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It's a small thing to her.

Good times.

I think she likes to be answered, Chief.

I think I'll be still home.

Is somebody else going this time?

It's my understanding that Kathy Bachman is going.

Who?

Kathy Bachman.

She's one of us.

But the point is that it's always to be done on the basis that I'm going for Maine.

I'm going to use it on Maine and Alabama.

So she didn't...

But I'll get it controlled because we can't have her go to the con because it's just, you know, we've not got that in order to do.

And when she's there also, we have a little problem with social problems.

I understand that very well.

And also, I usually touch base with her and sort of lead her to believe that she's been fucked.

Yeah, a lot.

He says that he feels that somewhere that Rose got her nose out of coming when she has been told and invited to go to Florida or any place else.

Even though she doesn't want to go?

Yeah, I didn't know anybody was going at all.

I haven't seen a girl, huh?

Well, Kathy Popp is going down just under your orders.

Yeah, okay.

She's got somebody there in case we have a nuclear war or something.

That's right.

She's going down hiding in the hotel rooms.

What was the situation?

Why didn't she handle it?

I thought she might, well, what bothers her is, has she ever, did she ever talk to her mother about that?

No.

I mean, she hasn't.

She won't want to do that?

Yeah, according to Warren, she's looking forward to resting there.

Of course she is.

I'm sure she probably should.

Or whoever goes has to work down there.

That's the point.

And I get it.

And it has to be the work community, work over there in the office, wherever it is.

And that's all we've taken up.

That's the point that I mean, I don't even know anybody's going.

It's the staff secretary that's going down there.

The staff secretary has to go, always be there.

And God damn it, she does.

There can't be any question on that.

I mean, I can't hurt her every time.

No, you can't.

She doesn't want to get down there and do it herself.

What did she get me to do?

It's much better to have the others and also let them do the work.

that's right right here

Anyway, that's so damn ridiculous that, you know, you'd be concerned about going back.

But she raised it with you, and she raised it with Alex.

She hasn't done it.

Of course, I didn't even know anybody was going this time, because I figured that nobody is, except for you.

You said, as a cloud order, you must always have one secretary.

Because I've had occasions when I had to get messages out, and I have no damn way.

I can't get up to some, I mean, to Munson.

And there always should be some one secretary along, or whatever I have.

But over the hell, they're with the military aid, or whoever the hell they stay with.

I don't care where, but they're not there for them.

You know what I mean?

Well, anyway, it's a small thing.

It's a stupid little problem.

The old question, you know, it's, what does the, what does the Rumsfeld rule of RU for somebody the point they want?

Is this fun or serious?

Jesus Christ.

I mean, take Rosa and every goddamn thing.

She went to every social function.

I just saw that little one out here.

I said, were you in Russia?

I never saw her at a goddamn thing.

She was there one day.

Well, no problem.

She had, I think she thought it was a hell of an experience.

She did.

Is it raining?

Yeah.

I called you last night.

That must be a really goddamn job.

Poor Gregory to have that deal with Connors.

You do a job, don't you?

Yeah, we probably should blast me for a chit-chat.

Well, what are your provocations?

You're not going down there, Bob.

Don't bother.

Do what you feel is best for yourself.

You'd prefer to go to Camp David, you know, because...

Nothing, nothing.

I'm not keen on going myself.

I can assure you.

I could do six to one and a half dozen, but nothing I know of.

But I'm grateful to stay here.

I'll get sandbagged by, for example, George Shultz or Peterson.

I'll tell you what I've done.

I've tried to collect a sort of a summary of where things are.

When you get to the end of your time down there, I'm planning on coming back.

You can look at it.

And I think it will bring you up to date pretty well on what the current problems are.

There's nothing that can't wait.

As far as the action is concerned, there really isn't anything that's all-lettered.

We'll want to get started with some stuff when you get back, parochial aids and some things of that kind.

Did Bob mention to you Connelly testifying on Monday?

No.

He's using the – he's – I don't know whether it's an excuse or he doesn't want to testify or what.

Everybody feels very keenly that he ought to be the leadoff witness on this debt ceiling hearing Monday because he was in on your breakfast with Mills and understands what happened there and is a good witness.

It would be awfully good if we could request him to do that before he comes down to see you Monday afternoon.

And why don't we do that?

Yes, sir.

I just wanted to, I just gave a very general outline of the meetings.

Marty said they'd all agree to be reviewed and, you know, they bring the state of the nation forward.

I think that Steve should actually put in a tax certificate or a significance report to the Declaration of Principles that...

...leaderships to be very responsive to the agreements, and that you made the point that the Senate would have a responsibility to ratify and discuss, and it was my sense that they would proceed.

With the discussion in the healthy environment, that was the sense that I got from the meeting, that following the ratification of the treaty, the approval of the agreement that the United States was required to move to the second phase of the under-resolution of the law.

So that's basically all I said.

But making the point that

The leadership and I think they did seem very responsive.

We didn't get much chance to do it.

We didn't get much chance to talk, which of course is always a way to do it.

Seeing that key approval, and I've said that there will now be discussion with the presidents of the cities, and I'm careful with you on this, but I felt that it would proceed in a healthy way, and that we probably can wrap this up.

Oh, I hear what you're going to have to say.

You've got to be creative enough to doubt what's not going to happen.

This is your day to day problem.

But I'll be defensive.

No, no.

As a matter of fact, I tried to take, because you made the remark in there, I tried to take the opposite course, confident in the fact that it's a good agreement.

Now it would be discussed.

We feel it will be done.

Now it's a good agreement.

Well, of course, the real point is, what it follows, you want this agreement or not, you're trying to get this agreement or something back.

I didn't want to do that, because I didn't want to say it.

I thought it would be a shame to say it.

But we have, we have our, we have our opposition in the hell of a spot here to run.

Because the bastards are divided.

I mean, on the one hand, you've got Jackson saying, for Christ's sakes, go out and build 18,000 more submarines.

Or ABMs, whatever the hell he wants to build.

On the other hand, you've got Men's Field and the rest of the ones that cut the defense budget $30 million right now.

They've got to make up their minds.

Huh?

What are you for?

You for cutting their debt, or do you want to make a discrepancy?

They're in hell, as far as I know.

And of course, the other key point, too, is that you have proven in this that if you have a basis of strength in negotiating issues with the Trump, that that is the only way to accomplish it.

I mean, you can't do it unilaterally.

If you do it unilaterally, then, I would say, as a man says, you have both rights and better rights.

And then you'll find yourselves in the position of Senator Grant's governor.

OK.

But I thought it was a good, I thought it was an excellent session.

They seem to, the best thing to handle is to see if he's not going to get into too much detail where this guy's an idealist.

They don't understand.

They don't know the size of those goddamn holes or whatever they call them and how many submarines and the G-class and all that.

If you get into that, it's a little too complicated for them.

But they, I think they're more interested in sort of the generalities.

You'll be getting some questions on Laird's request for a supplemental.

Laird's going up Monday and asked for 5,000 or more.

And part of it's Vietnam and part of it's salt.

So you'll be getting some of that.

Well, we're caught, of course, in a debt ceiling increase with all this testimony about no new taxes and the revised budget with a big deficit and so on.

So we're sort of in the middle.

It would really be better if he could wait a little while until we get this tax thing behind us, but I don't know what the ins and outs of that are.

Well, we do want to talk to him.

Oh, sure.

There he is.

The answer you've heard me say this morning, I didn't get into that today.

I said it didn't raise my options.

Yeah, because I didn't want to raise it.

But I think if they continue to press on it, the position that we should take is the fact that I committed to anything, but it seems essential that we proceed.

On that basis, it was a recommendation of the Joint Chiefs to transfer the...

I just simply say it was a recommendation of the Joint Chiefs to go ahead and we support that recommendation and let the goddamn Senate turn it down if they want.

We don't care.

I personally don't care.

It's worth a damn.

But from a good look...

But no, we won't give it any time.

Say hell if anything, the agreement allowed us to build, we're going to build it.

We're not required to, but it would be a mistake to not go to the point that we agreed that for which it would go to.

Well, just say, put them in the position where they're saying that it would be a suggestion of mine, so that we have an advantage.

The treaty was negotiated in such a way that that would be, that would give an advantage to the Soviets.

I did make a point that I said that the president came on the Wayne Foundation, though.

were good agreements and in the self-interest of the non-specialists.

I'm going to get to that point and I'll put this out of the way.

Well, I didn't say put this out of the way.

All right.

Sure.

That's right.

I agree.

But I don't decay.

OK. All right.

Well, thank you.

What about your other problems, John?

Well, I'm just going to let you wait on those, if you don't mind.

No, no.

We have one I want to talk to you about.

I have a good friend, Elliot Richardson.

15 minutes.

Elliot's pressing very hard to soften our position on welfare.

Do you like it?

Softened.

Well, the rest is true.

Well...

Okay.

He's got a big memo and a big option paper for you.

I want to abolish it.

His argument is, well, I want no bill.

That's right.

If we hang in on H.R.

1 right where we are,

And make noises like we're supporting it.

Send our congressional guys up to pound the pavements up there and make a lot of motion that we're trying to get H.R.

1.

We'll get nothing.

Bob, John, there's no bullshit either.

I know.

It is a lousy issue.

There would be.

You would have trouble.

After whatever came out of this silly goddamn thing, I think it would be brilliant.

Well, see, Elliott's arguing that there's good politics in trying to split off the responsible liberals.

Okay.

Well, I think we can...

Okay.

All right.

Now, here's my...

Here's my Richardson problem.

He says that he's got to talk to you about this.

He's out of town today.

He's going to Japan next Wednesday morning.

If you could just somehow figure out a way to stay and keep us game until Wednesday morning.

Oh, I'm coming back on Wednesday night.

Good.

Okay.

Well, then that does it.

Oh, sir.

That does it.

No, I know what his problem is, and I know that he wants to act for all these other's constituencies, and they all think we ought to press him for a vote there, and he wants to make a deal to lose it with Riddle Coffee.

Yep.

God damn it, sir.

They might pass it.

Well, and he's undercut us here, in a way.

He's been to the Winnesee group.

He's been to Scott, Javits, Schweiker, all those guys.

Jesus Christ.

And he could pass it.

If he came partway toward Ribicoff, they'd get a bill.

I don't think there's any question about it.

Then we'd have a hell of a thing.

And also, we're not sure where.

Well, that's it.

That's it.

There are a great, great thousand out there.

The more I see of it...

The compromise that he wants would cost substantially more money than H.R.

1.

What I'd like to do is to have Connelly, as the last desperate actor, say that he regrets that he simply got to pay the bills on purpose and don't give an inch on H.R.

1.

Maybe that's one way or the other.

Schultz should say it.

Yeah, Schultz is saying it.

And he's a better one to say it.

Because he's...

He's got liberal credentials.

He can simply say, I regret it, but I'm just going to say it.

And that can do it for a lot of other things, like, for example, if you're counting those guys, they have a lot of great professors.

Well, yes, sir.

MIT and other schools, no, because they don't know it yet.

They're not going to know their strokes until they turn their heads.

Good.

Now, I've got some other stuff in this notebook that you can look at Wednesday on the clean water veto.

Rural revenue sharing.

Mitchell disagrees, but everybody else in- Clean water?

Yep.

He thinks it's a suicide veto then.

But anyway, it costs $14 billion and four liters.

Well, you've got to do it, though, in a setting of the economy where you say, I'm going to have to take a lot of tough steps here.

And he did a lot of things that are often being polite but being favored on.

We just can't do it because of the sanctions.

Well, anyway, this is postponed until you get around to doing this.

There's a little black notebook in there with his stuff in it.

And there's another one.

It'll be in your weekend read.

There's another one on...

I was going to tell you that Edward Keller will do not just talk.

It's 100% for him to testify.

He's very significant.

You put Humphrey Cole to say a tremendous thing and tell the president...

I'll vote for it and then, you know, disagree and support it.

John Stanton, I don't know whether he had a chance to... No, I didn't see anybody play it.

He said, I want you to know that I'm going to be a strong supporter of the treaty.

I'm just playing it now in such a way so that it might support me in some way.

Listen to a little more testimony and then I'll come out strong.

He's talking about the ABM treaty.

The SALT treaty.

The SALT.

Well, the ABM party.

Les Aaron is treading forward...

Maynard came up to me and said, Maynard's all right.

Yes, they said, we'll take care of the house for you.

What we want to do is meet with you next week.

And then we'll plan the strategy.

It's a masterful achievement, they said.

Maynard asked a critical question, which was that it enabled us to stick it to Mansfield.

And you see that silly owner.

Do you know Mansfield made the statement we shouldn't build a site around Washington?

My owner says this requires development.

And then, of course, we'd be damned if we don't.

McGregor said there would be no more than six votes in the Senate against the truth.

The other thing is, Henry, I think that Maynard asked a good question.

He said, how about these other programs, our defense programs?

That's what I mean.

So we could be for them.

There's your hawks.

As long as we're for those programs.

Tala came up to me and said he was tremendously reassured.

Mahon said he would fight for it.

Aaron said he'd fight for it.

No, the only one that wasn't there was Peter.

No, but Aaron said, they're sure they can get Peter here.

And I'm going to be pretty big on that.

And could I ask you to do this?

Because he's such a personal friend.

You might even call him here and say to the President, just say, Congressman, the President noted you were not there and wanted me to be sure it's getting that.

He'd love it.

And he'll say, I'll do what he says.

We had an experience that got overwhelming.

I mean, I thought that through.

It was really, well, I think I did hear recommendations to how to do it, because we had gotten into all the haggling details and everything, but we had just enough detail to give them a feeling that we negotiated hard, and we gave them enough answers.

Well, I think the way you ended it was very helpful, because I had given them such a tough line.

that for you to get some stuff to .

Well, it's true.

It is absolutely true, you know?

I mean, it's true, due to the fact that neither you nor I appreciate, I mean, like.

Actually, our better course, really, if we had a goddamn Congress line, is to go out on a building program of our own.

No.

But we did not have a Congress horse.

No, our best course is to do what we did and use the five years to start a building program.

Yeah.

Well, yeah, it was what I had.

Did you know?

Well, you well know, Henry.

You well know.

The way, where did we have, we went to Moscow with no cars.

And we did that well with no cars.

That's right.

That's the point.

Did you notice how I got the submarine thing in?

Oh, yeah.

There's a copy of it.

You'll notice that I told Gresham, I said, he knew very well that we weren't going to build any submarines.

I thought your opening statement was good.

It was very long, it was weak, but it was, it showed that there was a real conception there, that we hadn't just gotten there by accident.

And it could, I thought it was, and incidentally, I hope that you always do this, too, because you have Marvin and I, always bringing the China part, too.

Because I don't want the Chinese to get the feeling we're screwing them.

And it's not that close to Mansfield.

So, if you notice, he would know how to go down there.

Yeah.

And that doesn't make the Soviet mad.

No, it doesn't.

Well, we've got to be careful.

Well, we didn't go too far.

No.

The Chinese are doing it for this reason.

No.

Thank you.

The Soviets would like at least the impression that they have isolated the Chinese.

Yeah.

We have to leave it.

We still have to leave it.

They're going to jump on us.

Yeah.

I just can't.

We've got to resist it.

We can't.

Well, we can't.

If the Soviet Union takes China, they take the world.

Because of the Soviet power, Chinese manpower, they got the world.

In fact, that's what I would have discussed with our government.

I told Mansfield, I said, look, we're informing the Chinese of all we've seen.

We're insulting them.

Good.

Excellent.

Yeah.

But I do think that you .

Yeah, for me.

The letter, I don't mean you, but Kev Sonnenfeld or somebody.

No, no, I do not know Sonnenfeld.

No, the hell with you.

You've got enough to do.

But you know those letters are very helpful.

Yeah, except we have to be careful that these guys can't have anything.

They can show it out.

Yeah.

No, I know.

I'll do it.

I'll make an oral message from you.

Yeah, an oral.

You mean to the Chinese?

But I meant to some of the other leaders.

Like the Prime Minister.

I read your letter to the cabinet.

Can you help me call a chance if we can get a British one for me with a Chinese one?

Well, do you remember the Polish prime minister mentioning letters to you?

I don't know what the hell I had written.

He's a very, uh...

The prime minister was nice, but his wife was probably the most tragic woman of the, uh, of our age.

But the guy that really died was the Polish...

Their secretary was like, God damn, he's a formidable man.

They said, you know, you think of our people, they said, the real concern I have is the way our people underestimate the Communist leadership because they are coal miner's sons.

They dig them up the hard way.

Some of them do have vulgar manners, not the Chinese, but the Soviet people.

And the rest, although both, are still very much there.

It's late, but these assholes are highly prolific in their stand, and they are impressive.

I don't know an American businessman that I would go to the ring of care.

Well, the question is, do you?

I don't know.

and then we sat through some of this water and some of that, we got a little shot in on that place and, I mean, and I just said to him, I said, I'll tell you what, you can come up to us often, and he said, well, he, I think that there's a possibility that he is going to try to get out of that place.

I said, come up to us, and I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what, I said, I'll tell you what,

They laughed at everything in a way that I hadn't ever seen.

Freshmen could see.

And the President's behavior was an installment, because they put it there.

I think it's a kind of hypnotic drive, because, you know, the temptation would be to argue

I was efficiently arguing the timelines for the show, thinking that he was a good guy and that he was a rather good guy.

The president was just sitting there, like a rock, with a slight of a strange little smile on his face.

And every once in a while he would throw a tough question on his proceedings at times, and he said,

The President just started advancing to that.

He's going to thank us.

I'll go ahead and thank Danny, who, uh, they were talking about elections.

And they said, they, they said, you got, that you, you're supporting this man in South Vietnam, this, uh, this man who has not been elected from the people.

I said, who, who elected the President from the government?

Yeah, but, um, I suppose, Lord, I suppose,

It went on for two hours, and then he stepped through a lot of stress.

And then at the end, the president made about a ten-minute statement.

So I opened up, and just another button, and dropped off the guitar, and I was just, another button, and then, and, they, suddenly, two of them, they, did what they said, and it wasn't anything we wanted to understand.

When they hit back, you could call it, and it was, I mean, mass murder, I mean, everything you've ever seen on a flag, they had.

And they said, only if the two of us could talk to each other like this.

And it was the most jovial that I ever drank.

That was the one that said it.

Or was it Persegian as you learned it?

No, Persegian.

Persegian, he said, would admit it thus far and say, you know, the fact that we've been having this manner of having a kind of conversation over there is a very instructive thing.

Then, and he had, I think he, Persegian is, of course, the brightest gal, but on the other hand, Gresham is the toughest.

And Brezhnev is a formidable man.

I can't shake the part of people who are intolerant of these people.

Don't give us adequate intelligence on these people.

But you have to remember, Mr. President, that you and I, put together, have lost more time with Brezhnev

that all of us voted to leave this in the group, put together, and see where these other foreign leaders, you know, have given us.

Every foreign leader has told us that they didn't appreciate it.

I heard it over and over again.

I see it with very bright eyes.

I appreciate it.

I said, he's not very smart.

Even though he's like, he's like Fitzsimmons or me.

That's it.

But what businessman will tell you that Fitzsimmons or me is smart?

I don't understand every time.

Would you agree with that?

We, we people, the trouble with the West is we're all over educated.

Henry Lepson's right.

But then these, these people, I said, don't you regret us a vulnerable man?

Well, literally.

And then, then the people that I had, it was another vulnerable man.

Oh, yeah.

Hey, uh, you know, listen.

You know, from people, we had a couple of, I don't know, Secretary of State, you know,

What do you know about Memphis?

I told the president, I said the president said that he was going to do what I told him he was going to do.

And he's got, he's got, and we, he's got, we raised by a bill.

We have given a bill all, most of the United Nations, to the survivors of it.

But Grameen was not on it.

He made sense of it.

Right.

Well, then I had two four-hour sessions with Grameen, and then on the last day, I came to the President with what he was expecting.

Soviet decommissioned support of the Soviet Union.

Well, I have a good play.

Let me tell you.

Tell them I'll be quiet for a minute.

Are they on the plane?

I think you have, for example, Mr. President.

Yesterday, the central committee of the Communist Party in Moscow made a statement supporting what President Putin did to the President.

And they had to have something in FYB, which is so paid.

What they put into our statement is already so paid.

They were going to put into the community case their position and our position.

Their position, which was nothing but a word about mine.

And they had two statements, and they have one that said, the difference is between Osgoode and the British.

And the other one was that they had a favor with Osgoode, and they had with the Army, and they had with the President.

I'll say, look, I know you want this.

This is going to be very difficult for me, but I'll concede this, but not until you get the answer.

But you were in the next position, Mr. President, that the end of the C-5 release means that there's

Police guys just pop their way up in here.

I told you.

I said the president said he's going to do what I want.

He's got it.

First of all, I didn't think it was a virus.

But for me, it's not a virus.

He makes me sick of it.

You make me sick of it.

Right.

Well, then I had two, four other patients with me.

For example, the last day of surgery, I came to the president's office.

One of his detectives, Sylvia, didn't come through.

I have a question.

Let me hear you.

Tell them, I'll be quiet for a minute.

Are they on a plane?

Is it a drone or a helicopter?

I think the U.S., for example, is a business.

Yesterday, the center committee of the Communist Party in Moscow made a statement supporting a professional business development.

which is so tight, what they put into our state, which is already so tight, they regret to put into our communities, their position, our position, their position, which was nothing but a burden on mine.

And they had...

They never criticized our mining, even the buddies of mine.

Really, they had to admire it.

And they... We had to admire the mining we've been doing.

And they had true statements, and they have honestly said, the difference is between us versus under the bridge.

I'll say, look, I know you want this.

This is going to be very difficult for me, but I want to see this.

But now I want you to get cancer.

means that they'll probably be defeated.

But really, you will never know what the, probably will never know.

They've always just, you know, used to have their call range from the body of the city.

We may, you know, there were some bloody sessions in Henry.

The first had to wrap it all up.

So I bet you it would be with a typewriter.

Right.

If Henry has no objection, I'm going to sleep tomorrow for the whole UN meeting.

And I'll be gone.

I'll be back about the same time you are.

Well, that's part of the course, I guess.

And I don't need to go, as far as I'm concerned.

Now, he's going to make a very provocative speech.

I don't mind your going.

He's going to make a provocative speech.

As long as I'm Vietnam.

To the UN.

As long as you know you're going to get it.

All right.

Well, as long as you...

The only reason I'm going, Henry, is to keep training and get up in the hospital air base.

And then Whitaker's going to go when I come back Wednesday.

I don't know.

I think you're going to go anyway.

I'm going to go, but be confident.

Well, I have that.

You see him.

I can speak.

I can speak with this other guy.

Don't be a mother to him.

This is not how it works.

The Bill Ryan's always saying, look, the president's doing what he wants.

He's getting on Vietnam.

He's doing everything that he can to end the war.

He didn't need it.

No, the thing to do is to say, look, we, it is not we that are continuing the war.

They are continuing the war.

You say stop the war, tell them to stop it.

That's it.

Sure, we're ready.

But they are on this lead in that sense.

Is that right?

That's right.

Yeah, that's right.

Well, you know what?