Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 843 › Conversation 843-013

Nixon, Timmons & Woods on 1974 Budget and Congressional Relations

Friday, January 26, 1973 · 12:21 PM–12:28 PM ET · Oval Office · 6 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Timmons, William E.; Woods, Rose Mary; Bull, Stephen B.Conversation843-013 on Tape 843StartFriday, January 26, 1973 at 12:21 PMEndFriday, January 26, 1973 at 12:28 PMRecording deviceOval OfficeSourceNixon Library record for 843-013 ↗ · National Archives Catalog, NAID 417182241 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon met with William E. Timmons, Rose Mary Woods, and Stephen B. Bull to discuss the administration's strategy regarding the 1974 budget, potential tax increases, and congressional relations. The participants reviewed the successful passage of a recent congressional resolution and coordinated the distribution of the President’s upcoming radio speech to Republican allies. Additionally, the group addressed logistical arrangements for upcoming state dinners, specifically focusing on managing guest lists and seating configurations to better accommodate political figures like Senator Hugh Scott.

Audio

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NARA Description

On January 26, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, William E. Timmons, Rose Mary Woods, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:21 pm to 12:28 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 843-013 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 843-13

Date: January 26, 1973
Time: Between 12:21 pm and 12:28 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with William E. Timmons.

       Congressional resolution

       1974 Budget
                                                -13-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                                              Conversation No. 843-14 (cont’d)

             -House Committees on Ways and Means and on Appropriations
                  -Tax increase
                  -The President's meeting with Congressmen
                        -Michael J. (“Mike”) Mansfield, Carl B. Albert

       Vietnam
            -Prisoners of War [POWs]
            -Mansfield
            -J. William Fulbright

       The President's radio speech
            -Distribution to Republicans

       State dinners
             -Rose Mary Woods
             -Eisaku Sato
                    -Hugh Scott
             -Mansfield
             -Sato, [Hussein, King of Jordan] Hussein ibn Talal
             -Scott

Woods entered at 12:24 pm.

       State dinners
             -Timmons
             -Scott
             -Hussein
             -Arrangements

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 12:24 pm.

       The President's schedule
            -Adam Malik

Bull left at an unknown time before 12:27 pm.

             -Edward R.G. Heath

Woods and Timmons left at 12:28 pm.
                                              -14-

                   NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                                               Conversation No. 843-14 (cont’d)

Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Well, it passed the resolution, Mr. President.
Oh, did it?
Good, good.
24 hours.
Well, I think we've got them to be given a pretty good shot here today.
Well, that was a good session, I'd say.
It was just a good job.
That was amazing.
But they all recognize the strength.
Well, also, we put the shot across the bow.
I think there's a...
If it's a tax increase for all of us, yours, it's not mine.
And they're going to have to know that.
And so I got it.
They bring this budget.
They take the responsibility for the tax increase.
They ask for the responsibility.
They're going to get it.
You know, you just got to lay it to them hard.
I wish that Mike and the speaker had been able to stay for the given take later on, because that was productive.
And they had to go back to Congress, of course.
But they were a problem, I think.
Well, it didn't take long to bring it up.
It was good to just remind us of what those people have done.
You know, except for Mike.
Everybody in that room supports what we've done.
Did you realize that?
And we had one over here.
And it was true the other morning too.
I'm sending a copy of my radio speech to all the Republicans.
And I've asked the...
I'm going to give you two more names that you can add to this out there.
Scott, he wanted to do the name of the race, and I'm very bad at it.
Had he told you that earlier?
No, he hadn't.
And we didn't recommend him.
As you know, we want to get new faces.
He told me this morning.
Oh, yeah.
But if we could add one to that band banner.
But I wouldn't have it for any of the others.
Because I told them we were picking.
They could take their pick.
Mike should be called, and that's all.
But not a lot of British anarchists.
We've got the Sado banner.
We've got the Hussein banner.
I think that's good enough.
They don't have to come here every month, do they?
They don't.
I don't think they expect to.
Oh, Scott.
Scott doesn't have to come here every month.
Well, he was upset.
He was invited to a lesser individual once, and he felt that he didn't really want to come to that.
He wanted the biggies.
I forgot to say one more thing.
We were just talking about these dinner girls and Bill Jones' friends.
It's impossible to please, and particularly Scott, who is a jerk.
Scott raised Bill on the, I mean, mostly on TV, but raised him, of course.
It's too late for that.
Did we have a, did they all accept?
Well, I don't know.
That was so late, you know, right now.
Let me say that we could put him in the British, but then he gets none of the others.
You see, we've got, I've added the same now, so you've got one more here in flavor.
He won't know what I want.
There are 144 on the British list already.
I don't know if you're having an E-shaped table, but you can only see the 111.
So we have to have that in the grid, I suppose.
Yeah.
144.
Well, you have to do it that many over, or you don't have enough.
People know everybody the day before.
We didn't know that, necessarily, so many times.
I had no objection to the round table.
Round table, then it's a hard question, isn't it?
I wouldn't mind having a round table, but with us seated at a long table at the front.
It's much better for me not to sit around people, because then I have to talk here around the table.
See what I mean?
It's a very wearing thing.
And people like to see the Prime Minister and the President sitting together.
But you didn't do that.
It's a lot easier for me to do it that way.
So, yeah.
Let's see.
The Mallory is going to sit here.
My mom is going to sit here.
I don't know.
At least we were going to be just partners.
Oh, OK.
But if you have to, I would just have the British be ready.
They do have more fun.
People get to sit around and talk to each other.
They get acquainted with people.
We can share.
That's right.
Otherwise, they get seated between two people and they don't know.
That's right.
They have eight people around the table and they can talk.
Well, we can sort of see that they do know somebody at least once.
And then, you know, like we did once for the fire question, we just put a table for eight of us up there.
And we can sit there.
And Eve and I need to sit together for a minute.
I need to sit with the head governor, because we use the dinner for the purpose of continuing our conversation, you see.
Other than that, expect that to happen.
Well, if you work it out, Rose.
Don't press too hard.
I gave her the options.
I said, you take it with you.
Okay.
Thank you.

Also recorded on January 26, 1973

  • 843-016 10:34 AM · 2 min — Stephen B. Bull and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 10:34 am and 11:10 am.
  • 843-009 11:10 AM · 16 sec — President Richard M. Nixon, Phyllis Galanti, Darlene Sadler, and Helene Knapp met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:10 am to 11:12 am.
  • 113-005 11:12 AM · 46 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Vice President Spiro T. Agnew, and bipartisan Congressional leaders, including George P. Shultz, Michael J. ("Mike") Mansfield, Robert C. Byrd, Hugh Scott, Robert P. Griffin, John L. McClellan, Russell B. Long, Milton R. Young, Wallace F. Bennett, Carl B. Albert, Gerald R. Ford, John J. McFall, George H. Mahon, Wilbur D. Mills, Elford A. Cederberg, Herman T. Schneebeli, John D. Ehrlichman, Herbert Stein, William E. Timmons, Caspar W. ("Cap") Weinberger, Kenneth R. Cole, Jr., Frederic V. Malek, Phyllis Galanti, Darlene Sadler, Helene Knapp, the White House photographer, and members of the press, met in the Cabinet Room of the White House from 11:12 am to 11:59 am.
  • 843-010 12:00 PM · 8 min — President Richard M. Nixon, John D. Ehrlichman, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:00 pm to 12:09 pm.
  • 113-006 12:09 PM · 7 min — during the signing of the 1974 Budget Message to Congress, President Richard M. Nixon and Caspar ("Cap") Weinberger, Roy L. Ash, Frank C. Carlucci, III, Frederic V. Malek, James S. Dwight, Jr., Paul H. O'Neill, Kenneth W. Dam, William Morrill, Samuel M. Cohn, Dwight A. Ink, Wilfred H. Rommel, William H. Kohlberg, David P. Taylor, Jack W. Carlson, Walter W. Haase, Julius Shiskin, Donald E. Crabill, James M. Frey, Mark W. Alger, C. William Fischer, Ellis H. Veatch, John D. Young, Joseph Laitin, Velma N. Baldwin, James Bradley, William H. Taft, IV, Wilmer Hunt, Louise L. Yarbrough, Roger Adkins, Howard Heun, Edward Strait, William Hamm, James Rotherham, John Carey, Dale R. McOmber, C. Peter Modlin, Jr., Raymond Clarke, George Strauss, Virginia Banks, Terry Prevost, Florence Pro, Mary Fletcher, Evelyn Woltz, Marilyn Parker, Isabelle Bethel, White House photographer, and members of the press met in the Cabinet Room of the White House from 12:09 pm to 12:15 pm.
  • 843-011 12:15 PM · 20 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 12:15 pm and 12:21 pm.
  • 843-012 12:15 PM · 10 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 12:15 pm and 12:21 pm.
  • 843-014 12:28 PM · 14 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, Adam Malik, and Oliver F. ("Ollie") Atkins met in the Oval Office of the White House from 12:28 pm to 12:41 pm.

All 21 conversations from January 26, 1973 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 843-013, January 26, 1973. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives (NAID 417182241). Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/843-013 (accessed November 2, 2026).