Nixon White House Tapes ›Tape 776 › Conversation 776-012

Nixon, Timmons & Bull on Carl Albert and Congressional leadership

Thursday, September 14, 1972 · 11:39 AM–11:47 AM ET · Oval Office ·7 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Timmons, William E.;  Bull, Stephen B.Conversation776-012 onTape 776StartThursday, September 14, 1972 at 11:39 AMEndThursday, September 14, 1972 at 11:47 AMRecording deviceOval OfficeSourceNixon Library record for 776-012 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and William E. Timmons discuss the personal behavior and political standing of House Speaker Carl Albert, expressing concern over his recent public conduct and potential impact on his leadership. The conversation centers on the risks posed by Albert's perceived decline and explores potential ways to handle the situation, including a discreet telephone outreach to address these issues. Nixon ultimately tasks Timmons with coordinating a strategy, potentially involving consultation with others close to the Speaker, to address the vulnerability surrounding Albert's position.

Audio

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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I think the way it should be done is by phone.
That would be just borrow.
Okay.
And once you just call them and say,
Thank you for watching.
I was embarrassed at one of your receptions.
You showed up kind of hand-flockered and embarrassed.
Um, I think he's gonna have a serious doubt that there's a dictatorship next year, and if they still have control of the house.
They may have it now.
They may have it now.
Uh, this is, uh, I thought you'd understand what it was called, but it was the Korean girl who was actually driving the car.
Is that true?
Oh, I don't, I don't heard that, but I'm not surprised that he was driving the car, and that's why he drove away from the scene of the accident and got around the car and drove back.
Ha!
He, uh, now I don't know if he's coming up as a free intern when we have to tell him, because if he was the other secretary, it would be sort of eligible to not know his staff.
But apparently, I mean, he was in public, you know.
His staff here come privately from that one thing, but I don't think he's doing that publicly.
He does it all the time.
One of our guests went to a party out someplace a long time ago, six months ago.
And, uh, here's a colleague of one that turns around to play around with a white shirt and a hat and a drop player.
And some of these are colleagues.
So, he has something he can't get rid of.
Which is, uh, which is a bad sign.
Yeah.
Uh, yeah.
He's one of the, uh, apparently, people he can trust.
I'm very pleased to hit the ball.
I think it was a beauty to reach the people out there shouting behind the speaker in the house.
I got to hear Ray's push-ups and that's awesome.
That's unbelievable.
Uh, he's got a hell of a problem with his wheels.
I know.
I've tried with that in mind.
I believe in that.
That's not what they can't arrest, but, uh...
But a lot of his colleagues really kind of grumble over who they are, and for whatever effect he had, that is gone, I think.
They talk about it in derogatory terms, and it's kind of like they talk about taking a log, you know, kind of a sexy joke, you know, when he couldn't be quit.
Totally.
Well, as far as I know, we're going to play this on him, and I've been in his presence so much, and he's had to enter it or something, so...
I guess that's the only thing a guy should do with his cousin.
If a guy doesn't give you some strength, you've got to do one of these things.
You've either got to limit the strength to a full, solely private party, or you've got to quit.
Now basically, the other thing, with a public figure, you shouldn't have a grand public.
And I bet that they just are damn fools.
But Albert, apparently, was getting something's happened, something's coming to harm him.
That's what I'm trying to tell you.
The pressure's tough.
He wasn't this bad before.
No, he wasn't.
I just wonder if maybe now he's kind of over his career, and he's all kind of behind him, and he can still do nothing.
There's still enough to let him someplace he wanted to go, and maybe he just kind of said, the hell with it.
I don't know.
Maybe before he was his age, he realized he's not old enough.
and I've heard he's kept his flack on the conservative liberals on this party up there.
They're all working on it all the time.
Um, but I thought he'd measure up better, frankly.
I wrote it here that, you know, you have to appreciate old McCormick, and I think, uh, McCormick had a, uh,
I wish I knew somebody that's close enough to help with personnel that they could approach him on that obviously knows that he's got a problem, but he's going to read these stories when he's got a whole problem.
I don't know if that's the one on the delegation that's the closest to the neighbor.
I don't think it's this one.
Maybe he's a lot higher up.
Yeah, all these guys keep on trying to step up a little bit.
I don't think they're really that close.
But his body is kind of, it's just right in there.
And he might have a little heart to heart.
It's protecting his condition, it's not how it hurts him.
Do you find that, do you want me to do that?
No, I'm ready to let you do it.
Thank you.

NARA Description

On September 14, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon, William E. Timmons, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:39 am to 11:47 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 776-012 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 776-12

Date: September 14, 1972
Time: 11:39 am - 11:47 am
Location: Oval Office

The President met with William E. Timmons.

                                     (rev. Oct-06)

          Richard K. Cook memorandum
              -Carl B. Albert
              -Melvin Warshaw’s letter to the President
                  -Response by telephone
                       -Timmons

          Albert
              -Mrs. Albert
                   -White House reception
              -Speakership
              -Incidents
              -Jack N. Anderson
              -Congressional leadership
              -[Thomas] Hale Boggs
              -Public figures
              -The President’s view

*****************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 31s        ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2

*****************************************************************

          Albert
              -The President’s view
              -Timmons’s view
              -Democrats
              -John W. McCormack
              -Sam Rayburn
              -McCormack and Rayburn
                  -The President’s view
              -Lyndon B. Johnson as Senator
              -Everett M. Dirksen
              -Oklahoma delegation
              -McCormack

                                           (rev. Oct-06)

                   -Instructions for Timmons
                        -Bryce N. Harlow

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:39 am.

              The President's schedule
                  -Tom S. Gettys

Bull and Timmons left at 11:47 am.

Also recorded on September 14, 1972

  • 776-009 11:23 AM · 24 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and John D. Ehrlichman met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 11:23 am and 11:28 am.
  • 776-010 11:28 AM · 27 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:28 am to 11:30 am.
  • 776-011 11:36 AM · 17 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 11:36 am and 11:39 am.
  • 776-013 11:47 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Thomas S. Gettys, John E. Nidecker, Max L. Friedersdorf, and White House photographer met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:47 am to 11:49 am.
  • 776-014 11:49 AM · 43 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 11:49 am and 12:02 pm.
  • 776-015 12:02 PM · 33 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Frank L. Rizzo, John G. Carlson, White House photographer, John D. Ehrlichman, and Kenneth R. Cole, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:02 pm to 12:45 pm.
  • 776-016 12:45 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 12:45 pm and 12:52 pm.
  • 776-017 12:52 PM · 26 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:52 pm to 1:43 pm.

All 29 conversations from September 14, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 776-012, September 14, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/776-012 (accessed September 18, 2026).