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Conversation: 478-007

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Start Date: 13-Apr-1971 11:17 AM

End Date: 13-Apr-1971 12:18 PM

Participants:

Nixon, Richard M. (President)Haldeman, H. R. ("Bob")Kissinger, Henry A.Scali, John A.White House photographerBull, Stephen B.[Unknown person(s)]Sanchez, Manolo

Recording Device: Oval Office

Full Tape Conversation Start Time: 01:51:22

Full Tape Conversation End Time: 02:48:48

478-007.mp3

NARA Description:

On April 13, 1971, President Richard M. Nixon, H. R. ("Bob") Haldeman, Henry A. Kissinger, John A. Scali, White House photographer, Stephen B. Bull, unknown person(s), and Manolo Sanchez met in the Oval Office of the White House at an unknown time between 11:17 am and 12:18 pm. The Oval Office taping system captured this recording, which is known as Conversation 478-007 of the White House Tapes.

Nixon Library Finding Aid:

Conversation No. 478-7

Date: April 13, 1971
Time: Unknown between 11:17 am and 12:18 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman

     President’s conversation with Charles W. Colson

Henry A. Kissinger and John A. Scali entered at 11:19 am; the White House photographer was
                                                21

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present at the beginning of the meeting

     Scali on payroll

     Photograph

     Scali’s assignment
           -Orientation
                 -Difficulties
                 -First weeks
                 -Contribution
                       -Long-term
                 -Differences from previous career
                 -Senior consultant
                 -Ronald L. Ziegler
                 -Taking initiative
                 -Colson
                       -Responsibilities
                 -Herbert G. Klein
                 -Staff meetings
                       -Outgoing matters versus internal ones
                 -Decision making
                 -Foreign policy
                       -Kissinger
                       -Peter G. Peterson
                             -International economic policy
                             -Speeches
                       -Kissinger
                             -Relationship with
                 -Kissinger
                       -Importance
                       -Responsibilities
                             -Television commentators
                                   -John W. Chancellor
                       -Priorities
                             -Networks
                             -Wire services
                                   -Radio
                             -Columnists
                             -Magazines
                             -Networks
                                   -Importance
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                       -Wire services
                       -Columnists
                            -Stewart M. Hensley
                            -Arthur P. Henderson
                            -Hensley

Scali’s assignment
      -Analysis of television industry                            Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
            -Kissinger
            -Klein

President’s People’s Republic of China [PRC] initiative
     -Scali
     -Background
     -Press corps
     -State Department
     -Announcements
           -Timing
     -State Department
           -Foreign Service
           -Kremlinologists
           -Charles E. (“Chip”) Bohlen
           -Llewellyn E. (“Tommy”) Thompson, Jr.
     -William P. Rogers
     -Union of Soviet Socialist Republics [USSR]
     -State Department
     -USSR
           -Aleksei N. Kosygin
           -US policy
     -Ping-pong team
     -Forthcoming announcement [Relaxation of trade and travel restrictions with the
           PRC, April 14, 1971]
     -Publicity
           -Dangers
           -USSR
           -Ping-pong team
           -US goals
           -Benefits
           -Announcement, April 14, 1971
           -Ping-pong team
     -US relations
           -Thaw
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               -Warsaw
         -Chinese
               -Compared to Soviets
         -USSR
               -Ping-pong team
               -Anatoliy F. Dobrynin
                     -Announcement
         -State Department                                   Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
               -President’s Position
               -Rogers
         -President’s initiative
         -National Security Council [NSC]
         -President’s 1969 world trip
         -Dangers
         -NSC
         -Critical areas
         -Sensitivity
         -Scali’s recommendations
               -Ping-pong team
               -President’s image
                     -Demonstrators
                           -Vietnam
                     -Farsightedness
               -President’s schedule
                     -Visit to San Diego
                     -Camp Pendleton
                           -Timing
                     -Demonstrations


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
[National Security]
[Duration: 15s ]


    FOREIGN VISIT


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 2
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******************************************************************************


         -Timing
         -News stories

    Kissinger’s schedule
         -Scali’s briefing                                             Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
         -Peterson

    President’s schedule
         -Camp Pendleton visit

    Scali’s role
          -Advocacy
          -Preparation for Ziegler’s briefings
                -Benefits
                -Announcement of relaxation of PRC trade and travel restrictions
                      -Walter L. Cronkite, Jr.
                      -Wire
                      -Television
                -Framework
                -Possible changes
                -Atmosphere
                -Access to President
                -Possible use
                      -Consultant
                -Possibilities
                      -Speech
                      -Television
                -Problem
                      -Kissinger
                      -State Department
                -State/Defense Department
                      -Ziegler
                      -Robert J. McCloskey
                      -Coordination
                -Haldeman
                      -Need to study problems
                            -Timing
                -Pressure
                -Value
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                     -Ideas
               -Raymond K. Price, Jr.
               -William L. Safire
               -Klein
               -Richard A. Moore
                     -Location
               -Ziegler
               -Colson                                         Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
               -Moore
               -Price
               -Safire
               -Relationship with Kissinger


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11
[Personal Returnable]
[Duration: 1m 4s ]


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11

******************************************************************************


    Scali’s role
          -Summary
          -Emotions
          -Issues
          -Publicity
                -Carl M. Yastrzemski
          -Goals
                -News stories
          -Foreign policy
                -PRC initiative
                      -Significance
                      -Press
                      -Credit for Administration
                -Vietnam
                      -Relation to PRC initiative
                -Issues
                                               26

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                                        Tape Subject Log
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                  -PRC
                  -US initiatives

     Scali’s office
           -Location
           -Executive Office Building

Scali and Haldeman left at 11:46 am                                      Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
      Henry Cabot Lodge

     Scali
             -Forthcoming Kissinger briefing
                  -Summit meeting
                        -Need for confidentiality
                             -Haldeman
                             -George P. Shultz
                             -John D. Ehrlichman
                        -Dobrynin
                             -Schedule
                  -Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT] negotiations
                        -Need for confidentiality
                  -PRC

     US/USSR relations
         -Kissinger’s meeting with Dobrynin’s replacement
         -Berlin
               -[David] Kenneth Rush’s meeting with Pyotr A. Abrassimov
               -Timing
               -Arrangements

     Lodge


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4
[National Security]
[Duration: 11s ]


     THE VATICAN
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END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 4

******************************************************************************


         -General Nguyen Van Thieu
         -Lieutenant General Duong Van (“Big Minh”) Minh    Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
         -Forthcoming trip to Vietnam
         -Health
         -Beverly, Massachusetts
         -New York establishment
         -New England upper class
              -Harvard University
              -Cambridge, Massachusetts

    Eastern establishment
         -Barry M. Goldwater
               -Opinion
         -Boston

    Vietnam


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6
[National Security]
[Duration: 14s ]


    THE VATICAN


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 6

******************************************************************************


         -PRC/USSR relations
         -North Vietnam
              -Negotiations
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              -Hanoi


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 12
[National Security]
[Duration: 2m 41s ]                                          Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)


    THE VATICAN


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 12

******************************************************************************


    PRC/Taiwan
        -Lodge’s view regarding US/Japanese initiative
              -United Nations [UN] representation
        -State Department
              -Sponsorship
        -Dual representation
        -US policy
        -John B. Connally’s views


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 13
[National Security]
[Duration: 56s ]


    PRC


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 13

******************************************************************************
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Japan
     -Textiles
          -Eisaku Sato
          -Armin H. Meyer

Peterson’s trip to Far East
     -David M. Kennedy                                     Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
     -Marshall Green
     -Taiwan
     -Korea

Korea
     -William J. Porter
           -Assignment
     -Green

State Department
      -William H. Sullivan
      -Reorganization
            -Scope
                 -Assistant secretaries
      -Resignations
      -Replacements
      -Promotions
      -Secretary

Cabinet
     -Resignations
     -Melvin R. Laird
     -Rogers
           -Career aspirations
     -John N. Mitchell
           -Martha (Beall) Mitchell
     -Maurice H. Stans
     -George W. Romney
     -John A. Volpe
     -James D. Hodgson
     -Shultz
     -Elliot L. Richardson
           -State Department
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State Department
      -Nelson A. Rockefeller
      -Richardson
           -Qualifications
           -Career
           -Conditions
      -Resignations
                                                           Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
Defense Department
     -Resignations
     -David Packard

President’s second term
     -Changes in government
     -First term

Vietnam
     -Kissinger’s conversation with Frank F. Mankiewicz
          -Democrats
                -Hubert H. Humphrey
                -Robert F. (“Bobby”) Kennedy
                -Troop levels
     -Kissinger’s call from McGeorge Bundy
          -USSR
     -Kissinger’s response to Bundy
     -Moral issue
     -Deadline for withdrawal
     -Negotiations
          -Issue
          -Withdrawal
          -North Vietnam
          -Deadline for withdrawal
          -US options
          -Cease fire
          -Deadline
          -Bombing
          -Withdrawal
          -Bombing
          -Prisoners of War [POWs]
          -Cease fire
          -Residual forces
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        -Bombing
            -USSR

USSR
    -Summit

Vietnam
     -Bombing                                                     Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)

Bundy
    -Telephone calls to and from Kissinger
    -Career

Secretaries of State
     -President’s conversation with Charles G. (“Bebe”) Rebozo, 1967
           -Dean G. Acheson
           -John Foster Dulles
     -Bundy
           -James B. (“Scotty”) Reston
                 -1960 recommendation

Bundy
    -Career
    -Qualifications
    -Harvard University
    -Haldeman
    -Shultz
    -Liberal position
    -William P. Bundy
    -Call to Kissinger regarding Vietnam

Vietnam
     -Mankiewicz’s views
     -Bundy’s defense of administration’s Southeast Asia policy
          -Bombing
     -Robert S. McNamara
          -Compared with Bundy
     -Mankiewicz’s views
          -Liberal

Press
        -Time
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                 -Ziegler
             -Newsweek
             -Hugh S. Sidey

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:46 am

     President’s schedule
          -Ziegler                                                 Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)

Bull left at an unknown time before 12:16 pm

     Press
             -Phone calls to Kissinger
             -Ziegler

     PRC
             -Press
             -US initiatives
                   -Timing
             -President’s position
             -USSR
                   -US relations
             -Vietnam
             -North Vietnam
                   -Chou En-lai’s visit to Hanoi
                   -General Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
                   -Negotiations

Bull entered at an unknown time after 11:46 am

     Ziegler’s schedule
          -Location
          -Cabinet briefing

Bull left at an unknown time before 12:16 pm

     PRC
             -Intervention
                   -Laos
                   -Cambodia
                   -Administration’s position
                   -State Department
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******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9
[National Security]
[Duration: 5s ]
                                                                Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)

    FOREIGN AFFAIRS


END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9

******************************************************************************


               -North Vietnam

    Press

    Vietnam
         -Bundy’s reaction
         -Mankiewicz
               -Reaction to Lieutenant William L. Calley, Jr.
         -Calley case
               -President’s role
         -George C. Wallace
         -Ronald W. Reagan

    1972 elections
         -President’s re-election
         -Foreign policy
         -Economy
               -Research and Development [RAND] Corporation Board

    Stock market
         -Rise
         -Howard Stein

    Vietnam
         -Kissinger’s possible conversation with Stein
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         -President’s speech on Southeast Asia, April 7, 1971
               -Press reaction
               -Structure
               -Emotion
         -Congress
         -President’s speech, April 7, 1971
               -Impact
               -Compared with President’s November 3, 1969 speech Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
               -Withdrawal issue
               -Resignation
         -Possible consequences of a loss of Vietnam
               -Public reaction
                     -Casualties
                     -Calley
         -Negotiations
         -Settlement

    USSR
        -Summit meeting
        -SALT negotiations
        -Summit meeting
             -Leonid I. Brezhnev
        -USSR/US relations
             -Brezhnev’s position
        -Summit meeting
             -Possible trip to Moscow by President
             -Attitude of Russians toward Americans
             -Symbolism
             -SALT negotiations
        -Non-aggression pact
             -Dobrynin


******************************************************************************

BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
[National Security]
[Duration: 22s ]

    FOREIGN AFFAIRS

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
                                             35

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******************************************************************************


           -European Security Conference
           -Negotiations
           -US policy
                                                                    Conv. No. 478-7 (cont.)
     President’s re-election
          -Importance
          -Connally
                -Tenure
                -Qualifications
          -Richardson
          -Connally
          -Richardson
                -Cabinet
          -Connally
                -Qualifications

Bull and an unknown man entered at an unknown time after 11:46 am

     President’s schedule
          -Ziegler
          -Yastrzemski
          -Press

Kissinger left at 12:16 pm

                -Wire service
           -Open Door Hour

Bull and the unknown man left at an unknown time before 12:18 pm

Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 12:16 pm

     Unknown activity

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 12:18 pm
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                            NIXON PRESIDENTIAL MATERIALS STAFF

                                     Tape Subject Log
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