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Conversation: 733-003

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Start Date: 14-Jun-1972 10:04 AM

End Date: 14-Jun-1972 11:07 AM

Participants:

Rogers, William P.Kissinger, Henry A.[Unknown person(s)]Nixon, Richard M. (President)White House operatorMcClellan, John L.

Recording Device: Oval Office

Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 01:31:30

Full Tape Conversation End Time: 02:36:33

NARA Description:

On June 14, 1972, William P. Rogers, Henry A. Kissinger, unknown person(s), President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and John L. McClellan met in the Oval Office of the White House from 10:04 am to 11:07 am. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 733-003 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 733-3

Date: June 14, 1972
Time: 10:04-11:07 am
Location: Oval Office

William P. Rogers met with Henry A. Kissinger.
                                              9

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. Jan-02)

     Refreshments

     Vietnam
     -Kissinger’s meeting with Andrei A. Gromyko
          -Meeting between the President and Leonid I. Brezhnev
                -Nguyen Van Thieu
                -Prisoners of war [POWs]
          -Hanoi
                -Nikolai V. Podgorny’s forthcoming visit
          -US response to Soviet Union proposals

An unknown man entered and left at an unknown time.

     Kissinger's plans
          -Possible meetings with the Soviet Union
          -People’s Republic of China [PRC]
                -Consultations
          -Reaction to Podgorny trip to Hanoi
          -Kissinger’s forthcoming trip to PRC
                -Podgorny’s trip

     John B. Connally
          -Possible trip

     Vietnam
          -Bombing
              -PRC reaction
              -Press reactions
              -Military

     Kissinger’s meeting with Eisaku Sato
          -Briefing for Rogers
          -Takeo Fukuda
          -Press conference

     International Labor Organization [ILO]
           -Kissinger’s memorandum
           -Rogers’s memorandum
           -Charles Colson
           -George Meany

     Rogers’s forthcoming trip
         -Austalia, New Zealand and the US [ANZUS]
                                            10

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. Jan-02)                Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)


     Kissinger’s forthcoming briefing for Congressmen
          -Gerard C. Smith
                -Presence
                -Forthcoming testimony

The President entered at 10:12 am.

     Rogers
         -Health
              -Lee Trevino

     Rogers forthcoming trip to Asia
         -Southeast Asia Treaty Organization [SEATO] meeting
         -The President's earlier trip to Poland
                -Yugoslavia
                -SEATO
                      -Canberra
         -Timing
                -Congress
                -Democratic National Convention
         -Possible itinerary
                -Indonesia
                -Indochina
                      -Cambodia
                      -Laos
                -Persian Gulf
                      -Bahrain
                      -Iran
                            -Mohammed Reza Pahlavi [Shah of Iran]
                      -Spiro T. Agnew
                            -Kuwait
                -Romania And Yugoslavia
                      -Request for Rogers
                -Hungary
                -Czechoslovakia
                -Cyprus
                -Ceylon
                      -Relations with India
                      -Visit by US officials
                      -The President's 1953 trip to Colombia
                      -Compared to Switzerland
                -Greece
                                       11

                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                Tape Subject Log
                                  (rev. Jan-02)              Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

                -North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
          -Turkey
          -Political considerations
          -SEATO
                -Sir Alexander F. Douglas-Home
          -ANZUS
          -Indonesia
                -Japanese
                      -Sato
                      -Takeo Fukuda

Rogers forthcoming trip
    -Ceylon
           -US relations
                 -Robert Strausz-Hupe
    -Afghanistan
           -Visit by Rogers
           -John B. Connally
                 -Pakistan
                 -Bangladesh
    -Shah
           -Persian Gulf
    -Romania and Yugoslavia
           -Soviet Union reactions
           -Visit by Rogers
           -Josip Broz Tito
                 -Moscow
           -Gromyko
                 -Paris
           -Yugoslavia
                 -US relations
                 -Romania
                       -The President’s view
                       -Nicolae Ceausescu
                 -Tito
                       -Age
           -Tito’s previous meeting with Brezhnev
           -Romania
                 -Visit by Rogers
    -Greece
           -The President’s view
           -Agnew
           -NATO reactions to visit
                                      12

                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                              Tape Subject Log
                                (rev. Jan-02)          Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

                 -Scandinavians
           -Importance to US
           -Political considerations
     -Romania
           -Domestic reactions by Romanian-Americans
                 -Political considerations
                       -Chicago
                       -Pittsburgh
     -Spain
     -Portugal
     -Morocco
           -Political considerations
     -Greece, Romania, and Yugoslavia
           -Domestic reactions
                 -Rogers’s view
     -Korea
           -Talks with North Korea
                 -Credit to the President
           -Taiwan
                 -Possible problem
                 -Amount of time
                 -John S. D. Eisenhower
     -Singapore, Malaysia
     Middle East
           -Oil supplies
           -Bahrain
           -Kuwait
                 -Connally, Agnew
           -Iran
           -Bahrain
                 -Saudi Arabia
                 -Port facilities
                 -British reaction
                       -Douglas-Home
                 -Shah's reaction
     -Itinerary
     -Length
     -Report to the President

The President's schedule
     -San Clemente
     -Congressional recess
                                        13

                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                Tape Subject Log
                                  (rev. Jan-02)            Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

Rogers speech at Commonwealth Club
    -Press coverage
          -Television

Possible speaking engagements for Rogers
     -Ethnic groups
     -Reactions to Rogers's trip
     -Chicago Execuritves Club
     -Arrangements
           -H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
     -Foreign relations councils
           -Rogers visit
           -Los Angeles
           -Town Hall
                 -Advantages
     -Labor organizations
           -Colson
           -International Brotherhood of Teamsters
           -Building trades
           -Import for foreign policy
     -American Legion and Veterans of Foreign Wars [VFW]
           -Rogers's appearance
     -Ethnic groups
     -Catholic groups

Personnel
     -Ambassadorships
          -Blacks
               -John E. Reinhardt
                     -Nigeria
               -W. Beverly Carter, Jr.
                     -Tanzania
               -Terrance A. Todman
               -Samuel Z. Westerfield, Jr.
                     -Liberia
               -Jerome H. Holland
               -Quality of appointments
               -Photograph sessions
          -Ceylon
               -Ambassadorship
               -Racial factors
                     -Tamils
                     -Black Ambassadors
                                         14

                NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                 Tape Subject Log
                                   (rev. Jan-02)                   Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

     -Pakistan
           -Robert G. Neumann
                 -Background
                 -Afghanistan
                 -Haldeman
                 -University of Califorinia at Los Angeles [UCLA]
                 -James R. Schlesinger
                 -Rogers view
                 -Background
                 -Support for the President
                       -1960
                              -UCLA
                 -Kissinger’s view
     -Walter J. Stoessel, Jr.
           -Martin J. Hillenbrand
           -Ambassadorship to Poland
                 -Possible representative to NATO
                       David M. Kennedy
                 -Qualifications
           -Advantages of appointment as Assistant Secretary of
                 State for European Affairs
                 -European Security Conference
           -The President’s view
     -Hillenbrand
           -Ambassador to West Germany
           -Background
     -George C. McGee
           -Lyndon B. Johnson, John F. Kennedy
           -The President's meeting with Hillenbrand

Strategic Arms and Limitation Treaty [SALT]
      -Forthcoming testimony to Congress
            -Reservations
                 -Potential problems
                       -Re-negotiations
            -Timing
                 -Defense expenditures
            -J. William Fulbright
      -Melvin R. Laird
            -Opposition
                 -Defense budget
                       -Trident submarines
                       -Washington, DC anti-ballistic missile [ABM] site
                                               15

                      NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                         Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. Jan-02)          Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

          -Administration position
               -B-1 bomber
          -Henry M. (“Scoop”) Jackson
               -Talk with Kissinger
               -George S. McGovern
                     -Jackson’s view
                     -Statement on Vietnam War
                           -Prisoners of war [POWs]
               -Kissinger’s view
          -John C. Stennis
               -Previous meeting with the President
                     -Vietnam
          -John L. McClellan

The President talked with the White House operator at 10:45 am.

[Conversation No. 733-3A]

[See Conversation No. 25-63]

[End of telephone conversation]

     The President's call to McClellan

     SALT
         -Jackson’s view
              -Support for defense budget
              -Clark MacGregor
              -Michael J. Mansfield, J. William Fulbright
              -Support for the President
              -Defense appropriations

          -Testimony before Congress
                -Laird
                -Negotiations with the Soviets
                -The President's conversation with Stennis
                     -Next round of SALT negotiations
                     -Passage of SALT I
                -Jackson
                -US military strength
                     -The President’s view
                -Congressional limitations on defense budget
                     -Weaponry
                                             16

                     NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
                                       (rev. Jan-02)               Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

                            -Philip A. Hart [?]
                      -ABM
                -Future of US strength
                      -Weapons systems
                            -Undersea long-range missiles [ULMS]
                            -B-I bomber
                -Joint Chiefs of Staff [JCS]
                -Laird
                -ABM
                      -Malmstrom site
                      -Gen. Royal B. Allison
                      -Adm. Thomas H. Moorer
                      -Paul H. Nitze

The President talked with McClellan between 10:51 and 10:53 am.

[Conversation No. 733-3B]

[See Conversation No. 25-64]

Rogers talked with McClellan.

[See Conversation No. 25-64]

[End of telephone conversation]

     SALT
         -The President's talk with Republican leaders
               -Need for SALT
                     -The President’s view
               -Laird's statement
         -Soviet Union
               -Missile defense system
               -Protection
               -PRC
         -Advantages
               -Technology development
                     -Defense costs
         -Defense budget
               -Opponents
         -Laird's testimony

     Forthcoming negotiations with Soviet Union
                                          17

                 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                  Tape Subject Log
                                    (rev. Jan-02)                    Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)

     -Resignation of Smith
          -Replacement
                -Qualities

Rogers's trip
    -White House announcement
            -Itinerary
            -Meeting with the President

Rogers's testimony
    -Smith
    -Format
    -Questions
    -Laird and Moorer
    -Smith’s role

Colson
     -Signals to Rogers on television appearances
     -Haldeman
          -Role of Cabinet heads
                 -Richard G. Kleindienst

"Meet the Press"
    -Rogers's appearance

The President's press conference
     -Scheduling
          -Timing
          -Colson and John A. Scali
          -The President’s view
                 -Foreign policy achievements
     -Domestic issues
          -Timing
                 -Relation to the President's trip to Soviet Union
     -Content

The President's previous meeting with Brezhnev
     -Vietnam
     -Podgorny's trip to Hanoi
          -Itinerary
          -Proposals to Hanoi
          -Secrecy of trip
          -US hopes for trip
                                               18

                        NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                         Tape Subject Log
                                           (rev. Jan-02)    Conv. No. 733-3 (cont.)


     John D. Lavelle
          -Actions
          -Removal by Laird
          -Testimony before Congress
          -Effect
          -Actions
                -Gen. Creighton W. Abrams. Jr.

     Television appearances by Rogers
          -Haldeman
          -SALT
          -Rogers's trip

     "Issues and Answers"
          -Compared with a press conference
          -Quality of show
          -Importance of show
          -Press conference
                -Colson

     John N. Mitchell

     Press conference
          -Publicity

Rogers and Kissinger left at 11:07 am.