On January 31, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, Stephen B. Bull, and John B. Connally met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 4:52 pm and 6:13 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 845-012 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
You're having a yellow room.
This is basically what I would start that with.
Let's just go right in.
We won't go in the yellow.
I think it's best to go right in the green because it's upstairs and there's so much time.
Okay.
Because we want this to be a very reasonable time.
We're just going to be in Brooklyn for 15 minutes.
I don't want anybody to feel that this has been done for any public purpose.
So I just don't have any microphone material.
This is a private area.
I stopped.
Has he been told there's a toast?
I'll have to check on it.
I think he expects it.
I may or may not, but I want them to just alert whoever is charging them.
I can't get him out of there because he has a long day.
There's not going to be a long conversation after the dinner.
After the dinner it's over.
Are they having a school meeting or another meeting?
It's not a green report.
When they come in we'll go directly to the green room.
This is nothing upstairs.
I mean, I can bring that to the upstairs, right?
I will have her agree that we don't want to bring it directly out.
And with the conclusion, we will have her receding her own block, where it's very, very receding, right near the floor where she went in to put the green room in the blue, all right?
Let's put a table set up in the blue.
I'm going to have her call me.
And they will have that in part, whatever it is, nine or six.
Oh, I have to get her.
Would you like to have friends here?
Friends will be here soon.
Okay.
There's the stage.
No, no.
We got it.
We've got a mean situation.
This is going to be of interest to you.
The reason I want my new apartment to be up here, Charlie Williams, who I have over here, this is a gross question.
This is the second apartment I was going to buy.
He wants to acquire an R&D institute.
It's a great place.
He wants to turn the tender off at that point.
And he thinks he can get it.
25% star.
I don't think it can.
Foundation, Hartford Foundation has 34.
In fact, it has 31.
They've got absolute control, I'm sure.
Absolute control.
We don't think it.
It's not our interest.
We've got a department.
We're trying to get the department to say it.
You know, we're not going to seek any injunction.
That's all we're asking.
We said we'll agree.
We won't take over 30%.
We can't possibly be in control of this company.
We'll abandon it.
It's a negative company.
We think we're going to buy it.
It's the bad guys.
That's what I was like.
I was running a whole bunch.
But they won't do it.
It's not our decision.
It's not about it.
But they won't do it.
It's tough.
They won't tell us to get it.
And all we messaged is just not to join us for 10 days.
We said, we agree not to take over 30%.
It's hard.
We don't think we'll get 20%.
If you would just tell us, if you could take it, if you could announce immediately that you're going to investigate, we would appear.
We want you to investigate.
We don't think it's any problem.
But just tell us if you want to take 75 million dollars out of here, 100 million.
Uh, and then you come in four days later, it's a job.
It was ten days.
And then it woke up.
So, anyway, that was the call.
I hope you were given the tape.
I wish you as well.
Well, I think, uh, this is one of those times that I'll mention anything you've got, but I'm just telling you that for certain things, because they just, you know,
And I feel all right with this tender offering that I've been waiting on for a minute.
One of the things that was happening over here in Texas is corporate.
The other thing that you're trying to do is see where he's going to fall into.
I think he is.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know.
It's supposed to be an improvement.
Yeah, I think he is.
I think he is.
And the department is going to ask about it.
Yeah, I don't know what he's going to be saying.
I don't know what he's going to say.
Corporate is the part of it.
It's the part of it that I think is big.
And the young lawyer was Richard Keaton, whose father's dean at the University of Texas was.
Oh, yeah.
So they got along real well.
And I can understand that a lot, because they just cared for each other.
Anyway, that was the reason for it.
But back on the trading thing, I was saying that you're going to be pilloried here for, during this entire session,
Carl Haber comes out and says, you know, what have you done to the poor people and so forth, and all the press is going to pick this up, and cut down on this tracking system.
We're all in this demonstration here in the Johnson years.
I think for me, you're going to need some of the additions to more or less capture the imagination of people and do what you can do.
You stay in your game.
uh... uh...
from an economic standpoint than the other was from a diplomatic standpoint, because you've got so many more avenues and so many more countries involved.
And my God, if you ever get into it, I think you just see how you can be the builder of this country and use this country and its strength to get yourself and this country back on the side of the ground.
Because if we don't, I think we may have another financial crisis there trying to create one for you right now.
about it to get its all-time low, I guess, in whatever European market.
And for whatever else you say, the strength of this country, the diplomat in the military that you know I've discussed so many times, has found another strong economic base, and we don't have that, we don't have anything.
And all of these people who profess to be our friends, the Japanese, they're doing this death-forbidding trade that serves with us is outrageous.
Canada, with the two major services, outranged with the advantages they have over us.
And, uh, no less than a billionaires who could have said, and, uh, abroad.
Sir?
Abroad!
That's what I'm trying to, that's what I'm trying to, whatever it is.
And, uh, so I just would hope that you, that you give serious thought to, to those two areas, because I think the two areas where, where so much, uh, political aid can be made,
You can do it so well and so easy, and the need is going to be so apparent.
It's a trade in energy.
Trade in energy.
And I think it would be fascinating for both of them.
Well, it's necessary for both of us.
Yeah, really.
Yeah, really.
But it's good.
Of course, everybody's talking about it at the moment.
There are various studies that are being done.
I've got to take a look at it in terms of what you were suggesting here.
It may be that this idea of the government getting a discount is going to be an answer.
I just wonder if we can have American companies, big as they are, competing with each other, running around and so forth and so on, but without that stroke.
I don't think it would.
It's not a case of weapon of death.
It's a case of, I assure you, it's a case of death.
They have no weapons.
They're all in bed.
They're all in bed.
Sir Eric Drake, the British patrolman, says to Toby, he said, we're through.
He said, the time's fast.
We have no weapons.
We have the markets.
We have the mountains.
We have the transportation.
We have no know-how.
He said, every one of these companies now have a requirement of know-how, a requirement of technology.
They understand.
They understand every phase of the business.
There's a shortage now of crude worldwide, and we have no party to help us unless our heroes take over.
And I think that's basically the attitude of every American.
And so I just think it's a whole ballgame.
I know it is.
And it's going to be one that's going to be very interesting, very fascinating.
I think it's what we're going to win.
Yes, I'm sure.
Because we're going to win.
Because we've got the money.
I'm not sure everybody else has got it, but everybody wants to get in and crash the road.
There's not a big deal.
Large and small, I don't care.
And this nation, you've got to maintain the strength of the nation.
I don't think we should be saying this to you, because all of us work together.
But from an economic standpoint, we've never been split up.
Because Europe, my judgment, is in a state of moral decay, not economic decay.
They're not going to stand up to anybody, ever since.
That's your man.
That's your man.
I'm 10 years in king right now.
And so we're all under his.
And I heard the economics of Europe that we're in real trouble.
And we also do not have to maintain, as you speak of me, the moral dependence of Europe.
We've also got to look at the moral problems in this country.
Should I not be referring to old-fashioned morality in that disorder in any sense like that?
There are great forces in this country.
Forces that are represented basically by the old, new left, bad, rich people who
We're really very heavily behind government.
While they did not prevail, we have to remember that when it comes to the so-called better people in this country, intellectual leadership and so forth and so on, it's more than that.
That really is.
You have a problem with that.
That's what I was talking about before.
that God has got a lot of intellectual people that are informed.
And that's why, why we were able to survive.
It's the country's great day.
There's a lot more moral strength and character in the country than the media would have us believe, or that they would want us to believe.
The trouble with so many of the media, basically, is that the intellectual media knows the grounds of why Hitch and all the rest isn't, you know, they talk about the country that it's a
looking out the window of the country, they look in the mirror, they see themselves, they are going to, they see the country as a whole state, as a state, as a country, right?
And now, I said, I'm having said that about this, when you look at England, when you look at France, when you look at Europe, Canada, in our countries, they're all going to have, right?
There's no character out there.
There is no building procession.
Whatever we may think about the Russians, the Chinese, and their horrible systems, there's a lot of character.
Of course, there's a lot of character.
That's the big word is to give up the word.
See, I've been very lucid about how many missiles the Russians have, and how strong their air defense is.
And, you know, and characters.
That's what it is.
It's true.
We don't question that.
I want to use these things.
I don't care about the interviews, but there are going to be some times the territory will be very strong.
But what's rich is bad is, of course, the trade.
It means, on the trade end, of course,
other directions, the so-called can't-be-around-all-the-rests.
Well, you're suggesting both are in a protectionist line.
Well, are you?
Right.
So, I mean, it's an elective protectionist line.
Yes, sir.
It's fundamentally far too long for us to permit Japan to shoot radios in this country where she can soar to 96% of this market.
At a time when she would have gone to a ship
It's wrong.
When we tried for 20 years to get an insurance company to write a policy there, we haven't done it yet.
When they won't let us own banks there in any meaningful way, it's wrong.
When they won't let us run in our centers until the last year and find out how to pay the fee for any energy we want to talk about, they will not let us in that market.
And yet they should have been.
Their television, they've got about 80% of the television market in this country today.
96% of the radios, the tape recorders, the tape recorders, all this stuff.
So if we're talking about, if you shut that market down, I'll guarantee you there's all kinds of things.
It's all the leather you have.
But it's enormous leather.
But you have to use it.
Because this country has to use it.
If we don't get out of it, there's no way you're going to make a turnaround.
Canada's not going to do it.
All they do is sit up hard and say, what the best of us, what the best of we are, which they always do.
And Japan's going to say, he's got it all worked out.
The war's out.
He's going to say to you, well, you can't mix money and trade.
Well, by God, one results in the other, Mr. President.
That's why we've got money dropped.
Because we've got trade dropped.
That's why we had monetary problems.
If we didn't have a trade problem, we wouldn't have any deficits, and we wouldn't be worried about the dollar.
What happened to the markets in Europe yesterday?
And the U.S. said, well, obviously, you can't make some investment with all of this.
So this again is an old game that we're suffering from.
Because they pick us apart.
And all I say is I think time has come.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
You've got to do your job.
And I didn't have any circumstances before she could do it that I did.
But in the year I had, they're both errors.
I don't want to keep you out of this.
And all I'm suggesting is that you get ahead of the circumstances.
You should control that and so on.
And if you do, you ought to just progress right through it.
Rock it with a team of you.
And so, I didn't give Bill some strength.
I didn't give Tim some strength.
We're no different than anybody else.
Everybody follows a leader.
When a leader has courage, this is why we have lost a lot of courage.
We've got to give them a chance.
We've got to give them a chance.
They haven't touched anyone's strength so far.
And they don't know what strength is.
And I just thought this was very interesting.
the writers are already making their play and all they can do is make their own kind of show so they're going to say they're all kind of aesthetic
There you go.
That's nothing to be further from the truth.
Those are all companies that we've seen go wrong here.
Those are all companies that's beside the point.
But it's a bad plan.
I understand that.
I understand that.
The government was responsible for it, wasn't it?
The federal government?
Yes.
That's why we set up all of that.
It was a matter of back and forth between the Secretary of Labor and
And uh, the police signed the damn thing, quite candidly, because of the injection at the end of it, and the other one was exhausted.
Which, again, we're probably going to call.
Uh, I'm not sure if you mentioned it.
Yes, I remember it clearly, but... Well, it was an L import from Canada, an M import from here, an M import from that.
You know, I mean, basically, the charges are pretty tricky, you know.
Uh, so, uh, he's before, he'd be all right in a while, and then he'd leave the other way until the other one was free.
I'm not sure he will.
Have you talked to him?
I've talked to him this morning.
I've talked to him last year, I guess.
Not the same words, but the same thing.
He has not talked to me.
Not that he's going to have to be beat up.
No, that's what I meant.
I think he's got to step in.
George wants to get us a message.
I mean, your life was happening.
Your controls were damaged.
So we're supposed to know once they went ahead and supported him.
And so we hear that if we decide something, the general will have to decide.
If he's there, he's going to be the traitor in charge.
We're just going to go down and do it.
Unless it's humanity, he can understand it.
Unless I'm just waiting for him to know and understand it, he'll be able to say yes or no.
Good.
Let me talk to one man.
I don't know if I should be sure.
We'll see.
I told him to call you, but I don't know where he is.
I want you to talk to him.
Have you seen him?
No, sir.
I know that it's not a word, but he's a very great father.
What I want to do is to make an effect.
I want him to be an ambassador at large in that area.
I think you've got to, we've got to catch these little, little oil principalities, the Soviets, etc., etc.
And I don't know if there has to be a first base on this.
He's no expert on art, but he is an expert on governance, on covert activities, etc., etc.
He's now plunging in.
My request is to get into this whole business of the government.
And, uh, I heard, uh, what I'd like to do, what I'd ask you to do is to talk to you when you return from your trip.
I hear from, frankly, the whole area, all the way from, I mean, Iran to Algeria.
Uh, now, when I say the area, uh, you don't say this in public, but when I say the State Department, what I told him, he's not going out there the 1st of April.
I told him to get out and take us on the trip earlier than that.
I don't know where to take it from now, but if you were to spend maybe an hour with him and say, no, here's what the situation is, I don't know whether I'd want him in a position that I consider him to be the man in that area.
But we don't have anyone in that area at the present time among our ambassadors who understands or takes the view of the whole area.
So he's not on the committee.
Something is out there.
But I'll talk to her.
On the other hand, I told you that I wanted to look to you on the private side.
I've always said, well, I'm going to be shy.
And I cannot be.
I'm perfectly free to talk to you.
And I don't care, and I don't know, and I don't care who he represents or if they're going to be important or not important.
If I go here, I'm going to be dependent on him.
I don't know if it is true or not.
But everybody will understand that he was the former Secretary of the Treasury of the United States.
So I like him, and I want him to control as much as you can those oil companies.
I don't want somebody else coming into this place talking to Schultz or Herman or whoever we can get in this oil area finally.
Coming at us from the private oil side,
So if you would take in those terms, I'd like for you to do it.
We're getting in session.
And that's what I'd like to do.
I may do it.
I may want to go to the second one.
I may want to recess.
I may want to get out and have a group of maybe six people, maybe you from the outside.
Maybe you have somebody else from the outside.
I don't know.
Certainly I have shells.
Yes, sir.
All right.
I take that, too.
Thank you.
We've got to find out a few places that I understand.
That sounds like a horrible thing, but it's all good.
Oh, sure, it's actually not.
That's true.
So if you don't contain it, let me suggest this.
For lack of a man at the present time that I have the confidence in, I'd like to have John Hurd try to pull it together.
He will not run.
He's an investment counselor.
And we'll get a result soon, you know, in creation.
uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh... uh...
We can't say, but probably we have a Russian, we have a Chinese, we're all pushing.
But we've got a Russian, a Chinese, we have played a restraining role.
We did the whole thing.
They certainly cut the water off in Iraq and cut it off in Saudi Arabia, because all of the enemies were over-raised.
That's right.
They're fighting too long.
Sure.
Now,
Well, you know,
We should go into that.
There are more policy considerations that I'm not really aware of.
And you will have to talk to .
And so I would, I don't, I didn't.
But my aim was this, and I'm very pleased with it, and sure to help the Russians.
We can burn the hell out of the Chinese, and we have that problem.
But as I see it, in what you say is half true, and we assume that it's at least half true, we need what the hell the Russians have got.
No questions about it.
It's just, all right, if that happens, it's an overwhelming consideration, then it's going to diverge a lot of society, right?
And the Russians, get up to the Russians,
I think that it's over.
Everybody will say that, yeah, people voted too much in terms of the foreign policy consideration.
You know, what is this?
I mean, the Chinese matter.
Are we going to get the Japanese involved?
And that's not good.
And so forth and so on.
We'll go there and have those things.
I mean, we have to weigh those things, but they must not be totally controlled.
The foreign policy will be considered when we go to it.
I think I will delay those discussions and then we can talk about that.
But I think we might have a discussion on the other hand.
As far as the house is concerned, if you could just see, I'm just messing around, it's worthwhile.
Obviously, I want to have them educated and also, as I say, be able to understand what I'm trying to do.
Those guys are all rich out there.
They're all great.
how do you feel about Elf doing this?
Elf is not I've never felt a very strong very adult man totally an adult man he knows the game and you know it's hard to find a speaking part of a person that knows the game he's the best man that I could possibly think of now see I have a different business man but I also have a less than business man
And John and Dick as a matter of fact used to find a way to tell a side of Rick he was, you know what I mean, and understand him.
And if you put a guy that's in oil, they won't approve him, you know what I'm saying.
So I thought the helmsman just revealed he's the best guy we could go to, John.
And Dick, after all, Dick's been head of the CIA now for some time, so he's tried to fool himself and...
and the objectivity of analysis on both sides.
So years before, perhaps, the first weakness that he really is.
And they will be, first of all, I was privileged to talk to him by watching him.
uh... uh...
But now I think that he is, he recognizes that he's got a hell of an important assignment.
And you can talk to him cold-heartedly about the concerns that you and I have discussed.
What we want to do.
And he'll let you know.
I don't want to get too broad, too many, because I've heard you in the private auto companies and the rest, you know, they're great cities and all, and all sorts of possibilities.
People swoon about this and that and the other, but I don't want to add anything on here.
You see, the beauty of your position is that you're the only person representing, or in the private sector, who no one will question my opportunity to get advice from you.
If I got into, for example, a council for ESSO, or I know all these people, you know, that follow, you know, Sanford, Jersey, the Canadians, and Kansas, great guys.
Christ didn't say, well, I must be trying to push the stock.
I don't know.
Right?
So I think we've got a good deal here.
And I'm going to get you ready to do it.
I would like, too, if you could do it.
You wouldn't have any problem with it coming up for a couple days.
I don't want this to be limited to what I call an in-house bureaucratic thing.
And then I had talked to Sue, my ministerial suggestion, and he said, I want to bring that to, that he came and prompted me by.
And I mentioned him that I was, that I called him by.
And so, and I mentioned the leaders when I met them on the 3rd of January, 3rd of July.
negotiations that I've had with Dr. Jackson Simon.
He is the, he's basically the only, the only one I keep out there.
His son, his wife, he's got enough brains to work with.
But he's an honorable guy.
He has a broad gauge of all he thinks he is.
And, uh, and, uh, see, I wanted to get, get the Senate, uh, active on that, too.
And he had a postcard from, uh, from Tulsa, from the state, but I didn't get production.
No, no way.
Uh, any other, uh, any, uh, I'm trying to, one more time to suggest to you that you, this is a guy who's been stealing the light.
who is the best man in the world, has done quite a good job.
I hope to reach out to him.
We all can find a good spot for him.
I know it.
I know he's done it.
He said, I've seen him.
He's totally wrong.
Totally wrong.
And he's smarter than most people, give him credit.
I've seen him do it.
I had a very difficult circumstance when Richard Reynolds made a complete accident.
Great.
He had that problem.
Unbelievable.
In Jamaica, that was the prime minister.
He was the dinner party for the people.
And Vince handled himself exceedingly well.
And over a two-day period, I was down in the States.
I could get a spot of terror.
I was last to go somewhere.
I said, here, we can't get him out of the big pool.
We've already got a record of him.
We've already got a record of him.
We've already got a record of him.
Yes, sir.
He's a tough cookie.
Oh, I know he's a pro-marketer.
The State Department will be very strong on him.
He's a character, in a way.
No question about that.
But he don't have food.
We have him.
He's on our list.
Don't you worry.
I don't know whether I thought you had told him about the answer, though.
I didn't.
I don't think he has it, because we've had this problem with his son, Rich.
Oh, right, you know.
Let me prove it, I guess.
First I would wait, I would wait, but I'm sure it relates to our clients because I looked at the list and I knew it.
I wrote about it.
I remember the guys that sued us.
I'll leave a letter to Kevin Carey for one.
I mentioned to Bob already.
From King Friesland.
And he was speaking.
Yeah, let me get something to say.
I've spent an hour and 45 minutes with King Friesland.
And I'm hardly going to talk about it in the evening.
except he's right, he is obsessive and it's going to color everything he does and I don't care what anybody says this man talked, nothing but that I tried to get off, I talked about other problems Mr. Moore immediately come back and four of his advisors including Prince Bob who was supposed to go succeed they were all sitting there
And he just talked for one hour and 45 minutes.
That just was really, really strong.
He said, you're worried about communism.
He said, it's attacking you and your country.
He said, the whole secret of communism is science.
That's what created communism in the first place.
He said it's a creature of Zionism.
He just went on and on and on.
Even the next morning, I was sitting with his father, and his father said about an hour, an hour and a half with him, and he almost apologized.
He said, he said, well, it is a problem.
But he said, let me simply say to you, I'm afraid.
I don't think he's right in the United States.
We have no common cause in the United States.
to error in any common code.
But he said, let me also say to you that no responsible error leader, and certainly no irresponsible error leader, can ever develop or accept the status quo of the Israeli situation now.
They've got to do what's on their territory.
This was Prince Bob.
He said, nonetheless, they retreat.
That's all their territory is.
And he said, I'm bad, I'm sure.
And he was a very reasonable guy.
And I'll talk to him.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But do the marketing show, Mark?
Yes.
I want to hear.
I've talked to Chuck.
I've talked to Bob.
I've talked to you.
What suggestions do you have for me to grab the, uh, the, uh,
I would say that, I don't know if they're aware of what I'm talking about, but of course, on a Sunday day, it's still, at the present time, it's still getting on.
And I'd say to the U.S. Senate, we made some of the hard decisions, and I think we did some work on that.
But one thing, again, I'm just trying to check that.
Well, I'm sorry.
I had heard that Mrs. Johnson said yesterday, it comes up, or in her brain, it's a nice thought, that the president, or the president, to be honest with you, was dead at this time.
Yeah.
And that something was put out here by the press office to the effect that that, which
He did not deny it.
They weren't sure what he was referring to.
I want to tell you what happened in Africa.
It's a very nice story.
I called Johnson the last time I talked to him on the 2nd of January.
He had just been to Texas.
Well, it was a couple.
Couple.
And he was hoarse.
He said, and had a heart attack, or at least a heart seizure.
He said, I mean, I mean, I said, I'll let you get out.
He said, yes, I did.
I said, well, that just did mighty well.
He said, yeah, you're great.
And I told him at that time about, well, I, you know, I even told him about the fact that we were going back to the coaching table and
You know how he talks.
He says, well, this is, you know, what I prayed for.
He says, I know the agony must be going through all these attacks.
And I said, look, I know it's really agony.
I said, it's like you should not do the right thing.
I said, let me do something.
It's going to work out.
I said, it's all good.
Come back to this party and get back to me and Bob.
I said, are you ready to talk?
He said, I think you know very well.
That's why we did it.
He said, yeah, which is why I do it.
At that time I was just like, it's going to work out.
On the 15th of January.
After Henry returned from Paris, I knew it was locked, but I knew that Henry had to get back on Tuesday.
And I knew that he had also to, in order to, I had to pay, and I had to go see him once more.
Now that's the side of it that can't be told, but I, uh, I put in truth in the ring about that a little bit.
I'm sure you might have.
I'm sure you might have, but I'm okay with that.
And they carried out what was delivered the day before the inauguration, saying, you go on.
Or, these come.
This is the day.
And they go on.
Okay, they do it.
That's what happened then.
Was it off the pitch?
uh... uh... uh... uh... uh...
You know, the highlights.
So, and he said that two days, three days before he died, that the president, he was the president, he knew, first, that there was a rhetoric, and second, he had seen the substance of the agreement that he had, and that he died knowing that he was not only was at hand, but being at hand.
It's a nice story, but it really is.
but the other day they're going to hit you on the first in your context but let's see that story that came out and they asked me about the day I was walking around and I was trying to remember what happened and they said they had an inter-religion option and we should run this house he doesn't know anything about the political situation he was asked about and he said that the inter-religion
and records says that the election went on in 1976 and throughout the economy he was on as a solicitor and as a licensed idol and the president was always looking very highly at him when he was in their company but not in the same direction as 1976 so a couple of them, Jules Whitmore actually a solicitor and wrote a story to the effect that the president told a visitor to the White House recently that he supported Congress in 1976 and that was the story that busted yesterday
When they asked me about it, I just left.
I said, well, I'm here.
I'm just going to finish my lunch.
And I said, well, I have very much regard for this.
And I thought, well, I'm sitting here.
I said, well, I'm pretty sure that my advice to all cashiers is that between now and the 19th century, I'm really going to run for the Democrats when we come to the foundation.
The best way to get it is to do everything that you can to support the candidates for the House, the Senate, the Supreme Court, the Democratic Party, and then make that bill set before election time.
Make that rule run by the governor.
And I'll mention this.
That's the way I did it.
This isn't that successful.
Sometimes it's just not as successful.
So I'd like to know that.
Yeah.
So the inevitable question is, I think that's what they'll say.
That would be something that they will be happy to offer.
And so you bring in something from Vietnam or something like that.
And if I were you, I think it's very important, Sean, really not to, I mean, let me say the least of all,
And, uh, and of course there was not enough back-loading, but we used a lot of registration options, registration and so forth, and I'm thinking we could introduce that to our own country.
The reason is that it is not done.
There's on the A, there's a rock-and-ball footer, and there, in rock-and-ball days ago, I convinced a man who was apparently going to go home to some city, and he was just in the water, and so forth.
uh, they are, and uh, and I know your own feelings, I mean, I mean, frankly, I understand this, we don't want to be subject to you, but on the other hand, uh, you, I think, are going to have to face that problem, I, I think you're going to have to face it, uh, not November 7th or, but you're going to have to say, well, uh, in order to, uh,
You're going to have to be a Republican candidate, and you're going to be nominated for the election.
Now, uh, the head of the executive committee before, Ken, was nominated, but he was not, you know, uh, and Dale Burry before that.
He's not a nomination.
his mind and so forth, he played it a little differently.
He could probably, might, might get nominated.
Oh, I'm serious about it.
Eric, well, it's, uh, Eric, uh, rock hard, he's 67 years of age.
Great, he's 67.
That's just damn old for this office.
Uh, who else you got?
Hillary.
Well, Hillary might, might go, but, uh,
He might be not in the mail, but I'd like to proceed.
I would like to close him.
I would like to close him.
And I must say, so I just want you to know that I really feel that with all of your, I don't know, your interests and my other interests and the rest, that this country, this country is going to need some accountability for the rest of the camp.
But, you know, holding the line, even John, now he looks like he doesn't get enough.
So I just want to trust you there.
I didn't put it in my own terms, but I mentioned it.
And I saw the way that I made the official call case announcement when I said to Johnson, you were the official of the delegation.
The delegation he had was redundant.
Here's what I had to do.
I edited my own part, as he did.
But I had, on this case, merged with the other side, and the media, and the intellectuals, the marketers around the White House, and all that sort of connection, and so forth.
But it had to be true, because the United States, by looking at the other Vietnam, as I told you, Japan, Eastern, as I was trying to get some of this, Japan, and I'm going to make some statements, ask them to treat us as if we were the same.
because we don't have any other recommendations.
But I said the United States did not demonstrate that it was a good ally, a good ally with a small country like Vietnam.
Do you, Japan, think that we would be a good ally when the risks were much greater if you were gone?
with the British and so, with the French and so, the rest.
I said, what was involved in Vietnam, of course, was the future of Vietnam, but what was also involved, and whether or not, basically, Mark Johnson and Kennedy both went in, mostly for bad communist government being opposed to Vietnam.
We could have settled the war four years ago, or even up until October the 8th, until October the 8th.
What the communists insisted upon, the North Indian communities, was the immunization of the communist government.
That was their promise.
There was no way for us to get our prisoners back.
No way to get out.
And that, of course, would have had a victory for the communists.
The immunization of the communist government, 70, 50 people.
And it would have meant this is the North Indian thing.
The crushing defeat.
We would have let down an ally of the FBI.
There would have been a great sense of relief.
The point that I make is that they
as an enormous state in the United States coming out in Vietnam.
Vietnam has hit high because by demonstrating that we were a dependable ally in Vietnam, we demonstrate that we will be a dependable ally in Europe and in Japan.
And it's that structure we've evolved.
And so also, first of all, there's a shout out for us about the Russians and Chinese.
They know that at the present time, this White House is not going to be deterred by the public, by anything else, by an election, by an inauguration, by whatever the case might be, and we want to be right to maintain our commitments.
And, well, having said all that, too, as we look around the world today, there is no free world here.
The First Amendment is a country strong enough.
either the jury, and I shouldn't be that way, but it's very clear, and so far, and that's the hard part, to take this position.
So it's all right here.
It's got to be the president, whoever it is.
I've gotten to a lot, and it will certainly be the case, a liberal Democrat, and that would be Kennedy, because he probably had too much, or somebody like Mondale, who
to the President of the United States about what it will do to the economy, but what it will do to the chances for freedom, for peace, with freedom, to survive, because whatever we may make, whatever we may make of the attitudes of other people, you know, you and I,
But as far as the Chinese are concerned, the only reason I mention the word is because they hate us.
That means they hate the Russians.
They don't hate the Russians.
They don't hate the Russians.
The worst is because they're worried about the Chinese, but they're the future also.
They're trying to serve Europe better.
And the only reason that they will talk to us is that we're worth talking to.
The moment that the United States breaks down its alliance, weakens its defenses, it no longer is worth talking to.
actually working this out, you know.
Well, I'm digressing.
It's one of those, it'd be hard to say, but it'd probably be a chance to, but it does get down to your own position and what you've done, you know, because you've, that hit is something that, after all, you've given a lot to your city, to your country, but the rest, when you look around, when you look around this city at the present time, the, I can't even say to you,
And I, and I, and I have noticed, and I've seen all of the notices and posts of us, uh, in our field, that's observable.
And that's all that we can, that we are.
I think that raises the idea that I've got to be a little careful on that, because he talks too hard about it.
The point is that, uh, that, uh, I think that it's one of those things where the advances are moving, it's actually moving in that direction.
And it doesn't mean that you've got to move, sorry about that, it doesn't mean that you've got to play in such a way that the doors open and they can move at the right time according to the person.
So that's really where it stands.
I'm hurt for what I do.
I've done a lot of things about it.
Eddie and I have talked about it.
Frankly, I've talked to some of my very closest friends.
George Christian, Larry Temple, some of those others that have been politically associated with it for many years.
They all think it's great.
I don't think it's a choice.
I don't think it's a real choice.
I don't think in my lifetime, I don't think the Democratic Party will ever come back to being what I stand for.
I don't think I'd ever be in my lifetime being comfortable with the Democratic Party.
I don't think it's a good question, but I have, from my standpoint, I trust that all future political aspirations aside, just on the basis of what you stand for, what you'd like to see preserved and protected and promoted in this country, I think I have to believe in the Democratic Party.
Now, the common independent is no Asian, so the only, it's a two-party country.
I'm prepared to do it.
I don't know when to do it.
I wouldn't
I have thought about it in a low key way.
I talked to the client each yesterday and Dick talked about this very thing.
I thought he did.
Yes he did.
He suggested that the way to do it and I will do that.
I think there ought to be a
It's a steady sort of thing.
I mean, it always has to come out casually.
It's a fairly casual thing.
And I mean, I don't know what I'll do tomorrow, because I really need to talk to you.
You need to serve us.
I really need to let some people know it.
And I think it's pretty mature to do it tomorrow.
But I'll get back and we can probably sort of just show you the time.
all I have to do is spit out your questions and just say, yeah, there he is.
Now, I don't know if he has any more stories, but yeah, I'm sure he does.
That might be the best thing I can do.
The rest is still a lot.
So, but I think it's now fairly soon.
I don't know.
I agree.
I think that's going to be very hard.
I think it's a big time.
I think it's very dark.
I think that's strange enough that Johnson passed away.
Yeah, makes it a lot easier.
Absolutely.
Makes it a lot easier.
I can see that before that it was going to be terribly difficult.
Well, it would have been technically difficult for Texas.
Yeah, yeah.
You see, it would have put us in a judgmental position in Texas.
You know, one thing, too, I think that it's a rather curious thing, how tragedies go inside, where it's very healthy.
I think that's nice, right, in that very interesting situation.
I, uh, I have a nurse and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a, and a,
Your assistance and your demeanor during the general service that I was here for, Johnston, were excellent.
You were just superb.
And when you met Ms. Johnston, I tell you, it's a great pleasure to talk to you about it.
Everybody talked about it.
Everybody talked about it.
Well, I'll talk a little bit.
Maybe you can talk to the council about what's going on.
All right.
But I would propose that you go forward.
Keep the doors open.