Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 14 › Conversation 014-108

Nixon phone call with Connally on Phase II economic policy

Monday, November 15, 1971 · 5:55 PM–6:03 PM ET · White House Telephone · 7 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); White House operator; Connally, John B.Conversation014-108 on Tape 14 (tape position 03:21:50–03:29:10)StartMonday, November 15, 1971 at 5:55 PMEndMonday, November 15, 1971 at 6:03 PMRecording deviceWhite House TelephoneSourceNixon Library record for 014-108 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and Treasury Secretary John Connally discussed the administration's aggressive legislative strategy with congressional leaders and the political opposition they faced. They reviewed the status of Phase II economic policies, including wage retroactivity and market perceptions, while expressing mutual confidence in their economic direction. The conversation also touched upon Connally's potential political vulnerability following his trip to Vietnam and concluded with arrangements for an upcoming Quadriad meeting.

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Transcript (AI-generated)

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Secretary Connolly, Mr. President.
Oh, yes, sir.
I just wanted you to know that I felt that your advice to play the hard line with these leaders was exactly right.
You know, I had to decide that at noon, and Holloman called you.
Yes, sir.
And I took that line.
I was very nice to them, as you could gather from the cabinet meeting.
Yes.
But by golly, John, and after our talk last night and today, I just decided we've got to fight back.
We cannot sit here and sort of roll and this and that and the other thing.
And then they're going to cave, in my opinion.
Well, of course, I think they are.
They have to.
And if they don't, you've laid a perfect predicate for us.
That's right.
And frankly, let me tell you this.
We'll let the damn fire department off and the welfare mothers.
Let them go down there.
Let them come down, you know, and sit in their front steps, you know, with their little babies.
And we'll say that we can't protect our Americans abroad because they're not going to send that Air Force out without having their, you know, the planes properly done.
You know, you've got a hell of a case here.
No question about it.
And so I felt it was the right thing.
Well, I'm real happy you did it, Mr. President.
And it was a kind of a hairy session.
We had about, it took them in here for 45 minutes, but I'll tell you,
This Mike Mansfield disappoints me somewhere.
Oh, he's a weak filter.
What do you think?
He seems so partisan.
Well, he's gotten that way, and I don't know what caused it.
He's always been... Well, it came around.
I think it's going to work out sometime tonight, but I thought you'd be interested.
Tell me, how's everything else going?
Did you get through the cost of living thing all right?
Is it working to your satisfaction?
Yes, sir.
I think so.
I'm not sure I'm up to speed on it yet.
I'll have to wait a few more days.
I wouldn't get too into it.
I mean, I think Rumsfeld's pretty close to it, and they're just doing the best they can.
That retroactivity thing is the hardest thing.
I'm afraid, I don't know, they're going to have to probably do most of that.
No question.
Don't you think?
I don't see how you can break it down.
And that'll just be a flip and then off we'll go.
That's right.
And it'll be written about here for 30, 60 days.
By the first of the year, though, we ought to be over that, and we all knew it was coming, and I think they just take their medicine, and we take it, and go on about our business.
Right.
George Allen had a very, a big charge, you know, as an old friend, came in today, you know, Eisenhower's and Truman's friends.
Oh, yeah.
You know him well, yeah.
He said, and he's great.
We were talking a little.
He had a, you know, he's quite a clever fellow in the market.
He said, you know, he said, you know what's happening to the market?
And I said, no.
Look, they can say, well, you know what it really is?
It isn't because they think phase two is uncertain.
They think it's going to work.
And therefore, part of this is the fact that the market is discounting the fact that it's inflation.
And they don't see it as inflationary as it was.
You know, he may have a point there.
Sure, Mark.
Frankly, phase two is going to work.
It's going to work damn well for probably long enough.
I guess so.
I'm quite, I must say, I'm quite optimistic.
I just don't understand all this uncertainty that these businessmen expect.
I just have less and less confidence in them all the time.
That's right, that's right.
Well, we could get along.
Did you get a good talk with Henry?
Yes, sir, I did.
I haven't seen him since then.
Henry's reflecting, I think, some of the
the basic sentiment that, you know, they're getting worried about.
Except that he's not, he's not doctrinaire about it.
He didn't care what's done.
Oh, no.
Oh, no.
Oh, no.
I mean, he's got a, he had one point that he made for him.
He says that, you know, he's, of course, looking out after all of us.
But he said, he said, the main thing in you that he thinks he, that he thinks, he says, look here, he says that, he said, we did exactly the right thing.
It had a massive effect.
It was a great thing.
He said, now, he said,
He said, I just want to see the secretary.
I want to see him take the major move, the big move, and the statesman thing at the right time.
And I think he's probably right on that.
He was thinking politically, not on the economic side.
And so I said that before it went over, I said, well, pass it on to you for whatever it's worth.
We'll have something this week.
I talked to Volker over the weekend.
We've got some ideas being formulated.
We talked again about it at noon today, about an approach and a posture to begin, which we'll firm up.
and I'll turn out all the wrinkles, and I'll talk to you about it.
I think there's a time when we have to move, and I think, as far as I'm concerned, I don't think there's any question but what, just realistic and praising this criticism that's going to come, I think when you sent me to Vietnam, this pretty well settled in the minds of a great many people that, well, you were certainly going to have me in the wings if something happened to the East, and they...
pretty much accepted around town now that I might well be a candidate for something.
And so they're going to start chopping.
It's going to coalesce the criticism now.
They're going to start really leveling on me.
And I don't think there's any doubt about that.
It's going to be a
deliberate political decision that they're going to make.
That could be, but on the other hand, we've got a hell of a lot of cards to play, too, because we're on the right side.
Oh, yeah, oh, yeah.
Part of this is political.
Because, as you well know, it's not anything I want.
I know damn well I'm expendable, and I play it that way every day, and that suits me fine and to hell with them.
But I just know that I pick it up from some of my Democratic friends, and they're going to zero in on me, which is fine.
Well, we'll have some fun with them.
Well, anyway, now, one other thing.
What, John, do you want to do about a quadriad this week?
Do you want to have one or not?
I think we should.
All right.
And at that time, we'll...
Oh, incidentally, I sicked Alan on to Arthur on the money supply thing.
He knows him well, so I'm sicking everybody on him, and that's the way to do it, isn't it?
Yes, sir.
Shall I tell them around here to see what the work out of date later this week?
About Thursday would be a good time for you to get a quadrat in.
On the other thing, let me say I'm still keeping...
The other thing is I understand you will continue to keep your own counsel on it.
Yes, sir.
You talk to Henry, and if you want, Schultz, you know.
And I'm available any time, because at this time I've kept my calendar free, to talk this week on international monetary or cost of living, any of those things.
You see, we've got Vietnam backups for a week at least.
All right, sir.
All right, sir.
All right, thank you.
Bye-bye.

NARA Description

On November 15, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and John B. Connally talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 5:55 pm and 6:03 pm. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 014-108 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 14-108

Date: November 15, 1971
Time: Unknown after 5:55 pm until 6:03 pm
Location: White House Telephone

The President talked with the White House operator.

     John B. Connally

The President talked with Connally.

[See Conversation No. 617-22]

     Pending legislation
          -Connally's advice
                -H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
                -The President's meeting with congressional leaders

     Michael J. Mansfield

     National economy
          -Cost of Living Council
                -Donald H. Rumsfeld
          -Pay Board
                -Wage retroactivity
          -George E. Allen
                -Dwight D. Eisenhower, Harry S. Truman
                -Views regarding stock market
          -Phase II

     Henry A. Kissinger
          -Conversation with Connally regarding international economic concern

          -Views regarding Connally's stand

     Connally's conversation with Paul A. Volcker

     Connally
         -Trip to Vietnam
         -Possible attacks by Democrats

     Schedule
          -Quadriad

     National economy
          -Money supply
                -Arthur F. Burns
                     -The President's conversation with Allen

     Quadriad
         -Haldeman

     Connally's schedule
         -Haldeman
         -George P. Shultz
         -The President
                -Schedule

Also recorded on November 15, 1971

  • 014-106 2:20 PM · 34 sec — President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Howard H. Baker, Jr. talked on the telephone from 2:20 pm to 2:21 pm.
  • 083-001 3:36 PM · 59 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Cabinet officers, including William P. Rogers, John B. Connally, Melvin R. Laird, John N. Mitchell, William T. Pecora, Clifford M. Hardin, Maurice H. Stans, James D. Hodgson, John G. Veneman, George W. Romney, John A. Volpe, David M. Kennedy, George P. Shultz, Donald H. Rumsfeld, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, John D. Ehrlichman, Raymond K. Price, Jr., Alexander P. Butterfield, William Bird, Chester C. Spurgeon, Ronald L. Ziegler, and Clark MacGregor, met in the Cabinet Room of the White House at an unknown time between 3:36 pm and 11:59 pm.
  • 014-107 5:55 PM · 5 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at 5:55 pm.
  • 014-109 6:03 PM · 9 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 6:03 pm and 6:04 pm.
  • 014-110 6:03 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 6:03 pm and 6:04 pm.
  • 014-111 6:04 PM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon, White House operator, and Hugh Scott talked on the telephone from 6:04 pm to 6:09 pm.
  • 014-112 6:09 PM · 38 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Julie Nixon Eisenhower talked on the telephone from 6:09 pm to 6:10 pm.
  • 014-113 6:56 PM · 5 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 6:56 pm and 7:03 pm.

All 57 conversations from November 15, 1971 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 014-108, November 15, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/014-108 (accessed October 27, 2026).