Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 204 › Conversation 204-004

Nixon phone call with Haldeman on Economic policy and Taxation

Thursday, August 17, 1972 · 10:32 PM–10:51 PM ET · Camp David Hard Wire · 13 min

ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President); Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Conversation204-004 on Tape 204StartThursday, August 17, 1972 at 10:32 PMEndThursday, August 17, 1972 at 10:51 PMRecording deviceCamp David Hard WireSourceNixon Library record for 204-004 ↗

AI Summary

President Nixon and H. R. Haldeman discuss the political messaging and economic data required for the administration's reelection platform. Nixon expresses frustration with technical, bureaucratic responses from his staff, specifically regarding tax cut figures, and directs Haldeman to assign someone with political intuition to verify if his administration truly provided the largest tax cuts in history. The conversation also touches upon the President's discomfort with self-congratulatory rhetoric, as he and Haldeman debate the effectiveness of campaign materials cataloging administration accomplishments.

Audio

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Transcript (AI-generated)

This transcript is incomplete. The transcription skipped stretches of speech — roughly 3 minutes of this recording (about 24% of it) is represented by only a few words. Listen to the audio rather than relying on the text below; a corrected transcript is queued.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI (WhisperX) and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Names and numbers are often wrong; speakers are not identified. Do not cite it as authoritative — verify against the audio and the finding aid.

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Yeah.
Yeah.
Who is Gergen?
Is that somebody that knows anything
about the gross, not her, extent.
And so if you gave price money to them, it gives me eight.
I don't know what the hell the score is.
Well, then fine.
Then fine.
Let's go further.
Just say, how much have we cut taxes?
Have we not cut taxes?
this administration.
We haven't provided the biggest tax cuts in this administration.
And, you know, which is what he knows what the hell the question is, because that's what Price had in his document.
That's the point he was making, the $22 billion cut.
And the other figure, they only had it when he was comparing corporate with this and that and the other thing.
But, uh, get somebody on it who's thinking politically.
You understand what I mean?
It isn't just trying to, you know, get
See, what he says is that the largest, he goes back to 64, he says the largest cut in individual income tax is 48 when they were reduced by 22%.
I don't care a shit about the percent, because the actual dollar would have
I just want to know, what was the tax cut?
How much tax cuts did this administration provide?
We provided the biggest tax cuts of any administration in history.
Just find out whether that is true or not true.
Would you do that?
I don't know.
He's being terribly technical, you know.
Like, for example, I asked him about the CEA thing.
I know what it is, 31% of our national income.
Let me, let me, don't tell me that.
31% of our national income is collected in taxes.
I understand that.
I understand.
You see what I mean?
The question is, would the addition in taxes,
The government's going to add $140 billion to the budget.
All right.
What does that make the percentage?
Let's see.
But you understand, the federal bite is about 80% of it.
The federal bite is about 75-80% is my recollection.
But at least he can find out.
And of course with the, well, tell him to figure it out with the $1,000 thing in it too.
With an increase, with the $1,000 thing, and then just with the increases in the budget.
See, both ways.
With the increases in the budget.
How much of a percent of our national income would have to be collected by taxes?
And don't be even being cute about it.
Just say that it reaches $1,000.
Then with a $1,000 proposal, what is it?
And then you'll get the 50%.
I'm sure all I need to do is to get the 50%.
Well, I can check some of this.
Let me ask you this.
I probably...
used one of the people up here to work on this goddamn thing and some of this checking and so forth uh i'm debating between andrews and who's the other fellow the only problem is i've never worked with
Oh, you'll explain the price.
I guess why I'm here because they've got some things in their crabs.
See what I mean?
That I want to check out.
That's really what it gets down to.
There's nothing to it.
No, no way you can read it.
the whole economic one is easy that way and i think the uh frankly the foreign policy letters and and frankly so is the law what's just done
We have had the largest impact of inflation in half.
We have had the national legacy of the parks.
And I really think cataloguery, and this is one thing, the only country recently I just think it's deadly.
I think it's deadly as hell now.
John thinks maybe people want to hear it now.
How do you do it?
I read it to you.
I mean, I read the best catalog we have.
What do you think of it?
Well, that's the catalog.
I read Price's catalog.
I disagree with it.
You see, when you say what we have accomplished, I think
I agree with you that they're going to get that over and over and over again.
And I don't think people get one goddamn about that.
Deflation in half.
We've added four million jobs.
Big deal.
That's what they come up with, like, all the others are virtually all jobs.
That's my problem.
I just don't think it is.
I don't think, I don't know whether Connelly would agree with it, but I don't think Connelly thinks that's the right one.
I mean, we've accomplished all these great things, so put us back in.
That's what John really thinks we should say is.
I don't know what we've done.
I don't feel very comfortable, frankly, standing up before the people bragging about what I've done.
It's just not my style.
Well, John's quite as it is.
Most people aren't going to hear it.
Of course, he's naturally influenced.
I mean, part of the problem here really is
Well, we'll try again when we have the answer.
Yeah.
So, so we can.
I want to know, isn't this the biggest, I don't mean percentage, dollar tax cut, tax cut for individuals, for individuals, because corporate taxes were raised before.
So it must be that Price has got another year in there.
What happens, you see, is this.
What has happened here is this.
Nergens is looking at it in terms of the year 69.
What he doesn't realize, of course, is he probably, of course, won't realize, the 69 cut provided for Cutts
provided for not just 69, but for other years as well.
It was the bite of the next year, and the next year we reduced taxes.
You see, what they ought to do, Bill, what I'm really trying to get at is something far more fundamental.
A question like this comes, the fellow getting it should think in terms of, what the hell is he trying to prove, and can I prove it?
You give it to him that way, and see if you can prove it.
Okay?

NARA Description

On August 17, 1972, President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 10:32 pm to 10:51 pm. The Camp David Hard Wire taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 204-004 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid

Conversation No. 204-4

Date: August 17, 1972
Time: 10:32 pm - 10:51 pm
Location: Camp David Hard Wire

The President talked with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman.

[See Conversation No. 140-29]

Also recorded on August 18, 1972

  • 140-029 10:32 PM · 19 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone at Camp David from 10:32 pm to 10:51 pm.
  • 140-030 10:51 PM · 9 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 10:51 pm and 11:02 pm.
  • 204-005 10:51 PM · 7 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David at an unknown time between 10:51 pm and 11:02 pm.
  • 140-031 11:02 PM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman talked on the telephone at Camp David from 11:02 pm to 11:04 pm.
  • 204-006 11:02 PM · 1 min — President Richard M. Nixon and H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David from 11:02 pm to 11:04 pm.
  • 140-032 11:04 PM · 11 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 11:04 pm and 11:43 pm.
  • 140-033 11:04 PM · 8 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Camp David operator talked on the telephone at Camp David at an unknown time between 11:04 pm and 11:43 pm.
  • 204-007 11:04 PM · 6 min — President Richard M. Nixon met in the Aspen Lodge study at Camp David at an unknown time between 11:04 pm and 11:43 pm.

All 22 conversations from August 18, 1972 →

Cite this conversation

Conversation 204-004, August 18, 1972. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/204-004 (accessed October 12, 2026).