Nixon, Ziegler & Kissinger on Watergate and John W. Dean III

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I didn't read the whole thing.

Bill Sapphire had a... Well, he's read.

Bill Sapphire had a column today called Gangamine, Gangamine, which was the most scathing, cutting, ripping, shredding, personal name.

Well, 100%.

The man you have betrayed, Gangamine, is a far better man than you will ever be.

Second point, it's a strategy with regard to how, uh, responses may be changed.

Uh, I have no, uh, but Bazaar has said, uh, how much, uh, Thompson is not very bright or how much he, he knows, uh, these, uh, second and sixth grade teachers.

Correct?

That's correct.

John, what is your opinion?

Well, I think you'll go on with a very long, babbling statement of about three to five hours, and that'll be tomorrow.

And I think it'll be rambling in nature.

This is only my speculation.

And tell me your stories out on the course, and there'll be heavy coverage of it.

I simply, I deeply believe this, and I've talked to a lot of different people about it, tested it.

The worst thing we can do.

The worst thing would be, what about the man in the dog?

One thing, you see, the image of that is perfect.

If you just, I don't think we could, after that lousy job that Gergen or somebody did on him, and the post is on him, we're going to find out, and I'm going to fire somebody with that, you understand?

in the Post.

If anybody has his out, and I need the data consumption, I just want to have that.

When you say not respond, you can't be hanging out there in the charge that the President said, we will pay a million dollars for the buck to these people, because I didn't say that.

The answer is wrong.

You, of course, understand.

I've told you a dozen times.

But the answer is very simple.

When the President said, this is blackmail, I said, how much would it cost to do this thing?

And I said, it's a black man.

And Dean said, it's wrong.

It won't work because you can't get clemency with it.

And then I ordered Dean and Holder to meet with Mitchell and Earl the following day to get this whole story out.

No, no, of course not.

But you see, I don't know whether that can be said.

And I just said, well, get Wilson to say it or get Holder to say it.

Well, there are two ways to do it.

If this breaks and when it breaks, there are two ways to do it.

Okay, two ways.

Have Haldeman, who is his lawyer, issue an immediate direct attack on him.

The second way would be for the counsel's office.

They were supposed to have two

Yes, I did.

The president never promised to raise a million dollars or never promised to pay a million dollars.

You can't say that, can you?

Well, Holloman could, but I can't.

We have already said in our statements that the president was not involved in the activities.

His investigation began on March 21st.

And there's nothing more to say.

We will not respond any further to these type of judgments.

That's one way to do it.

You've got men over there in EOB thinking about this and worrying about it.

And we've got nothing's going to develop today on it.

The damn storage has already been run three times.

That's right.

And they will deal with it.

The press was rather surprised at me this morning.

It was so much.

You know what I'm saying?

And the only place you see this is where we miss Joe's next time.

The only place that there ought to be...

It was a straight political story, pieced together by Woodward and Bernstein.

I'm sure of the instructions of the people over there.

There's no one source for that story.

I read it four times.

It's a pieced together thing.

I want to find out who the White House source is, too.

But that's not a story.

It's a cleverly written story.

And if you go through it, they weave paragraphs into the thing which they've been compiling from all over the place, out of context stuff, to create an impression.

Creating an impression that the president's going to move from a position not called.

The president's going to say, I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to say I was misled.

That's the only place of what it is.

without denying any charge against Ed Rodney.

And they said that's totally, that it's false.

And the facts will show, the investigators will be noticed.

When I heard about that break-in, I thought somebody's been out of his mind.

I heard about Mark, as you know.

He told me about it.

And incidentally, Krogh has already testified, has he not, that he did it, and that Hurley did not know about it.

Correct?

Am I correct or am I not correct?

You are correct.

The other point is, right, it's all the same.

They have something like, Mr. D's motives are clear and we're not going to participate in his strategy.

His allegations are self-serving and for the most part false, period.

Something like that.

No, and as far as the President is concerned, false.

And as far as any charges the President has acknowledged or participated in, or something like that, they are totally false.

Totally false.

You could get them with that.

Then, uh, uh, the, uh, of course, the other lie, if that would be compared to the answer, is that some jackass is likely to be baited, in my opinion.

He's such a publicity secret in the present time.

we have to deal with this we have a couple ways to go but also must restrain ourselves by not slipping

and build him up even further.

Now, Dean, there's a little... Oh, excuse me.

Yeah, uh, just one other thought.

When we talk to professionals, we talk about this prospect of strengthening the leg.

It's also to say we have a special obligation to preserve the piece, but also a special obligation to prevent the impression that we're trying to run the world.

And say something about condominium.

All right.

Okay.

Okay?

You can move that way.

to suck us into his strategy where we begin to respond to him and have more attention on him.

I think the way to deal with Dean, as we've talked about at length, is to ignore him.

If a charge comes out on a $1 million thing, you're right, we hit it with this ball, so we get that out there, right, with a story.

But we cannot allow ourselves to be intimidated by this guy, and if we do, it is a fatal move that we will make.

And it is a fatal move.

the basis of Santa Barbara's column on Dunga Bean today, you know.

I don't want to be more impressive than that.

I mean, it's such an unbelievable thing.

Well, you know, your level, Mr. President, is fresh.

Dean is insignificant.

And if we can approach this week with that in mind, not allowing ourselves to be, you know, hurt by a lot

Reading it on there on the president's shoulder.

So we get that out there, right, with the story.

But we cannot allow ourselves to be intimidated by this guy.

And if we do, it is a fatal move that we will make.

And it is, you know, and that was the basis of Santa Barbara's column on Dunga Bean today, you know.

I don't want to be more impressive than that.

I mean, it's such an unbelievable thing.

Well, you know, your level, Mr. President,

is very strong.

Being is insignificant.

And if we can approach this week with that in mind, not allowing ourselves to be hurt

No, he has answered.

We have to deal with this.

We have a couple of ways to go, but also we must restrain ourselves.

to build him up even further.

Now, Dean, there's a little... Oh, excuse me.

Yeah, uh, since one of us already talked to Gresham about this, we've talked about this prospect of strengthening the legacy of support, so to say, we have a special obligation to preserve the peace, but also a special obligation to prevent the oppression that we're trying to run in the world.

And say something about countrymen and union.

All right.

Okay.

Okay?

You can move right away.

to suck us into his strategy where we begin to respond to him.

We'll get a little more attention on him.

I think the way to deal with Dean, as we've talked about at length, is to ignore him.

If a charge comes out on a $1 million thing, you're right, we hit it with this ball.

So we get that out there, right, with a story.

But we cannot allow ourselves to be intimidated by this guy.

And if we do, it is a fatal move that we will make.

And it is a fatal move.

You know, your level, Mr. President, is very low.

Dean is insignificant.

And if we can approach this week with that in mind, not allowing ourselves to be, you know, hurt by a

Reading and all the men are out in front of the store, Houston.

Nixon, Ziegler & Kissinger on Watergate and John W. Dean III

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Nixon Library Finding Aid

Also recorded on June 18, 1973

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