Conversation: 908-013
Prev: 908-012 Next: 908-014Start Date: 1-May-1973 10:44 AM
End Date: 1-May-1973 12:24 PM
Participants:
Nixon, Richard M. (President); Brandt, Willy; [Unknown person(s)]; Kissinger, Henry A.; Bahr, Egon; Sanchez, Manolo;Recording Device: Oval Office
NARA Description:
On May 1, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, Willy Brandt, unknown person(s), Henry A. Kissinger, Egon Bahr, and Manolo Sanchez met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:44 am to 12:24 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 908-013 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid:
Conversation No. 908-13
Date: May 1, 1973
Time: 10:44 am - 12:24 pm
Location: Oval Office
The President met with Willy Brandt. The recording began at an unknown time while the
conversation was in progress.
May Day
-Riots, demonstrations
-West German holiday
-Compared to Labor Day
-Parades
-New York
-Communists
West Germany elections
-Communists
-Brandt’s previous victory
An unknown man entered at an unknown time after 10:44 am.
Photographers
Henry A. Kissinger
The unknown man left at an unknown time before 10:50 am.
Brandt’s schedule
-National Press Club
-Senate Foreign Relations committee
-13-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Travel
-New York
-Reception at embassy
-Airplane flight
West Germany economy
-Inflation
An unknown man entered at an unknown time after 10:44 am.
Press photographs
-Frequency
Kissinger
Photographs
-State dinner
-Grand Ballroom
-Color
The unknown man left at an unknown time before 10:50 am.
Year of Europe
Ostpolitik
Mutual and Balanced Force Reduction [MBFR]
President’s schedule
-Brandt
-Meeting with Leonid I. Brezhnev
-President’s domestic problems
-Compared to Die Spiegel affair [Speigel-Affare]
Domestic politics
-Campaigns
-14-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
Year of Europe
-US-Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR] summit
-MBFR
-Conference on Security and Cooperation in Europe [CSCE]
-President’s travel to Europe
-West Germany
Berndt von Staden
-Estonia
-Wife
-Experience in US
Kissinger and Egon Bahr entered at 10:50 am.
Greetings
Bahr
-Kissinger
President’s, Brandt’s political experience
-Domestic problems
-“Big play”
-Comeback
-Previous meeting
-Bonn
Agenda
-Bi-lateral relations
-Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT]
-Economics
-Middle East
-Energy problems
-Oil dependence
US-Europe relations
-President’s request for Brandt’s view
-US Congress
-15-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
-Budget cuts
-MBFR, CSCE
-Japan
-Kissinger’s speech
-Economic power
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
[National security]
[Duration: 7 s ]
JAPAN
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
*****************************************************************
US-Europe relations
-NATO
-Unilateral troop reductions
-MBFR
-Off-set agreement
-State Department, Foreign Office
-George P. Shultz, Helmut H. W. Schmidt
-Role of Finance Ministers
-Schmidt’s previous role as Defense Minister
-Renewal
-State Department, Foreign Office roles compared to Treasury
-Military and economic independence
-NATO and MBFR
-Kissinger’s speech
-16-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-International Monetary Fund [IMF] meeting in Nairobi, Kenya
-Meeting of Finance Ministers
-Preparation
-Reform
-Role of Great Britain, France
-Trade policy
-US Congress
-Trade bill
-European Economic Community [EEC]
-Commission policy
-West Germany’s, Great Britain’s position
-Trade liberalization
-France, West Germany
-Agriculture compared to industry
-Gen. Charles A. J. M. de Gaulle
-Great Britain’s entry
-Trade liberalization
-France
-Free trade compared to protectionism
-EEC
-Common compared to national foreign policies
-Trade, defense, foreign policy
-Paris Conference
-European Union
-US reaction
-President’s visit
-EEC compared with NATO
-Precedent
-NATO meeting reflecting Head of State quality
-Meeting with Georges J. R. Pompidou, Brandt, Edward R.
G. Heath
-Brussels
-Informal meetings about trade, monetary policy
-EEC Chairman’s attendance
-“Big Four”
-Timing
-17-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 10:50 am.
Refreshment
Sanchez left at an unknown time before 12:24 pm.
Europe
-President’s possible visit
-Schedule
-Individual countries
-Summit
-Brussels
-Atlantic Charter
-France
-Brandt’s forthcoming speech to National Press Club and Senate Foreign
Relations Committee
-Discussions with President
-Herbert G. Klein and Ronald L. Ziegler
-Pompidou and Heath
-NATO input
-Duration
-President’s possible visit
-Schedule
-National capitals
-Brussels
-Scandinavia
-NATO meeting
-West Germany, France, Great Britain, and Italy
-Heath, Pompidou, Brandt, Guilio Andreotti
-Politics
-Elections
-Italy
-Constitutions
-Terms of office
-France, West Germany
-Elections
-1976
-18-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-West Germany, US, France
-President’s visit
-EEC
-Council
-Foreign Ministers
-Chairman [?]
-Commission
-President
-Francois-Xavier Ortoli
-Council Meeting
-President’s chairmanship
-Pompidou’s objection
-Bahr
-Otto von Bismark
-NATO and EEC meetings
-William P. Rogers, Walter Scheel
-Foreign Ministers
-European voting bloc
-US problem
-Informal discussions
-Dinner party
-Demonstrations
-Vietnam War
-Great Britain’s, France’s response
-President’s meeting with Pompidou
-Timing
-Iceland
-Azores
-President’s, Brandt’s experience
-Compared to Greenland
-Brandt’s meeting with Heath
-President, Leonid I. Brezhnev
-Brandt’s meeting with Pompidou
-President
-Kissinger’s contact with Sir Burke Trend
-Consensus
-Heath and Pompidou
-19-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-NATO compared with EEC
West Germany’s bi-lateral relations
-East Germany
-Ratification
-Czechoslovakia
-Munich Agreement
-USSR support
-Scheel
-CSCE Foreign Ministers’ meeting
-Helsinki
-USSR, Warsaw Pact
-Hungary and Bulgaria
-Diplomatic relations
-Warsaw Pact agreement
-Czechoslovakia
-USSR
-Meeting with Brezhnev
-Kissinger
-Agreements, principles of cooperation
-Cultural and scientific exchange
-Air traffic
-Political exchange
-France
-Meeting with Brezhnev
-Status of Berlin
-East Germany’s Communist Party
-Relations with USSR, West Germany
-CSCE
-Helsinki
-Vienna
-Brezhnev’s letter to President
-Dates for Foreign Ministers’ meeting
-Pompidou, Brandt
-Andrei A. Gromyko’s appointment to Politburo
-Foreign Minister
-CSCE results
-20-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Reply to Brezhnev’s letter
CSCE
-USSR viewpoint
-Detente
-Disintegration
-Romania, Poland, Hungary
-Problem of euphoria
-Danger
-Helsinki talks
-NATO
-Integration
Neo-isolationism in US
-President’s meeting with Congress
-NATO, foreign aid
-Past agenda
-Vietnam War
-Peace agreement
-Moscow, Peking summits
-Internationalists
-John J. McCloy, [First name unknown] Clay [?], Dean G.
Acheson
-Unilateral disarmament
-Michael J. (“Mike”) Mansfield
-Disagreement
-Vietnam
-Europe
-Pacifism, Communism
-Impact of US domestic politics
US-Europe relations
-NATO
-US credibility
-Neo-isolationism
-Economic confrontation
-Military cooperation
-21-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Impact of domestic politics
-West Germany, US
-Public opinion
-Post-World War II generation
-Idealism compared with realism
-Public statements
-Hope
-Negotiations with USSR
-Leadership
-Brandt
-President
-Public support
-Congressional relations
-Brandt
-West Germany’s strength
-Ostpolitik
-US role in Europe
-President
-Congressional relations
-Bi-partisan Congressional leadership meeting
-Moscow, Peking summits
-Vietnam War
-Isolationism
-US strength
-Compared to Brezhnev
-Impact of domestic politics
-Public opinion problems
-Detente
-USSR
-Trade
-Wheat, gas, scientific exchanges
-Confrontation
-Quid pro quo
-USSR’s objectives
-US-Europe divisiveness
-Impact of domestic politics
-Public opinion
-22-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-West Germany
-Anti-Americanism
-Polls
-Brandt’s speech at National Press Club
-Contents
-US military in West Germany
-Nuremberg
-Delegations to US ambassador
-Bonn
-F. J. Strauss
-[Christian Socialist Union]
-Compared to West Germany military
-Land use issues
-Peasants
-Opposition
-Social Democratic Party Congress
-Brandt’s foreign policy
-Support and opposition
-Pacifism
-NATO
-USSR
-Brezhnev
-Goals
-Divisiveness between Western Europe and US
-NATO and Warsaw Pact alliances
-Contradictions
-Romania
-Stability
-People’s Republic of China [PRC]
-USSR Communist Party Central Committee resolution
-Population of Siberia
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
[National security]
-23-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
[Duration: 49 s ]
PRC
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
*****************************************************************
US bilateral relations with PRC, USSR
US-Europe relations
-USSR viewpoint
-Berlin
-US presence
-Berlin Agreement
-US role
-MBFR and CSCE
-Changes since 1969
-MBFR
-Superpowers compared to “indigenous” forces
-Georg Leber [Defense Minister]
-Domestic considerations
-West Germany compared to Czechoslovakia and Poland
-NATO
-Symbolic cut
-Kissinger and Bahr consultations
-Defense ministers
-US studies
Middle East
Josip Broz Tito
-24-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 3
[National security]
[Duration: 6 s ]
INTELLIGENCE
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 3
*****************************************************************
Josip Broz Tito
-Stroke
-Brandt’s meeting
-Lifestyle
-Elizabeth II [Elizabeth, Queen of England]
-Whiskey
-Yugoslavia’s political integrity
-Message for President
-Middle East
-Anwar El-Sadat’s problems
-Egypt’s military
-Electability
-Mammer Qaddafi
-Libya
-Religious fanatic
-Nationalist
-Morocco
-Hassan II [Hassan, King of Morocco] [Moulay]
-Brandt’s meeting when foreign minister
-Military deployment
Middle East
-25-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Syria, Iraq
-Military build-up
-Brandt’s meeting with [Unintelligible name]
-Baghdad
-Political negotiations
-Tito
-Meetings with Nahum Goldmann
-Jewish World Congress
-Influence in Israel
-Impact on Yugoslavia [?]
-Foreign Ministers’ meeting
-Bahr and Kissinger
-US negotiation efforts
-Arabs
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4
[National security]
[Duration: 9 s ]
NEGOTIATIONS
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4
*****************************************************************
Middle East
-US negotiation efforts
-Talks
-Leaks
-Publicity
-Brandt’s visit
-26-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Scheel’s trip to Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon
-Brezhnev’s vist to West Germany
-Brandt’s visit to Israel
-Postponement due to elections
-Arab opposition and support
-Hafiz Ismail
-Sadat
-Request for Brandt’s moderating influence
-Israel’s election
-Oil
-World consumption
-Energy crisis if regional instability
-Peace negotiations
-US role
-President’s priority
-Israel’s survival
-Critique of intransigence
-Pressure on Israel
-Golda Meir
-Settlement
-West Germany’s support
-Israel’s position
-Territory
-Security guarantee
-Palestinians, Arabs, USSR
-USSR’s military support
-US military support
-Sixth Fleet
-Inevitability
-US public opinion
-Aid to Israel
-Balance of power
-Congressional support
-New York Times position
-USSR’s role
-Brezhnev
-Domestic political opposition
-27-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Cooperation with US
-Imposed settlement
-Israel’s opposition
-Pressure on Israel, Egypt
-Intransigence
-Support for Eygpt
-Expulsion of USSR’s military advisors
-Support for Sadat
-Cooperation with US
-US role
-Private talks
-Pressure on Israel
-Compared to Egypt
-Palestinians
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5
[National security]
[Duration: 30 s ]
PALESTINIANS
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 5
*****************************************************************
Middle East
-Peace negotiations
-Israel
-Abilities
-Ethos
-Election
-28-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-President’s meeting with Meir
-US military aid
-Air planes
-Military
-Courage
-Historical example
-Masada
-US-West Germany’s efforts
Energy
-US-West Germany meeting
-Kissinger and Bahr
-President’s message to Congress on energy policy
-Domestic issues
-US study
-President’s Statement on Energy and Natural Resources
-US market regulation
-Free competition
-Standard Oil of New Jersey, Texaco
-Compared to West Germany, Great Britain, Japan
-Producing nations
-Consuming nations
-Condominium [?]
-Competition
-Iran
-Mohammed Reza Pahlavi [Shah of Iran]
-Libya
-Algeria
-Expropriation
-France
-El Paso Natural Gas
-US influence
-Industry regulation
-US corporations
-International cooperation compared to competition between consuming
nations
-US and France
-29-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)
Conversation No. 908-13 (cont’d)
-Netherlands and Japan
-Production
-Price
-Saudi Arabia
-Kissinger’s meeting with Minister of Oil Production
*****************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6
[National security]
[Duration: 10 s ]
OIL PRODUCTION AND INVESTMENT
END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6
*****************************************************************
Energy
-US policy
-Diversification
-Coal
-Delay
-Compared to West Germany
State dinner
-President’s remarks, Brandt’s remarks
The President et al. left at 12:24 pm.
-30-
NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM
Tape Subject Log
(rev. October-2012)