Conversation 911-004

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Nothing's more important.

Wait till you guys get a better view.

I wanted you to be Secretary of Defense.

selling problems are because these are not just anything of my own feeling.

When I came out here before, I put the Hewlett-Packard stock that I had in a terrible trust, a two-year trust under the terms of which all of the income from the stock went to charity.

And in order to sort of assure that nothing that was done while I was here would include my benefit in regard to this stock,

I also agreed to give the charity any appreciation of the stock.

In other words, the value of the stock when it came out of the trust was more than the ones that I made.

I agreed to give that to the charity.

So on a note of this, did I receive either any income or any appreciation?

And it's when I went to present this appreciation, I gave away about $18 million in pushes.

One of the reasons that I thought I had this idea is because some things have been happening in the economy.

I didn't know the economy was going up.

I didn't know there was money in the economy.

So just to give you a little calibration, I had stayed another year and made $200 million out of this stuff.

And that seemed to me, and I anticipated that, and that's the way it came out.

Now, the first problem is that

The short-term trust, the terrible trust, was taken out in the Revenue Act of 1969, so that mechanism is no longer available.

And where I don't see, well, in the first place, there's no possibility of selling this stock under these conditions.

And I don't see any basis on which I can insulate myself from this, and it isn't just whether the Senate

I don't see any ways that can be done again.

I've talked to Mel about this and he's troubled with it.

So that, now I'm going to talk to Senator Stennis today, and I will explore this, but I wanted you to understand that is a very difficult problem, and not just in terms of what the Senate would do, but, you know, especially in these times, if I came back here with someone I could like,

If I had any question to it, it wouldn't be good.

I think it might be true of almost any of you, but even accepting your confidence in me, one of the reasons that I think I did it,

The second problem is with Mr. Hewlett.

He and I have been partners for 30 years now.

He agreed to take over the responsibility, not only for the company, but for some other things that we've had in common.

He was very enthusiastic about my coming out in 69, and he was very unenthusiastic about it today.

Now that, I think, could be handled, but

It would involve my having to impose on him again.

I don't want to bother you with all of these details.

I am going to talk to Bill Rogers, to Elliot, and to Senator Stennis.

But I don't see any way in which this talk can be handled at this time.

Now, there are...

some other things that I think I'd like to mention.

If I did come out, and if I could work these things out, I would definitely want it understood that I don't have the complete control of the appointments in the department.

I couldn't tell him that he had any cases, and especially under these times.

That would be essentially legal.

There are two other possibilities.

If I couldn't work it out for the full time, it might be feasible to work out something that would be acceptable on a transition.

I could come out here and spend some time helping

about some of these problems, I could come out and spend a substantial amount of time and get into some of these specific things.

I could help lucky perhaps up on the Hill, some of the issues on the budget and these other matters, and I could do that without any question.

That would have to be, of course, subject to whether the people over at the Pentagon and you felt that would be of any value to you.

Yeah, you see, that would help.

You know, the last, I see, the last couple months, I stayed over after my official resignation.

I'm helping now, and I was able to do some things there that would help, would be helpful.

And I could do that, and I do want to see that, if we can't work on anything else.

I'd like to assure a fair man, Mr. Kestrel, he's

You need to talk to Bill, talk to, I'm going to talk to Bill, and I'm going to have lunch with Senator Severson.

But you don't see any way that it could work?

I don't see any way.

No, but you don't have any other candidates, do you?

No, ma'am.

There really isn't, by any chance.

What about Ken Ross?

I think that the combination of Ken and Clements wouldn't be too bad.

My judgment is that I didn't get too out of play with Rush, but he understands some of the international aspects of the job, and I think Clements understands some of the other side of the job.

I think the combination would not be too bad.

and that would be a circumstance in which I would sit in the room, help them, and your father would help them.

I'll tell you what you do.

First year, first choice.

I think you'd be a much better man.

You'd be an awful lot to us.

It's just too complicated for me to understand.

But we have to decide very soon.

Well, I think this matter that I want to talk to Bill Rogers, I want to talk to Elliot, and I'm going to do all that today.

Fine.

So I can let you know.

Well, at the end of the day or tomorrow, whether George thinks there's anywhere...

I'll be...

I'll be gone until I report to the argument.

No, no, no.

Oh, you mean you're trying to phone...

I mean, I'll be in Florida, but I'm going to put the White House phone in.

And I'm available with this description at any time you want.

I'm just... Let me put it this way.

They can possibly do it.

Possibly do it.

And if you can't do it, I'll understand.

Well, I'm not going to give you that heart or so all of a sudden...

I don't want to help you.

It'll work out.

Yeah, well, I know it'll work out.

But at the end of the day, it's pretty hard, you know, to have to take two of the decent men, like all of them, and early ones.

And eventually it had to be done.

But you agreed.

Well, I, well, I did.

It's one of the things that I think that you might feel would be helpful.

Uh-huh.

and tell them where it stands to release the names of the donors prior to April 7th.

I told you at that time.

Now, I think, well, I know, I know my old dad.

I've talked to him.

He feels he has a commitment to those people that their names wouldn't be released.

But I think the issue is bigger than that now.

And you didn't make that commitment to them.

I think you ought to tell them to do it.

If I told them to do it, the moment it rose,

You know, in the spring, I said, Marty, put it out.

But I told him, I don't know, maybe he's got names in there.

He goes, what?

What the hell?

What difference does it make?

That's right.

I think it's critical that be done.

I think it would be, I think it would be a very secondary thing if you told him or if you made it public that you told him.

And if there's some names on there, that's a problem, but I think we'd better get one out right now.

Because the collider, I don't know what it might have been.

You know, those vestal things, the damage from being ever hurt, the...

Whether he did or didn't, I haven't gotten that to my home.

But believe me, we have what a shocking outfit he is.

They're all sorts of people that either want to get money, they don't get a thing out of us.

We don't really know.

Well, I hope you understand that if I can't do this, I will only be a cause sign.

I just don't see any way in which I think you'll stand the light of the scoop in here.

I think that's very important at this time.

You really don't think so?

Well, you know, that other arrangement was absolutely clean.

There was no way that anybody could criticize that.

And that mechanism just isn't available.

I'll explore this very carefully with Senator Stanton, and I think he'll be sympathetic.

or anything that might be all right, but so far I haven't really seen any way it can be done.

And I can agree to give away the income, but then it gets all complicated to the taxable.

Well, I don't want to argue.

Well, I'll tell you, I appreciate what you've done.

I'm going to work on it.

I'll talk to the rest of you.

Good.

Let me know.

You can do this or do whatever else you can.

I appreciate it, David.

I appreciate you taking that long flight.

Do it if you can.

That's quite no problem.

I certainly will.

Thank you.

Thanks a lot.