Conversation 941-007

On June 14, 1973, President Richard M. Nixon, Alexander M. Haig, Jr., Stephen B. Bull, Willam H. Henkel, Jr., John V. Brennan, Maj. Gen. John C. Bennett, Gen. Brent G. Scowcroft, Henry A. Kissinger, David N. Parker, Garry M. Jenkins, William G. Hyland, Helmut ("Hal") Sonnenfeldt, and unknown person(s) met in the Oval Office of the White House from 6:14 pm to 6:38 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 941-007 of the White House Tapes.

Conversation No. 941-7 (cont’d)

                                                                       Conversation No. 941-7

Date: June 14, 1973
Time: 6:14 pm - 6:38 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Alexander M. Haig, Jr., Stephen B. Bull, William Henkel, Jr., John V.
(“Jack”) Brennan, Major General John C. Bennett, Gen. Brent G. Scowcroft, Henry A.
Kissinger, David N. Parker, Garry M. Jenkins, William G. Hyland, and Helmut (“Hal”)
Sonnenfeldt. The recording began while the conversation was in progress.

     Meeting attendees
          -Chairs
          -Sonnenfeldt

     Forthcoming Leonid I. Brezhnev state visit
           -Agenda
                -Dinner
                -Camp David
                -Sequoia
                     -Security
                     -Wife
                     -Guest list
                            -Andrei A. Gromyko, Anatoliy F. Dobrynin, Nikolai S. Patolichev
                            -Henry A. Kissinger, George P. Shultz, William P. Rogers,
                             Dobrynin [?]
                -Camp David
                -Agreements [?]
                -Luncheon with business and industrial leaders
                     -Shultz
                -Timing of signing [?]
                -Congress members
                -Locations of events [signing documents?]
                     -East Room
                     -Rogers
                            -State Department
                     -Shultz
                                           -19-

                  NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                     (rev. July-2012)

                                                             Conversation No. 941-7 (cont’d)

                             -Treasury Department
                -California, Camp David
                -Ronald L. Ziegler’s press briefings
                      -Location
                -Accommodations at San Clemente
                      -President’s conversation with Dobrynin
                             -Brezhnev
                             -Gromyko, Dobrynin, Brezhnev, an aide
                                   -Bedrooms
                                         -Dobrynin’s room compared to Gromyko’s room
                -San Clemente
                      -Possible reception
                             -Guest list
                                   -Numbers
                                   -Dobrynin
                                   -Compared to St. George’s event [?]
                                   -Hollywood celebrities, businessmen, and politicians
                                   -Private dinner compared to party
                                         -Political guest
                                   -James (“Jimmy”) Stewart, John Wayne
                                   -Arrangements
                                   -Ronald W. Reagan, Dobrynin
                                   -Women
                                   -Businessmen
                                   -Size

An unknown man entered at an unknown time after 6:14 pm.

     Thelma C (“Pat”). Nixon
          -Rose Mary Woods

The unknown man left at an unknown time before 6:38 pm.

     Forthcoming Brezhnev visit
           -Agenda
                -San Clemente
                     -Reception
                           -20-

 NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                     (rev. July-2012)

                                            Conversation No. 941-7 (cont’d)

            -Guest list
                   -Woods
                   -Sammy Davis, Jr.
                   -Jews
                   -Wayne
                   -Stewart
-Flight to California
      -Gromyko
      -Dobrynin
      -Rogers
      -Brezhnev
-Kissinger’s conversation with Dobrynin
      -Gromyko, Rogers
-Flight to California
      -Dobrynin, Brezhnev, Gromyko
      -Gromyko’s role in Politburo
-San Clemente
      -Possible reception
            -Arrangements
                   -Henry Mancini, Hollywood Orchestra
                   -Food
                         -Chasen’s restaurant
                   -Music
                         -Military band
                   -Food
                         -Chasen’s restaurant
                         -Type
      -President’s conversations with Brezhnev
-Photo coverage
      -San Clemente, Camp David
      -Oliver F. (“Ollie”) Atkins
      -Press pool
-Possible drive
-Sequoia
-Disneyland
-Sequoia
-Security
                                              -21-

                    NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

                                         (rev. July-2012)

                                                            Conversation No. 941-7 (cont’d)

                 -Possible costal drive
                       -Dobrynin
                       -Security
                             -Spontaneity
                       -Ziegler and press
                             -Press pool
                       -Value
            -Work on trip

The President et al. left at 6:38 pm.

This transcript was generated automatically by AI and has not been reviewed for accuracy. Do not cite this transcript as authoritative. Consult the Finding Aid above for verified information.

What are the open questions?
Plans, plans, plans, and how's that?
You know, I've been in here.
All your chairs are on it.
You know, I'm on board.
I'll take a seat.
All the way around.
I'll sit here.
On the right.
This is a crazy conversation.
Sorry.
Well, uh, I was wondering about a couple of points that, uh, that Mr. Jerome, uh, that the Russians didn't research the country, right?
Or ever used the country.
And what was done for it?
What was your conclusion?
How do I go to mandate it to the government?
What I want to do there is to go down, and then come down to the Great Dispatch and write a little ceremony.
Now, the point is, I can't go off.
I can stay.
And his wife is not here, so we've got to make sure that we've got to get a very select group that that should be involved.
You know, if you have a, let's say, six people in the room.
I'm going to hold up the whole thing because it's long and long, but I need what you would like.
I don't need a big crowd as well as you.
I don't need a big crowd as well as you.
I don't need a big crowd as well as you.
I think anything would be nice.
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I think anything would be nice.
What do you think?
I
I would have our side, I would have the...
I would have... obviously I would have the secretary of the church, uh... and, uh, everything to myself.
That's that.
And that way you can have a good calm product.
I'll set that up again.
Just, I wonder about wind speed for a second.
Does it keep going that way?
Yes, it's nice to be able to accelerate.
How long, do we only have to stay there, just for that night?
One night.
Return to the next day.
All day, return to the next day.
Huh.
Thanks.
writing, signing, agreement, whatever you've got.
It's a lot of help, and they have the pricing that you requested, security notes, and your office, and we have a meeting with American Business, especially when you write, where it says, hey, we have just made one of the head signings.
After that meeting on the board, after the special, after we get all the bonds, we can do it next time.
But, you know, we'll build that push, and we will leave.
We'll build it, and we'll be able to do it.
I think it's all right in there.
Thursday, Sunday, what you do back here in the afternoon is a different location.
So we like to try to do it later.
And besides this, it's a song.
I'm not having a teacher.
They did all their system work, so it's a different deal.
I think I participated in one of these programs.
But I don't think Congress does better than the student department.
And Hanford is a culture-centered institution.
Not it.
The two-off in California.
That's what I do.
I believe they take the best choices they want.
They don't want to be too political and get to the ground because they've got to be straight and right in the middle of the picture.
They just care about side foot up there, up there, up there, up there.
But they strip, put it there, and they've got to get real close.
Maybe they want to take the long way.
Mr. President, are you considering a collection of sailboats as press briefings at the beginning of the ECHO Interaction?
There will be no sort of transactions that will be done on the grounds.
So there's no press briefings?
I don't know if that's how it's going to be discussed.
I was talking about the camp safety.
When you're on safety, I mean, for the safety, you mentioned up to 87.
The safety is a question not a lot, but it's a big question.
This is only a television crew.
This allows no certain presence on the network.
when I was discussing this, the possibility that we could do the taping out where the sailor is and the space station is.
That was fine.
You could do the taping out where everybody is at night.
It would stand up on its own there, but I don't think it is.
Like, you've got to leave the studio in the atmosphere.
I couldn't go on.
I think that's what you're looking for.
It's a great little project.
It was right.
They gave us a very good loop for our game.
I think that's correct.
But Dr. Henry could be the reason to go through with it.
I was the impression of the reason Mr. Williams could stay in the house.
And I know he wasn't necessarily the type of person working for you as a supervisor, Mr. Williams.
But on the other hand, both sides, you're going to be working out with Mr. Williams, whatever you want to do.
You're willing to do that, Mr. Williams.
How many times does that have to do with the state?
All right, he's saying it's two.
They are.
If you're going to make a specific request, this is the most, of course.
And that is, Mr. Bursch, that employer stays in the residence itself.
Yes.
And that should be legal.
All right.
Thank you.
Freshback at 100, saying the actual residence, I think it is a, I don't know, one of them, I guess.
Is there anyone in his life?
No, sir.
No, no, there isn't.
Well, how about it?
I've got, I've got one free headroom, and I've also got a cottage that I can put in there.
Well, please don't make the cottage too great.
I know I've got another cottage up next to our house.
For as far as I know, he bought the room he called, and agreed with it.
Great, all right.
And we'll put each in a separate room.
So, this is our room for one headroom, and I'll leave it at that.
The president says it's essential that this room be...
That's good, that's ridiculous.
We're all the same.
We're all the same.
If it makes no sense, can it be better?
Now, what if, what if, what if right now, there is a, that cottage is set up, if you know what I mean, in a way that there is another room assigned.
Would he like to have that be the other room?
He's doing it.
It's a part of him.
If he likes it, he can do that.
He can throw a bed in there.
All right.
Now with regard to saying, well maybe the other point was, whether or not he did want to have a reception, a poolside reception.
He did, whatever he wanted.
Yeah, whatever he wanted.
Now we could put on a hell of a show, a very nice show, but I had a mindless to do it, which was for you to do it.
Yeah, sorry to interrupt.
No, thank you.
Yeah, he had a good day back, nothing to spill.
Uh, if there's a quick show, there's Peter.
There he is.
I mean, he can't be mocked by a hundred people... ...all trying to...
I don't know if they're receiving money... ...and come through, and they go out and drink... ...and we just go around standing with each other, you know?
Well, but not so that a hundred people can catch up, you know?
They can't do that.
We won't find out exactly.
I mean, that's what to me is said enough.
If it's said enough, like it was if they said two or three.
Oh, I understand.
You know what I mean?
I understand.
Right.
I'll take you through that.
But what I was wondering, wouldn't he like to meet probably some of the Hollywood celebrities?
But he might have to meet some of the top business people.
What do you think?
It's a combination.
What do you think?
I think it must not look too privileged for him to accept it.
Or our employer should be loyal.
I think you should do it.
It's an empire for your own good.
It's an empire.
I mean, uh, I think you did that, you got that combination of seizures.
Yeah, I think that was, and I don't know if anybody has a chance, but I just, just have a private figure for you.
I think I've had a party.
All right?
I think you should have seen the indigenous people, the true political people, and some of the new Hollywood people up there.
Why do you think the Hollywood people, like the Older Stars, you know, that are known in the changing stores, count as eligible to rule about as good as that?
We were hoping to build them up tremendously.
So it was very hard to take the piece, you know, right now, that we were going to hand them.
So I knew we were going to do that.
All right, fine.
Now, what kind of men did we want on that angle?
On Saturday night, we were looking at the, what we, you remember, right?
We had the Hollywood party.
They, we met them.
They came to, you know, the party was very long.
And all of them went out in that area.
So we went out and stood around by ourselves.
He chatted with each other.
I'm glad.
He used to give us a bowl of toast, and we liked it.
If you can't sort a good thing, the only thing that would worry me is if it were a big rush towards you and him.
But you came up, and if you could set it up so that maybe you'd stand under the canopy, and each make a little speech.
So the people don't get it.
Alright, we're going to get that boy to start being very, very careful about it.
Richard's got to be there for one of us.
Would that be a safe there?
No.
He doesn't care about that.
I think he'd prefer it not to, okay?
I have to love him, he said to him.
And I have to really, he said to him, because of the heat that he was in, he had a bad spot.
He had to be careful.
And, uh, well...
Oh, they want to say we could make it a demarcation if you see some of the women, all of the gals, and all of the men.
Fair deal.
Well, the thing is that we might be bad at the list.
And as far as the businessmen are concerned, they've got to be the real, real topics and not just the computer viewers.
So that list is going to be very, very common.
What would you like for $100,000?
That's a half off.
Half off.
I think $100,000 is about right.
$100,000 is around $100,000.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thank you.
God will work this list out.
This is very, very important.
And I'm really grateful for that.
And, uh, I guess you can put it on the 30th or whatever.
Well, if I, uh, if you have a question, I'm on the motion.
Here's the slide.
I have Sandy Davis.
I'm on the motion.
I'm on the motion.
I'm sure he's a good one.
We are having a hell of a time getting our team in because of that.
It's not because there aren't some of them, you know, that are kind of Jewish because of their flag or something, but they're managers.
I think that's very good.
That's going to be great.
No, I'm making my clear.
John Lane, Jimmy Stewart, the guys in East Coast...
Hey, I'll work that out.
I'll work that out.
Listen, I'm not here to talk to you.
I'm not here to talk to you.
On to the place you're going now.
Does he want to have, does he want to have a great show and a great show and everybody on it?
Does he want that going on?
He doesn't care.
As long as he doesn't say.
Yeah, the thing is, the more we have, the less chance of it.
Well, the reason is that was, that whenever, now that we go to the public bureau, I mean, whenever you go, that's easy.
No, not necessarily, but it's easier to say, when the two foreign ministers travel together, why don't the two foreign ministers go and do something?
Yeah.
And to have pressure.
I see.
So we put another thing.
Well, I think that makes a much more problem.
But it is a problem.
And I think there are people who have figured out logistically if we can have them on.
And I'll bring them in.
I mean, I'll bring them in.
Pressure up behind the little compartment that leads up there, talking to the gun.
You probably have a very, very, very, very, very,
Well, you'll have to throw me the ground, which I'll explain to you tomorrow.
But you'll have to take me there.
I'll see you home.
No, but you'll have to say, or you'll have to sign certain things to the board of directors, because I'll have to throw me the ground, because if I don't do it, he can't take me around.
Well, that I can't do.
All right.
I don't know why.
All right.
All right.
Anything else you need to know from me about this?
I just want to know what the party, now on the party, Henry, what would you like to do next?
Would you like to have a, say, Henry Munch, Henry Munch, Henry Munch, Henry Munch, Henry Munch, Henry Munch.
Uh, would he like, uh, would he like a king or two, or chasers, or would he like, uh, a Spanish guy, or...
Which I think, my impression of this, I guess, is that he doesn't know this sort of thing.
He could have chasers.
I'd have more chasers.
Chasers, and, uh, more chasers, I'd argue, because...
I don't want that strength.
I don't want that strength.
I don't want that strength.
I don't want that strength.
I don't want that strength.
I don't want that strength.
They're awfully good.
Awfully good.
They're really well done.
Well, sir.
Sit down.
Sit down, sir.
Be alone.
They're playing with you.
They're used to order.
I don't think they're going to do it.
I think it's anti-crime.
If you sit down, you're going to have a problem.
It gets bored as hell out here.
It amazes you.
That takes a lot of time.
Now, we will not sit down, but have food around so the food table is where anybody has to sit down and eat.
And if you order, it's like a party.
It's like a party.
It's good.
And, uh, did I take care of that?
Now I do, I do need an eye for our jokes up there.
We can get out there Friday night.
Well, uh, big one.
Saturday morning.
Well, that's really all that's needed.
And Sunday, what happens then?
Uh, Sunday's secret, uh, is that, uh, if I don't, uh, well, one thing we want are, which is very, very important to us here, I don't think you will want, there's plenty of pictures of us in San Clemente.
I think that he heard of us and the reason for that is the first of that was a scene on this visit with his husband.
I haven't seen that in generally a lot of events.
The walk along by the beach and so forth and so on.
um i'm referring
And I'm referring just to stills.
One who told the camera, and maybe a couple stills, where they take pictures of us walking around town.
Now, uh...
And he also suggested to me that he approached her, uh, to see if she was out by the area.
But that won't be her house.
They have to be prepared.
They said we'll have to leave.
We'll do it early in the afternoon.
That's right.
Yeah.
This is why I told you about it.
Because we didn't fix the thing.
That you might like it, but there was a time when we thought I'd stand it.
Yeah.
We didn't have the opportunity to support you.
He wouldn't like to do it, would he?
No, definitely not.
He'd like to go out and vote, but not to do that.
That's a problem for a place to go and vote.
You could have done that, see?
But we need to do it.
No, no, the other person, well, we can't take him out.
Well, something you might consider is to go back to your thoughts.
Let them go.
The difficulty is, you've got to be very sure of whether they're going to take that procedure.
It's not a common thing.
It's like, what?
You've got to have the trust.
I hope it's not a natural thing.
What do you like to do this with?
Would you like on a very cold base?
We've just got a fire to the right of the coast so you can see.
Well, that's better.
He would like it.
But we might have to make it a little bit more security.
The bringer has told me that what he likes best is if you say something that looks very spontaneous.
Yeah.
And I think it might be a good idea if it was.
Saturday morning, you don't really have all that much left.
Okay, sure, we've done it.
We've done a big part of the work.
If you just set it in, why don't you take it?
I'll show you.
Yeah.
Is that what you said?
Yeah.
What we could do would be to take him up the coast to the point there and let him see the marina below and then come back.
It's perfect, we'll say.
It's a beautiful drive.
There's no security problem.
But it shouldn't be planned in this house.
It's outside.
It's not an house.
That's right.
And he, uh...
I'll leave this however it is.
The Savior will be with us.
Don't be surprised.
They'll come following us.
Uh, it... Yeah, but...
It must be laid on as a convoy of security people that I...
I'm not sure how it's actually...
It is what it is.
I'll just deal with it outside.
That's all right.
It's one of those things that organize stress and quiet.
And let them follow you.
Yeah, okay.
We'll try to still get along after we get there, huh?
He said if he stopped driving, we could have something closer.
We could have something close back home.
Yeah, that's right.
We could get a small pool.
We might have a very, very small pool that we're just going to take a drive across.
Because I think that will give him a chance to say that he found that he saw a little America.
If he did that otherwise, he would have seen nothing except flying over it.
Except that I'm just very slow, but I can just find it.
I've worked with savers.
It doesn't have to be three.
My parents is multiple regards, not one more.
I don't care how much, I'm like Scott.
My dad had been great at what it was like.
Everything he told me was very grateful and grand.
But suddenly it broke my sense of it.
All right.
Thank you for all your hard work, fellas.
If I made any mistakes, I was part of the Henry West team.
That's a good thing.
Well, we appreciate all your work.
We'll see you next week.
Cheers.
We'll be right back.