{"conversationCode":"859-025","tapeNumber":859,"conversationNumber":25,"identifier":"37-wht-conversation-859-025","startDateTime":"1973-02-21T16:16:00.000Z","endDateTime":"1973-02-21T16:17:00.000Z","startDate":"21-Feb-1973","startTime":"11:16 AM","endDate":"21-Feb-1973","endTime":"11:17 AM","dateCertainty":"certain","timeCertainty":"certain","participants":"Nixon, Richard M. (President); Ziegler, Ronald L.;","description":"On February 21, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon and Ronald L. Ziegler met in the Oval Office of the White House from 11:16 am to 11:17 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 859-025 of the White House Tapes.","locationCode":"OVAL","recordingDevice":"Oval Office","latitudeEstimated":38.8974,"longitudeEstimated":-77.0374,"chronCode":"5.4","chronRelease":"Fifth Chronological Release: Part IV","chronReleaseDate":"8-Dec-2010","aogpRelease":null,"aogpSegment":null,"lastModified":"2015-07-27T17:04:10.235Z","findingAid":"Conversation No. 859-25\n\nDate: February 21, 1973\nTime: Between 11:16 am and 11:17 am\nLocation: Oval Office\n\nThe President talked with Ronald L. Ziegler.\n\n[See Conversation No. 43-147]","filename":["859-025.mp3"],"tapeStart":"","tapeEnd":"","participantsList":["Nixon, Richard M. (President)","Ziegler, Ronald L."],"prevCode":"859-024","nextCode":"859-026","transcript":[{"start":17.27,"end":24.27,"text":"I really feel that we should come down against the thing that we all decided now."},{"start":24.29,"end":35.28,"text":"And the fact that, for example, Henry's point was that it would just raise the metric for our level and so forth."},{"start":35.34,"end":35.64,"text":"Much agreed."},{"start":36.12,"end":40.25,"text":"Now, the other point is you get the other ball in."},{"start":40.27,"end":42.95,"text":"Now, the other point is, though, they can't."},{"start":42.97,"end":43.99,"text":"Now, the other thing is, I love it for me."},{"start":51.28,"end":55.83,"text":"I would have to be sure."}],"aiSummary":{"text":"President Nixon and Press Secretary Ronald Ziegler briefly consulted on a strategic decision regarding a previously discussed policy matter. The President expressed a firm stance on rejecting a proposal, citing concerns raised by Henry Kissinger about its potential negative impact on established metrics. The discussion concluded with a brief internal agreement to proceed with this rejection.","topics":["Policy Strategy","Henry Kissinger","White House Communications","Decision Making"],"generatedAt":"2026-04-08T01:27:27.502Z"},"topicSlugs":["policy-strategy","henry-kissinger","white-house-communications","decision-making"],"audioDurationSec":66,"audioFiles":[{"file":"859-025.mp3","bytes":1575711,"durationSec":65.53,"bitrate":192355,"missing":false}],"audioIsShared":false,"audioProbedAt":"2026-09-18T02:20:00.696Z","audio":["https://nixon.nyc3.digitaloceanspaces.com/audio/859-025.mp3"],"url":"https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/859-025","nixonLibraryUrl":"https://www.nixonlibrary.gov/white-house-tapes/859/conversation-859-025","license":"Public domain (U.S. Government work). AI-generated fields (transcript, aiSummary) are provided as-is without warranty."}