Nixon White House Tapes — Conversation 795-022
Date: Tuesday, October 10, 1972 at 4:26 PM
Participants: Nixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob"); Monzon, Zosimo T.; Bull, Stephen B.; Butterfield, Alexander P.
Recording device: Oval Office
Source: https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/795-022

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite it as authoritative.

[0:00] We're fine.
[0:01] You know, this is...
[0:32] Anything further on the hanging thing?
[0:33] I don't know what time he gets back.
[0:35] It's still 2 o'clock in the morning.
[0:38] I'll check this.
[0:40] Well, no one doesn't kill me.
[0:41] He just needs his time to come up there.
[0:44] I'll find work and speech.
[0:45] And let him come up, go to bed, and then come up when he's up.
[0:47] Take his time.
[0:48] That's right.
[0:49] That's right.
[0:49] Now we get to Roger's problem.
[0:51] Again.
[0:53] I'll let you in and see him before he comes up.
[0:54] Okay.
[0:54] I want him to report to Roger's first.
[0:56] Then come up and see him.
[0:58] Okay.
[0:59] I don't want it done up there.
[1:02] Yeah.
[1:04] And you?
[1:05] It's fine.
[1:06] I think he'll understand.
[1:08] You've got to tell him that you can trust Bill on this.
[1:10] Bill must say anything you tell him not to.
[1:12] Well, there he goes again.
[1:15] He's working hard to trust him.
[1:34] Well, Ken made an interesting point.
[1:44] The press has tried to make a thing, and the opposition more than the press, really.
[1:51] The president scuttled welfare reform by not pushing it and staying out of it.
[1:58] And the president scuttled the consumer bill, which we did.
[2:04] And that if you've got the bussing out there, don't let them try to play the same game on it.
[2:08] You know, just a little symbolic thing that those guys can go out and throw presents and those, you know, gotta get the bussing thing worked and all that.
[2:38] How about the, Colson said that he saw that hard hat ad in the middle of the road in Markham last night.
[2:46] You know, that's a good time.
[2:48] We've got just superb time in some of those commercials.
[2:53] We've really, they've done a hell of a job.
[2:55] I actually will squeal about that.
[2:59] What do they say?
[2:59] They say that's a different position, or he's changed his position.
[3:03] That's not what he told me.
[3:04] I'm falsified.
[3:06] That's what the press is.
[3:09] Dave?
[3:10] They said that on defense, too.
[3:14] Yeah, they backed off of it.
[3:16] They said, well, it isn't that the figures are wrong, it's the interpretation that's drawn, the inference that's drawn from it.
[3:26] What the hell is it?
[3:27] It was developed in one of his programs.
[3:30] Sure.
[3:32] It was developed.
[3:38] The welfare rights organization.
[3:40] But it basically relates to the principle, not to the specifics.
[3:44] It says they're going to put half the people on welfare, and who's going to pay for them?
[3:49] The other half who aren't.
[3:52] So you only put a third on, and who's going to pay for that?
[3:54] The two thirds who aren't.
[3:58] But he isn't going to do it.
[4:06] But they're
[4:08] Well, it'd be interesting to see how their negative stuff comes out.
[4:11] But we don't want, I mean, put it this way, the only thing I am, would be concerned about is any idea when they're playing dirty, if they claim that we're playing dirty, right?
[4:21] You get my point?
[4:22] Sure.
[4:23] And that's why, the only reason I'd be a bit concerned.
[4:27] That one is so, there doesn't, so softening.
[4:31] It's not strident.
[4:32] It's not scary.
[4:34] It isn't that they'll say we're misrepresented.
[4:36] I don't believe them talking about welfare.
[4:39] No, that's good.
[4:40] I think that's right.
[4:42] We haven't misrepresented his position.
[4:44] The point is, how do we know which position to discuss?
[4:47] He's got three of them.
[4:48] Sure.
[4:49] Well, you guys asked Rawson to discuss the $1,000.
[4:52] He takes my position on the war four years ago.
[4:55] And it's not that he's got any right to.
[4:58] And anyhow, he said, I'm stuck with it.
[5:00] We can't squeal.
[5:00] That's right.
[5:02] We can find out just that we're seeing an honorable end to the war and so forth.
[5:06] Can you leave that out there, Mickey?
[5:08] Can you quote Richard Nixon from four years ago?
[5:10] Why can't we quote you from four months ago?
[5:25] Sure.
[5:25] Good point.
[5:26] I think they're hard-footed.
[5:26] If these were dirty, if they were, you know,
[5:31] I mean, I'd like to think that's about it, that that actually was a true view thing.
[5:37] Particularly this label, with the negative ads.
[5:39] I'm sure there's a trustee trying.
[5:42] I think so.
[5:42] You know, there's still some argument that we shouldn't change the fact.
[5:47] It isn't that tough.
[5:49] Well, basically not bad.
[5:50] It's true.
[5:52] Says he says this, then he says that.
[5:54] Then he says this, then he says that.
[5:57] What will he say next year?
[6:00] That's all.
[6:00] It just says that quietly.
[6:02] It doesn't do anything on that.
[6:04] It states facts.
[6:07] The process, it states some things he doesn't want stated, but what he said, it doesn't distort anything at all.
[6:15] Oh, absolutely.
[6:16] There's no, not even, by any occasion, if you enter or anything else.
[6:19] And as I told you, the amnesty is on that one, which is good.
[6:26] I've got to get that right.
[6:28] And he gets it with several other ones.
[6:30] It hits him on Vietnam, it hits him on amnesty, it hits him on welfare, and it hits him on something else.
[6:37] Question?
[6:45] No?
[6:46] Well, we'll do some more specifics.
[6:53] You can't think we should make some more negative bets and make them rougher.
[6:57] Does he?
[6:57] And be ready to go with some harder stuff.
[7:01] Because of theirs?
[7:02] Yeah.
[7:03] But I think he's over anticipating theirs.
[7:05] Oh, they'll be rough.
[7:07] Yeah.
[7:08] But that may hurt.
[7:09] I think ours are rough enough.
[7:12] Ours aren't rough.
[7:14] But they're very...
[7:15] The cannon tends to be a little rougher than the traffic should bear.
[7:20] I think.
[7:23] Well, we have a problem with the company.
[7:26] He, as of now, has said that they're not going to run anymore at it.
[7:33] Well, is that right?
[7:36] What's the reason?
[7:37] Well, the reason, as far as I can figure, is, and I've talked to him about it, is that they haven't raised the money that they had hoped to.
[7:50] And he doesn't think they should be spending
[7:53] That may not be the reason.
[7:56] I think we can.
[7:59] We can certainly do something.
[8:26] I think we probably have to get these people a little comfortable.
[8:39] We're starting to get low on those pins.
[8:43] We have to get the people that are there.
[8:47] We have to get the old people.
[9:01] It was good to get birded.
[9:02] Yeah, that was worth meeting.