Conversation 634-007

TapeTape 634StartThursday, December 9, 1971 at 3:00 PMEndThursday, December 9, 1971 at 3:29 PMTape start time00:33:06Tape end time01:02:51ParticipantsNixon, Richard M. (President);  Maga, Hubert;  Porson, Sophia K.;  White House photographer;  Haig, Alexander M., Jr.Recording deviceOval Office

On December 9, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, Hubert Maga, Sophia K. Porson, White House photographer, and Alexander M. Haig, Jr. met in the Oval Office of the White House from 3:00 pm to 3:29 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 634-007 of the White House Tapes.

Conversation No. 634-7

Date: December 9, 1971
Time: 3:00 pm - 3:29 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Hubert Maga and Sophia K. Porson; the White House photographer and
members of the press were present at the beginning of the meeting.

     Introductions

     Photographs

     Maga's appreciation for meeting

[Photograph session]

Alexander M. Haig, Jr. entered at 3:05 pm.

     United Nations [UN]
          -Previous meeting between the President and Maga
          -Taiwan, vote
                -Dahomey’s position
          -International relations
                -Country size
                      -Dahomey
                      -India-Pakistan situation
                            -Cease-fire
                                  -UN vote
                                  -US position
                                        -Population comparison

     Dahomey-US relations
         -UN
             -Taiwan vote

     Dahomey-US comparison
         -Freedom
         -Proposal for a working relationship in the future

     Size of Dahomey
           -Importance in US relations

Foreign aid
     -Multilateral
           -Potential Congressional opposition
                -Full support for US programs in Africa

Urban development
    -Importance to Dahomey
    -Development of roads
          -Possible problems

Dahomey agriculture
    -Drought
         -Corn
              -Rise in cost
              -US aid
                    -Assistance from West Germany and international organizations
                    -Level of importance to US interests
                         -Potential tragedy

Africa
     -New countries priorities
         -Education
         -Capital investment
         -Dahomey
              -Agriculture
                     -Increase in production of food crops and cash crops
              -Roads
                     -Niger
                     -Upper Votta
                     -Nigeria
              -City development and urban planning
                     -Water supply
                           -Problems concerning year-round access
              -Main source of assistance
                     -International organizations
                     -US loan to Southern Dahomey
                           -Water supply
              -Maga's visit to Geneva
                     -International Labor Organization [ILO]
                           -Maga’s concern

                                  -American Federation of Labor-Congress of International
                                      Organizations [AFL-CIO]
                                      -Opposition to ILO
                                      -George Meany
                                  -Congress
                                      -Appropriations
                                            -Domestic programs compared to international
                                                  programs
                                  -Dahomey relations
                                      -Work with the US
                                      -[Forename unknown] Tevoedjre
                                            -Candidacy
                                                 -Senegal, Cameroon, Chad
                                                 -Possible support from the President

     Organization of African Unity [OAU]
          -UN recommendations
          -African chiefs of state memorandum
                -Proposals on Middle East
                     -Possible US support
                     -Maga’s conversation with Abba Eban
                           -Israeli agreement
                     -US consideration

     Visit to African countries
           -Yakubu Gowon

     Closing remarks
          -The President’s travels
          -The President’s knowledge and support of Africa

The President, Maga, Haig, and Porson left at 3:29 pm.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

Le prezident, le prezident Naomi.
Le prezident, le prezident.
Le prezident, le prezident.
Le prezident, le prezident.
Le prezident, le prezident.
Eus c'hoazh eo beth a-señ, Mr. President, eus c'hoazh a-leu ar-leu ar-benn eo wariet eo kwerint eus ketekur e-tarn.
Neu a obez eo beth a-señ eo beth a-señ eo beth a-señ eo beth a-señ eo beth a-señ.
Se honi e verry-verry small country, beth e'r country d'eo d'inspired very moch, e plenit eo beth e soffing e soffing ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein ar-lein
Neu c'hoant eo, neu c'hoant eo.
We are grateful for supporting our position on the gender representation issue in the United Nations.
d'eo, as you point out, er eus eus e small country, e, e, ar viole o francioet per coutry e oes not determined ar basis o sempit e saiz, er eus nabar e zbeg, ar basis o sempit e saiz, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus, er eus,
There are some who voted for the Indian resolution or the Indian position.
And whereas the majority of countries voted for a position calling for a withdrawal and ceasefire, those who supported the Indian position did so because they said, well, India has 600 million people, Pakistan has only 60 million people,
That's totally irrelevant.
The 600 million, that doesn't make it, make a nation right.
And the 60 million doesn't make it wrong.
What matters is what a country does.
Our position is very simply that a country follows the rules
We support all those rules, we do not support them.
Je tiens d'abord d'une excellence que nous sommes extrêmement reconnaissants de l'appui que vous avez donné a-pour notre position sur la question de la représentation de la Chine au stade des Nations Unies.
Et bien que, comme vous avez dit, le Darmaïs soit un pays très petit,
Ha n'oc'h amitiae n'est pas baser sur les dimensions d'un peil, mais sur l'organisation, le nombre d'enfants de ce peil, met sur les principes de la nation.
Par exemple, la situation actuelle en Inde et au Pakistan en est un exemple de cela.
Y a certains qui ont voté pour la position indienne.
La mayorité, au fond, ont voté pour une résolution qui ne demandait pas très bien cessez le feu.
Ceux qui ont voté pour la position indienne, en fait, parce qu'ils se sont dit qu'il y avait 600 millions d'habitants et pourtant,
Du Pakistan, n'y a vez ket 60 000 habitants, met en-faet, ex-sagir a-di unh konsideratioñ qui ne devrez pas rentre en konsideratioñ.
Le fait d'avoir une population de 600 millions de personnes ne justifie pas certaines actions, et le fait d'avoir des 60 millions ne justifie...
a-tañ ou a-bon, n'est-se c'est pas d'eo beth ce j'eus c'hoant, er l'action du peiñ.
Et si un peiñ suit les règles de la conduite internationale, alors n'est-ce pas qu'on a notre accuñ a-seu peiñ ?
Met se ne le faites pas, alors vous ne d'amant pas notre accuñ.
Et si je l'ai compris, c'est d'ailleurs un c'est-à-faut d'armer demain.
Parfaitement.
C'est évident, effektivant, a-t-on d'où d'ar vien a-t-on ?
Non, n'ou n'est-il n'a-t-il a-t-on a-tion ?
Lâzou-meñ, n'est-ce pas d'oeuvres d'oeuvres de l'empreint d'Azulez ?
N'avons, n'est-ce pas d'oeuvres d'oeuvres de l'empreint d'Azulez ?
N'avons, n'est-ce pas d'oeuvres d'oeuvres de l'empreint d'Azulez ?
N'avons, n'est-ce pas d'oeuvres d'oeuvres de l'empreint d'Azulez ?
N'avons, n'est-ce pas d'oeuvres d'oeuvres de l'empreint d'Azulez ?
n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra, n'où a-ra,
It's very much true.
You're quite right, Mr. President.
And we have always sought to listen to the recommendations and the requests that have been formulated by the United States representatives and we have tried to align our views with affairs.
And we ourselves are very pleased with the position which we took on the question of the Chinese representation as much as we thought that this was the equitable position.
Neu, n'eo c'hoazh, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh... Neu, n'eo c'hoazh...
Et d'où pas, c'est-à-dire, c'est d'arvañ kañ, d'un pizit, qui respecte ur liberté des autres, a-noz, breu, en estan ket...
In fact, we find that in most cases, since our independence, our views have been consistent with those of the United States, and we're very happy with the situation and pretend that it should continue, and we can follow very closely what is done in the United States and adapt our views to those of the United States, particularly because Dahomey respects the freedoms of other people, and we feel that this is the freedom of the Jew.
The United States is an example that we ourselves should follow.
We hope that we can always work together on principle rather than simply on the basis of power and size.
We respect the right of small companies to independence.
What's the principle of a country's right to be independent and free?
Oppression in Asia is destroyed and no small country is safe.
Nous espérons justement qu'il nous sera toujours possible de collaborer ensemble sur les questions de pratique plutôt que sur des aspects de puissance ou des dimensions de paix.
Parce que nous respectons le droit des petits pays à leur indépendance d'une domination étrangère.
Et je suis ravi qu'une fois que le principe des droits des pays à leur indépendance est d'être libres d'une agression ou d'une agression,
c'est-eo c'hoazh eo c'hoazh a c'hoazh a c'hoazh a c'hoazh eo.
pour lesquelles il n'y a pas d'exemple.
Bon, c'est parce que nous sommes, au départ, dans un contexte-là, qu'il y a pas si beaucoup d'exemple.
Alors, ce qu'on a, on ne pense pas que les Etats-Unis ne sont prédisants.
Donc, pour nous permettre, savez-vous, les Etats-Unis, et les autres pays, quand on est un pays où il n'y a pas d'Etat-Unis, c'est-à-dire qu'il n'y a pas d'Etat-Unis, c'est-à-dire qu'il n'y a pas d'Etat-Unis, c'est-à-dire qu'il n'y a pas d'Etat-Unis, c'est-à-dire qu'il n'y a pas d'Etat-Unis.
Yes, what you said is very true and I appreciate it all the more so from the standpoint of a very small country like ours which is faced with just enormous problems because we're really just getting started in life and that's really why I very much appreciate what you said and we very much count on your assistance Mr President and that of the United States
in general for us to be able to grow in peace and develop the economy of our country.
And I know that the United States has already been of some help in that connection and we very much appreciate it as well as the friendly relations between me and Joe.
Large sentences that the President knows is primarily an ultimatum.
I feel, I can assure you that despite some congressional opposition that we will continue to try to play our part
C'hoant eo d'eus d'eus d'eus d'eus d'eus d'eus.
Ha, je tiens à vous dire, comme vous le savez d'ailleurs, qu'il n'y a pas d'assistance multilatéral, mais je tiens à vous assurer que, malgré kelques oppositions de la part du Congrès des Etats-Unis, nous allons cacher de continuer de jouer un rôle avec d'autres nations, bien entendu, pour le developement et le progrès, pour des programmes de developement des nouvelles nations, comme le 2 mai, qui est un éleveur judiciaire.
N'a plesant beaucoup sa, et n'en s'avant l'espoir d'où marier l'adevoutik, tout l'effort qu'il faiz justant pour l'integrez a-tel, qui n'osez pas l'espoir d'où marier, n'est-ce pas ?
Osez un ouvenn ekonomik, a-sevoar, l'espoir d'eo d'où tout biñez, d'où n'osez un cancer, d'eo d'où n'osez un intérêt animal, eo ket eo importan.
N'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'avant, n'en s'av
Yes, we're very much aware of what you said, Mr. President, and we're very grateful for it.
And I might add that we realize that, despite the very difficulties that you're encountering from the time we're alive, and we're very much appreciative of the great efforts that you personally are making to ensure that these programs continue.
These programs are absolutely imperative to the development of our economies and for a whole range of projects such as Rhodes and the type of thing that we're doing right now.
In this case, it's on a regional basis.
And this is very important in our particular case because Dahomey is a crossroads of the various states of the Anton group and also we are looking forward to your assistance in the field of city planning and urban development.
How is the, what do you call it, the problem range that you had encountered there?
Kallet-se du problem du maizh, paskañ, je c'hoant kompant, se veu eus, se stresc'h, se stresc'h ?
Nei, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se, n'est-se,
Yes, you're quite right.
Corn, which was selling for 1,000 CFA francs, a bank has now gone up to 4,500, which is just an installment for us to expect our people to be able to pay.
And so this is a very serious problem that we're trying to resolve by every means.
We're trying to get help there, as we have in our programme, as long as the Germans are there.
Où eus kañ a-leus an a-frengh a dezhaet e osez eo pas met e c'hoant a-sev ar c'hormañ a vetezh a-mañ a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg a-seg
a terrible tragedy for the bads of your country to have the price of their basic stable food for four times.
Oui, nous allons certainement nous aider dans la mesure où cela nous est possible, parce que je ne comprends pas vraiment que ceci pourrait être une tragédie terrible pour les familles.
Du coup, d'abord, l'aliment de base, c'est un peu frais, c'est qu'un reflet, constatez-vous.
What do you believe, Mr. President, in two countries to act as he demonstrated?
Ha vok a veit-se lan-se, n'eo ket koa ez-keu lennu a-n lanskant a l-agrikomp a-se oan a-se a-trouzhez ?
A-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a-se a
Neu, n'est-ce pas ?
Neu, n'est-ce pas ?
N'est-ce pas ?
Yes, but I think the first question is agriculture, because we really very need, quickly, to develop our production, both in the staple food crops as well as cash crops.
And then the second priority, a place on transportation, very seriously, for roads between Dahomey and Nigeria, Dahomey and Foult, Dahomey and Nigeria, because we're sort of at the crossroads there, with all of that area there.
Lec'h c'hest d'eo a-lis, d'eo, se o-poz ket eo plannat eo c'hoant eo ar c'hoant eo ur c'hort, eo c'hort, eo c'hort, eo c'hort, eo c'hort, eo c'hort
Yes, and in the matter also of city development and urban planning in the northern part of our country, we have a hard time with the water supply getting in of water all year round in our towns.
What are your major assistances from the international organizations now in these fields?
Nes ket ar te sot paethe c'hapur eo booz a-bed ar telozh ket a-benn vienz a-o c'hez a-seant an eus ar nez ar nez ?
Eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo,
Yes, we are getting assistance from the international organizations, but actually, compared to others, we're rather behind in that area.
But I would like to mention that in the southern part of our country, we have recently received a loan from the United States to improve water supply in that area of the country.
Is that true, AID?
Is that not what I did?
Was that able to do so, Claire?
AID?
Yes, AID.
Thank you.
n'eo c'hoant eo stomp oaet eo ar set eo stomp, n'ar c'hoant eo ar stomp n'eo c'hiñ, n'eo c'hoant eo ar set eo ar stomp.
But of course, we're still far from filling all of our needs, because everything remains to be done in our country.
N'est-ce pas ?
N'est-ce pas ?
N'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-ce pas que, d'un an, n'est-
eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo, eo,
We are trying to get the congress to continue.
an ar c'hier appropriation.
But labour organizations have very great influence with our Congress, ie our domestic labour organizations.
This is a battle that is a difficult one to get our Congress under those circumstances to go against the domestic labour organization in order to support and entertain labour organizations all across the province.
Oui, nous essayons de faire, parce que le progrès continue de financer notre contribution à l'organisation, mais mali c'est que les organismes du travail syndicalistes d'ici aux Etats-Unis ont du trait dans la financeur du progrès des Etats-Unis.
Et donc, il s'agit là d'une bataille où l'eus est reussit d'eux de convainc'h, de convainc'h des Etats-Unis, d'aller à l'encontre des vœux et des deseñs d'organisation du traballe Américain pour appuyer l'organisation internationale du traballe.
Oui.
Donc, on ne peut pas dire, justement, c'est un programme que, pratikatel-ment, n'eus-t-il pas fiñ, qui fes a-feu, n'est-ce pas, d'opposition ?
et qui serait d'un prez mouñt, sa vant d'anoc'h ur-Français, d'où l'eo c'est potomp se preparer l'avenir.
Et, dans ces cas-là, sa vant d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Français, c'est-à-d'anoc'h ur-Franç
Da c'hoazh-hoazh.
Da c'hoazh-hoazh.
Y a-se pêr a-se pêr o fous se teort eo.
Ha met, a-se pêr d'ar vort d'eo, d'eo pas an...
Yes, well we of course are full and understand this situation and there are certain things about the ILO programme I think that have actually led to this opposition and therefore we, not only ILO, it's a small country that's been trying to make its contribution to preparing the way to the future of the ILO and therefore we have made certain proposals of our own in the context of the ILO and we would hope to be able to work with
eo United States Press Coordiator ar Fusil eo ar c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra eo c'hantra
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Eñs a-walc'h d'où ?
Yes, this is an elective post of Mr. President.
Last year, in fact, he already entered his candidacy for the post of Director.
He was supported by Senegal and Cameroon and Canada at that time, among others.
And since the year he was Assistant Director of the NRLO, it's my belief that he will go down hard again in the next elections, and we would appreciate your support if at all possible.
Neu a lot a seth.
Neu a lot a seth.
Neu a lot a seth.
Neu a lot a seth.
Neu a lot a seth.
Neu a lot a seth.
Alors, terminez, eo ket eo e-galement, eo demandez au Président des Centres Socialistes un numerant d'ordres azez eo déposet an chevez d'Etat, azez eo e-di-défiñez, eo c'est n'eo ligañ, azez eo e-deffiñez, azez eo e-deffiñez, eo c'est eo e-deffiñez.
n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas, n'est-ce qu'on n'a pas,
Isos, gosgat na dweud.
Un o'r very last item d'arhaet e dweud, Mr. President, a-haet e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud e dweud
a Middle East and which is currently in a discussion in the United Nations, whether you could, within the United Nations, see what we can do to make it work out a solution along the lines proposed by the wide command of the four wide men of the organization of African Unity in connection with that problem area.
The President said that he talked with Mr. Abedin yesterday and he gained the impression, not specifically, but he gained the impression that the Israelis were in agreement on certain points
There is some points contained in the African Tuesday statement around it.
Well, I assure the President of very careful consideration of the decision of the African Tuesday.
After all, they may not want a peaceful settlement in the area.
They have no designs on the area.
Constantly, we believe their views will be very fair and we will serve them.
Oui, je tiens à vous assurer que nous avons entourné une considération, en fait, soignée de la position qui a été exprimée par le chef d'Etat.
Par l'Etat, parce qu'après tout, c'est avant qu'il ne veule ur la paix dans cette region-là, ou bien qu'il n'entre pas un deusin pour cette region-là, et donc, d'un point de vue de peut-être oeuvrer, et qu'il s'arrenait.
Donc, nous allons certainement l'apprendre en considération, en formellant notre position.
Yes, I would like to thank you very much for that, Mr. President.
I might add that General Gallant, who is my very close neighbour, has been also very sure to bring this up with you to ask you to intervene in the Playable Lighting Programme.
Acrica leaders will see them.
In all of my travels, I am not able to go every place I would like, but you can be sure that I am not going to visit as president of an Acrica country which does not indicate any lack of interest, no Acrica will, previously.
Your aspiration
eo c'hoazh, eo c'hoazh, eo c'hoazh, eo c'hoazh.
Da fad ket, en tant que Président, n'est-ce pas uti partout, n'est-ce pas dirañ ket je n'ai pas d'intérêt dans c'est-ce qui se passe ?
Je venez bien d'Afrique, etant-danek, des visites ket je l'ai faites auparament, avant de devenir Président, je venez bien des aspirations, je crois, de mon pays, des aspirations pour le progrès, pour ma population, et, vous savez, Maxence Platzi est mon appui treu fort.
eo tomor eo soret eo c'hoant, eo c'hoant eo c'hoant, eo c'hoant eo c'hoant, eo c'hoant eo c'hoant, eo c'hoant eo c'hoant,
Neuze, n'eo beth eo gweithset eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth.
Neuze, n'eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth eo beth
A prezant d'ar homi a-s gado d'ar homi a-ferst.
Ya, d'ar homi a-s gado d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-ferst d'ar homi a-fer