On July 23, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, and Stephen B. Bull met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 1:47 pm and 3:11 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 544-014 of the White House Tapes.
Transcript (AI-Generated)This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.
I was intrigued by that lower goal.
It's a typical, you know, other kind of thing.
Several have had the same thing.
Well, our own, the 50, our own identical had the same.
John, you mentioned we didn't ask the questions.
I know you didn't.
How did we ask you to do that?
What about the economy?
I think that's the one that you do your research.
Most people think it's going to get worse rather than better.
But the first thing is that I want to be sure that that question or a variation gets in our future polls.
Do you do that?
The economy one or the rope room?
The rope room, yeah.
I think it's really better.
It's a very general question.
It's a good barometer type question.
It's the psychology of people.
Now, the second thing is that
The reason for this is a very fundamental one.
People are discouraged about the war.
It's interestingly interesting enough, isn't the environment?
Which another thing is, they're terribly discouraged about their kids.
I think that's part of it.
They're losing their bearers, their mourners.
That's what drugs is about.
Drugs is about that more than anything else.
Drugs isn't about old folks, it's about kids.
Right.
Is it?
Yeah.
And Robert makes that point.
Yeah.
The other thing is that, and that's related to work, the other thing is that also kids are not the ones that are concerned about the drugs.
Oh, I understand that.
Yeah.
I get the point.
Now, hire the older folks.
But the other thing is, what they have had, the people are having,
You know, one of our problems, as we've been in, they have been having an unmerciful beating from media, by radio, television, college and university.
Their teachers, their ministers say everything's going to hell.
Their teachers say everything's going to hell.
They, etc.
And, of course, they're getting a lot from the media, and they're getting it from some of their leaders, which means Democrats, obviously.
The more the media just channels the numbers, night after night after night, when you pick up the media, it's always bad news, isn't it?
Everything they put a bad question, every bit of news, it's never good.
Now, on the other hand, it also shows us our problem, the approval of the president.
The approval of the president is, of course, I don't want that approval of the president being any of that with the country still feeling so negative about itself.
Right?
There's that part of the problem.
If that's the case, sir, because you're the
As the leader, you're the, you're at least not necessarily the blame, but just the fact that you're, you know, they turn to you.
And that is why people talk about leadership.
Let's have leadership, leadership, leadership.
It's not that you're the blame, it's that you epitomize what somebody's done to bring us out of this terrible thing.
The other thing is that there needs to be an offensive throughout the administration in terms of what the hell's right about America, you know what I mean?
First, attack the judge problem, the drugs.
Attack it hard.
And we are attacking the world problem.
You realize that we're going to have an, I think we can have an enormous effect on this candidate through some successes.
My guess is that Roper's poll himself, now this is one thing that would be very interesting.
I'll bet you if you polled this next week, kind of the people would feel better because of the candidate.
Would you not agree?
I mean, it probably wouldn't change it, 50 points, 25, but it changed it 8, 10, you know what I mean?
People say, my God, things aren't quite as bad, you know, as they thought.
It's the whole thing.
People have got to be a little bit hopeful to get the point.
So they might be trying to hammer over the staff.
And the congressmen and senators are our own people, you know, they all come in with their faces down.
The leader's got to give them a little hope, he's got to, you know, I go out and say, hell, this is a great country.
Well, and incidentally, the fact that people say 64% that they don't think things are going so well doesn't mean they don't want you to say that things are going to be better.
You see, they want to believe things are going to be better, right?
No question.
David, he says that this is a remarkable finding in the light of past polling experts, because on almost any issue, people show a reluctance to criticize and a predilection for optimistic answers.
On a poll, others say one thing should be good.
And here is an issue involving national pride, on which patriotism might dictate a defense, yet faced with a choice between faint praise and outspoken criticism, people abandon their normal practice in an ace out of nearly three to one.
and the fact that it covers every group.
There is a difference between the... On education, 33% of the college educated think we're headed in the right direction.
Only 15% of those of the grade school education think we are.
And 25% of the whites think we're all right, and only 12% of the blacks, yeah.
Well, for Christ's sakes, the blacks ought to.
They're getting everything.
You see what I mean?
There's the other side of it.
Yes, they don't.
They think... Well, because they're told.
But it needs fencing.
Now, this also shows what is really needed in terms of the so-called radio series.
What is really needed is to get any...
Remember, I still haven't gotten that through to Price and his group, but it's the big issues.
And to say, God damn it, here's some things, you know, let's, uh, uh, and hold up the, we can do things, you know what I mean?
Maybe we're working on that now.
Uh, do you think that Sapphire's speech is one that helps in this respect?
I don't know if it does or it doesn't, if you know the subject.
Yeah, because you're talking about the future, what we're doing economically.
Oh, okay.
Well, you, you, if you will hold it.
I think it's a very important thing to get across.
The other thing is that people feel that way about it.
Anybody who threatens against things that are, they mean you can just see the issue developing.
If you satisfy the way things are, vote for us.
You see my point?
If you're not satisfied, vote for a change.
On the other hand, it cuts two ways, and that's where the Congress, you see, comes in.
That is why we have to be in a position, Conley understands this particularly, when he says, Jesus Christ, throw out some things, let the Russians vote against it, and say, vote for a change.
In other words, we all run against the way things are, run against the status quo.
That's why we have to have a new, exciting,
State of the Union, one that just didn't fire along with the same old crap bomb, you know.
So my point is, yes, we listen to this freedom.
Why are you just going to do more of the same?
There's got to be something, we've got to put off something there that says that... For example, one thing, you twist this, you say, gee whiz, did you realize that for the first time in 25 years,
We're going to have peace and jobs, you know, together.
Just think.
See what I mean?
Moving in that direction.
Look, for the first time in my career, we can look to the fact that we're not going to have a war.
Things aren't going to get better.
It's the first time in my life.
It's the first time since the Great Depression.
Oh, it's a 340.
Yeah, because we really didn't have jobs right up to the war.
1940.
So it's 1930.
First time in 45 years.
First time in 45 years.
And with the Great Depression.
42, 41 or 42.
Anyway, my point is, we've got it all within the hit here.
The Depression was 29.
I got away in three years.
42 years, right, Chuck?
We'll call it 40 years.
a 40 year number, and say what do we have?
And now let's get going here.
But it's also, I don't know, you say they gave them the list, unfortunately they didn't put the goddamn environment on there.
I think they would put it, I don't think it shows, I don't think they have that.
They don't show here that they've got something
Now they only gave a list of 13 groups.
I see.
Not a very good list.
They didn't have that on them.
That's so crazy.
Believe me, I can't tell you too strongly that the council, don't you?
I don't think we should be discouraged.
It seems to me it shows a hell of an opportunity here.
Because, and it also shows something else, we, considering the economy, are doing awful goddamn well to hold up where we are.
Correct?
Yep.
What holds us up there, I don't know.
Because we sure have the lousiest public relations I ever heard of.
Not our fault, because of the media, I guess.
What I mean is we aren't getting it because you could have said it better if you said it in the day that the crisis and the whole difference isn't all we're doing, it's carrying on the Great Society program until we haven't changed a fucking thing.
And you're right.
You're absolutely right.
Well, that's what we've said as far as people are concerned.
That's why I have a lot of people who are here believing and I don't believe.
I can't get it across to anybody.
Well, that's what, see, Connie jumped on that right away.
That's what he was saying to me at the campaign about this domestic initiative thing.
He says that you can't appear to be just doing the same things.
This is a very important poll, Bob.
A very important one.
And also, if you would go back then and then do your other domestic, in other words, what are the four or five that you went across?
I've given you, we have one less line, haven't we?
Leadership.
I've gotten out that they want leadership.
30% of the people want leadership.
We answer that with the China thing.
There's nothing that answers leadership except a great traumatic event.
That's the Claude Robinson theory.
Correct.
All right.
but you can't destroy it.
And don't let our little boys get into this crap that it's because, well, Jesus Christ, we're gonna get along with 800 million Chinese, I guess is what it's about.
Overthrow that in, that's nice for the kids to hear.
And the gee whiz, they just get this better hope of peace, I think that's good too.
But the main thing is the great dramatic, Henry sees this, he sees that as reestablishing the authority of the president, correct?
Absolutely.
Michael, I think that's, I think that's correct, isn't it?
Get your lube out.
You need to shake them up there and see what can they do.
Get that out and hold on.
There's one time, I really think if we try, we can really get any theme across and everybody gets it.
What do you think?
Don't you think we can?
Yeah.
This is the theme.
And then let's hit it.
You can roll speakers to hit it.
I mean, we tried it, and it cracked at the end of the year.
It makes you a nice, warm-hearted, good old bard or something like that, and that didn't work.
Now, what about knowing something?
You say, well, he's a cold, ruthless, effective guy.
That's what I'm getting at.
Correct.
Isn't that pretty good?
And it plays down.
It's not cold.
It's ruthless in a sense, but it's strong, bold, solid, unwavering.
Cold in the head, that's cold blood.
Wow.
He's terrible.
He put that great pole in the water, see?
I guess he had it all right.
This is Jeff's gun.
He's an old man.
He needs help a lot.
Oh, my God, he's up 48.
Hello, here's a sophisticated guy who knows holes that we've got to hold.
Yeah, let's see how this is going.
Okay, what we do have, and that really concerns me, is that they do have a letterhead, news for our opinion research.
Nixon's plan to visit the county center widely approved by a wide margin endorsement.
The same survey says publicly approved, the way it's handling his job increased from a low of 48 to 54%, apparently.
67, good night.
So, uh, he's down with the punch, too.
That's, uh, he, he's picked it up.
Yeah, it's 49.
It is now.
That's, uh, he's putting it.
He's putting it.
Well, that's a one point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Keep coming to this.
Yes, I'll be ready.