Nixon White House Tapes › Tape 3 › Conversation 003-078
Nixon phone call with Ball on Mathias Resolution and Congressional relations
Thursday, May 20, 1971 · 8:16 AM–8:19 AM ET · White House Telephone · 3 min
AI Summary
President Nixon calls George W. Ball to express appreciation for Ball's instrumental role in lobbying Democrats to defeat the Mathias Resolution. Ball highlights a growing sense of isolation and suspicion among senators regarding foreign policy, recommending that the administration improve congressional relations through small-group briefings on sensitive topics like Soviet negotiations. Nixon acknowledges the need for better communication and suggests coordinating these sessions through Secretary of State William P. Rogers to mitigate institutional friction between the State Department and the White House.
- Mathias Resolution
- Congressional relations
- Foreign policy
- USSR
- Mutual and Balanced Force Reductions
- State Department
Audio
Transcript (AI-generated)
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Hello.
Hello.
Before you got into your work, I wanted to tell you that I was just talking to McGregor, and I said, you know, that was a very good job.
And he said, well...
He said, the man that really helped us the most on the Democratic side was George Ball.
So I just wanted to express appreciation to you and tell you that while we naturally have our differences on party and other matters, that I really thought this was a really fine demonstration of putting the interests of the
country first.
Well, it's very kind of you.
And I know you worked, from what I heard, very long hours, and I'm sorry we can't pay you what you're worth.
Well, this was in a good cause.
Right.
And they all came true?
You remember the ones you talked about all came true?
Well, I was very worried for a while yesterday that this Matthias thing was going to get out of hand.
Yeah, that was the one.
I got that one, and yet
It didn't even get as much as Fulbright's, did it?
No, that's right.
That was a curious thing.
If I may, I'd like just to repeat something I told Henry a few minutes ago.
Sure.
I found on both sides of the house a feeling of isolation, a sense that they had a lot of suspicions that things weren't being done that I know were in fact being done, largely because I think there probably should be a little more
private talk, when I say private talk, if Henry or some of the other people who were informed, Bill Rogers, could have a series of small meetings with five or six people, senators at a time, and talk about the substance of what they're doing, for example, in
on these questions of negotiation with the Soviets.
I know the intellectual work that's been done, I know the complexity of the problem, but I have a feeling up there that nobody pays any attention to it, which is not true.
Probably the best thing is to have that done by State, don't you think?
I think so, yeah.
Bill and Sean Irwin.
I do think, actually, that Henry, in spite of this problem of visibility, that they have a great respect for him.
He could be very helpful, too.
Let me say that on that, just talking in the family, that it is the...
international family, there is a great sensitivity in sometimes, you know, in state for anybody at the White House should know how to do it.
And we've had that problem, as you know, it was raised in press conferences.
But I think I'll have a talk with Bill and just say, look, we can...
we can do it because we do want to do it and of course i see lots of individual senators but i can't see them all and what has to happen is that if i have a dozen of them i i see your point exactly it isn't really a matter of giving you know a sales pitch it's just a matter of telling them what's going on so that they have a feeling of being in on the deal that's right that's right knowing that a great deal of serious thoughts are being given and that's right yeah there'll be an announcement today that will be of considerable interest in this general area and
I think after you hear it, we'll realize that we are working on a few things.
But in any event, I do appreciate your having worked, and I'm most grateful.
Thank you.
NARA Description
On May 20, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon and George W. Ball talked on the telephone from 8:16 am to 8:19 am. The White House Telephone taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 003-078 of the White House Tapes.
Nixon Library Finding Aid
Conversation No. 003-078
Date: May 20, 1971
Time: 8:16 am - 8:19 am
Location: White House Telephone
The President talked with George W. Ball.
[See Conversation No. 502-003]
Mathias Resolution
-Ball's position
-Clark MacGregor
-President's appreciation for support
-Vote
-Compared with a J. William Fulbright resolution
Congressional relations
-Henry A. Kissinger
-William P. Rogers
-Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR], Mutual and Balanced Force Reductions
[MBFR]
-Possible State Department briefings
-Rogers, John N. Irwin, II
Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, NARA Online Public Access Catalog Identifier: 597542
-Kissinger
-State Department and White House
-Rogers
-President's role
May 20, 1971 announcement
Ball's workAlso recorded on May 20, 1971
- 502-001 7:21 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Dean G. Acheson met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 7:21 am and 8:05 am.
- 502-002 8:05 AM · 35 sec — unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:05 am and 8:14 am.
- 502-003 8:16 AM · 3 min — President Richard M. Nixon and George W. Ball met in the Oval Office of the White House from 8:16 am to 8:19 am.
- 003-079 8:19 AM · 4 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and the White House operator talked on the telephone at an unknown time between 8:19 am and 11:50 am.
- 502-004 8:19 AM · 5 sec — President Richard M. Nixon and Manolo Sanchez met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:19 am and 8:32 am.
- 502-005 8:32 AM · 2 min — President Richard M. Nixon and Alexander P. Butterfield met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 8:32 am and 8:38 am.
- 502-006 8:38 AM · 21 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Henry A. Kissinger, Stephen B. Bull, and Marjorie P. Acker met in the Oval Office of the White House from 8:38 am to 9:02 am.
- 058-004 9:02 AM · 43 min — President Richard M. Nixon, Vice President Spiro T. Agnew, and the Cabinet members, including William P. Rogers, John B. Connally, Melvin R. Laird, John N. Mitchell, Winton M. ("Red") Blount, Jr., William T. Pecora, Clifford M. Hardin, James T. Lynn, Laurence H. Silberman, Elliot L. Richardson, George W. Romney, James M. Beggs, George P. Shultz, Robert H. Finch, Donald H. Rumsfeld, George H. W. Bush, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, John D. Ehrlichman, Henry A. Kissinger, Clark MacGregor, Peter M. Flanigan, Herbert G. Klein, Dr. Edward E. David, Jr., Raymond K. Price, Jr., Alexander P. Butterfield, Ronald L. Ziegler, William E. Timmons, Charles W. Colson, John A. Scali, Richard A. Moore, Harry S. Dent, Leonard Garment, John W. Dean, III, Frederic V. Malek, Robert J. Brown, Robert J. Dole, Adm. Thomas H. Moorer, Gerald C. Smith, Arthur J. Sohmer, Caspar W. ("Cap") Weinberger, Virginia H. Knauer, and Arnold R. Weber, met in the Cabinet Room of the White House from 9:02 am to 9:48 am.
Cite this conversation
Conversation 003-078, May 20, 1971. White House Tapes, Richard Nixon Presidential Library and Museum, National Archives. Audio and AI transcript via Easy Nixon, https://www.easynixon.org/tapes/003-078 (accessed October 9, 2026).