Conversation 545-001

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Yes, sir.

I don't think he's planning to, but he sure can.

Well, he can.

Let's see, though.

Hi, Henry.

You want to check on him, please?

He has the understanding that you want him to do the...

That's the security budget set on Thursday rather than Friday of next week.

I don't get why they're keeping Thursday up to 3, 4.30 clear in case you wanted to do a press conference Thursday, which I was going to continue to do, unless you know you don't want to.

Unless we could move it up, which you would.

As of now, we have a Friday morning, which is what people are planning on.

Which I would think would be better for everybody, including him.

Unless you just make a credit.

You want to get it out of the way.

It doesn't really make any difference.

An NSTB doesn't have goddamn attention.

It's not an NSTB.

It's a budget meeting.

Come on.

I'm ready with an extra budget.

An extra meeting.

I'm not worried about that.

No, I'm not, no.

As a matter of fact, Henry forgets.

I'm not even ready to do it then, because he's, I told him to take a month from the defense budget.

Now, you get right back to, you've got to get back to, uh, uh, Schultz.

Well, I was on a, you know, third defense thing.

I said, I want to see a defense budget.

And I said, you really get down to it.

You don't get to do it.

That's a month.

You don't get to do it.

That's me.

Say, hell no.

Hell no.

I don't want to.

Look at them by saying it's old terms.

They're going to be not okay.

Oh, sure.

So we moved out and that's something he was talking about having done by mid-August then.

I said, take him off.

He said, why not?

Then he said he'd get out by August 15th, and that was certain.

So I wanted you to get it done by August 11th.

Okay.

Now, what is it you were doing?

You know, one possibility on next weekend, if you wanted to consider, which might not be a bad idea, if you do want to, if you did want to do the growth, would be to go to Friday and drop in at that, uh, at the banquet in Kent the night before.

Yeah, there's a banquet the night before, and, uh, that would be the best.

Well, it'd be just as, certainly just as good

And, um, you just want to make, uh, an appearance of the thing that you're talking about.

You did at the public event.

That's right.

So you have to spend the night someplace.

But go on, because if you do, I'll tell them at the next point that you can spend the night in Akron, which is, is not bad.

Uh, the Akron is just, it's the same airport as Cannes.

And it's only 20 miles away, so you can get there late.

Yeah, I just wanted to try to see what we can get together today, because you're leaving tomorrow.

That's right, yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I just wanted to leave.

I've got this budget session at 10 o'clock today.

So let's see what you're scheduled to do.

Oh, I was just going to rest today.

I was going to take the day off, but I have nothing particular planned.

Well, listen, you don't have to thank me.

What do you need tomorrow?

The first thing in the morning at eight o'clock.

What I was basically going to do, I have a book, but basically I was going to say a hell of a lot because they

all the other issues.

But the only thing I can do is, I haven't given them a deadline yet.

He said he needed instructions.

He'll let Walter know by tomorrow.

But if I see him, I'll tell him.

orally about some of these political things.

But I looked over my note to him, which was very sharp.

I said, the prime minister must understand the importance of insulating it from American domestic politics.

All right, fine.

We've got plenty of time.

Right.

You just have somebody call me, and I'll be at home.

The only thing I have is I'm having lunch with Henry Brand and his wife.

I think you're right.

You're right.

Get out of this way to sleep.

It's, Mr. President, the leaking in this government now is...

Right now, right now, there's a, I told, I told them now, there's 48 hours of polygraphing.

100 people, I understand, had access to that document.

That was a violation of my order last week.

The 100 are going to take a polygraph test this weekend.

They cancel all their vacations.

Every goddamn thing they're going to do is send me a document.

I want Roger shaken up.

I want Larry shaken up.

I want Thurston.

We're going to find out why they gave us so many.

Everybody in action.

I'm beginning to think...

Which date was it, Thurston?

The time Thurston was presented out.

Your directive went out Wednesday night, but Thursday it had leaked.

Okay.

Yeah.

And this is now...

I think there is a traitor on the seventh floor of state.

I don't think it's the system anymore.

It used to be that you could say the system is leaking.

But now, for example...

The state sent a back channel on Thursday night to Porter telling him they would announce his appointment next week that was on television last night.

It literally leaks now within 24 hours.

All right.

I want you to get a load of Rogers.

There should be a polygraph on that.

Is that clear?

We didn't know about it, did we?

Oh, no.

Yes.

Well, but we... No, no, no, no.

About the...

All we knew was they wanted to announce it Thursday, did Thursday, so we told them to hold it a week.

But the fact that they had sent it back channel, we did not know.

No, that was on television, on radio.

Well, Irvin told me, for example, that when their people testified before the Congressional

committee on Pakistan, Kennedy was sitting there with seven State Department cables in his hands and asking them questions about it.

You know, the state's given notice to Kennedy now that they aren't going to cooperate with the committee at the Senate.

You know, there were many times when I said the system in state is lousy, but this time I think there are one or two traitors in there.

rather than a bunch of leakers.

Jerry Smith has written you a letter by cable saying that he thinks you should institute criminal proceedings because he's really in a hell of a spot there.

I don't think so.

But he's disturbed about the leave.

Oh, he's beside himself because he didn't even, hadn't even presented it to the Russians yet.

And this was in the papers.

He was going to present it next Monday to the Russians.

He said, why in the hell, why is it that I was not informed of this until yesterday and then by Colson?

Because it didn't happen, I guess.

It didn't happen until yesterday.

You weren't even aware of it.

No, I was aware of it, but I didn't.

Bob, you know, you're supposed to follow these goddamn things.

And I want to be rude.

And by God, we're going to polygraph him and fire the son of a bitch that did it.

I mean it.

I think it was one of the most vicious leagues I've seen.

It's

The Russians.

Was that a Beecher story?

Yeah.

Beecher?

Who talked to Beecher?

Who's following up?

I've told him.

He's heard the message, but he's got good croak on him.

Yeah.

All right.

And they're polygraphed.

There's no excuse.

I don't want any excuse that they're busy today.

They are to call back.

Everybody's to be called back.

They're not to get off the golf courses or the tennis courts or whatever the goddamn head they're sleeping in.

And they are to be polygraphed.

The sons of bitches that could have talked to me.

I mean, he was a defense man, though.

No, but you never can tell who the hell...

I know, but Beecher does cover defense.

See, that's the thing, you can't poly... We gotta be careful how we do it, Bill.

Polygraph them, did they talk to Beecher?

No, they talked to any reporter.

Those kinds of leaks generally are, especially at the time of that crosswalk operation, and they give it to one, and then they put it to another so that it doesn't get this thing.

So the guy who's byline that is not the guy who's got the source.

Here again, though, that shows you why we can't see him again.

No, I want you to call Frank.

I want you to call it the day and say that this was detrimental to the foreign policy of the United States.

Absolutely, I'll do it.

I said this is detrimental to the foreign policy and that we are, we have this kind of thing, I mean, I think that this is just exactly the kind of thing we're talking about.

But Jerry Smith said that a man who shouts fire in a theater isn't half as dangerous as a man who ruins dissolved negotiations.

And the Russians have been very good.

They've never put out their positions.

Today, have you heard about the real story or the story now?

It's finding out, as I'm talking with this fellow that is being presently held up as the scapegoat for all these elsewhere Pentagon papers.

It's probably not him.

that he's part of it but that they're a discovery but the papers at times predator knock is a lot of that they came from the gil group and that she had uh what up she had left the boston did you hear about this got four locksmiths in boston and they broke into some

Some foundation place they're trying to find in Boston.

The Times wired in $600 for the purpose of getting the locksmiths.

She had broken the deeds to get the papers.

They think they may have the time, so I'm breaking it in her.

That's she in.

Breaking it in.

Unbidding it.

I'm just, that's just what they're trying to see.

Once the Bureau, we found things, Henry, they're, you know, it's got some fascinating stuff on Ellsworth.

Boy, he is a really promoting character.

That's the only outcome.

His wife is a daughter.

He's got a daughter, 13 years old, by his first wife.

who has testified that she spent time, he went to a whole series of girlfriends, but he probably was still married to the wife, and then afterwards, but even while he was married to the wife, he was going to all these girlfriends, and the daughter would spend the weekend with him, and he'd be trapped up in the weekend with some other girlfriend.

Her father and the girlfriend wandered around the house in the nude.

Her father had pornographic pictures.

had pornographic pictures of himself and the girlfriend around the house.

And his files had a grand crowd.

It's very screw up.

Have you seen that report?

It's on its way up to Elkford.

Yeah.

Oh, he's a new person.

That is about juicier.

All that stuff is nice, but that's not the problem.

And then there's the elegant way it says, you know, that information will provide some insight into a side of the character of one Daniel Elkford that has not been there too.

Hoover is always, he loves that.

He's having rebels with that stuff.

But my point is that I think that what is more fascinating is that she and Gil, the four locksmiths that Henry this and that, broke in at the end of the night.

I wonder if it was your school, that's what I was saying.

But your pieces are not there.

I didn't have these pieces anywhere.

The think tank up there is sort of... Because I never had these pieces.

The think tank in Harvard was in Cambridge.

Cambridge.

Well, that is up there.

They're also...

Well, my papers are down here.

And in any event, I never had these volumes.

I didn't even know they were finished.

And that last piece.

I wanted to post on this leak.

There are no excuses left.

The Defense Department thinks they're very close to pinning this on somebody.

They've been working this since yesterday.

And they just called me to say that they have a defense department in the Defense Department.

And we would in any case won't have the access list and

I know them today, but after them, we'll be ready to go if you want us to.

I do.

Now, their case concern is that we're liable to blow the investigation in defense if we start there.

And, uh, but they don't polygraph.

They don't polygraph the act of people.

They do state act of, uh, MSC.

Now, I would like us just to be sure that they, so they don't say we didn't do our own.

Okay.

Now, I just want you to know that much.

I'll know more at noon than I do right now.

Did I see the paper?

Yeah.

I'll take the polygram, too, then.

Oh, God, no.

No, the president didn't take a polygram.

No, but I mean, my point is, I think we've got to be like Caesar's wife.

Yeah, but no one, if the president has to take a polygram, then we're in trouble.

But let me say this, what do you mean?

It'll be the first time they ever call us.

I don't have any way of warning you that there's anything to this.

I want you to cover up for defense.

I understand.

Now, the gunman defense department feature is a defense man, but it could come from Spade or the S.O.P.

So is he selling?

Is he just going to put your leg out, John, in Hague's?

Hague?

Yes.

I doubt it.

Hague would be pulling guns on defense.

Maybe he's pulling Hague's leg out.

They're trying to see everything.

The matches are bad apple here, too.

Oh, yes.

They're both bad.

They're both no good.

They leak for different purposes.

Sure.

But there are pieces of it.

On the civilian side, absolutely.

That's what I mean.

Apparently, this was a, as Al reads it anyway, was the defense position that was being argued in the article.

It was a paraphrase of the defense position.

Only on one point.

Just go ahead.

I want the polygraph shot.

Also, if they're on the golf course, on the tennis courts, going to New York or to Boston or someplace, or to Nassau, get the fuckers back here and polygraph.

Is that clear?

Every goddamn one that has access to it.

Now, I mean everyone.

Just as well these people be shaken up.

It would take some of the other stuff, because if they didn't leave this time, they will be leaving next week.

I want them polygraphed.

Everybody that has access is to be polygraphed.

And the second thing is, John, which it's a violation of my order that 100 people have access to this highly sensitive secret negotiating position.

That we've already done something about.

We've already... From now on, from now on, I'll tell you what good it is.

There'll be people free.

Free will have access.

God damn it, that's all you need.

Why does CIA get us?

They should.

They should be Henry Kissinger.

He can have access and responsibility, and then they'll... Henry Kissinger, Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of State, and the head of that, and nobody else.

Now, God damn it, that's the way to stop this thing.

What we've set up is that we no longer distribute instructions through the system.

We put them in a sealed envelope to the head of the department.

And he is then responsible, and he has to keep a list of the one or two people he shows it to.

But he can't fan it out over his department.

on these instructions, or on any other instructions that have your signature on it.

But you really won't do it until Henry is delivered.

Absolutely.

How did we work this out?

You know very well how we worked it.

We didn't tell anybody.

And there were no papers, sir.

None.

Absolutely none.

And no speculation.

And for Christ's sakes, that was the reason that Deborah Chapman wouldn't have told Rogers.

He wouldn't.

How do we know?

I mean, he wouldn't have done it.

He wouldn't have done it.

I'm so very sure.

Now, there's nobody who should know anything in the future.

There's somebody on that seventh floor, whether they did it or not.

Defense is awful.

Yeah, I know.

That seventh floor has leaked everything on banks.

And on any appointment in the last two or three weeks.

I'm going to find out about that appointment.

I'm going to find out who...

And he said, he's not going.

That's the thing.

And that's the way we'll stop that.

I am not sending the son of a bitch.

Since it's been leaked, I won't be here today.

I'll listen on Twitter, call Rodgers and tell him that I'm revoking the thing because of the leak.

We'll start playing the Johnson game.

I might change my mind.

Just call him and tell him.

I think there's a way to handle it.

We cannot get in a position where we just say this is what it is and that I really, I'm screwed up.

I won't talk to him about it and not be in budget meetings all day.

But Bob, you mean, unless you're rough on these people, they are not going to shape up.

Bill's probably off playing golf now.

Happy as a clam.

He doesn't think this is significant, does he?

This kind of sentence.

Oh, no, Bill is, yeah.

Yes, because I think it's significant.

No, no, Alex, I haven't talked to Phil, but Alex Johnson is, Alex Johnson is really shaken up by this.

Well, by the...

I don't see why there can be a quarter leak.

A quarter leak has been published in the paper for weeks.

Well, over a period of two weeks, almost everything that's been put into the seventh floor has leaked out so fast that there has to be one run... Give me the note about the quarter leak.

I can't think of one.

I can't guess the details.

I don't know if there is, Chris.

Uh...

They were going to announce it this week.

We told them not to because of my meeting on Monday.

But then, well, what they leaked was the date of the announcement.

The minute it was said, they leaked it.

It's not a huge thing.

It's fine.

The data, you know.

Okay.

Let's see.

Just to talk about the other part of the topic.

I'm watching that talk over there.

Yeah, he said he changed his mind, right?

Of course, I don't know, though, that's what he said.

Here, Connolly gets it up here.

He thinks probably less of the Lockheed than anybody else, but he knows that we've said we're going to save Lockheed.

He's trying to save it.

I understand Packard, who's sort of a pleasant fellow that sort of has his convictions, but Larry's got no convictions.

God damn it, he does what we say.

He said he backed the thing because it's our position.

He said he was.

He also claimed that he didn't say that.

He said, well, I should read these transfers, which I did.

Transfers are worse than commissioners.

So, I was an honest girl then.

If you should read it, you're a few weeks on, but I'm sure that she...

There's another group beyond the, what's his name, Ellsberg.

Well, I think, I think he, see Marty was giving me raw data.

And, uh.

That's great.

He says that it looks like the papers were the papers that Gelma and his group had, rather than the papers that Ellsberg was shopping around.

That he had gotten.

It's going to get all the push that security comes.

I don't think I made myself clear in San Clemente as to how I want to display it.

I am not interested in the legal things.

I don't give a damn about the legal things.

I want to have to leave to the Chicago Tribune this story now, now, about the four locksmiths.

The $600, that sort of thing.

We'll leak it right out.

You understand?

Right.

That sort of thing can kill the bastards.

But, John, if you wait, they'll cover it up.

I understand.

But if you...

Does Marty understand?

No, he doesn't.

I don't understand.

I haven't let Marty get into that at all.

I see.

We're going to put that out here to Colson and Tom.

See, if you get Marty into it, he's going to cross the east by the way to the Chicago Tribune.

And I want also the story on Ellsberg and all this stuff that John has.

Well, I've asked Marty to give me this stuff on him.

My point is, leaking is a game.

Sure.

Now, they leak on us all the time.

I'm going to leak this up.

I'm going to leak the Ellsberg thing up.

Remember, Uncle John, you've got to win it in the newspaper.

I said, let's just keep it alive.

And if you look up the yellow story in the background, who he was, he was McNamara's man.

He was Kennedy's man.

She had, and all the rest.

One other thing I want to know.

Colson made an interesting study with the BLS crew.

He found out of the 21, remember he said last time, 16 were Democrats.

No, he told me in the car.

16 were registered Democrats.

One was a registered Republican.

And, uh, well, there had been 23, and four were declined to States.

Now, that is a surprise to him in the L.S.

The point that he did not get into that I want to allow him on, that he were Jews.

Out of the 23 men in the L.S., would you get the United States?

There's a Jewish cabal, you know, running through this, working with people like Byrds and the rest, and they all, they all only talk to Jews.

Now, but there it is, but there's a DLS stamp.

Now, how the hell do you ever expect us to get anything from that stamp?

We're all able to let it alone, but the poor guys have to say it's tough, but it's going to be loaded against us.

You understand?

Is Alex working?

No.

Oh, Alex?

People are rude to each other.

Also, John, there's one thing that I've said that I don't know whether Crowe ever got the message on.

He says, Bob, you've got to get it through me.

All people who have access to top-secret information are to sign a statement saying, in the event that this document leaks, it's to be on everyone.

I agree to take a polygraph test.

You see what I mean?

I don't want any crap on this.

Now, I don't know, was that followed through, John?

Remember, I mentioned that in one of the meetings.

I asked the way to do it, but we, they did, but it's only fear that will stop this from happening.

Nothing but fear.

I don't know how you would do it, but either do that, or anybody that's weird or top secret, I agree to take a polygraph test.

All right?

Yeah, yeah, because it's one of the things we're going to run into this weekend that people have a right to refuse.

All right.

All right, fine.

this order up two weeks ago, and again, it hasn't followed through, immediately, in the State Department and the Defense Department, particularly State Defense, and the rest, they are to go to all of their people, get it written out, that anybody who has access to top-secret documents, get this around.

I, as having access to top-secret, get this, if any document, which has, which is in my possession, has come to my possession,

to take polygraph tests for his top secret clearance is reasonable now do i have that clear and can't bother once we follow up something that i ordered got that i ordered it two weeks ago and nobody's paid that bit of attention to it now get it done put some fear into these people that's a good one too

Can't you just put out something, write something up?

What do you think, John?

We can do that.

Put out a piece of paper.

But what I meant is, I can see these little shit-asses.

I know these people.

They're all cowards.

But send it around.

They've got to sign a piece of paper.

I agree to take a polygraph.

And the NSC staff does it, too.

Everybody signs a piece of paper that I agree to take a polygraph in the event that any document that comes into my possession...

Leaves.

Correct.

Yep, I call.

And I'd like from you just enough discretion that we can lay off DMV this weekend if we're satisfied that they really have an investigation close to fruition.

He said we're also going to put a tap.

Fine, we'll try to leave that.

I'd like to delay this meeting 15 minutes.

Sure.

I have a reason, because I've got to get Henry.

Henry's got some big anchors.

And if you don't mind, I'll be ready.

Hello.

Who are you?

Uh, the two of you, I mean, this is about time.

I mean, this is Joel.

Joel's not going to be able to see me, so I'm going to have to go close to him.

I'm not as anxious as a problem.

He should wait and see her.

You were there, Bob.

And Roger says, that's a hell of a good idea.

Do you remember?

where I said, well, now they don't do it because nobody's in charge.

Nobody is in charge of carrying out what I've ordered in this field.

You see the point as we spread it out?

Here's those being in charge.

Then John and I were not broken.

I ordered not to be put in any charge.

Let's just take a look at this.

I'm sure that this instruction never got to him, but I will speak to him that it does.

And this was done right out of the NSC.

I want this developed.

What I meant is I want this developed.

Developed, right?

And then the crow, the crow, you see, gets around.

But I wanted to get a very significant amount of labor and make those pastures sign and make them sign and get it all out there.

clearance, they're free to take polygraph, and that's everybody in this government.

Now, if they're making it, fine, that's a making it sign, because I agree with you.

I know what the polygraph, you remember, you, as I get back to my old case of this, if you remember, Tamer said, I will take it twice.

It's for you and yourself.

Anybody in this government who has any top secret questions from now on, who

will not agree in advance, as of today.

Well, you can't get it done.

Get it cranked up hard enough that Trump presses overtime.

He will not sign a paper that he will make public.

Yes, yes, I'll go up with them.

Why don't they come here?

Well, it won't be quite that simple.

Why don't we just say that we will leave?

But I think it's better to say that we leave, say they get here at 12.30, 1 o'clock.

Why don't you just wait and tell them to have a little lunch here, have some lunch here.

And that we'll leave for, say, 2 o'clock or something like that.

2 o'clock?

Yep.

Don't you think so?

We're all through with that.

Well, all right.

Allow me.

We can stay on the stand by you.

We can leave on the stand by you.

No, I think it better.

I thought I had to lay there.

I think that we don't have much time left.

Let me say it.

I'm, uh, I can't do it without you.

There really isn't much to it, except that I think you have to really don't be too relaxed with regard to say, well, it's their move, and now I'm going to wait until the next meeting to see what happens.

Sure.

I think that I think it would be, of course,

put them in a position where they are enforced in order to say their honor, et cetera, et cetera, to be recalcitrant.

But I think if you're in a position now to say, well, I'm going to lay down your clothes to journal what I know you're going to do, then we aren't going to screw around anymore.

I feel that you would, in other words, I wouldn't be too dead.

I think I would just be a citizen.

You and I have one of these things, exactly the same.

Communists are communists.

They are different from other people.

They are tough, ruthless sons of bitches.

They don't do things for the same reasons that we do things.

For that reason, you can negotiate with them.

Rogers can't, let's face it.

So if I've got to be tough, be tough, you know what I mean?

I don't need to doubt it.

There's a way to be tough.

But on this, don't give it too much time.

I think there's a, I'd be that way.

On the Chinese side of things, guys, I would be there, I'd be there a little bit cool.

That's what I think.

I think a little cool with regard to that.

Well, and I think it's definitely with regard to the visitors and the rest.

The line that I gave, we developed the other day.

Well, frankly, it's up to them.

But I would just throw in the thought that we have to have somebody want to think.

They can't have everybody want to think.

They just have the Senate majority leaders.

I'm going to get to you.

I'm sure that it may be that he's one of them on the list, but it may be that they are really just making the play to have a lot of politicians.

Well, on the other hand, let me say, I'm sort of like you, so they have all those people rushing over there to China.

It does debase the currency, but I think some of our boys here are a little bit too sensitive on that issue.

I am sensitive on it.

We just can't have it all our own way.

I still think the presidential visit is going to mean a massive death to Alaska.

That is exactly what I think.

But how do you feel about it?

I don't know.

My thought, Mr. President, is

These other guys will just, in a way, accentuate your vision.

All of us will be going like a bunch of sheep after I've broken the ice.

Oh, yes.

I really think they want you to win.

I mean, they said so to a newsman this week.

They said to him essentially what they had told these other guys in Ottawa.

Now they've sent in instructions to their own people, after all, withdrawal from Taiwan.

We have more or less promised them that the war in Vietnam ends.

We'll withdraw some forces from Taiwan.

But that's among their three points.

Oh, we're playing.

We're playing.

Sure.

What do they do about the Russians?

What are they up to these days?

Well, they're being unreasonable.

Well, I, uh, the funny thing is, they're more reasonable.

Before we went on this trip, uh, the President said, sure, we're interested in Seoul, but you're more interested than we are.

Now they're talking all over town how interested they are.

There was a reception at the Soviet Embassy the other day.

I wasn't there.

But a lot of newsmen have since called in to say that Vorontsov, who is the deputy of, was going around saying, well, everything now depends on our finishing soul, showing that you and we can come to agreement.

Right.

And I think it may speed it up a bit.

It looks like what they may want.

We've had a terrific break.

They didn't accept the summit.

We never had a Chinese summit.

They accepted the summit.

Well, if they had accepted the summit, everyone would accuse us of having double-crossed, and they accept the summit.

No.

I mean, now we're in a perfect position to go there.

The Chinese, when you were sent here, your intuition was correct.

Well, of course, I felt the same way.

We had to get clear when we really want to go, December.

I've got the weather charts.

It's bad all the time in Thailand, the weather is cold.

December is clear, but very cold.

November is a little warmer.

January is awful.

Let me say, let me say.

March is the best, but that's too late.

We want to get it two minutes closer.

I agree.

Get the goddamn thing off in December.

We'll aim for December.

And let it be cold.

That's right.

Well, we were in Europe when it was cold.

It was a very successful trip.

Well, they'll try on most people.

They don't.

They will.

Oh, they've tracked them out.

If they want them, they'll have them out there.

They are not dependent on that.

But you see, the last time, here I've got the transcript of my meeting with him.

I said, I'm looking for the, I said, I must tell you in all honesty that the President is becoming extremely restless with our progress

I'm not sure how much longer he will permit us to continue these conversations unless we make some progress quickly.

This is an objective fact.

And he said, now you have said that if next time we do not settle the problem, there will be no further meeting.

And I said, we have to make progress.

That is the President's instruction.

Now, what is your instinct, Mr. President?

Should I give them the date, or should I let them dangle a little bit more?

They don't know what we're giving them.

The date is appropriate.

They'll put it out.

That's my point.

I'd say, Senator, we can negotiate a date.

I mean, it's clearly in our interest and yours.

But the point is, we've got to negotiate a date.

I'll tell him it's the first agenda item if we agree to everything else.

That's right.

In principle.

That's right.

We'll give you a date of the throne.

We have a date.

And just say we have a date in mind.

I think you might say that.

The only other thing that's possible... That's what the command school is putting out.

One could say nine months after the agreement is signed.

So then the quicker the agreement, the quicker we can get...

I like that.

I don't see any... Actually, we say then it's in the fixed date.

We just say nine months after the agreement is signed.

Nine months after the agreement is signed, correct.

And I don't think it's a good idea to give them a date.

Don't put a date.

I don't want any date like May 1st coming up.

Because nine months after the agreement was signed, that's the... And then we can also say we've given them a date if we ever get under pressure again, which we won't now for a month.

We've got these people...

I've talked to you.

I think you've got them.

I'm going to ask you some of your things you've been saying.

I'll tell you.

It's amazing.

But you're...

The whole China thing.

It's got these elections.

Right.

They're talking and so on.

Well, yesterday... You see them all.

I don't see them.

Well, Henry Branton... Henry Branton is... No, they are writing you too.

They're just not in here yet.

uh, Henry Grant is doing an article for this week saying, with a brilliant leapfrog, the president has jumped over the Vietnam, uh, issue.

That's really the issue.

But it is true.

It's the leapfrog.

But I have had put together here a comparison of all of our decisions.

And really, except for the political, for the Q issue, uh, we've practically,

Everything else we've settled.

On economic aid, can we tell them we'll have an economic aid program for five years after?

For all of Vietnam?

I think I think we can.

Yep.

You say we always have economic aid programs.

Well, we're going to need economic aid programs.

For all of Vietnam.

Put it that way.

For all of Southeast Asia.

I'd rather put it that way.

We'll have all Southeast Asia Vietnam.

And next year they will be a major beneficiary.

Right.

I can put it that way.

And then we get a little bit of service because of the separation to say that all of you will be a major beneficiary because of your needs.

Based on needs that they will make.

Right.

And

All of that can be done.

You know, they're probably right on the seventh floor.

There must be somebody there, Mr. President.

There must be one or two traitors there.

And there must be somebody in the defense that's part of it.

I think it's a conspiracy.

I think there's a defense.

There's somebody there.

And there's somebody out in the CIA and the whole life we're in together.

I just feel that way.

I have no confidence.

I think that's right.

Because what they did was all...

If Alex was disturbed, then he... Oh, Alex is deeply disturbed.

For once, I really think that the professionals... ...are beginning to see what's happening.

I'm not... Are you letting them know that I'm just not that curious?

I want them to know.

Well, this polygraph thing I'm sending here, that is true.

That is absolutely true.

Because, you know, people don't like to take polygraphs.

It scares them to death.

And they don't get it.

They don't get the confidence anymore.

I do, uh...

We've got to put these documents in a much more restricted list.

But what these Pentagon Papers have done, I mean, I know every time I get a document, I have to figure how it will play in the press.

Well, what they've got to do is that every time we distribute the documents, we make sure that their list is not as long.

Now, if this thing went to 100 people, it's just ridiculous.

Yeah.

It doesn't need to go to 100 people.

No, we've got to keep it at 5 or 10.

We've proved it.

I don't think anything has ever leaked out of him.

I have to say, in defense of my former staff members, Tony Lace knows I've been meeting with Lee Ducktoe.

And he must, I mean, he could steer his people off it.

I mean, they keep attacking us for not meeting with Lee Ducktoe.

And if he dropped a word saying he must be meeting with him, they'd stop it.

So a lot of people have actually, to the best of my knowledge, not leaked any documents yet, although it's no excuse for...

I made a mistake in the first year to take all these goddamn liberals.

I did it... Well, we... Well, I did it cynically.

I did it for protective coloration.

We had a few, too.

And that's what I decided.

It doesn't work.

I must say.

Well, I thought you were...

I'm convinced that that night... We're going to get loyalists now, aren't we?

It never occurred to me that...

It seems to me, though, if you look at this whole term, the whole impact, the impact on the country, it's going to be continuing.

It isn't like last year, because it's over a period of time.

We've come on this, and I must say that the effect on our enemies has just been, I think it's just been catastrophic, too.

Hanoi is screaming everywhere.

Oh, I mean our enemies at home.

Oh, our enemies at home.

It's catastrophic.

It's wiped them out.

Manfield has now introduced his resolution formula yesterday.

Yes.

He's agreed to it.

Well, they're all shifting to domestic now.

Vance has written a letter.

People like Sol Linovich has written a letter.

Lucep, Gardner.

And the press has written a letter.

And...

And the whole tone now of this brilliant, daring, cool move.

And we see it in some...

All because of one thing.

We've done a lot of other things.

We've never had any credit for it.

You know, like the Cuban missiles and the submarine.

Well, frankly, the whole bad Georgian thing.

I was worried for a few months.

I really thought maybe we had paid too heavy a price for the house.

I don't know what we paid

If you compare it, if it weren't for that, they'd now be launching an attack.

First of all, I doubt that China would have come through quite that well.

But if they would be launching an attack right now on Huawei, which is what they almost certainly would be doing, we'd be in the worst part of the shit.

Instead, our casualties are now down while our troops are going out.

Okay.

I will get you back a while from the plane, okay?

No, no.

This is necessary.

I mean, I'll see if you want.

But you won't be back until, uh... Monday night.

You have your meeting Monday this morning, yes?

I'm leaving two states in the morning.

Uh, you're leaving, uh... Two states tomorrow morning because I have to go by Franco to set up the cover this time.

Good luck, Kyle.

Have a good time.

This is my best friend.