Arab countries.
I mean, my God.
Yes, they love, you know, I mean, I, we get to stand Jewish about our next, we could just take that like a grant to a Christian.
And I'll go to Iran and Saudi Arabia.
I've been to Algeria on three occasions.
Saudi Arabia you could go to.
I'm going to go around on this trip.
Well, that's right.
I'll have that one on the way.
Right.
But there's Morocco.
You could do the northern African countries, no problem with that.
Well, that's not something that you need to worry about.
No, but I think it's very good.
Frankly, if you're going to take a trip, you may as well.
Take a trip that has to do it on a mission.
In other words, it's going to take all your time.
It's over.
You go in.
You see Medellin.
You say, I want to talk to you about the nature of things, about the sun, and everything else.
I think it might be a very good doing.
It'd be great to go right out.
You could go and say, the time's going to be about the 15th of June.
You'll be back by the 4th of July.
It's going to be a pretty good time.
I agree.
But I don't need to do this.
It would really serve me.
Well, I think it would.
I think it would, frankly, to show.
First, it's so interesting.
It's good.
It's going to be a big name to those people.
The second term, it will show sort of a continuity relationship.
going to be very important.
And that's been a very solid way.
See, yes, we understand.
You wouldn't say we're going to not.
That's right.
But we have to show some continuity.
That's right.
Now, we will.
That continuity will show after the convention.
But I'd like to have something done at this time, say, just before the convention, see?
Right.
And where you just do.
You're going to undertake a mission at my request to these countries.
Now, the other thing is.
You've never been to... You've been to the Iron Curtain, right, Chris?
Yes, sir.
Well, see, I would have done a poem to me in years long.
I've done a poem in this trip, that makes three.
Right.
I'm reading.
I'm just watching.
I have a strong feeling Latin America is right.
I just think we ought to show some interest in that.
Mexico, I have to do when he comes here.
But if you're going to figure Latin America, doing two or three major countries down there, I think it would be okay.
Maybe Colombia.
Colombia, I'd love to go to.
And Brazil.
Colombia, Brazil.
Argentina.
Argentina.
That's the big ones.
I like to live in Argentina, where we really, of course, you get all kinds of budget amounts in terms of Argentina.
It's just not progressively built.
They have terrible problems.
And could I actually might be one of them?
Would you go from this, in this case, that you think would be a very, very good thing for continuity?
You know, we met yesterday.
I remember when we started.
I thought it was one of you.
You've got a colored hat over here.
But the thing is that our intelligence is not so good.
I think you should know, because this is a different church here, I'm going to remove Helms after the election.
He's been in too long.
He's been in too long.
He's a good man, a decent man.
But I want the toughest, meanest, most ruthless fellow to kick all the Georgetown bricks out of that agency.
In other words, I can't look at him as a CIA man.
Now, Admiral Anderson is presently the head of the U.S. Army.
Very much.
You're lying.
Yes, sir.
I think he's the right man to be the head of.
But I think it means leadership brought us on to that thing.
We are strong in that field, just for the mothers.
The...
That, to me, is the one, is the only one of the boards that I will be with.
I'm not going to be, I'm just not going to be with that Angus Army, or the employees, or all the bunch of, you know, I don't know, Snarkers.
But the five I've come to once a month, once we get past this staff, they're not going to be with us.
We really have got to get in to our ontologists, and this can seem tolerable, I know, I strengthen what I've been doing, and we now are going to get into such matters as the
advocacy of our intelligence, the advocacy of our relationship with the Soviet and a lot of other things.
And so I think that if you could undertake that, I think that we could announce that, say, right after we return from Russia.
How would that sound to you?
That's fine.
And that also, the other advantage of that job, it gives a good reason for you to come up to Washington.
Right.
You know, on occasion.
Right.
And, you know, not that you have to have a reason, but, no, so you're just well-adjusted right here.
And then, if you set up our education on the other side, it gives you continuing education and input, and you have access, but you also have access to everything.
Right.
But that is something.
If you're going to ask questions, you can read, you can do all that sort of thing.
It's the best way to go.
Yes, sir.
Let's have that.
Bye.
Because the main, the main thing that we really, that I think we need for, frankly, politics, of course, is really good advice, but I can't even think about politics until I get this goddamn war over it.
And then I don't have a lot of politics, too.
But, more important, really, is the
It's the whole area of the defense of the United States in its broadest estimate.
And that means our foreign policy, it means what we do, it's our stance with other countries and so forth.
For example, one thing that FIAT is not getting due to their great credit is economic intelligence.
Which we don't have any money for.
They're in that now.
Now that is something that you write down in your analyst report.
I've talked to George about this last fall, but I've told him it's in the management.
Well, they've got a commission on it.
That's right.
So, we could, in fact, we may move on that.
Put it on that board.
It's already due.
Sure.
All right.
Well, anyway, so the Deer Grove tomorrow will be very simple.
I'll sit in the cabin.
I'll get you out there.
I'll be talking.
So don't ask me any questions.
I'll just keep it as brief as we can.
I'll tell it to her.
And then I'm not going to have any interviews when it's over because I'm distracted.
They're going to be speculating about everything in the world here.
including the fact that I'm going home from the end of the local events just because of my approach in Barnsley, Texas.
That won't get national in Texas.
Now listen, if you get back over to your office floor, it'll be a half off.
I see Henry for a minute, but he's back.
And why don't I just check in with George's office before you go to see me?
Because I'm going to be there in a minute.
Would you rather talk to him than Henry?
No, I think it's just as well if I see him in there.
All right, fine.
I'll just go.
I'll let you know when I get to see him.
All right.
George, how are you?
Very well, thank you.