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Conversation 009-043

TapeTape 9StartThursday, September 16, 1971 at 2:10 PMEndThursday, September 16, 1971 at 6:21 PMTape start time01:27:45Tape end time01:30:31ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  MacGregor, ClarkRecording deviceWhite House Telephone
AudioNARA Description

On September 16, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and Clark MacGregor talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 2:10 pm and 6:21 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 009-043 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 9-43

Date: September 16, 1971
Time: Unknown between 2:10 pm and 6:21 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with Clark MacGregor.

     MacGregor's location

     Draft issue
           -Alan Cranston
           -Gordon L. Allott
                 -Talk with Michael J. (“Mike”) Mansfield
                 -F. Edward Hébert
                 -Leslie C. Arends
                 -Talk with MacGregor
                       -The President's meeting with Hébert and Arends

                          -George P. Shultz
                     -Alex Hersch
                     -John C. Stennis
                     -Margaret Chase Smith
Transcript (AI-Generated)

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Mr. Haldeman, sir.
Mr. President, Clark McGregor.
I'm in Bob's office.
I just came in to tell Bob the latest developments.
Senator Cranston backed away from his plan to move the tabling at 2 o'clock because he got word that Gordon Allitt had left him.
Then the latest development was that Gordon told Mike Mansfield that he couldn't be with him.
And so Mike, knowing that Gordon had to be in Colorado tomorrow morning, took the floor and said that he, Mike Mansfield, would move to table at 11 o'clock tomorrow morning.
I, of course, had told Gordon of the fact that you would call Eddie Hebert and Les Ahrens.
And Gordon...
Now someone wants to know, well, what did Abe Aaron say?
And I said, well, the president can't call them right now, Gordon, but we'll call them.
No, no.
No, I'm not going to call them until they finish action on the bill.
Good.
Okay.
No, that's the whole deal, you see.
Fair enough.
Now, if we just sink the thing anyway, then there's no use to call them.
Now, Gordon has just called me back and said since he has to be in Colorado tomorrow, he's going to move at 3 o'clock to table.
Today?
Yeah.
That's in about 10 minutes.
He himself is going to do it.
He himself.
So he's deserting us.
Yes.
Well, what good does it do then?
It really doesn't do much good, sir.
I wanted to convey this to you.
Oh, I see.
He suggests that I call him and indicate to him that your fixed intention to meet personally once this issue is behind us to... What is the problem?
What do you mean that his...
Do you think he's trying to pressure you by saying he's going to move the table of three because he hasn't heard what I'm going to do?
He's fearful that Ahrens and Hebert, not supporting the Gates Commission recommendations, will buck him on the Defense Procurement Act when that gets into conference.
And what he wants, of course, is the maximum amount of assurance.
He's driving the hardest bargain he can before the issue is drawn.
The hardest, the most we can say is that I cannot, of course, get them to
agree, Clark.
I can't talk to them before they see what the proposition is.
But he has a commitment that I will talk to them personally and that it is my personal opinion that I can prevail on it.
That is, George Shultz has told me what the numbers are.
that it's my personal opinion that I can sell those numbers to them.
That's my personal opinion.
And if Senator Alex, sir, should ask that...
If you talk to me, no.
No, if you should ask that at some subsequent meeting of the kind that you envision that Stennis and Margaret J. Smith be included, would that be agreeable to you?
They will be included.
Thank you very much.
I would include them.
Good.
Thank you, sir.
Bye.
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