← 820-008820-010 →

Conversation 820-009

TapeTape 820StartTuesday, December 12, 1972 at 10:53 AMEndTuesday, December 12, 1972 at 11:13 AMParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Recording deviceOval Office
AI Summary

President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman met to discuss the potential role of Julie Nixon Eisenhower within the White House during the second-term reorganization. Nixon expressed a strong desire to utilize his daughter in a capacity where she could manage public relations planning and help coordinate his and the First Lady’s schedules more effectively. The two also addressed operational concerns regarding the President’s scheduling process, specifically criticizing staff failures to handle significant symbolic events and high-level visits appropriately.

Julie Nixon EisenhowerWhite House reorganizationPublic relationsPresidential schedulingFirst Lady image
AudioNARA Description

On December 12, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:53 am to 11:13 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 820-009 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 820-9

Date: December 12, 1972
Time: 10:53 am - 11:13 am
Location: Oval Office

The President met with H. R.(“Bob”) Haldeman.

      The President’s schedule
           -Meeting with W. Clement Stone
                 -Fundraising
                        -The President’s role
                             -Commitments
                             -White House
                             -Dinners
                                   -John F. Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts

      -Volunteerism
           -National Center for Voluntary Action [NCVA]
                                           -13-

                 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                      (rev. May-08)

                                                             Conversation No. 820-9 (cont’d)

                -Credit
           -Credit
                -Football players

      Second term reorganization
           -Julie Nixon Eisenhower
                  -Conversation with the President
                        -Constance M. (Cornell) (“Connie”) Stuart
                               -Retention
                                    -Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon’s conversation with Ronald L.
                                     Ziegler
                  -Ziegler’s view
                  -Work with Stuart
                  -White House
                  -NCVA
                        -Julie Nixon Eisenhower’s meeting with Lenore (LaFount) Romney,
                         December 11, 1972
                  -White House
                        -Stephen B. Bull

*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

                 -Abilities

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************

                 -Unknown person
                 -Shelley A. (Scarney) Buchanan
                 -Scheduling, events, cooperation

      The President’s schedule
           -George P. Shultz [?]
           -Mayor of Whittier, California [Blake Sanborn] and President of Whittier Chamber
             of Commerce [Donald Kemp]
                 -Scroll
                                          -14-

                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                     (rev. May-08)

                                                           Conversation No. 820-9 (cont’d)

                     -Presentation to Mrs. Nixon
                     -Nixon Library
                     -Whittier
                           -The President’s hometown
                           -1972 election
                           -Signatures
                -Rose Mary Woods’s involvement
                     -Mrs. Nixon
                -White House staff instructions
                     -David N. Parker
                     -Haldeman’s role
                     -Personal matters
                           -Compared to meetings with associations, clubs

     Second term reorganization
          -Julie Nixon Eisenhower
                 -Mrs. Nixon
                 -NCVA
                 -Possible conversation with Haldeman
                 -Value

*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

                -Value
                -Relations with White House staff

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************

                      -Woods

      The President’s schedule
           -Cancelled meeting with Sanborn and Kemp
                 -Whittier
                 -Scroll
                        -Symbolism
                                     -15-

           NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                (rev. May-08)

                                                      Conversation No. 820-9 (cont’d)

           -Ziegler
           -Timing
           -The President’s foot
                 -Executive Office Building [EOB]

Second term reorganization
     -Julie Eisenhower
            -White House
                  -Buffering role
                         -Bull
                  -East Wing
                  -Meeting with veterans, Jews, blacks
            -Mrs. Nixon’s schedule
            -Mrs. Nixon’s image
                  -Foreign policy
                  -Claudia A. (Taylor) (“Lady Bird”) Johnson
                         -Beautification
                  -Jacqueline Lee Bouvier Kennedy Onassis
                         -White House decorations
                  -The President’s trip to the People’s Republic of China [PRC]
                  -Alexander P. Butterfield
                  -Dwight L. Chapin
                  -Bull
                  -Stuart
                         -Press relations
                               -Schedule
                                      -Planning
                                             -Christmas
                                             -Rose Parade
                                      -First term
                                             -Trips, dedications, blind people
                  -Trips
                  -Receptions
                         -Hand-shaking
                               -Compared to Mrs. Johnson, Mamie G. D. Eisenhower,
                                Mrs. Kennedy
            -Public relations [PR] planning
                  -Chapin
                  -Richard A. Moore
                                                -16-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                        (rev. May-08)

                                                         Conversation No. 820-9 (cont’d)

*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

                        -Value
                             -Personaliy

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************

                  -White House staff
                  -Meetings with public
                       -East Wing
                  -Conversation with Haldeman
                       -The President’s schedule

Haldeman left at 11:13 am.
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Supposedly,
I just want to be sure that nobody else is in any of those.
I can't.
I'm not going to do any of those, sir.
This thing, it just goes on and on.
Let's say here that he may ask you for a dinner with the chief.
He's going to ask you for two dinners.
We keep agonizing over that thing.
If it can't go by itself, there really isn't any point in it.
I rather think so.
They think they're accomplishing something, and maybe they are, but they're sure not getting credit for it if they aren't.
Oh, man, the football heads.
Yeah.
The best thing to do.
That's right.
I, uh, Julie came over and had a talk with me, and apparently that, uh, that is, uh, these over there, uh, they have, uh, it, it just persists in kind of those things where we have that signal, and it's nobody's fault, but it's...
The talk she had with Ron about Connie convinced her that now she's gonna have to keep Connie.
Now she ditched her.
But anyway, she doesn't do anything.
And Ron, of course, has said that he doesn't believe that Julie should have to be the bottom of the press.
He's totally right.
Now, what I didn't think, though, is that there is quite a very, very deep fear.
And I was thinking,
the other thing is
My point is, let's consider what Julie can do here.
I don't want her to go out.
She went over to see Mrs. Romney yesterday.
I don't want her to get involved in that document.
She just doesn't want a job.
It's a sacred job.
My ideal thing is the thing over there.
Can't we go back and work at that house?
It won't work.
I think it will not work.
She just can't be there as the fourth wheel.
She can't be there running it.
The best thing is to put her in a position here.
I mentioned the speaking bowl position.
It's possible she could do that.
The point is that Julie is good for me.
She's good for me.
She can be around.
She's well-earned.
She finds us.
And she picks up things.
I mean, I don't miss little things, which are important.
I'd like you to put your, I'd like you to put your mind in a new organization here and all the people that are leaving and see what a position she can do right here.
It doesn't have to be right with me.
It doesn't have to be out there, for example, with this little girl running out of the office.
That would be good.
And it shouldn't be sitting where Shelly is, you know, smiling at people when they come in.
Because she's fired at that, you see.
She can do something else.
She's awfully good at the whole business of scheduling and events and getting people to cooperate and so forth and so on.
You see what I mean?
And it may be that she must have taken charge of it because of the will of the man and so forth and so on.
But let's do a little thinking about that.
Maybe, yeah.
I had a guest, I had a one that was a little bit, he'd come yesterday, I didn't know him, I didn't care.
And he did a show for me, he's got a, sort of have somebody buffer him a little bit, you know, got him a pretty, I saw it on the schedule and I wondered about it, maybe it was some mistake, but it sounds small, but it's one of those things,
the, you know, the mayor of, what are you, the president of the Congress from back here, with the scrolls and stuff, and he was in Paterson, the library, the clock,
You know what I mean?
As I said, we've got 50,000 people that did it, but there's only one lawyer.
There's only, you know what I mean?
There's only one on the count.
There's only one on the count of that side of 180%.
So, but my point is, it'd be that difficult to get 5,000 people to be silenced where it's like a goddamned thing, but I'd have to get 3,000 miles across, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands, and thousands,
But it's not a very good decision.
That's one that never even came in for a decision, to my knowledge, so it was handled.
Why, not you?
It was your deal, but I didn't see it.
They never came in as a scheduled proposal.
Who was your proposal?
But those were, see that's the kind of thing, they're under instructions to work out someone else to handle.
We said they came along until this week, and then we got a bunch of these things that were backed up.
who would decide ?
Normally they would come to me, thing like that, yeah.
But the reason they don't, the reason they haven't now is because we've laid down a basic plan of what they're even gonna consider and what they're not, that would fall into what they're not to consider, so they don't set that.
So we have .
There are things that we have to be very sensitive to.
I mean, they're more importantly about whether I see the President of the National Association of Professional and Responsible Men today as a, as curious as that may have been,
What do you think you're thinking?
I just don't want her to do a job or work.
I want her to be centered.
Can I talk to you a little bit?
She's such a hell of a problem that it matters today.
We talked to her today.
She makes her mind up in a hell of a hurry.
But I don't think that she thinks she can handle it.
She'll be in a daily fight with her mother, and she doesn't want to do that.
And I can see that.
But she wouldn't be in a daily fight with me.
And I just haven't worked out with the staff.
I just have to get along with her.
You know what I mean?
So there would be no problem if the staff came.
Well, there's always little feelings.
The major company grows, you know, you never know.
We've got a little bit of a problem in that respect, as I've said, but when it does come to these things that I do want to do, I've got to get too off on the buying side, and I don't want to hold.
And but many times, things like,
Things like a couple of guys go up there across the country for your home count.
Some of them took weeks to get off.
Each person could use a dollar to get signed to the name.
Money goes to the foundation or something like that.
So rather, it had a certain symbolism that was very special.
And anybody that is here where, again, your Ziegler crowd would never, ever understand why that is a special field.
Not yet.
I'm surprised that this wasn't, wasn't phrased as that kind of thing that I would have calculated.
I didn't have that out there other than, well.
It'd be interesting to hear what happened on that.
If I was here, I could have walked over the tree and walked down here.
Oh, yes, I could.
But think of what, think of this, think of Julie as a property, and think of her using her in the mine house, if that's what I mean.
Right here.
In other words, then she does all the buffering, rather than Adam Steed trying to do it.
She works out the things for the East Wing.
I mean, she does the, Anne Franklin.
You can see important people in there.
Work with Beth Nash.
Julie.
Blanche.
You see, in other words, you've got a property here that's maybe more important than this, and she also will know what comes in on the schedule and what her mother ought to do.
She, for example, has a dairy, which is absolutely correct, which we have failed on our own side to work out, but we have worked it out.
We've made a proportion, we've had a board of officers, and that is...
that her mother ought to be identified with one single thing.
Mrs. Johnson was identified with beautification.
Mrs. Kennedy was doing over-the-wines and had done all those things, but identified with nothing except the Crips of China.
She's pushed her to not be identified with one single thing.
That's Julie's point.
Or whatever her point is, that there is a way.
And maybe you can see she's the kind, Julie's the kind to get over her doubts.
Or if Alex couldn't get it across, Chapin couldn't, Bo couldn't, none of us, none of the people, it's not their fault.
It's not their fault because basically over there, you have a kind of a rigid, rather, you know,
Connie, let me tell you what all this is.
It is a day-to-day battle in the press.
That's the way she looks at it.
She tries to be one of them.
She does a hell of a good job.
She's taught the rules.
But Connie does not sit down and figure out a long-winded plan.
Connie would never have sat down as I have.
I just hate to admit it.
I hate to admit it.
I said, did it ever occur to you that you were going to talk about the person's name?
Since that she's about to get a decision.
How many parks has she dedicated?
How many blind people has she hugged?
It's a hell of a story.
But you've got to get the story out, and there's a reason to get it out.
And you can't get it out in a ham-ass way.
You've got to get it out and broker it and sell it and so forth.
It's that kind of activity that we need here.
And Connie, of course, is totally in on that over there.
But she's got a hell of a record here.
She's traveled more miles.
She's been a virtual ambassador abroad.
She's done a lot of reality on that same thing.
And she's really busted her ass going around.
She's shaking more damn hands than that white house at the receptions.
The others didn't do it.
Mrs. Johnson did quite well, but not as many.
Mrs. Eisenhardt and Hershel Gannon, neither of whose tenants.
What's it mean, shake a hand?
Well, it means something to people.
The role of Julie was the biggest hole in it.
The role of the biggest hole in it is sort of the PR planning role that she was in.
Julie could really do, I know, the job of that.
The sitting with the moors and the folks like that and going over what ought to be done.
She had a good sense of what you will do and what you won't do, what you should do and what you shouldn't do.
We extend that to the whole family.
She's great at PR planning, but also you want to remember, she's better than anybody who's got a staff, not because she's a member of the family, but because of her special personality in getting people to do things that they ought to do.
Obviously, you must have no illusions about that.
She's just that young.
She can get anybody to do anything.
She can get a mother to do things.
She can get me to do things that I may not want to do.
And that's good, you see.
Better than anybody who's done it.
So you don't want to lose that capable woman.
She's better than anybody who's done it.
And saying hello to somebody, not because she's Jewish.
The daughter is because she's done it the goddamn first time.
See, so we don't want to lose her and come with her then, too.
And that's the problem with a staff man.
That's right.
That's what I do.
What's that?
Well, if we could call her over, Bob.
I know you're very busy today.
She'd be very interested, Bob.
← 820-008820-010 →